User Banned (Permanent): Victim Blaming, history of infractions. Junior account.
Or leaving all together? That works too.
Aziz Ansari testing out new material in Charleston, SC next week
- Thread starter cheddahz
- Start date
How about not assuming that a woman wants sex just because she's in your apartment and clear that up before you go down on her.
So unless you wanna fuck a dude you shouldn't be in their apartment?
User Banned (Permanent): Misogyny, history of severe infractions.
Well, you see, when a person comes to your house after a dinner date, you tend to get romantic, never heard of a one night stand? I could see if he forced himself on her, but he assumed wrong and tried to advanced things too quickly, which you're right on that front, but calling this sexual assault is overboard.
It's like people never had a date or, in this case, a bad date before in their life.
This is exactly why people don't come forward. She did leave, but that's not good enough, she should have left after X or Y. It shifts the blame back onto the victim for the actions of the alleged abuser.
He did force himself on her, according to the woman's allegations. She even said "no, I'm done, I want to leave" and he still forced himself on her (kissed her aggressively, tried to get her to perform more oral sex).
So again, you can't end up in someones place and change your mind? Going to a guys apartment is an open invite to pursue a woman and getting her to do some sexual acts?
Of course you can change your mind, you just need to be clear, because one or both parties could be tipsy and non verbal communication might not be enough to signal "I don't want this". And in this case, I think the dude was the drunk one, unless that one glass of wine was enough to get her drunk as well.
I agree with everything that user said. I've also managed to teach people the harm about being racist. I've also experienced casual racism, and I don't think that's the same as being a Nazi or near the same level. Are you going to accuse me of being a alt account also?
How about you not put words in my mouth? If you are feeling uncomfortable, then you probably shouldn't be there. That is a far cry from "So unless you wanna fuck a dude you shouldn't be in their apartment?".
Yeah, looks like I put all of that work into my post for nothing. He forced himself on her multiple times, after she pushed him away, said she was uncomfortable.. even said she doesn't want him to force himself on her, and he did that shit regardless and tried to feed her more alcohol.
You can be in a situation where you think you want sex, but then decide to stop. You may be uncomfortable in going forward with the act but still want to hang around to see how the guy is.
If she was uncomfortable with his advances she may have been worried about saying "Please stop" because of how he'd react. There are many stories of women having this happen to them
Why is this so hard for you all to grasp.
At what point did she walk away? Did she walk away as she was leaving the apartment? Did she push his hand away just before leaving? Context matters in this situation, if she pushed his hand away and he kept advancing, thats sexual harassment. I hope you can see the difference.
I didn't read the entire article because I heard it was quite biased in her favor, but from the woman he was with, she said it was consensual.
Why don't you read the actual allegations? She pushed his hand away multiple times and even said "no", and yet he still tried aggressive sexual moves on her.
When she left is irrelevant to the fact that he committed these acts, according to her.
THATS EXACTLY WHAT HE DID
Did you even bother to read Surfinn post highlighting the moments of physical clues
Almost nobody reads my posts when I put in a shit ton of effort
I think the comparison to racism by deep water is apt.
None thinks they are racist.
Yet people who don’t consider themselves racist will do/say racist things.
I think racism effects everything since we are brought up in a society that is based in white supremacy.
Just like we are brought up in a society that indoctrinate us in sexism behavior.
We can’t ignore that Aziz acted like many men have and do act (my self including).
The many ideas that give this behavior (mens self worth coupled to how many girls he sleeps with and a shitload more).
I didn’t like the way they wrote the first article and almost nothing that followed after.
I wish it was framed as a issue of how men put their sexuality over the comfort of others.
None thinks they are racist.
Yet people who don’t consider themselves racist will do/say racist things.
I think racism effects everything since we are brought up in a society that is based in white supremacy.
Just like we are brought up in a society that indoctrinate us in sexism behavior.
We can’t ignore that Aziz acted like many men have and do act (my self including).
The many ideas that give this behavior (mens self worth coupled to how many girls he sleeps with and a shitload more).
I didn’t like the way they wrote the first article and almost nothing that followed after.
I wish it was framed as a issue of how men put their sexuality over the comfort of others.
I just remember a lot of people saying this was a gray stain to the MeToo movement, so that's why I got interested in this thread and the allegations being brought up again, but I guess it was more to it than I initially thought. And no, not on incel/alt right forums, but on television shows such as The View (is the view even good, lol)
I dislike the notion that peoples careers should be ruined because of the "guilty until proven innocent" clause that's in effect in today's day and age, especially if it truly was a case of a bad date / drunk dude not getting physical cues. I just feel like if the dude wasn't famous, this wouldn't be any different from your average bad date, but who am I to know? Maybe thats part of the issue.
