Ye. I think the clip was already trending the other day anyway without the campaign having to get directly involved.
It will have a different tone for sure lol
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Bernie really out here cutting ads with Joe Rogan's endorsement (SEE STAFF POST)
- Thread starter GrapeApes
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The justification is to do as much as possible to knock Biden out of the race, and defeat Trump. Bernie is far and away the best viable candidate right now.
I don't know what's complicated about this.
We can only hope Sanders would immediately distance himself, but we know how shrewd and expedient he can be.
I thought we liked realpolitik here? I'm confused by the reactions in this thread. I don't like Rogan, as he's a gullible dunce who platforms awful people, but he's one of the biggest podcasters online, and a gateway to millions of potential voters.
If Rogan is going to be a class traitor and support Bernie I'm... ok with that, and I'm ok with Bernie retweeting it.
Like, Bernie has a live chance to win this thing. Let's take it?
If Rogan is going to be a class traitor and support Bernie I'm... ok with that, and I'm ok with Bernie retweeting it.
Like, Bernie has a live chance to win this thing. Let's take it?
Wow Bernie fans want to actually win an election and remove Trump from office, disgusting.
I know that the reaction would be different with a different name in the title and the explanation seems to be "Bad things are bad when bad people do them, but when good people I like do bad things it's for the 'greater good', also I'm all for realpoltik now."
Y'all complaining about electability, but then throw Bernie under the bus when he gets possibly the strongest endorsement ever.
I dont like Rogan or his show, but it has reach with a lot of people, and I don't see how this undermines Sanders' message or ideals.
I dont like Rogan or his show, but it has reach with a lot of people, and I don't see how this undermines Sanders' message or ideals.
I would agree with "I don't see how this contradicts Sanders' message or ideals" because it doesn't. But effectively saying 'Look which bigot likes us!' to their 10m followers definitely undermines his message since the message is about inclusion, LGBTQ+ rights, etc.
If Rogan wants to endorse Bernie fine that's okay.
My issue is them trumpeting this endorsement from such a shithead. Sorry I just don't think "hey don't step over our trans comrades" is in any way too much to ask, or even a fucking challenging bar to step over. It's an unforced error, and one that again makes me question his team's judgment.
My issue is them trumpeting this endorsement from such a shithead. Sorry I just don't think "hey don't step over our trans comrades" is in any way too much to ask, or even a fucking challenging bar to step over. It's an unforced error, and one that again makes me question his team's judgment.
The amount of "dont worry it's for the greater good" is pretty not good in my opinion. Especially given that this isn't a huge thing that's going to super strongly affect the race and people are still acting like this.
He's my easy second choice after Liz but yea I don't like this, Rogan caters to a gross,gross audience
the thing is this also doesn't hurt anyone. bernie accepting the endorsement is not a tacit approval of everything that rogan has said or does
accepting an endorsement is much, much different than actively working with republicans
but Bernie didn't go out of his way to appeal to Joe Rogan, he just said out his plan. Do you not understand the difference?
Do you want him to be flawless or do you wanna actually win and remove that orange shitstain from office?
Anger or disappointment? It's just, make no mistake about it, and there's no real argument to be made that Joe Rogan isn't a porridge-brained shit who happens to have one of the largest megaphones in America. Speaking for myself, even if he's a lost cause, I prefer some attempt at engagement and swaying the crowds he draws instead of writing them off and dropping them into the deplorable bin.
I'm not sure you understood my point. It's not about the interview. It's about boosting a questionable character's endorsement.
It is a bit funny to see him throw Cenk under the bus, but embrace Rogan. Odd times we live in.
I don't think your post reflects what you're trying to say. I think we all unequivocally agree that the boosting wasn't necessary.
he didn't throw cenk under the bus, he rightly withdrew his endorsement
I think you need to put this in context of who actually dislike Rogan, and who considers him an actual stochastic terrorist.
In the very left sphere, yes, Rogan is a stochastic terrorist. He has enabled and hosted bigots, racists, nazis etc etc. but is this the hill that's worth dying on if it undermines Sanders' chance at actually winning? Especially when this isn't an endorsement of Rogan. Sanders just told Rogan what he believes in, and Rogan said "I like that".
I'm personally starting to feel that "identity politics" and "purity tests" are detrimental to actual change. Actual change comes from fixing class issues with education and more wealth distribution. Yes, we need to call out bigots, but without actual change of the systems behind them, there'll just be another bigot tomorrow created by the system.
With this said, I will not belittle or blame anyone from being frustrated and sad for what this advert means for them. I can't tell anyone who's been actively or indirectly hurt by Joe Rogan and his actions, that their feelings aren't valid; they are.
