If that's the case, that the series is intrinsically linked to Asian racism, than it need to die. There's no place for such games in the 21st century.
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Bethesda's latest tone deaf addition to Fallout 76 Daily Ops: killing hundreds of Chinese communists
- Thread starter Lemoncholy
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If that's the case, that the series is intrinsically linked to Asian racism, than it need to die. There's no place for such games in the 21st century.
Well it takes place in West Virginia, the least linguistically and ethnically diverse state in the country
Hang on; you're saying that any game that has some sort of conflict with China (or any Asian country) should not be allowed because that makes it explicitly racist? What if one of those countries invades someone first?
I understand the OP's point in making this thread but I think this particular line of thinking is a bridge too far for me
A quick check says that there are around 1.7 million people in West Virginia as of last year, and while the state is overwhelming white, 0.8% of the population is Asian, which would still be around 14 thousand people. I'd have to imagine that it's possible to bump into someone in West Virginia that speaks Chinese.
User Banned (1 Month): Dismissive Drive-by; Prior Ban for the Same
Yup me too…It's going in a totalitarian way of thinking .
In the world we live in right now...yes. We let game developers get away with a lot of shit in a post 9/11 world. We shoudln't make the same mistake in a post pandemic world.
On a good day, it's still jerk off material for jingoists.
i forgot when you generate a character in fallout 76 it stops you if it detects that too many non-white characters are being generated to preserve the real ethnic makeup of virginia
Nice whataboutism. This thread is not about Russians, if you have problem with killing Russians feel free to make a new thread.
Yikes... I may dislike the CCP but they do not represent its citizens or people of Chinese descent around the world. How easy it seems to forget that fact, especially as of late. The increasing amount of racism and xenophobia is alarming and distressing.
So we already went to "People that complain are the REAL bigots"
Hate crimes against Asians in the US (and the world in general) increased a lot in the past year, the devs really should think better about making minorities the enemy in times like this
Covid 'hate crimes' against Asian Americans on rise
President Biden signs a bipartisan law to "stop the hatred and the bias" against Asian Americans.
www.bbc.com
Yikes at Bethesda and at this thread. Also lol at "it's okay killing comunist". A lot of raw reactions for a post, I know! But hard to comment on anything with so much going on on this thread!
I'll try to add something relevant lol: Bethesda doing this is very tone deaf, the lore doesn't really matter in this case and even if it did Bethesda has never really cared about fallout Lore (since F3)
I'll try to add something relevant lol: Bethesda doing this is very tone deaf, the lore doesn't really matter in this case and even if it did Bethesda has never really cared about fallout Lore (since F3)
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I agree with that but people will say that due to the random nature of the daily ops. They'd prob say it for any enemy type that comes up. However, there is probably a minority of hateful people that would be obliged to do it because the enemy is Asian, not for rewards. I don't really think it's a game problem rather more of a society problem. Can't blame the random nature of the game when the fault lies in the toxic real world.
Then why stop at just banning games that features conflicts with Asian countries? Why do we tolerate games where any two countries, governments, populations are in conflict?
There are ways to depict and handle such conflicts gracefully and with a deft touch. This thread is primarily being used to discuss whether or not this was the case here. I think just outlawing an entire genre of the medium is really shortsighted
The lore of Fallout is a post future with a different 20th century that goes into a resource war. China and the US are big enemies, and the war goes hot. It's not directly stated who started throwing nukes. Most of the Fallout games have focused on going after the remnants of the old US government. Beyond this Fallout 76 stuff the only Chinese parts that get explored is Fallout 3 DLC and a mission in Fallout 4 relating to a Chinese nuclear sub.
OP
OP
At the very least, the content could be reviewed and modified or removed.
Chinese enemies do not have to be present in order to make a good Fallout game. The games are primarily local stories about surviving in a wasteland. In the Fallout universe the war is long over and not relevant to your current goals.
Case in point: in Fallouts 1 and 2, you were able to kill children. This actually impacted the game's European release until they removed children from the game entirely for Europe.
Later, they reviewed this element of the game and removed it from 3 onwards. You cannot kill children anymore.
So why not review the necessity of killing Chinese people as well?
It's a Fallout, do you really think it's going to for a naunced approach to geopolitics and racism? There are already games that do that, but a game set in a post apocalyptic world where you kill super mutants ain't gonna be one of them. The world we live in currently has no place for games where an asian country is the bad guy, even if it's just backstory.
Well yeah...
My point is just that it doesn't make much sense for anyone in Fallout 76's West Virginia to speak anything other than English to one another, there simply aren't going to be enough speakers to justify it outside of one or two families, so it makes sense that the only foreign faction is the only group to speak in a different language. Especially in the super racist eternal 1950s culture of the Fallout universe prior to the war and the often bloodthirsty lawless hellscape after the war.
