which is what im trying to say, at the end of the day "ANY DEM" might win this election.
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Bernie Sanders: Barack Obama won 10% of the white vote in Mississippi. That speaks to very bad work done by Democrats there
- Thread starter GrapeApes
- Start date
Seems like liberals have gone all in on "an unquestionable majority of the people in question are incurably programmed for hatred." This is absolving of the need to reach out to normal non-voting types for whom race clearly isn't a driving motivator. Also clearly a really great way to lose power! You have to wonder what would happen if the party took a genuine look at the question you've posed.
Guess we'll never know!
nah. This isn't the first time he's said something to this effect.
And clencher even here
People in any other thread wouldn't give two shits about whites in Mississippi.
Been years since I've read it but the GOP strategy for decades was/is to focus on wedge issues and consistently present government intervention as evil. Was particularly easy to target rural white Christians (many working class) to get them to prioritize social issues that were given a sort of urgency and hysteria. Also: Taxes are bad and the welfare state is for lazy people.
You're distorting what was said. nelsonroyale has a good and succinct way of explaining it:
I think re-framing this language is important.
When we see threads of similar "reach across the isle" bullshit from Biden, everyone rightfully dogpiles him for being a naive dumbass. But when Bernie espouses rhetoric of the same nature, there's an entire defense force of "But what's the big deal?!"
Language like this is damaging and it prevents progress by not talking about the root of a lot of these issues. Stop putting things on "economic anxiety". Shit's always been about race.
User Banned (permanent): consistent generalizations and account in junior phase
the problem is that this forum really isn't that far left, it's mostly just obama/clinton-tier liberals with no sense of historical materialism. it's further left than most gaming communities but that speaks more about gaming communities than anything.
because when Biden does it, it's about allowing the right to dictate how much we crank up the austerity knob on economically disadvantaged people. What Bernie is doing here is saying that more needs to be done to convince people that Biden's brand of politics doesn't represent the democrats (good luck with that lol)
disingenuous equivocation ya got there though
The intent is to separate the regular ppl from the republican politicians
i dont understand why this biden point keeps being repeated
Bernie is saying that the Dems can do better campaigning in Mississippi. This isn't him saying reach across the aisle and compromise with Republicans
nah that's being generous to Bernie. The only way Bernie believes it could be true is if he absolutely ignores everything about Mississippi in practice like the fact that it took until 2013 for the 13th amendment to be ratified in MS, the flag of MS, and the fact that a lot of political ads anti-social safety net/education access lead with the fact that MS tax dollars should go to Hinds county. Oh, you also have to ignore the fact that Bernie says being uncomfortable voting for a candidate who is black is not necessarily racist.
bernie went out of his way to mention people from Mississippi oh no !!
I know a lot of people on era championed Hillary when she called some trump voters "deplorables" but that ended up hurting her. It made for a feel good moment for liberals, but at the end of the day we are trying to get votes. It's stupid politics to call a segment of voters racist. Even though of course they are.
why should bernie kneecap himself and call voters racist? To make era posters approve? Sorry but this is an election and sadly we need some racist white peoples votes. I as a private person can say fuck these rural white racist people all day. Politicians don't have that luxury.
Threads like these are posted in bad faith. It's an attempt to distort what Bernie Sanders said and a chance for people to put words in his mouth. Any mention of people from southern states that don't attack those voters is now some kind of approval of racism and sexism? That's what you guys really believe?
I know a lot of people on era championed Hillary when she called some trump voters "deplorables" but that ended up hurting her. It made for a feel good moment for liberals, but at the end of the day we are trying to get votes. It's stupid politics to call a segment of voters racist. Even though of course they are.
why should bernie kneecap himself and call voters racist? To make era posters approve? Sorry but this is an election and sadly we need some racist white peoples votes. I as a private person can say fuck these rural white racist people all day. Politicians don't have that luxury.
Threads like these are posted in bad faith. It's an attempt to distort what Bernie Sanders said and a chance for people to put words in his mouth. Any mention of people from southern states that don't attack those voters is now some kind of approval of racism and sexism? That's what you guys really believe?
because he is saying Dems should campaign for the people that vote for republicans.
or are you saying that Dems haven't won MS for decades because they are lazy or don't want to?
or is this the mythical not-Racist but not voting for Dems for X and Y voting group that exists to be tapped.
There's a pretty large gap between attacking the voters and calling the smallest loss margin in decades a failure because they only captured 10% of the white vote.
I mean he attacked democrats in the state lol, he was still attacking people.
I'm not saying anything other than that comparison is false because when Biden says reach across the aisle he's saying compromise with Mitch McConnell and what Bernie is saying here is to actually campaign in all 50 states including Mississippi
again, Bernie could have stopped after the first two sentences, but he didn't. He also chose to say being uncomfortable voting for a candidate who is black because they are black is not necessarily racist in the past. This is not a single isolated datapoint. It's a datapoint in a pattern of statements Bernie has made prioritizing economic policy about policies about race or gender.
I'm afraid you're right. I had hoped for better, but the amount of people willing to overlook downplaying racism is concerning. Clearly, while left-leaning, it still attracts a lot of people who wouldn't mind throwing minorities under the bus in order to appeal to racists. A lot of progress yet to be made!
