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Commedieu

Banned
Nov 11, 2017
15,025
10 pages for the blacks buying gun thread.

2 pages for the Asians buying gun thread.

Pretending that this isn't fucked up is beyond absurd at this point. You all have a heavy black bias on this site. Its some of the most condescending shit I've seen on the site. No, not some. It is the most insulting thread I've seen here.

A lot of you are just on auto-pilot. Its amazing to watch. Every morning "what are the blacks doing? Jesus they don't know any better. I must tell them what they're doing is against statistical data?!" Every single page.

Meanwhile "Eh, good luck asians, we get it. sucks, but we get it."

2 pages.
 

Cream Stout

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,613
it's kinda funny to see people confronted with the reality that many folks beyond white people want/feel the need to have a gun and they can't just "muh guns" shit talk the people they ally with so it just becomes walls of needless statistics to do it politely
 

Royalan

I can say DEI; you can't.
Moderator
Oct 24, 2017
11,960
10 pages for the blacks buying gun thread.

2 pages for the Asians buying gun thread.

Pretending that this isn't fucked up is beyond absurd at this point. You all have a heavy black bias on this site. Its some of the most condescending shit I've seen on the site. No, not some. It is the most insulting thread I've seen here.

A lot of you are just on auto-pilot. Its amazing to watch. Every morning "what are the blacks doing? Jesus they don't know any better. I must tell them what they're doing is against statistical data?!" Every single page.

Meanwhile "Eh, good luck asians, we get it. sucks, but we get it."

2 pages.

11 pages now.
 

Deleted member 11039

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,109
it's kinda funny to see people confronted with the reality that many folks beyond white people want/feel the need to have a gun and they can't just "muh guns" shit talk the people they ally with so it just becomes walls of needless statistics to do it politely

What an odd take.

What's weird is to see so many people acknowlege that gun violence in America is a massive problem, but try and claim "but this is different" and guns are somehow a solution now.
 

Royalan

I can say DEI; you can't.
Moderator
Oct 24, 2017
11,960
What an odd take.

What's weird is to see so many people acknowlege that gun violence in America is a massive problem, but try and claim "but this is different" and guns are somehow a solution now.

Should Black people have ever owned guns?

I'd like someone to seriously answer that.
 

Deleted member 11039

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,109
Should Black people have ever owned guns?

I'd like someone to seriously answer that.

Broadly speaking, no. I don't think we should have ever let citizens own guns, at least in the near carte blanche way we have.

Can you answer if guns been good for Black people?

what is the solution for folks who feel they need to protect themselves?

If you mean like an immediate solution, then the best I have is to try and move to a different location if at all possible. If you mean more broadly, then I don't have a better answer than better education, social safety nets, etc.

But I know guns are not the answer.

I think it needs to be repeated, while white supremacist and their increased violence is a major issue we have to destroy, you're still WAY more likely to killed by someone you know, or someone of your own race, than a white supremiscits.
 
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TheMadTitan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
27,235
10 pages for the blacks buying gun thread.

2 pages for the Asians buying gun thread.

Pretending that this isn't fucked up is beyond absurd at this point. You all have a heavy black bias on this site. Its some of the most condescending shit I've seen on the site. No, not some. It is the most insulting thread I've seen here.

A lot of you are just on auto-pilot. Its amazing to watch. Every morning "what are the blacks doing? Jesus they don't know any better. I must tell them what they're doing is against statistical data?!" Every single page.

Meanwhile "Eh, good luck asians, we get it. sucks, but we get it."

2 pages.
It's some bullshit for sure. I knew this was going to happen from the beginning. My advocacy for Asian Americans to get guns practically went unchallenged.
 

Commedieu

Banned
Nov 11, 2017
15,025
It's some bullshit for sure. I knew this was going to happen from the beginning. My advocacy for Asian Americans to get guns practically went unchallenged.

same, i was supportive in that thread. And it poofed and went away as quicky as can be. We aren't talking years ago, this was weeks. Still am supportive, all minorities need to arm up.