No, you need to look at the actual allegations before passing judgment on the situation. Literally no one here is saying he's guilty in the court of law. This is a common talking point that holds no water. Public opinion does not equate to rule of law.
Read the damn account and tell me it's representative of a common "bad date". I'll wait.
Yes, being on the receiving end of racism is crazily exhausting. "Casual" racism still drains you.
Point?
True, but allegations can ruin a persons life/career, much like being guilty in the court of law would. They hold a lot of power, and proven allegations totally should.
A drunk dude trying to advance on a girl when shes not willing, I'm sure that happens all the time, men assume the woman is down, but is not, and ends up a nasty mess. This is assuming he was drunk, and I'm against drunk dating for this very reason, you lose a lot of common sense and is a bad excuse to use in court or in other situations.
Not a bad date, but a terrible date.
People are free to support or not support allegations of sexual harassment/assault/abuse, as they should be. If there is criminal action that is pursued in the court of law, that's different.
I'm gunna choose to support people who come out with allegations.
Supporting allegations is totally alright, I just don't support extremely strong allegations without sufficient proof that could ruin a persons life (not talking about this case, but, for example, a false assault allegation that could jail a man for 25+ years)
What do you call a person who always believes innocent until proven guilty? Gullible? I guess that's me.
Who here is trying to say he should be put in jail? We're reading the account of the story, his acknowledgement of the situation, and deciding to read it as a sexual assault issue
Yes, it does, which is exactly why #MeToo exists. That doesn't make it any less wrong. But that's not a "bad date", that's sexual abuse/assault.
Ok. So you've stopped listening, thanks for letting me know.
Oh, you got banned. Well.. bye.
I'll admit I haven't watched that show in a long time, he was absent during at least one season wasn't he?
I don't understand what my post count has to do with my opinion on the matter. By saying that I am an alt account, you are implying that I am somehow ashamed of this opinion. Like what the fuck, just because I want to fight racism my way (and I have been a victim of severe racism. Being called a terrorist my entire fucking teenage life damaged me in a way I don't think you can ever understand) doesn't mean I'm this alt-right personality that you think I am.
Anyways I'm derailing the thread, I apologize.
Nope, he was there the whole time. You might be thinking of Chris Pratt who was absent from the first half of Season 6 to film Guardians of the Galaxy.
I could pull the same stuff but then all we’d be doing is playing oppression Olympics.
So you weren't glad then? He never left. Only guy to leave was the one who played Mark after season 2, and then Rob Lowe and Rashida Jones left mid-way through season 6 and Chris Pratt was gone for 6 weeks at the start of season 6 in order to shoot GotG 1. Aziz was always there and with the exception of season 1, was always an incredibly funny member of the cast.
I'm not responding to casual racism the same way as something more sinister.
I don't have that kinda energy
Deaf woman was also part of the writers room for that Ep cause he wanted to include a deaf perspective.
I did not know this. That just makes the episode even better. I love showing that episode to people. I think it's an important piece of inclusion and representation.
It's funny to me how the best episodes of that show, for me, were less about Dev. The one with his family & eating dinner, Lena's thanksgiving one, and the deaf episode.
I would agree, however I would say what complicates this is I believe there was consensual oral sex early on at the apartment I believe?
That's not really a regular "hey lets look around my apartment, oh hey you're going down on me now I guess or I'm eating you out, now lets get back to the tour of my apartment" ... that's kind of a different situation. Not saying I agree with what he did, but it's not impossible to see how signals might get crossed.
The lead up to this was her saying "I went through with it thinking it would help things". Again, not an uncommon thing for women to talk about happening in situations. Where they just go through an act in hopes of getting the situation over.
Which ironically enough the character of Tom is all about not understanding what woman want and think.
Ultimately I think he is in the wrong, that said performing and receiving oral sex from someone usually sends a message that actual sex is going to follow at some point. Maybe there needs to be more nuance to things, but it's not impossible to see where intentions get mixed up once that is put on the table.
I don't think that's true. I wish there was a way to "like" or equivalent individual posts, because I understand wanting feedback after making a post that took effort. Quoting posts with "good post", "this", "I agree" etc. could clog up this forum fast. I just wanted to highlight that effort is read, even if you don't necessarily get feedback from it.
Those are direct lines from her story. There is plenty more to go through and I suggest you re-read it, carefully as it's poorly written, and think about the whole thing.
There is no nuance to this. If a woman makes verbal and physical queues that she doesn't want sex, be it vaginal or oral, that doesn't give the guy the ok to point to his dick. She clearly recognizes that she did it out of pressure and the moment.
The truth is if a post is making a point that's more than a few sentences, people typically don't tend to care enough to read them. I'm not looking for "great post!", I'm looking for some kind of discussion that forms as a result, even if it's from people who disagree. I'm sure there are people who read long posts and don't respond in any way, but I think the vast amount of people who are scrolling threads aren't doing it.
