We need to somehow make that about Sanders since I want to see this.
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Bernie Sanders will Run Again in 2020
- Thread starter RDreamer
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We need to somehow make that about Sanders since I want to see this.
Find me the person who has said there should be no one with an economics degree making decisions. Is it really so much to ask that you have some laborers in there who can provide the perspective on how decisions being made by those elites would hit working class people? Is it so vital that the economists making decisions never be subject to having to be in the same room with a working person or a farmer?
The idea that only "bankers" put up nominees to the Fed is nonsense. We have the AEA, liberal think tanks, and all sorts of other places giving input to Presidents on the topic. Brookings is going to have far more of an impact on who gets picked than say, Goldman Sachs, in a Dem admin.
Yes, you don't need laborers to tell you how things will effect working class people when you have left of center economists who can do that and make recommendations while actually knowing the field and the candidates' work. The idea that they're an out of touch cabal is ridiculous.
it doesn't suck as hard as your "meritocratic" classism
there's nothing actually precluding someone without a career in investment banking from having some say in america's monetary policy other than elitism
there do exist people in varied backgrounds who have studied economics
AOC was a fucking bartender and she can talk around a lot of people in D.C. as well as every online right wing dipshit like Ben Shapiro
is that supposed to make people feel better? liberal think tanks have way too much power and are uniformly garbage
Asking people who are making recommendations on economics staffing to have a background in economics and familiarity with the people involved is not "classism", it's establishing a minimum bar of credentials.
Yes, AOC is incredibly gifted as messaging. Which is an incredibly good skill to have for a politician. And she'd be the first to tell you she shouldn't be appointed to the Fed!
I think, in the same sense as Warren's co-management proposal to have employees on the boards of corporations, it would be good to have some representatives of labor on the Fed board, but farmers are not particularly representative of modern American labor or economics and choosing them rather arbitrarily is a little too redolent of anti-cosmopolitanism to me.
Put the head of a culinary worker's union on there instead.
Put the head of a culinary worker's union on there instead.
well i don't accept your premise that farmers for instance who meet that bar don't exist
it certainly wouldn't be akin to passengers flying an airliner
It's a real galaxy brain moment when you realize being socially liberal but economically conservative isn't really a thing, because those two things are intertwined. It's saying you support the marginalized on a conceptual level, but you don't want to actually do anything about their situation or the causes of it.
Ah yes, like that time Labour economist Ann Pettifor predicted the 2008 crash and was heeded and the crash stopped in time to save hundreds of thousands of middle class people from having to take on the burden of the crisis.
https://www.intheblack.com/articles...-and-why-we-should-listen-to-them-from-now-on
Oh wait no that's the good timeline. Sorry, my feeds are messed up, I forgot we're in the bad one.
Isn't the message of that film like "Not everyone can be a cook, but a great cook can come fron anywhere?"
how's this for a broad brush
no one running the american economy knows what the fuck they are doing, they make decisions that will benefit the richest people- not ones that will prevent the economy from crashing again, which is why it probably will within the next two years
Yes, it absolutely would be. I have a bachelor's in the subject and I'd be horribly unqualified to pick out a fed chair beyond vetoing the obvious crazies because I don't know the work of the candidates well enough to do that. And if I don't know enough, someone who doesn't even do anything related to the field certainly wouldn't be there.
I'm not saying they're perfect (Greenspan suuuuuuucked, and Navarro is accellerating the inevitable recession as we speak.) but Navarro would not pass a Senate vote for a Fed chair because he's fucking crazy, which is why Trump ended up having to nominate someone really boring.
Trump is President, so not really.
This is an astoundingly bad take, at least when it comes to the Fed. It's very much applicable to Trump and co though.
Not everyone can be a president, but a president can come from Vermont
I think the moral was "Bernie is a rat, and criticism is fake news spread by petty assholes who miss their mommies"
Yes. It's pretty apropos to the American democratic ideal.
Some of you all know investment banking isn't what the name implies, right? It's a complete misnomer.
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You are being really dense here. It's almost like you don't understand that there is such a thing as consumer advocacy, and banking is a service to be "consumed". No one thinks that we should put a farmer in charge of monetary policy. Im almost 100% sure Bernie is talking about consumer advocacy and how it makes no sense for the bankers to be influencing that aspect.