Its clear what the issue in this thread is, its black people buying guns and members biases that they have to inform the blacks that they can't read statistics and they don't know what they're doing.
 

AgPhoenix

Member
Oct 27, 2017
334
Broadly speaking, no. I don't think we should have ever let citizens own guns, at least in the near carte blanche way we have.

Can you answer if guns been good for Black people?

Can't believe on Page 11 we get this wrong headed of a Question. Did you not read this thread at all, cause you wouldn't ask this otherwise.
 

TheMadTitan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
27,235
same, i was supportive in that thread. And it poofed and went away as quicky as can be. We aren't talking years ago, this was weeks. Still am supportive, all minorities need to arm up.

Its clear what the issue in this thread is, its black people buying guns and members biases that they have to inform the blacks that they can't read statistics and they don't know what they're doing.
Black people = Scary
Asian people = ehh, you're not worth worrying about. You'll be fine.
 

Royalan

I can say DEI; you can't.
Moderator
Oct 24, 2017
11,960
Broadly speaking, no. I don't think we should have ever let citizens own guns, at least in the near carte blanche way we have.

And as I said to the other person, "nobody should have guns" isn't an answer to the question "Should Black people have ever owned guns?" Because...well, no shit.

Can you answer if guns been good for Black people?

Yes.
 

Mammoth Jones

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,309
New York
Can you answer if guns been good for Black people?

You didn't even read the fucking thread and you chiming in with this fuck shit that's been answered. But here, YES. There are PLENTY of times when guns were good for Black people defending themselves against racist violence in America. God damned you sheltered as shit to not HAVE to know this history and got nerve to open your mouth. You're not qualified to comment on this if you can't be bothered to read. Just read.
 

Mórríoghain

Member
Nov 2, 2017
5,148
Saying this about the general fun fetish in the US, how can you all need to buy a gun to feel safe and think you are living in a first world country? What kind of 1800s Wild West shit is this?
 

Commedieu

Banned
Nov 11, 2017
15,025
Saying this about the general fun fetish in the US, how can you all need to buy a gun to feel safe and think you are living in a first world country? What kind of 1800s Wild West shit is this?

what black people think they live in a first world when they're removing voting rights as we speak? Or are routinely executed by police...

What even is this shit? America musings day?

Ionno anyone say shit about black on black crime?

pretty much yeah, a page or so ago. an article about guns being bad for black people. Not to veiled.
 

pizoxuat

Member
Jan 12, 2018
1,458
If black people feel the need to arm themselves, there's nothing I've got to say in opposition. If they want to organize their own gun clubs to train and exert political pressure, all the better. The image of the confederate flag flying in our Capitol building is seared in my memory. White racists need to be made to be afraid.
 

Stone Dudeman

Member
Oct 27, 2017
693
Just wanted to say that at least this goofy white dude gets why more black folk want to own guns.

My response is " Good luck, stay safe, and get as much training and practice as you can."
 

Mórríoghain

Member
Nov 2, 2017
5,148
what black people think they live in a first world when they're removing voting rights as we speak? Or are routinely executed by police...

What even is this shit? America musings day?



pretty much yeah, a page or so ago. an article about guns being bad for black people. Not to veiled.

No no I do understand the idea behind minorities arming themselves. Like I said I was talking about the general gun culture.
 

Jeffolation

Member
Oct 30, 2017
7,117
Just...listen to what the black folks in this thread are saying. I'm a leftist with a general anti-gun stance but when you read what these folks are trying to communicate and looking at the heightened level of tension in the US right now, I'd wager statistics being thrown in their faces is just insulting considering the reality they wake up to every day in that country. If your response is to scold and hand wave towards statistics, you're either not getting it or posting in bad faith. I'd surmise these gun purchases aren't being done on the fly or for fun, this is a pragmatic choice they are making informed by the climate of the country and it's heinous record of abuse towards POC, which is fucking scary.
 