For an election cycle with a lot of noise about pragmatism ("vote for any Dem, we simply must defeat Trump"), there's sure a lot of pearl clutching when one candidate, who is in the lead right now in a at least one representative poll, actually does the pragmatic thing to get a lot more potential votes
Nothing quite like a thread full of cis people telling us that Bernie providing a stronger platform for Joe Rogan is somehow a massive positive for trans people, and that by daring to criticize this that we're just giving up on beating Trump. It really shows just how plainly people see us as a sacrificial chip they're willing to give up to win
Yo. Come on. If your campaign is posting excitedly about someone endorsing you, then you're implicitly saying that the person endorsing you is someone worth getting excited over. Which sucks to some people given this guy platforms racists and transphobes on the fucking daily.
I mean as expected im not surprised to see defenders. We all know this convo won't be the same had Rogan endorsed someone else. Just keep showing your hypocrisy.
Do you honestly think that people advocating for one form of pragmatism means that they're okay with any and every form of pragmatism?
the *endorsement* is worth getting excited over. it is not an approval of everything that person says or does.
bernie didn't compromise anything he said or does or believe in when talking with rogan and his base and he won them over. that's a positive thing and the campaign should be proud of that. considering so many people care about bridging games and bringing people over from other sides this is something that should rightly be celebrated
this doesn't mean that bernie cares less about trans people or suddenly is transphobe. it means that his LGBTQ+ positive message can reach people who have been bigoted towards those people
This is why the tweet is not sitting right with me. And especially after all the shit happened in regards to trans issues on ERA.
i understand this frustration, but bernie didn't compromise any of his views to win this endorsement. he's still the same pro-trans candidate he always was, accepting this endorsement doesn't change or damage that, and i don;t think sanders boosting this endorsement to his base is suddenly going to turn people already sympathetic to his message into transphobes that would wildly conflict with his message
The argument is that if Bernie is signal boosting a transphobe, that is compromising his beliefs. So people feel thrown under the bus when that's framed as being uncompromising or worth celebrating.
Ok im not anti Bernie in anyway we'd be blessed to have him as president. But many cadidates do the "pragmatic" thing all of the time and it's not ok but somehow this time its perfectly fine. We all need to admit that there is little to discuss beyond that fact that most people just want their guy to win. I could care less unless that guy is Trump.
p.s. Whatever Bernie has to do to garner votes and win is fine by me just as it would be if it was Liz or Joe.
p.s. Whatever Bernie has to do to garner votes and win is fine by me just as it would be if it was Liz or Joe.
What the hell does a person's views have to do with a person's actions?
he's signal boosting a known transphobe and racist.
If he can convince even some to vote for him or not to vote for Trump, its a win for him. Makes sense to do it when trying to win.
You do understand that for some people, even people who want Bernie to win, it isn't worth being excited over because of the caliber of person Joe Rogan is. And when you promote someone on your political platform you are showing approval of that person.
Maybe given how quick Bernie was to pull Cenk's endorsement, if we actually find a way to explain to his campaign why the retweet was bad they'll undo it?
i'm not saying everyone has to be happy with it, i'm certainly not, but it makes sense and doesn't compromise his beliefs at all
I aggressively dislike Sanders, but giving him shit for this is a lot of why I don't trust him or his base in a general election. He's running to earn more votes than he already has and endorsements from different audiences are an important way he can get them.
A Joe Rogan endorsment is kinda big, he has insane reach. He can sway non voters and undecided ones.
He would be insane not to capitalize on it.
This does not mean Rogan is a good person.
He would be insane not to capitalize on it.
This does not mean Rogan is a good person.
he's signal boosting an endorsement from someone that could be considered a gateway to the right, he's not signal boosting the other views rogan has. tweeting this endorsement is no different than tweeting about bernie's appearance on the podcast and appearing on the podcast at all. in hindsight it was a good move that worked
yeah this is a much more succinct way of how i feel. accepting the endorsement does not mean accepting rogan
I think what you're trying to say is that Bernie has not compromised on any of his policies, and I would agree with that. If Bernie gets into office, endorsing Rogan would ultimately not affect the policies that he wants to accomplish. But, it does compromise the safety and well being of trans people in ways that you don't seem to be fully grasping. The simple truth is, life is difficult for trans people because of transphobic people. A lot of people that I've interacted with and asked questions about how to solve these systemic issues largely said that they don't think about them because they don't know anyone trans in their life. The same is likely true of Joe Rogan's audience, as well as Bernie Sanders supporters. It's dangerous to provide a platform to people with bigoted views of us because it can validate negative preconceptions that people have about trans people and give confidence to hate that otherwise would not exist.
You all keep bringing up this idea that Bernie needed to accept this endorsement when he really didn't. It did not give more credibility to the endorsement but did signal boost that Sanders wants people to see Joe Rogan here.
How is a retweet worse than actually going on the show in August? Or have people been annoyed about that for this long?
I think if we go by the "the ends justify the means"-logic, trans people are right to be miffed about this.
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