Bane vs. Batman VS. Captain America vs. Winter Soldier: Which fight scene do you like more?

What was the better fight scene?

  • Batman vs. Bane in DKR

  • Winter Soldier vs. Captain America in Cap2


Results are only viewable after voting.
Oct 27, 2017
541
Cap vs WS is superior but it still has its own issues as well. Editing is choppy and the camera is too up close in some shots. The Russo's have made this a habit when it comes to way they shoot their H2H combat sequences.
 

JB1981

Member
Oct 28, 2017
7,450
The Bane scene is better. Way better cinematography, set design, audio design, fight progression, storytelling, dialogue, etc. some of the choreography is too loose for my tastes, but the gifs are not a fair indication of the final sequence. I don’t even like the movie much, but when the door shuts Batman in and no music is played over the fight, shit got real. It’s a good dramatic sequence told through action.
Yup
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,717
Before I came into the thread I was gonna say that the Cap v Bucky fight scene is way better but I decided to watch both clips before posting.

The choreography in the Bane fight is as bad as I remember but at least the way it's filmed means you can see what is going on clearly. Unfortunately what is going is two slow dudes throwing slow ass punches that look so ponderous that I feel as though I could beat either of them in a fight and I'm old and fat.

Cap v Bucky has a couple of cool gif-able moments but fucking hell the cinematography/editing is even worse than I remember, the constant cuts make it horrible to watch.

In conclusion: I'm abstaining from this vote.
 

TheMadTitan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,745
This looks better than the finished product which is a real shame.
American action movies are only just now getting away from the constant jump cuts thanks to John Wick. Well, at least the mainstream ones. Shit starring Michael Jai White never really had much of them, lol. I think Deadpool and Atomic Blonde are the only ones beside John Wick without a bazillion cuts, but everything else is slowly catching up.

We still have Asian action movies, though.
 

HammerOfThor

Member
Oct 26, 2017
817
Yeah the gifs are pretty unfair to this scene in DKR. It's like when images of mid-animation are taken from Dragonball Super to showcase how bad it is.

If you watch the scene normally its really good.

I personally prefer Winter Soldier tho.
 

Heshinsi

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,095
Edmonton
Cap vs Winter Soldier not only is the far superior show down, but the emotional impact to the reveal of who the Winter Soldier is hits so much harder than finding out that Bane is Talia’s juiced up foot soldier. What a terrible conclusion to that story.
 

Zaied

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,449
The Bane fights from The Dark Knight Rises, and the SWAT scene from The Dark Knight are three of my favorite action scenes in any comic book film. One shows the strategic brilliance of Batman — that even when the situation spins out of control and he has to improvise, he's still capable of saving the day without any loss of life. Thematically, the Bane fight was exceptional; Ra's al Ghul's two greatest students using the same exact teachings to break each other physically and spiritually. Nolan shot it very well, and he did a good job of setting up the right amount of drama. The Bane fight was also the first time we had ever seen Batman truly weak and powerless; even in Batman Begins when Scarecrow lit him on fire, Alfred and Lucius were able to save him. No one was coming to save Bruce this time, and that level of vulnerability in a story about Bane showed that Nolan really understood the character.
 

TheMadTitan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,745
The Bane fights from The Dark Knight Rises, and the SWAT scene from The Dark Knight are three of my favorite action scenes in any comic book film. One shows the strategic brilliance of Batman — that even when the situation spins out of control and he has to improvise, he's still capable of saving the day without any loss of life. Thematically, the Bane fight was exceptional; Ra's al Ghul's two greatest students using the same exact teachings to break each other physically and spiritually. Nolan shot it very well, and he did a good job of setting up the right amount of drama. The Bane fight was also the first time we'd had ever seen Batman truly weak and powerless; even if Batman Begins when Scarecrow lit him on fire, Alfred and Lucius were able to save him. No one was coming to save Bruce this time, and that level of vulnerability in a story about Bane showed that Nolan really understood the character.
But the set piece that all of those revolve around -- the fights -- are total ass. So everything building up to the conflict may be cool, but it's all useless if the conflict is atrocious.
 

bwahhhhh

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
770
Cap and Winter soldier objectively

Bane vs Batman irrationally

I voted Bane and Batman
same. The Bane vs Batman fight left an emotional impact when I saw it in the theater (though it was more a beatdown than a fight) and i thought about it after.

