Breath of the Wild was incredible.. until it wasn't - it became another open world drag

[Asbsand]

For me it wasn't even about getting to Ganon and completing the story, it was just about being absorbed in Hyrule. I got way more enjoyment out of just finding shit no matter how trivial, and seeing things like the ruins of Lon Lon Ranch and other locations from previous games that still somewhat stood after however many years.

Click to shrink...

A few discoveries definitely left me just soaked in and pondering about the world. But stuff like the Lon Lon Ranch is also immediately met with the contradiction that they're basically not doing the timeline in this game but they're also architecturally recreating relics of past games, and so it's nothing more than a cute reference because it can't really have any significance to the world since virtually everything else is changed and not to mention that this supposedly happens after Wind Waker, on a new Hyrule but also why are the Zoras living alongside the Rito when they were initially implied to be their descendants, and yet the game features Koroks but not Kokiri?

All I'm saying is, I feel the game is both pandering to, but also not respecting story-fans of the franchise and not just timeline nerds. I don't particularly care for the timeline, but there's such obvious attempts at hinting at a timeline connection with some of these things and yet none of it adds up, even when it seems like just maybe it would.

And that honestly frustrates me. I think the game would've been much better off with less fanservice and instead of Koroks there'd be a new race, let's call them Sproutwings or something, lol, and instead of Rito there would be Drakers, a new race that can fly or something. A lot of the "in-world" stuff in BotW comes across as perfunctory to me. The effort was clearly put into creating the functionality of everything but the story they slapped over it really leaves something to be desired.

 

[Bit_Reactor]

Pizza was incredible, until it wasn't because I kept eating and eating until I was disgusted. But in the end I don't regret it because I love pizza.

Click to shrink...

This and the ever growing sentiment of "After 50-100 hours it got so repetitive" are some of the ones I keep close to the chest to laugh at later.

I can't believe this game made by humans doesn't have infinite content after 50 hours! The nerve!

 

[Deleted member 60582]

A few discoveries definitely left me just soaked in and pondering about the world. But stuff like the Lon Lon Ranch is also immediately met with the contradiction that they're basically not doing the timeline in this game but they're also architecturally recreating relics of past games, and so it's nothing more than a cute reference because it can't really have any significance to the world since virtually everything else is changed and not to mention that this supposedly happens after Wind Waker, on a new Hyrule but also why are the Zoras living alongside the Rito when they were initially implied to be their descendants, and yet the game features Koroks but not Kokiri?

All I'm saying is, I feel the game is both pandering to, but also not respecting story-fans of the franchise and not just timeline nerds. I don't particularly care for the timeline, but there's such obvious attempts at hinting at a timeline connection with some of these things and yet none of it adds up, even when it seems like just maybe it would.

And that honestly frustrates me. I think the game would've been much better off with less fanservice and instead of Koroks there'd be a new race, let's call them Sproutwings or something, lol, and instead of Rito there would be Drakers, a new race that can fly or something. A lot of the "in-world" stuff in BotW comes across as perfunctory to me. The effort was clearly put into creating the functionality of everything but the story they slapped over it really leaves something to be desired.

Click to shrink...

I get it, believe me. I just kind of looked at it as a "Greatest Hits" Hyrule since I gave up on the timeline a long time ago.

 

[Loanshark]

Agree with OP.

Op eating marshmallows or Oreos: why is the 26th one I eat less satisfying???

Click to shrink...

This and the ever growing sentiment of "After 50-100 hours it got so repetitive" are some of the ones I keep close to the chest to laugh at later.

I can't believe this game made by humans doesn't have infinite content after 50 hours! The nerve!

Click to shrink...

I think that the point being made here is that BoTW runs out of concrete reasons to explore much faster than most other open world games, because there is no real robust itemization system, there are no compelling quests or narratives, you dont level up or get experience, the enemy variety is poor etc. All you will ever find is shrines and korok seeds.

 

[jviggy43]

This and the ever growing sentiment of "After 50-100 hours it got so repetitive" are some of the ones I keep close to the chest to laugh at later.

I can't believe this game made by humans doesn't have infinite content after 50 hours! The nerve!

Click to shrink...