Mekanos

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 17, 2018
44,171

Commedieu

Banned
Nov 11, 2017
15,025
Black people = Scary
Asian people = ehh, you're not worth worrying about. You'll be fine.

I think its more, to be blunt, people can empathize with Asians as human beings. They think "well gee, if this was golly gosh darn happening to me, ill tell ya.... I'd get a gun too. While I don't like gun culture, it makes sense ya know? Thinking about the family and all."

Blacks its just

well.

AstonishingFarflungCoati-size_restricted.gif
 

capitalCORN

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
10,436
I think its more, to be blunt, people can empathize with Asians as human beings. They think "well gee, if this was golly gosh darn happening to me, ill tell ya.... I'd get a gun too. While I don't like gun culture, it makes sense ya know? Thinking about the family and all."

Blacks its just

well.

AstonishingFarflungCoati-size_restricted.gif
I don't think it's been that long since people have questioned if Asians even had souls. The 'black problem' is rooted in insurgence, rather the myth of it.
 

Deleted member 11039

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,109
And as I said to the other person, "nobody should have guns" isn't an answer to the question "Should Black people have ever owned guns?" Because...well, no shit.



Yes.

You didn't even read the fucking thread and you chiming in with this fuck shit that's been answered. But here, YES. There are PLENTY of times when guns were good for Black people defending themselves against racist violence in America. God damned you sheltered as shit to not HAVE to know this history and got nerve to open your mouth. You're not qualified to comment on this if you can't be bothered to read. Just read.

You can find anecdotes to support anything. A group a hundred years ago on horse back isn't proof that guns are good any more than one guy who stopped a break in with his gun is. The black panthers arming themselves didn't stop police violence. I'd love to see people adopt their patrolling the police stuff than them arming up. Cops already irrationally think Black men are more dangerous. Guns aren't the answer.

Again we have tons of data. Black people owning guns isn't new. You can't refute what the data says. You can't refute that 90% of the time a Black person uses a gun, its on another Black person. 9 Black men are not worth 1 racist. A black person is WAY more likely to be killed by someone they know, then they are a white rascist. A racist white guy is WAY more likely to blow his own head off or be murdered by his family than he is to be killed by a Black citizen. Guns aren't the answer.

what a blessed life you must live to think that it's easy enough to just pack up and move your entire life if you're scared and need to protect yourself

I never said it was. In fact I specifically said "if at all possible" because I know how difficult that could be.

It still doesn't change the fact that guns aren't making you safer.
 

Commedieu

Banned
Nov 11, 2017
15,025
Yeah, that's a perfectly valid point I've seen made a number of times. While I like to be very data driven in what I do and don't support, minorities have to also figure in factors and make educated guesses on things the data doesn't capture.

The gun violence data we have doesn't say anything about the rise of Fascism, racist cops, or whether black communities will face another Greenwood type masacre. Will there be an uptick in lynchings? Will Biden's police reform plans successfuly improve that problem, or will it fail horribly or be forever blocked? Unlike all the white rural people and suburbanites, there are more legitimate fears for their saftey among minority groups.

Hopefully things will improve, but things can also get worse pretty fast. It was a pretty short time ago that the idea of an insurrection succeeding in taking over our Capital building, even for a brief time, would be considered pretty ridiculous and paranoid.

So I think it's in "Do what you think you've got to do" territory, where there just isn't a great answer to point at. It's something most of us white liberals or progressives just aren't capable of fully understanding at the moment.