The fact that Fallout New Vegas had essentially nothing in the way of Spanish speakers is way more inexcusable
We stopped talking about Fallout and started talking about games in general when you said we should not allow any game that involves a conflict with an Asian country. That's akin to saying you don't believe any game can ever handle a scenario where one of those countries is involved in a conflict.
Not sure where posts are going with the "should we not show war between two countries?" thing as if they're somehow missing the actual point that Bethesda is a US company developing a video game about bringing violent deaths to enemies of chinese origin painted by an extremely outdated and historically racist stereotype when at the same time people of asian ethnicities are victims of extreme violence in the real world by US citizens.
Oh wait it seems to be just one poster. Should have read more carefully.
Oh wait it seems to be just one poster. Should have read more carefully.
Alright, then maybe you should consider that if you're enforcing a largely white, English-speaking population with the decisions that you've made regarding the lore, having them against a non-white foreign enemy no longer has room to escape imperialistic or race war imagery.
My apologies. What I mean was that Fallout shouldn't be having that discussion. If a game can do it well, and not offensively, by all means.
I don't think the timing helps at all to be honest, but I also do not like the insinuation by some of you that any anti CCP concept is anti Chinese and therefore Racist, especially in light of the Israel/Palestine conflict where it is deemed to be antisemitic if you even criticize Israeli. A people are not inherently their government.
What? My point is that people in West Virginia are going to speak so little of other languages to one another, in real life or in an alternate history game, that it's extremely unlikely that any other language would implemented by the game's writers. It simply doesn't fit the setting
My point is that human beings in this universe - the one that you are typing out this post in, not the Fallout universe - made the decision to set this game in West Virginia and to uphold the demographics of West Virginia within their fiction. As such, they are responsible for the results of that set of decisions. It is not the fault of real life West Virginia if the only characters in the game that speak languages other than English are enemies.
That's fine, we can move on. I just didn't want to get to a point where we started questioning games like Civilization.
As for Fallout, while there are lore reasons for this (IIRC, China invaded Alaska for oil, causing the US to annex Canada and then fight China) I do agree the event itself is, at its best, not a great look and at worst, really detrimental to a larger conversation happening today. But this is not the first time this topic has come up in the Fallout franchise; the first DLC for Fallout 3, Operation Anchorage, was a full-on military simulation of the battle of Anchorage where you set out to destroy a Chinese base and all of its personnel. And there's a Chinese sub in Fallout 4 with feral ghouls that used to be sailors on it
While I think some of the proposed remedies are...not ones I would personally agree with, at the same time I have absolutely run into this repeated thing where a lot of people like proclaiming that they just hate the CCP government and then about 5 minutes later the slurs start coming out along with a general disregard of life for people they claimed to care about.
Like there is absolutely going be a whole bunch of people who will take a majority Chinese faction and treat it the worst way possible and I do hope Bethesda takes that into account with what they decide to do with this.
Like there is absolutely going be a whole bunch of people who will take a majority Chinese faction and treat it the worst way possible and I do hope Bethesda takes that into account with what they decide to do with this.
I completely agree that this is not a good idea especially right now in Fallout 76 and I never intended to say it was. I was more asking about OP's reference to other games and historical accuracy/lore.
Thank you for this! Gonna take a look through these and avoid derailing this threadI apologize for not going into detail on the subject, but I feel like arguments about historical accuracy were done to death back in 2018 when the creators of Kingdom Come Deliverance were defending the lack of any racial minorities in their game. I won't say "read these threads and get educated" because there really is a mountain of discussion to read through from that time, but suffice to say a lot of words have already been spilled on the subject.
[Waypoint] We Haven't Covered 'Kingdom Come: Deliverance.' Let's Talk About Why.
MOD EDIT: We have no intention of banning discussion of this game outright, and the views of the director can be relevant. However, it is clear that there will be no peace in these threads without tighter moderation and brighter lines. Therefore if that discussion is to happen we are laying...www.resetera.com
Separating Games from their Creators - Kingdom Come: Deliverance
Hello Reset! An article has been making the rounds in German speaking Twittersphere and games media and I thought both its message, and its discussion topic were really important, hence my sharing it here. The "most authentic" history game of all time?! The phenomenally skewed case of Kingdom...
Daniel Vavra: "There is no propaganda" in Kingdom Come: Deliverance
Full article: https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2018-04-19-vavra-there-is-no-propaganda-in-kingdom-come-deliverance
In some cases, historical accuracy is debatable enough to the point where you're willfully making a choice to exclude certain groups, when it couldn't possibly harm anything to slip some representation in.
But that's going a bit off topic from the thread.
Well to clarify, there are a lot of US hidden strongholds and bunkers in the hills of WV. That's one of the main reasons for the setting. The Presidential Bunker absolutely influenced the setting.
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