I'll keep waiting for an answer to this:

I keep seeing this sentiment and I'm confused by it. If youre playing the game blind it very likely is going to take you more than 50 hours to see everything. And if youve made a world that big that it would take that much time to explore, why should we not be evaluating it for its entire content?

Click to shrink...

Seriously is there a good reason for why people shouldn't be evaluating the game once they get over the 50 hour mark, when the game was designed to be a massive world that takes that long to explore? Because if there is I haven't read it and the arguments that you made continue to just come off as trying to stifle criticism.

 

[Bit_Reactor]

I think that the point being made here is that BoTW runs out of concrete reasons to explore much faster than most other open world games, because there is no real robust itemization system, there are no compelling quests or narratives, you dont level up or get experience, the enemy variety is poor etc. All you will ever find is shrines and korok seeds.

Click to shrink...

Right but that's intentional. There is no Avatar progression and itemization which is typically low effort in my eyes and fake progression to keep players on the treadmill. People like myself can get 300 hours across two playthroughs for the sheer joy of exploring and messing around with it in almost a minecraftian way.

I agree there could be more enemy variety. I agree they could vary up rewards, but I'm completely happy a forced (and typically fake/bullshit) RPG levelling system wasn't shoved into yet another game.

I'll always laugh at this because it's like players are conditioned to have to "get something" for literally every step they take that they now are conditioned to NEED the treadmill. They HAVE to have loot scaling, they HAVE to have levels, they HAVE to have skills. A game can't simply be fun, it has to incentivize you.

The compelling quests or narratives could use some upgrades sure, and there are plenty of valid critiques I myself have voiced about the game, but most people are asking for BOTW to be an UBI-title or a Witcher, when it's clearly designed to be the antithesis to that. The same reason why I stand by weapon degradation and the rest of its decisions on the macro, even if some micro decisions could definitely be improved in the sequel. I can critique a piece without going "it then became bad because it didn't do what I wanted" I just can see where it can be improved.

Seriously is there a good reason for why people shouldn't be evaluating the game once they get over the 50 hour mark, when the game was designed to be a massive world that takes that long to explore? Because if there is I haven't read it and the arguments that you made continue to just come off as trying to stifle criticism.

Click to shrink...

Because the game is meant to be a choose your own adventure. In the same way we don't request reviewers to play through every version of a narrative (for example every narrative choice in Witcher, every playthrough of Undertale albeit that game is shorter, both paragon and renegade modes, etc) I don't expect anyone to have to 100% a game to enjoy it, but like with my previous post there's this condition with platinum trophies and items and rpg numbers being shoved into everything that people feel like they have to have 100% A+++ quality across the board or it's somehow "not good" despite spending tens of hours in a game.

The game is meant to have too many korok dungeons and too many shrines to compensate for the world size it created and the scale it was going for. Could it be smaller? Possibly. Could it be more streamlined? Maybe! The world takes a long time to explore and has tons of stuff everywhere, but every game has what others call "Repetitive" content. Every game that's ever been made has been designed around core gameplay loops and disguising "repetitive" gameplay elements. People just like to use the word repetitive on games they don't like when they don't realize that a majority of games have you doing the same thing in the 100th quest as they do on the first.

The game is very clearly designed to be what the player wants to make of it, and I'll take that freedom of making my own fun and having an adventure I choose to have anywhere and any time I want over a curated experience of numbers and checklists any day of the week. Again, they can improve in the sequel, but the people who say the game isn't "good" after 50 hours can look at any other game and say the same thing, because resources aren't infinite and it's not possible to get everyone 100% of the time. And like others have said despite this thread of complaints there are tons of people who still love and appreciate the direction of this game.

But I mean I don't know why I normally post in these threads as we still have people who can't deal with the weapon degradation in the game, but that's on me lol

 

[rusty chrome]

It's a boring open world game with bad combat.

 

[Yunyo]

Still a fallacy and doesn't invalidate OP (or the rest of our) experience, nor is 2000 from ERA a great sample.

Click to shrink...

2000 on a hardcore gaming board is actually an enormous and highly useful sample size lol.

Right but that's intentional. There is no Avatar progression and itemization which is typically low effort in my eyes and fake progression to keep players on the treadmill. People like myself can get 300 hours across two playthroughs for the sheer joy of exploring and messing around with it in almost a minecraftian way.