My only useful advice is to learn to use the weapon well and as safe as possible to mitigate accidents. You don't want to be the guy on the news who carries a gun in his waistband and accidentally shoots his dick off, or the poor parent whose child accidentally (or intentionally) kills themselves with your gun. And try to reflect on your own mental health state and whether it would be a good idea for you to have a gun around. Get to the range and get good at shooting and hitting a target, and take a proper gun safety course if you can.
You advice is common sense then?

in the op it literally says " The cold shoulder they received has pushed scores to join Black gun clubs and seek training from Black experts. "June 2020 – when the riots were hitting different cities – my students increased," said Rogers Anderson, who is the commander of the Black Gun Owners Association's Oakland/Bay Area chapter and conducts training sessions at northern California shooting ranges. "Now 99.9% of my students are either single Black women or Black women with children who fear for their safety," Anderson said. "

in the OP, right there. It doesn't say people are buying guns to hold in their saggy pants or shoot up burger kings. Literally says training is also on the uptick with black ownership. In the title, literally says clubs.
 

Trey

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,004
This same story comes around every few years like clock work. Its companion piece about conservatives buying more guns in response will come in a few months to complete the cycle.
 

Commedieu

Banned
Nov 11, 2017
15,025
You can find anecdotes to support anything. A group a hundred years ago on horse back isn't proof that guns are good any more than one guy who stopped a break in with his gun is. The black panthers arming themselves didn't stop police violence. I'd love to see people adopt their patrolling the police stuff than them arming up. Guns aren't the answer.

Again we have tons of data. Black people owning guns isn't new. You can't refute what the data says. You can't refute that 90% of the time a Black person uses a gun, its on another Black person. 9 Black men are not worth 1 racist. A black person is WAY more likely to be killed by someone they know, then they are a white rascist. A racist white guy is WAY more likely to blow his own head off or be murdered by his family than he is to be killed by a Black citizen. Guns aren't the answer.

If anyone had Black on Black crime on their bingo card.

Theres your sign.
 

Deleted member 4346

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,976
what a blessed life you must live to think that it's easy enough to just pack up and move your entire life if you're scared and need to protect yourself

In this thread we've seen like, what, two counterpoints to black people buying guns?

"Why don't you pack up and move?" Even ignoring the practical concerns of how do we pay for this, and what about job/family/etc, I would ask "to where?", because there's not a city or state in the US that doesn't have racial issues.

"You could beg for your life!" I can't even with this shit.
 

Royalan

I can say DEI; you can't.
Moderator
Oct 24, 2017
11,960
You can find anecdotes to support anything. A group a hundred years ago on horse back isn't proof that guns are good any more than one guy who stopped a break in with his gun is. The black panthers arming themselves didn't stop police violence. I'd love to see people adopt their patrolling the police stuff than them arming up. Cops already irrationally think Black men are more dangerous. Guns aren't the answer.

Again we have tons of data. Black people owning guns isn't new. You can't refute what the data says. You can't refute that 90% of the time a Black person uses a gun, its on another Black person. 9 Black men are not worth 1 racist. A black person is WAY more likely to be killed by someone they know, then they are a white rascist. A racist white guy is WAY more likely to blow his own head off or be murdered by his family than he is to be killed by a Black citizen. Guns aren't the answer.

"A group 100 years ago on horse back..."

Oh, I got it. You're just ignorant the subject. I mean, you have to be, if you think you have to go back that far to find instances of Black people organizing and arming themselves to combat coordinated racial violence that the state either ignored or took part in.

Thanks for clearing that up.
 
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AgPhoenix

Member
Oct 27, 2017
334
You can find anecdotes to support anything. A group a hundred years ago on horse back isn't proof that guns are good any more than one guy who stopped a break in with his gun is. The black panthers arming themselves didn't stop police violence. I'd love to see people adopt their patrolling the police stuff than them arming up. Cops already irrationally think Black men are more dangerous. Guns aren't the answer.

Again we have tons of data. Black people owning guns isn't new. You can't refute what the data says. You can't refute that 90% of the time a Black person uses a gun, its on another Black person. 9 Black men are not worth 1 racist. A black person is WAY more likely to be killed by someone they know, then they are a white rascist. A racist white guy is WAY more likely to blow his own head off or be murdered by his family than he is to be killed by a Black citizen. Guns aren't the answer.