Viewing both those clips, yeah the WS fight is better choreographed but... I didn't think about it at all after the movie was over. I never thought of it as anything remarkable, either, until I saw these poll results.
 

Prine

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,079
Bane fight had a lasting impact. Cap, brushes himself off and goes again (boring).

I admit the Cap fight is choreographed much better, but it was forgettable because it was like a Family Guy fight, throwing everything at each other, rinse repeat for 10 minutes that leads to nothing. Dont say it came to an illuminating moment between the two through a flurry of fists, cant roll my eyes harder.
 
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Oct 26, 2017
8,385
Bat vs Bane is better. Overall. There's more to a fight scene than just how well the blows connect as a bit of eh is to be expected. It's how you frame and progress the fight that really matters. Cap vs Bucky is some d-tier The Raid stuff. That's all it really has. Like, TWS went for some Bourne trilogy stuff but they even forgot what makes those fights good: not the kinetic realism (because Bourne and his fights actually miss a ton if you look) but how its staged, shot, and the sort of grittiness of it. Bat vs Bane isn't going for some grand martial artist 1v1. It went for story and domination which it achieved in spades. It is a much better scene than Cap vs Bucky. To deny that means you only see fists and nothing else.
 

More_Badass

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,784
The actual fight is over-edited unfortunately.
Civil War’s fights in Laos, particularly the Black Widow one, has a similar issue. The b-roll flows better than the fight in the movie

I don’t particularly mind it - the editing isn’t as bad as Taken movies - but it’s a shame that it could have better
 

Zaied

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,449
But the set piece that all of those revolve around -- the fights -- are total ass. So everything building up to the conflict may be cool, but it's all useless if the conflict is atrocious.
I thought everything else that went into those scenes were done well enough to carry the action and negate the lack of special fight choreography (which certainly wasn't Nolan's strong suit). There are many fight scenes that may have good choreography, but fail to resonate with me in the same way as the Bane fight in their totality (e.g. basically anything in BvS). Also, I think the basic, hopeless fighting style that Bruce employs in the Bane fight fits with how broken, out of shape, and mentally shot he was by the time Selina shuts the gate on him, and he's forced to rely on skills he hadn't used in years, against someone who was his equal. I would say that most fights are probably more pleasing to the eye than what the Nolan films offer, but Nolan did a good job of making those scenes stick with me.
 

LL_Decitrig

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,890
Sunderland
As I said in the other poll thread, the comic bookiness of Batman puts me off. However even accounting for that I ended up wishing Bane would just shut up.

Steve versus Bucky is interesting, and the reveal is well handled. That wins by default.
 

TheMadTitan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,745
I thought everything else that went into those scenes were done well enough to carry the action and negate the lack of special fight choreography (which certainly wasn't Nolan's strong suit). There are many fight scenes that may have good choreography, but fail to resonate with me in the same way as the Bane fight in their totality (e.g. basically anything in BvS). Also, I think the basic, hopeless fighting style that Bruce employs in the Bane fight fits with how broken, out of shape, and mentally shot he was by the time Selina shuts the gate on him, and he's forced to rely on skills he hadn't used in years, against someone who was his equal. I would say that most fights are probably more pleasing to the eye than what the Nolan films offer, but Nolan did a good job of making those scenes stick with me.
None of those scenes stick with me because they're comically awful and are ripe for immediate criticism. They immediately defeat all context surrounding them. You can show an exhausted and out of shape superhero get their ass kicked by someone their skilled equal and in better shape with better choreography. Hell, Jackie Chan made a career out of expressing his characters barely getting through fights (and soundly getting his ass kicked in others until his comeback later on in the movie).

Nolan's strong suit not being fight scenes isn't an excuse because he could've easily hired people who have skills in fight cinematography and coreography as assistant directors.

The Russos did sitcoms and rom-coms before Winter Soldier; do you think they had any idea how to properly direct and film fight scenes? Probably not, but they probably got people on board who did to help them out.
 

Otnopolit

Member
Oct 28, 2017
353
Bane fight had a lasting impact. Cap, brushes himself off and goes again (boring).

I admit the Cap fight is choreographed much better, but it was forgettable because it was like a Family Guy fight, throwing everything at each other, rinse repeat for 10 minutes that leads to nothing. Dont say it came to an illuminating moment between the two through a flurry of fists, cant roll my eyes harder.
So your only metric is narrative impact? Both fights lead to the plot evolving, Batman did have much bigger repercussions, no doubt.