I agree there could be more enemy variety. I agree they could vary up rewards, but I'm completely happy a forced (and typically fake/bullshit) RPG levelling system wasn't shoved into yet another game.

I'll always laugh at this because it's like players are conditioned to have to "get something" for literally every step they take that they now are conditioned to NEED the treadmill. They HAVE to have loot scaling, they HAVE to have levels, they HAVE to have skills. A game can't simply be fun, it has to incentivize you.

Click to shrink...

Indeed, you can see vestiges of this in lots of posts in the first couple of pages.

People are so conditioned into the tried and true leveling approach that they never considered that playing and engaging in the system is its own reward in how fun it is.

 

[Bit_Reactor]

People are so conditioned into the tried and true leveling approach that they never considered that playing and engaging in the system is its own reward in how fun it is.

Click to shrink...

It's the age old tale of Avatar Strength vs Player Strength.

Many people know that "big numbers being bigger = better" and that avatar strength is what propels them through content. This is Avatar Strength, where the bigger numbers trigger people's brains into thinking they're progressing. The new God of War forced this stupid stuff into it for example.

Player Strength is something like BOTW or even Dark Souls (despite it having numbers) requiring a player to engage somehow with the systems at hand and/or get good with the resources available to them in the game.

Like remembering my first few hours afraid to use too much weapons and afraid to attack too many enemies compared to now where I can throw a bomb, stasis one guy kill him with a weapon and then pick up his weapon and chunk it at the guy next to him feels more rewarding to me because I embraced the systems and didn't just "get x item that makes this thing easier" or "get x skill that makes this broken."

There's different types of people for each gameplay system but that's typically not how these posts are phrased. People go "There is no compelling content." Instead of "I need levels and weapons handed to reward me for doing things." People say it's "repetitive" instead of saying "More well paced story beats or sidequests could help break up the exploration." These types of critiques are typically levied at the lowest possible criticisms someone can have of a product, and typically are so opinion based that anyone could say anything about any other game and still be at the same level of critique.

My opinion of the game is that things can be better in the sequel, which is great, but that it doesn't mean the original somehow sucks now in comparison. Certain people expect and/or need certain experiences. Other people like it a different way. But so long as the Ocarina model is what everyone "needs" from the series, or other games force numbers into them conditioning people into thinking it means progression instantly, things like BOTW will invariably cause problems for the discussion. And so long as people pass off "I don't like this therefore it sucks" there is no real fruitful discussion to be had.

 

[ShaDowDaNca]

No Dungeons was a killer.

 

[TheRulingRing]

BoTW: The life simulator.

Click to shrink...

Lol. Don't we play games to escape that tedium?

I think my main criticism of the game - and it seems to be borne out here - is that is just sort of peters out in the end, because the ending point is when you're fed up. It really has some high highs and does some really bold things, but it tends to leave you with a sort of 'ho-hum' feeling when you're done - or it did me. Like an absolute banging song that just degenerates into a long repeat at the end until you get up and switch it off.

For the sequel, I'd really like to see something a bit more streamlined, so that the game leaves you wanting more.

Click to shrink...

Yeah, I'm kinda sad it left me with that feeling. It really deserved better but did itself a disservice at the end game.

I'll always laugh at this because it's like players are conditioned to have to "get something" for literally every step they take that they now are conditioned to NEED the treadmill. They HAVE to have loot scaling, they HAVE to have levels, they HAVE to have skills. A game can't simply be fun, it has to incentivize you.

Click to shrink...

Maybe that's the case for some but that's not me, I don't need carrot-on-a-stick mechanics to enjoy playing.

However, the game didn't really replace carrot-on-a-stick with anything else worthwhile for me, which is where it falls apart.

The game is meant to have too many korok dungeons and too many shrines to compensate for the world size it created and the scale it was going for. Could it be smaller? Possibly. Could it be more streamlined? Maybe! The world takes a long time to explore and has tons of stuff everywhere, but every game has what others call "Repetitive" content. Every game that's ever been made has been designed around core gameplay loops and disguising "repetitive" gameplay elements. People just like to use the word repetitive on games they don't like when they don't realize that a majority of games have you doing the same thing in the 100th quest as they do on the first.

