Borderlands 3 - Review Thread

Final Predictions?


  • Total voters
    1,128
  • Poll closed .

LordofPwn

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,728
“I want to live in a more civilized age! No more wire hangers!” makes more sense and has more relevance as an abortion-related statement than "randomized battle callout" immediately followed by a 40-year-old Mommy Dearest reference.

I think the worst conclusion about the writer still stands: he can't write a good joke.
except "No more wire hangers!" was a callout also used in BL2 so it was just re-used in BL3...
 

LossAversion

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,923
It wasn't jumping to conclusions, though. You've missed the point.

There was literally no way to even think it was two random lines that happend to fall in place, it sounded written.

And if written, it doesn't matter about intent because it had a very clear meaning regardless.

It was a fair response.
Yeah, gonna hard disagree on that point.
 
Oct 25, 2017
13,746
A joke being funny or not is entirely subjective. Whether you think it's a good joke or not has no effect on the actual intention behind the line. Games like this are filled with hundreds, if not thousands of lines of unimportant dialogue and they can't all be amazing. Especially when you're writing dialogue for random psychotic enemies. I'd argue that a nonsensical line like that is perfectly in line with what you might expect out of those enemies. Regardless, there's no reason to just assume it was ill-intentioned. Just because you aren't old enough to understand the reference doesn't mean it's okay to turn it into something you do understand without any consideration for alternatives.
I mean this is an silly defense, there is a very specific ongoing societal issue that has more direct relevance to the set of lines that the writer of the review was presented with then a reference to a movie made more than 20 years ago. It's perfectly legitimate to make an assumption of intention given the context provided at the time. What you're asking for is an impossible standard of perfect clarity of creative intention.
 

LordofPwn

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,728
this person seems like they roll their eyes anytime the number "69" is referenced instead of instinctively saying "nice." also there are way better examples of terrible writing in games than the borderlands series. wish her thread had more examples though, the borderlands style of writing def isn't for everyone. more interested in hearing about the side quests though cause another review said they were good actually?
 

LossAversion

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,923
I mean this is an silly defense, there is a very specific ongoing societal issue that has more direct relevance to the set of lines that the writer of the review was presented with then a reference to a movie made more than 20 years ago. It's perfectly legitimate to make an assumption of intention given the context provided at the time. What you're asking for is an impossible standard of perfect clarity of creative intention.
Considering that we had people arguing whether or not the "joke" in question was intended to be pro-life or pro-choice, I think waiting for some clarity of intention would have been the right course of action.

Think a little about impact vs intent. It's not really something you can disagree with, tbh.

Why do we avoid certain jokes? This isn't hard to get.
I'm also considering the impact it might have on a writer to have a misunderstanding like this go unchecked. I don't think that's unreasonable.
 

Meta

Member
Oct 29, 2017
116
A joke being funny or not is entirely subjective. Whether you think it's a good joke or not has no effect on the actual intention behind the line. Games like this are filled with hundreds, if not thousands of lines of unimportant dialogue and they can't all be amazing. Especially when you're writing dialogue for random psychotic enemies. I'd argue that a nonsensical line like that is perfectly in line with what you might expect out of those enemies. Regardless, there's no reason to just assume it was ill-intentioned. Just because you aren't old enough to understand the reference doesn't mean it's okay to turn it into something you do understand without any consideration for alternatives.
Sure. Unlike the reviewer, I correctly understood the reference and never assumed that the joke was ill-intentioned.

The problem is whether or not that line is indicative of the writing in the game, which a few reviewers have already noted as a sore spot.

Even if that line is intended to be funny, it simply isn't - it's nonsense, meaningless noise even in the context of psycho spouting it in battle. It's hard to fault the reviewer for trying make sense out something when they're not in on the non-joke.

But, if it's what the fans want....

Borderlands 3 |OT| Poop Jokes and Mommy Dearest References
 

PopsMaellard

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
1,897
The “well, borderlands humor isn’t for everyone :) “ hand waving in response to “Borderlands 3 thinks a penis drawn on a bathroom stall is the pinnacle of comedy” is wild.
 

LossAversion

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,923
Sure. Unlike the reviewer, I correctly understood the reference and never assumed that the joke was ill-intentioned.