Throwing minorities under the bus by having these policy positions
Alright so we have this quote vs
Policy positions of Bernie
1. Expunge records of all drug-only offenders, legalize marijuana
2. Incarcerated population voting rights
3. End cash bail and for profit prisons
4. Free college & cancel student debt (of which higher % of people of color suffer from)
5. Medicare for All (free to the point of service health care & less expensive, everyone is covered)
6. End police force for mental health situations, homelessness, maintenance violations
7. Eliminate past-due medical debt
8. Address massive disparities in availability of financial services, health disparities, environmental disparities, & educational disparities
9. Withholding funding to Israel if they don't start treating Palestinians in a humane manner
And by rallying around these talking points
"Women deserve equal pay!"
"Black women are 3x more likely to die while giving birth!"
"We have a racial criminal justice system"
And so on. You guys have lost some perspective. At the end of the day, Bernie's policy positions are the policies that will bring down the power of the straight white men the most of all the candidates. There is no getting around this fact.
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Who's arguing against those policy positions here? You can have those positions and still put out shitty statements on race in America constantly. Bernie does it!
Of course. However, trying to paint Bernie as bad on race compared to the rest of the candidates just doesn't make sense when we look at the totality of candidates.
What else would you call someone saying securing 98% of the black vote and losing the state in the lowest margin since 1976 is a failure because they didn't attract enough white people?
Some people misinterpreting what the argument here is. No one is saying that no one can ever change. No one is saying that the "deplorables" comment was good for Hillary politically even if it was true. No, the argument is that it's idiotic to target them at all, because when it comes down to it a few words in a presidential campaign won't mean anything against the spigot of bigotry from right wing media that they (as a bloc) happily lap at. It's a waste of resources, and it grinds with minorities that need to be turned out more for the effort. Put that energy and money into energizing people you know will vote for you.
If he's not reaching across the aisle here, are you suggesting that it's Dem leaners (on this side of the aisle, as it were) who haven't been reached? In Mississippi?
Some of y'all need to go out and talk to black Southerners. As a white Mississippian, I'll say 90% of us being racist is lowballing it. But of course, this is the guy that believes some Trump voters just came down with the economic anxiety real bad.
None of which is relevant to the issue described in the title: appealing to racist voters.
I was gently pointing out that being progressive is not just about economic policies but also social ones.
To be somewhat fair to Bernie here, he has many plans for minorities and the base of his movement is making nonvoters and progressives turn out. Will it work? We"ll have to see.
Of every candidate Bernie is best on pretty much each of those topics in this race... The only one you could argue he isn't is gun control. Insinuating that "the working class" that Bernie and his supporters are referring to is a dog whistle for "give only white people shit" is absurd and a lie. How in any way is anything Bernie and his campaign pushing for going to roll back LGBTQ, civil rights, prison reform, health care, climate change etc? In every area assuming the votes can be obtained things would only get better. Do you think this "trend" means he already has or is going to abandon these principles?
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To be fair to Bernie, I'm not saying this is a make or break thing at all. Of course you have a bunch of posters in here saying that we should try harder for the state and that's nuts.
What does writing off 90% of white mississippians as racist do for minorities exactly?
I guess there might be some vindictive pleasure in it, but it only hurts the push for racial equality to write off the state and by extension the minorities in it.
It is very much relevant. This "appeal" vs what he talks about 99.9% of the time isn't much of an appeal. This is just unnecessarily muddying what it means to appeal to that base as if he's conceding on any of his anti-bigotry positions. Let's not confuse the two. He's not pulling a Biden by finding bipartisanship via appealing by compromising his policy positions. That is actual tangible benefit against minorities.
Again, Bernie's appeal to those racists still results in the largest decrease in straight white men power.
What does coddling the electorate that will never vote for him in the GE do for Bernie in the primary??
If he wants to campaign in Mississippi, he's more than welcome to. Last time around, he was busy on the day of the SC primary up north in some lily white state saying the people there were "too smart to not vote for him."
My advice if you wanna appeal to Southern Dems is maybe talk to them for once. Instead he's pandering to white racists who would never vote Dem. Ask a black Mississippian about their white neighbors. The ones who fly the state flag, the Confederate flag (oops, same one!), shoot up memorials to lynched folks.....
But we're in here trying make sure we say #NotAllWhites
what do you actually want bernie to do? he has a consistent history of taking policy positions that benefit minorities. do you want him to just say everyone in mississippi is racist, something that we already know? sure it makes us feel good that we're not racist, but it doesn't actually do anything.
Exactly. It's a pattern with Bernie.
Worse yet, his white supporters enjoy whitesplaining away his racial gaffes and try to erase/silence the concerns of black voters repeatedly.
I mean, you want him to say they're deplorable and give up on them and say they won't get their jobs back?
you don't tbh. the best bet for these people is knowing they'll still reap the benefits of a dem presidency and hopefully somewhere in between all that free healthcare and college they figure out how not to be racist.
A lot of us aren't white. Bernie has more non-white supporters than white supporters. I'm Mexican-American born to parents who worked on the fields picking vegetables.
And that's just %, not raw numbers. Bernie has to work on the boomer generation.