The game is very clearly designed to be what the player wants to make of it, and I'll take that freedom of making my own fun and having an adventure I choose to have anywhere and any time I want over a curated experience of numbers and checklists any day of the week. Again, they can improve in the sequel, but the people who say the game isn't "good" after 50 hours can look at any other game and say the same thing, because resources aren't infinite and it's not possible to get everyone 100% of the time. And like others have said despite this thread of complaints there are tons of people who still love and appreciate the direction of this game.

Click to shrink...

I don't mind repetition as long as the loop is engaging. Unfortunately the exploration loop here devolved into "climb to the top of another barren hill to lift a Korok seed rock". Occasionally (like once per region) there would actually be something genuinely new/unique.

I've also played plenty of games that are still good and enjoyable to me after 100s of hours (games that are systems driven like BOTW), so the people saying "suck it up you got 50 hours you ungrateful prick" aren't really providing a strong argument.

 

[Bit_Reactor]

I don't mind repetition as long as the loop is engaging. Unfortunately the exploration loop here devolved into "climb to the top of another barren hill to lift a Korok seed rock". Occasionally (like once per region) there would actually be something genuinely new/unique.

I've also played plenty of games that are still good and enjoyable to me after 100s of hours (games that are systems driven like BOTW), so the people saying "suck it up you got 50 hours you ungrateful prick" aren't really providing a strong argument.

Click to shrink...

I mean your entire phrasing is about the destination not the journey, so it pretty much sums up our difference in perspective.

You want incentivized reasons to do the thing, I don't. I can play games like DQBuilders and others just building things. Some people can't. You want a carrot. You say you don't but you do.

I would love more environmental storytelling in the next game like the cabin in the icy cliff on the bottom left, and other things for sure, but for me the puzzles were the "how do I get there" and the gameplay loop was the journey to get to said place. If you don't enjoy the journey, then that's fine, but the game is clearly not designed around "player go here and then do this." It's designed to be almost completely free form with a loose fitting narrative.

And I mean you can try to pass off my words as calling you an ungrateful prick (although it gives off a conflicting tone), but the truth is you don't like the game for it not being something you want it to be. If you can provide examples of games you like with similar systems as BOTW I'd love to see them, but as of now you're telling me "I don't need a carrot on the stick, but I'd appreciate a carrot."

The "Worthwhile" for me was the many different stories my girlfriend and I had trying to get to certain places, the emergent systems in the game, playing around with elementals and chemistry systems in the game to see what hijinks could ensue. That's clearly not your thing and that's fine.

 

[Swift_Gamer]

Op couldn't describe me better.

 

[jviggy43]

Right but that's intentional. There is no Avatar progression and itemization which is typically low effort in my eyes and fake progression to keep players on the treadmill. People like myself can get 300 hours across two playthroughs for the sheer joy of exploring and messing around with it in almost a minecraftian way.

I agree there could be more enemy variety. I agree they could vary up rewards, but I'm completely happy a forced (and typically fake/bullshit) RPG levelling system wasn't shoved into yet another game.

I'll always laugh at this because it's like players are conditioned to have to "get something" for literally every step they take that they now are conditioned to NEED the treadmill. They HAVE to have loot scaling, they HAVE to have levels, they HAVE to have skills. A game can't simply be fun, it has to incentivize you.

The compelling quests or narratives could use some upgrades sure, and there are plenty of valid critiques I myself have voiced about the game, but most people are asking for BOTW to be an UBI-title or a Witcher, when it's clearly designed to be the antithesis to that. The same reason why I stand by weapon degradation and the rest of its decisions on the macro, even if some micro decisions could definitely be improved in the sequel. I can critique a piece without going "it then became bad because it didn't do what I wanted" I just can see where it can be improved.


Because the game is meant to be a choose your own adventure. In the same way we don't request reviewers to play through every version of a narrative (for example every narrative choice in Witcher, every playthrough of Undertale albeit that game is shorter, both paragon and renegade modes, etc) I don't expect anyone to have to 100% a game to enjoy it, but like with my previous post there's this condition with platinum trophies and items and rpg numbers being shoved into everything that people feel like they have to have 100% A+++ quality across the board or it's somehow "not good" despite spending tens of hours in a game.