The problem is whether or not that line is indicative of the writing in the game, which a few reviewers have already noted as a sore spot.

Even if that line is intended to be funny, it simply isn't - it's nonsense, meaningless noise even in the context of psycho spouting it in battle. It's hard to fault the reviewer for trying make sense out something when they're not in on the non-joke.

But, if it's what the fans want....

Borderlands 3 |OT| Poop Jokes and Mommy Dearest References
That's fair enough. I won't pretend that the humor is anything but hit or miss for me when it comes to Borderlands. I just don't think it's fair to assume the worst right away when there could be multiple explanations like the one provided by the writer.
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,891
I'm also considering the impact it might have on a writer to have a misunderstanding like this go unchecked. I don't think that's unreasonable.
You are, but it is.

The point is you don't hear a line and think about anything than the line as a whole. You don't think "maybe this was two separate lines that randomly fellnin place and changed the meaning".

So as a single line it had a very clear meaning, whether the writer wanted that or not. The potential tone deafness was partly what was being called out.

Now, it happened to be that the lines randomly fell in place. But that is so random, that the consideration of that was impossible.

Again, the assumption was fair as was the response. None of this is hard.
 

LossAversion

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,923
You are, but it is.

The point is you don't hear a line and about anything than the line as a whole. You don't think "maybe this was teo serperste lines that change the meaning".

So as a single line it had a very clear meaning, whether the writer wanted that or not. The potential tone deafness was partly what was being called out.

Now, it happened to be that the lines randomly fell in place. But that is so random, that the consideration of that was impossible.

Again, the assumption was fair as was the response. None of this is hard.
Condescend a little harder next time.
 

GJ

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,532
The Netherlands
Let's be honest. The jokes in Borderlands have always been bad. It's mostly edgy comedy and references to pop culture. I've recently played through B2 and it's DLC with a friend and we had a lot of fun, but more because of how dumb everything was and not because it was actually funny. If this is more of the same then it'll be perfect.
 

hydruxo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,687
Worth noting that in the following tweet she says she's never played the other BL games before so it seems like the style of humor simply didn't sit well with her. I think people who are used to BL won't really mind the jokes she doesn't like. I love the BL games but the humor has always been childish as hell since the very first game, and I'm just kind of used to it. Some of it makes me laugh, some of it makes me roll my eyes. It is what it is.
 

Keasar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,751
Skövde, Sweden
Oof.

Seems like they should have hired whoever wrote Tales from the Borderlands to handle the writing of this one. I thought it was a bit worrying when they said that they were gonna return to the humour of BL1 which until General Knoxx was the weakest in the series in terms of comedic effect, after that comes BL2 that has at least Handsome Jack who is amazing and the Torque DLC and last Pre-Sequel which was....eh, had moments.

Tales from the Boderlands however should be the gold standard of what humour it could have.
 

LossAversion

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,923
I explained, because you didn't get what I meant.
I do understand what you mean but I don't agree with what you're saying. Even if we take the lines together, one of them is a reference to an old movie. So if you take that into consideration, there's probably more to it than a bad abortion joke. And like I said in another comment, people were even arguing whether the "joke' was meant to be pro-choice or pro-life. So that single line obviously didn't have a very clear meaning after all. So the assumptions were not fair to the writer. None of this is hard.
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,891
I do understand what you mean but I don't agree with what you're saying. Even if we take the lines together, one of them is a reference to an old movie. So if you take that into consideration, there's probably more to it than a bad abortion joke. And like I said in another comment, people were even arguing whether the "joke' was meant to be pro-choice or pro-life. So that single line obviously didn't have a very clear meaning after all. So the assumptions were not fair to the writer. None of this is hard.
Except you exclude intent vs impact, and the fact it doesn't matter what the writer might have intended, the fact was it ALSO makes a very clear reference to abortions as a whole line... and there was no way to realize it was not a whole line.

That tone deaf writing was what was being called out. You'll find that even the articles says "it may mean this... OR".