I am likely gonna catch a Ban (or at least a Warning) for this, but man don't you as an Arkansanian have much more pressing issues with your State Government than tut-tutting Black People in the most condensing manner possible about Gun Ownership?

Non-Black people, espcially White People need to get their heads out of their asses about the other factors that Statistics ain't covering. You act as if we aren't on the uptake with that stuff.

If you can't do that, I suggest shutting yo' ass up.
 

Deleted member 11039

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,109
"A group 100 years ago on horse back..."

Oh, I got it. You're just ignorant the subject. I mean, you have to be, if you think you have to go back that far to find instances of Black people organizing and arming themselves combat coordinated racial violence that the state either ignored or took part in.

Thanks for clearing that up.

Is it possible for you to not cherry pick parts of my post? Anecdotes (plural).

Why do you feel guns in this specific window of time would do more good than bad?
 

Royalan

I can say DEI; you can't.
Moderator
Oct 24, 2017
11,960
Is it possible for you to not cherry pick parts of my post? Anecdotes (plural).

Why do you feel guns in this specific window of time would do more good than bad?
(That doesn't clear it up.)

As for your question, I gave my position on a form of this question back on page 4.

I don't have any sort of data on hand at the moment, but I can definitely speak to what it feels like participating in these discussions on the left, and why at times they can feel really dismissive and incredibly patronizing to Black people.

I think, as with a lot of the things, when it comes to guns the right has benefitted from being so consistently terrible for so long, that people on the left have become desensitized to it, and even think their behavior is normal.

Sure, we acknowledge the right's cartoonish love of guns. We ridicule them for it. We make "that AR15 won't make your dick bigger!" jokes about it all the time. But, unless there's a mass shooting or insurrection at the top of the news cycle, it does feel like even folks on the Left - from liberal to progressive - can't hold it in their heads for 5 minutes how really, truly horrific it is that the right has such a fetishistic love of assault weaponry and are stockpiling it at time when they're more radicalized to violence than ever. At a time when white supremacist organizations/militias exist in all 50 states and have infiltrated the police force in a lot of those states. At a time when the Department of Homeland Security labeled white supremacist violence as the biggest concern to national security.

But here's the thing: Black people never lose sight of this. We can't. Because we have historically been on the receiving end of this violence. Just talk to regular schmegular Black folks and they'll tell you: it feels like Trump poured gasoline on something that was already there and building, and now we're one spark away from something truly terrible to the collective safety of Black people and minorities in this country. The purchasing of these guns is fear-based. This is not a power fantasy. This isn't dick waving. This is America: those people already have guns.

And so it can be incredibly frustrating when it feels like the left overlook and/or accepts the right's relationship to guns as a known quality, but the tut-tutting and pulling of stats comes out when Black people legally arm themselves against what feels like a growing tidal wave of white supremacist violence aimed square at us. It feels like you're asking Black people to willingly be sitting ducks. To be defenseless for the sake of your academic argument; for the sake of your unsupported belief that the worst won't come to pass.

And this is exactly why my stance has so far been, "I'm Black and I don't yet feel the urge to own a gun. But I'm not going to be the person chiding a Black person who feels the need to arm themselves, like I don't have eyes to see and ears to hear the bullshit."
 

zoku88

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,025
Man, this thread is making me glad that I regularly don't interact with people in real life. I'm a black man who is generally anti-gun, but man, a lot of you guys are really depressing me. The nerve of you all lecturing.. as if people don't know their individual situations better...
 