The game is meant to have too many korok dungeons and too many shrines to compensate for the world size it created and the scale it was going for. Could it be smaller? Possibly. Could it be more streamlined? Maybe! The world takes a long time to explore and has tons of stuff everywhere, but every game has what others call "Repetitive" content. Every game that's ever been made has been designed around core gameplay loops and disguising "repetitive" gameplay elements. People just like to use the word repetitive on games they don't like when they don't realize that a majority of games have you doing the same thing in the 100th quest as they do on the first.

The game is very clearly designed to be what the player wants to make of it, and I'll take that freedom of making my own fun and having an adventure I choose to have anywhere and any time I want over a curated experience of numbers and checklists any day of the week. Again, they can improve in the sequel, but the people who say the game isn't "good" after 50 hours can look at any other game and say the same thing, because resources aren't infinite and it's not possible to get everyone 100% of the time. And like others have said despite this thread of complaints there are tons of people who still love and appreciate the direction of this game.

But I mean I don't know why I normally post in these threads as we still have people who can't deal with the weapon degradation in the game, but that's on me lol

Click to shrink...

You don't need to make a game as big as BOTW if you don't want people to explore for over 50 hours. And further if the game was designed to be pick your own adventure, it would have done well to not make the end result of each adventure wind up as one of two things. And if thats all the outcome comes down to then theres no need to pad out the game to the extent to which they made the map. You cant have it both ways by proclaiming BOTW is this incredible, huge open world game and then turn around and say youre not supposed to explore the entire thing, but pick and choose. And most of what OP was talking about wasn't even about 100%ing the game, just that the magic worse off of exploration after the first 50 hours.

A lot of games have repetitive gameplay but few have the world the size of BOTW. I think its incredibly hypocritical to praise it for its massive world and then turn around and suggest people cant complain the lack of unique quests to do because they aren't supposed to explore all of it. Yes people can complain about any game at about the 50 hour mark. The difference being is the majority of games aren't designed to be played for that long whereas BoTW clearly is. No one here is arguing or saying others cant enjoy or appreciate the game either.

 

[Bit_Reactor]

You don't need to make a game as big as BOTW if you don't want people to explore for over 50 hours. And further if the game was designed to be pick your own adventure, it would have done well to not make the end result of each adventure wind up as one of two things. And if thats all the outcome comes down to then theres no need to pad out the game to the extent to which they made the map. You cant have it both ways by proclaiming BOTW is this incredible, huge open world game and then turn around and say youre not supposed to explore the entire thing, but pick and choose. And most of what OP was talking about wasn't even about 100%ing the game, just that the magic worse off of exploration after the first 50 hours.

A lot of games have repetitive gameplay but few have the world the size of BOTW. I think its incredibly hypocritical to praise it for its massive world and then turn around and suggest people cant complain the lack of unique quests to do because they aren't supposed to explore all of it. Yes people can complain about any game at about the 50 hour mark. The difference being is the majority of games aren't designed to be played for that long whereas BoTW clearly is. No one here is arguing or saying others cant enjoy or appreciate the game either.

Click to shrink...

You need a carrot on a stick. This is why I don't relate to anyone's critiques of this nature.

And I can have it both ways because exploring the huge open world was my favorite part of the game. I didn't say you're not "supposed to" I say you don't "have to" because the game is made to make your own fun out of it and spend as much time engaging with it as YOU the player want to. That's why from the getgo they said you can go slap ganon in the face from the second you get off the plateau.

I can praise it for its massive world, and enjoy playing it, and speak to how it's likely to have some repetition (even the much loved Witcher 3 has repetition out the ass by the time you get to Skellige) regardless of the game size. In fact I can even say that people who played just the four beasts and then fought Ganon have just as valid of an experience as a person like myself who waited until hundreds of hours later to do it. Because different people want different things out of the game.

The "being designed to be played long" is a flaccid critique as that can literally pertain to any open world game, much like Minecraft, which can get "repetitive" and "boring" to people after the 50 hour mark. You're confusing "I don't want to play after 50 hours" with "If the game is big enough to warrant 50 hours, it should incentivize more." For BOTW fans it's the journey not the destination, and I enjoyed every minute of my 300 hours of the game and didn't even beat Ganon until the 300th. Anything can be "Designed for" anything and find a different end user result or a previously unseen aspect gain traction.