It's largely an American phenomenon. We are taught that all of us can make it by our bootstraps but to also treat everyone equally. Except the poor, they're lazy. And those lazy poor people often tend to be nonwhite...hm. But the bootstraps!
I don't really find that your analogy fits the situation. Your doctor is paid to help you and has every reason to, the bankers don't (and will in many cases profit off of what hurts you). I tried to think of a better analogy with the doctor, but there really isn't one that fits (that I can think of).
Once again, not saying this is a real solution, but it's not terrible to have some people that represent working class people. It's elitist to say there isn't a smart farmer with the best of intentions (and some understating of economics), who will do better than some guy who is a banker, with the worst of intentions.
Not just an American phenomenon.
It's like this here in the Philippines too. I don't know how much of it is from American colonialism or how much of it is from the Philippines' love for the US but there.
I know. But that's the point of his article. Did you read it?
EDIT:
Let me clarify a bit. His point is that there are bankers on the board, and that's why it's bad. So why would a representative of laborers or farmers do worse.
They don't. They only have a reason to help farmers tho.
Also, don't wanna talk about this point too much. I think we are all basically on the same page TBH.
This is a bullshit dodge. You know what I mean, you understand verbal shorthand right? A lot of the people influencing monetary policy or consumer banking policy are waaaay too cozy with Wall Street. This inevitably is what keeps leading to decisions at the top that aren't helpful to middle and working class people.
I'm not an anti intellectual and I do believe that it's important to have experts in the proper positions, but I also think there needs to be more advocacy for the working and middle class because experts still have blind spots. It's not an either or situation and some of you are falsely trying to pose it as such.
It's this part I take exception to:
You imply a sort of openness to soliciting outside advice which is not born out by how the 2008 crisis was handled, or do you feel the 2008 crisis is an exception here?
Well Pettifor has similar outlooks for the next recession (which both you and I agree is coming) and we'll see if they handle this one well. Best two out of three?
https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/mo...nancial-crisis-now-shes-predicting-the-sequel
In the interest of fairness, I admit this is not Bernie's strongsuit as far as I can tell. Hillary understood "shadowbanking" better than Bernie did back in 2016, presumably owing to her faculty for policy intricacies.
http://rooseveltinstitute.org/sanders-clinton-approach-shadow-banking/
https://www.thenation.com/article/bernies-wall-street-plan-is-actually-not-enough/
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That's why Bernie's proposal was to have people from all walks of life involved. Farmers don't have every incentive to help me necessarily (but probably more than an economist would), but they do have an incentive to help other farmers. Laborers would have an incentive to help me as a fellow laborer, etc.
Eh. Personally I think most farmers probably hate me and would like to do me harm, while most economists are probably pretty disinterested about me but might be academically interested in being right.
But, as I said, the principle of having representation on the board is reasonable.
Bingo. Monetary policy experts and economists know the intricacies of the economic system, but that doesn't magically mean that they don't have gaps in their perspective on how their policy decisions effect everyday regular people.
I would disagree with the analogy. Piloting a plane requires science-backed expertise (objective reality) while being an "expert economist" is a more blurry space, since "The Economy" is not purely scientific itself and is traversed by both ideological bias + its object of study being subjectivity (value itself).
I agree anti-intellectual populism sucks, but so does the liberal elitism that enables it.
I'm finally able to contribute to a campaign financially and so Bernie gets my $10 per month. LET'S DO DIS BERNIE!!!
The analogy has an even simpler issue; the pilot is trustworthy because if he doesn't do his job he dies too.
I would love to see a poll of how many of the Bernie supporters here are actually white males because it sounds like there are tons of PoC and women.
Also, it's kind of cathartic to see some of the people who tried to suppress Bernie support at the old place have the wind taken out of their sails. You can tell they were trying, but it didn't catch on. Let's get rid of the "Bernie Bro" myth, please.
Also, it's kind of cathartic to see some of the people who tried to suppress Bernie support at the old place have the wind taken out of their sails. You can tell they were trying, but it didn't catch on. Let's get rid of the "Bernie Bro" myth, please.
If we extend this analogy further, the pilot and the co-pilot have parachutes (of the golden variety) in the case of plane failure while the passengers have nothing except the reassurances of the pilot that everything's okay:
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