Baji Boxer

Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,380
You advice is common sense then?

in the op it literally says " The cold shoulder they received has pushed scores to join Black gun clubs and seek training from Black experts. "June 2020 – when the riots were hitting different cities – my students increased," said Rogers Anderson, who is the commander of the Black Gun Owners Association's Oakland/Bay Area chapter and conducts training sessions at northern California shooting ranges. "Now 99.9% of my students are either single Black women or Black women with children who fear for their safety," Anderson said. "

in the OP, right there. It doesn't say people are buying guns to hold in their saggy pants or shoot up burger kings. Literally says training is also on the uptick with black ownership. In the title, literally says clubs.


Edit: After further thought I realize I was wrong in this and appologized. Deleted my not so nice confrontational reply.
 
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OP
OP
SilentPanda

SilentPanda

Member
Nov 6, 2017
13,712
Earth
Is it possible for you to not cherry pick parts of my post? Anecdotes (plural).

Why do you feel guns in this specific window of time would do more good than bad?

But it isn't just black people buying gun?
In the thread, someone listed the data that white people are still buying more guns, and it is ignore

From the article, although the black people are buying guns, alot of them are also getting proper training on how to use a dangerous item(Which should be a requirement, like learning to drive, but that's not relate)

And "data" and don't use feeling is not really talking with the issue, since ignoring feeling is a weird thing to focus on, since human are not robot.

A gun is not a toy, and I think that most people that are buying it and getting the training knows that.

If the people that are focus on black people buying gun and proper training, can put in the same drive to people like these...

pols_feature25.jpg
 

capitalCORN

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
10,436
Sense and sensibility seems to be for a specific crowd. Good thing the white folks already made you fold like a deck of cards for a minute, and then the investigation seems to be painfully immaculate.
 

Deleted member 11039

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,109
(That doesn't clear it up.)

As for your question, I gave my position on a form of this question back on page 4.

That doesn't answer my question and I have to point out that your post literally says I don't have data but I feel...

That's why we have data so we don't have to rely on feelings. Black people have had guns for a long time. What has it solved? Why do you think more guns will make things better?

You say its fear-based and I agree. But again, you're more likely to be killed by your family than you are a white supremacist. That's not a reason to own a gun.
 

Baji Boxer

Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,380
Edit: I had written this post as an edit of another post like a dumbass, without actually editing the post I meant to edit.
 

zon

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,426
Considering the history of black Americans you folks need it. The police won't help you.

Man, this thread is making me glad that I regularly don't interact with people in real life. I'm a black man who is generally anti-gun, but man, a lot of you guys are really depressing me. The nerve of you all lecturing.. as if people don't know their individual situations better...

It's the behaviour of people with no ability to self-reflect.
 

Royalan

I can say DEI; you can't.
Moderator
Oct 24, 2017
11,960
That doesn't answer my question and I have to point out that your post literally says I don't have data but I feel...

That's why we have data so we don't have to rely on feelings. Black people have had guns for a long time. What has it solved? Why do you think more guns will make things better?

You say its fear-based and I agree. But again, you're more likely to be killed by your family than you are a white supremacist. That's not a reason to own a gun.

I didn't have data at the time I wrote that post, but you know what I did have? History, and the current cultural context where even the Department of Homeland Security has labelled white supremacist violence as the leading threat to national security.

You know, the two things you continue to ignore in your clinging to data to silence Black people.
 

TheMadTitan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
27,235
But it isn't just black people buying gun?
In the thread, someone listed the data that white people are still buying more guns, and it is ignore

From the article, although the black people are buying guns, alot of them are also getting proper training on how to use a dangerous item(Which should be a requirement, like learning to drive, but that's not relate)

And "data" and don't use feeling is not really talking with the issue, since ignoring feeling is a weird thing to focus on, since human are not robot.

A gun is not a toy, and I think that most people that are buying it and getting the training knows that.

If the people that are focus on black people buying gun and proper training, can put in the same drive to people like these...

pols_feature25.jpg
Exactly.

Numbers say one thing, but numbers don't say everything. In most instances of white people showing up at a march/protest with their guns, the tone is completely different than black and other minorities rallying and doing the same thing. The mentalities in the communities are different.