But then you went and compared Winter Soldier's to a cartoon? I'm all for hyperbole, but seriously? It sounds like you don't care enough about the characters to vote the other way despite admitting that the choreography (you know, the foundation of fights) was better in Captain America.
 

Zaied

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,449
None of those scenes stick with me because they're comically awful and are ripe for immediate criticism. They immediately defeat all context surrounding them. You can show an exhausted and out of shape superhero get their ass kicked by someone their skilled equal and in better shape with better choreography. Hell, Jackie Chan made a career out of expressing his characters barely getting through fights (and soundly getting his ass kicked in others until his comeback later on in the movie).

Nolan's strong suit not being fight scenes isn't an excuse because he could've easily hired people who have skills in fight cinematography and coreography as assistant directors.

The Russos did sitcoms and rom-coms before Winter Soldier; do you think they had any idea how to properly direct and film fight scenes? Probably not, but they probably got people on board who did to help them out.
I think they're legitimately good scenes, especially the SWAT one. And Nolan did hire people and actual martial artists to help with the fight direction in his films and decided on Keysi. It's not the most pleasing fighting style, but it's brutally effective and realistic, which is tailor-made for this depiction of Batman. Nolan also had a specific way that he wanted to shoot his fight scenes, and wanted Bale to be heavily involved in the stunts. His mindset in Batman Begins with the erratic, quick-cut fight scenes was to show what Batman looked like from a criminal perspective, which he dropped in the sequels so that we could see the action.


TDKR did have some noticeable editing errors, however, so I think the choreography was a step back from TDK, overall.
 
Oct 28, 2017
3,242
It's not really a hard choice. The Bane fight is a lot better because there is actual weight to the fight. The fighting cinematography is nowhere as advanced or as well executed as the Winter Soldier fight, but it is still a lot more visually readable. The Winter Soldier fights has far too many cuts done to really speed up the movements and it makes things less cohesive. It doesn't help that the Winter Soldier fight feels very inconsequential. Both sides keep managing to block damaging blows. It makes it feel more like a dance than a fight. At least in the Bane fight, it feels like what is happening is about to be consequential to the plot. You're thinking "Oh man, Batman is fucked". And I think they did an excellent job of showing Bane's physical and mental advantages over Batman. You felt like he was being cut down as a man playing pretend or something. That's tough to beat with a flashy inconsequential fighting sequence.
 

Drewton

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,234
Winter Soldier is great but the TDKR fight is better with a great sense of doom. There’s way more weight to it. The poll results are ridiculous.
 
Jan 10, 2018
3,422
Cap vs Winter Soldier not only is the far superior show down, but the emotional impact to the reveal of who the Winter Soldier is hits so much harder than finding out that Bane is Talia’s juiced up foot soldier. What a terrible conclusion to that story.
The issue is (for me) the fight is never about the reveal. Or anything for that matter. Its just 2 evenly matched forces, something we have seen countless times.
 

Wes D. Mess

Avenger
Aug 11, 2018
318
Chicago
Voted for Bat/Bane.

The choreography is def worse than Cap/WS, but to me the Batman fight felt more intense. Just seeing Bane beat the shit outta Bats...woo.

Which just makes their 2nd fight all the more disappointing...hell the entire 2nd half of TDKR is just blah.
 
Apr 17, 2019
357
Viridia
Umm reading the posts of those who endorsed the Bane fight, somehow I get the feeling they would still vote for Bane even if it was up against the Raids, Ip Man, Jackie Chan or any other fight choreography masterpieces.

Cinematic atmosphere, narrative consequences over choreography huh...even though the thread title is explicitly only about the fight scenes. Not that I can't appreciate the former two but...Oh well, different strokes for different folks.
 

Merv

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,663
Bane fight had a lasting impact. Cap, brushes himself off and goes again (boring).

I admit the Cap fight is choreographed much better, but it was forgettable because it was like a Family Guy fight, throwing everything at each other, rinse repeat for 10 minutes that leads to nothing. Dont say it came to an illuminating moment between the two through a flurry of fists, cant roll my eyes harder.
Batman heals a broken back and a bum knee in three months in prison. That is zero impact and bad writing to boot. The second Bane vs Batman fight is worse.

At the end of Winter Soldier Cap breaks Bucky's arm and chokes him out. Thats the fight we should be talking about honestly.