I don't get why you can't see this. It's not debatable.
 

kiaaa

Member
Oct 27, 2017
731
I do understand what you mean but I don't agree with what you're saying. Even if we take the lines together, one of them is a reference to an old movie. So if you take that into consideration, there's probably more to it than a bad abortion joke. And like I said in another comment, people were even arguing whether the "joke' was meant to be pro-choice or pro-life. So that single line obviously didn't have a very clear meaning after all. So the assumptions were not fair to the writer. None of this is hard.
You're acting like people here were going after the writer rather than just saying that it was a bad joke.
 

LossAversion

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,923
Except you exclude intent vs impact, and the fact it doesn't matte what the writer might have intended, the fact was it ALSO makes a very clear reference to abortions as a while line... and there was noneay to realize it was not a whole line.

That tone deaf writing was what was being called out. You'll find that even the articles says "it may mean this... OR".

I don't get why you can't see this. It's not debatable.
Well since it's not debatable then I guess that's that.

You're acting like people here were going after the writer rather than just saying that it was a bad joke.
Putting ill-intentions onto the dialogue is the same thing as putting them onto the writer of that dialogue.
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,891
Well since it's not debatable then I guess that's that.

Putting ill-intentions onto the dialogue is the same thing as putting them onto the writer of that dialogue.
They were not saying it was definitely one thing.

They were saying, as a single line, it has one meaning that can't be ignored. Even if the intent was not that, it is tone deaf at best and at worst is an awful abortion joke.

I think you understand this and don't want to concede.
 

SeeingeyeDug

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,121
What’s the benchmark for good story telling in this style of looter game? Diablo 3? Destiny? Anthem? Do any of them have a story that’s worth a shit?
 

kiaaa

Member
Oct 27, 2017
731
What’s the benchmark for good story telling in this style of looter game? Diablo 3? Destiny? Anthem? Do any of them have a story that’s worth a shit?
I wouldn't say any of them are amazingly well written, but they're way less in-your-face with their shit than the Borderlands series. Destiny got some heavy criticism when they made ghost more talkative/jokey and then again when they had a second ghost show up for a bit in Destiny 2.
 

Static

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
4,205
What’s the benchmark for good story telling in this style of looter game? Diablo 3? Destiny? Anthem? Do any of them have a story that’s worth a shit?
Diablo 2 over Diablo 3 any day of the week, but... I don't know. I don't exactly play a lot of these. I know Diablo 3 was bad and Borderlands 1 was bland and Borderlands 2 was obnoxious.
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,891
What’s the benchmark for good story telling in this style of looter game? Diablo 3? Destiny? Anthem? Do any of them have a story that’s worth a shit?
At the time of release, BL2's story was hyped up as a much needed improvement on 1.

Tales form the Borderlands was well written.

So expectations were a certain way I think, even though you're correct that story is never a plus point in this type of game.
 

Van Bur3n

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
14,683
I wouldn't say any of them are amazingly well written, but they're way less in-your-face with their shit than the Borderlands series. Destiny got some heavy criticism when they made ghost more talkative/jokey and then again when they had a second ghost show up for a bit in Destiny 2.
Oh god, Sagira was one of the worst Destiny characters. She did have an unintentionally funny moment though when she screeched “ITS GOT MEEEEEE”. The delivery of that line was so bad I think I was ballin’ my eyes out for like five straight minutes.
 

AntiMacro

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,605
Alberta
The absolute dumbest thing about review threads here is that once the game is actually out and people have played it themselves the thread is dead. So all get is thousands of posts arguing and crying about scores based on nothing but fanboy bias until the game is released and then it's a ghost town.
My lowkey favourite thing about review threads is noting all the people who fanatically defend a game (they haven't played) to the death from 'unfair criticism' like how its quests aren't repetitive or whatever, and then seeing them pop up in the OT or a LTTP later saying how they liked it but the quests were really repetitive, etc...
 

kiaaa

Member
Oct 27, 2017
731
Oh god, Sagira was one of the worst Destiny characters. She did have an unintentionally funny moment though when she screeched “ITS GOT MEEEEEE”. The delivery of that line was so bad I think I was ballin’ my eyes out for like five straight minutes.
ha, I wasn't even talking about Sagira. Dropped D2 before that dlc. I was talking about Failsafe.