It's fine that others don't like that, but I can indeed have it both ways and say "The game is what you make of it" and "its massive world is great to explore and amazing to traverse." Because that's how opinions work. The OPs topic has a tangential link to 100% stuff because they specificaly mention if they'd known they wouldn't have the rewards or something they wouldn't have explored so much and should have just done the bare minimum in their quest. Maybe they'd have enjoyed that better who knows. But the "need" to unlock/do everything and get everything propels people to go do things and this game isn't about that kind of loop. Don't know what else to say.

 

[tenderbrew]

God I really hope Nintendo doesn't make "a more crafted experience" next time as this was the thing I loved the most.

 

[Deleted member 7462]

I give BotW credit for being pretty full of stuff for a game where the world is After the End. Compare its world to Rage (or Rage 2) or Mad Max, and it looks positively full!

But compare it to, say, Saints Row 2, and it looks like a really dull world with a repetitive nature and only a couple of stand-out things to find within the world (Eventide Island being the best example).

I try to look at it in the context of what a game that's meant to be in a bombed-out and depleted world might have to discover, and so in that context, I think it does passably well at adding things to find and do. In the context of most other open-world games, though, it's a poor one in that regard.

 

[Clear]

I was not a fan of BOTW and i ended my journey at around 4 hours, some guy wanted 12 crickets and that pushed me over the edge. I think I bought into the hype and the game did nothing to get me to the level of fun I was expecting.

The freedom was great but I needed a bit more suspense with my exploration. The weapon degrade system was fun as my combat decisions was not just run in and smash but the food/temperature system needs to feel more dynamic. I'm currently playing MG: Survive and while it is not open world the exploration part is great as I need to monitor my status and oxygen tank levels so going deeper from my base adds a lot tension that makes it fun. If BOTW2 added something that made exploring a calculated effort like the weapons I would be willing to give it a go. Even just changing the food system so I can't pause and heal up without punishment would help.

 

[Deleted member 33533]

A few discoveries definitely left me just soaked in and pondering about the world. But stuff like the Lon Lon Ranch is also immediately met with the contradiction that they're basically not doing the timeline in this game but they're also architecturally recreating relics of past games, and so it's nothing more than a cute reference because it can't really have any significance to the world since virtually everything else is changed and not to mention that this supposedly happens after Wind Waker, on a new Hyrule but also why are the Zoras living alongside the Rito when they were initially implied to be their descendants, and yet the game features Koroks but not Kokiri?

All I'm saying is, I feel the game is both pandering to, but also not respecting story-fans of the franchise and not just timeline nerds. I don't particularly care for the timeline, but there's such obvious attempts at hinting at a timeline connection with some of these things and yet none of it adds up, even when it seems like just maybe it would.

And that honestly frustrates me. I think the game would've been much better off with less fanservice and instead of Koroks there'd be a new race, let's call them Sproutwings or something, lol, and instead of Rito there would be Drakers, a new race that can fly or something. A lot of the "in-world" stuff in BotW comes across as perfunctory to me. The effort was clearly put into creating the functionality of everything but the story they slapped over it really leaves something to be desired.

Click to shrink...

Wait, who said this game takes place in New Hyrule from Spirit Tracks?

As for Rito and Zora, can a new species not emerge from an existing one without wiping out the old one? I don't think it's that weird in a fantasy context. If anything, it made less sense that Zora became birds after Hyrule became 90% water.

 

[Combo]

Too much of anything will make you dislike it.

 

[shem]

I got to your midway point after like the 5th or 6th shrine but still needed to do like 40 or so to make my stamina more amenable to exploring so I stopped having a lot of interesting exploration or combat fun almost immediately.

 

[a916]

Really liked the emergent gameplay, the discovering ways to do things... but the temples/divine beasts was so underwhelming, short, and easy as were the shrines and the story was just there... it was like the first Assassin's Creed, a lot of unfulfilled potential.

I think that the point being made here is that BoTW runs out of concrete reasons to explore much faster than most other open world games, because there is no real robust itemization system, there are no compelling quests or narratives, you dont level up or get experience, the enemy variety is poor etc. All you will ever find is shrines and korok seeds.

Click to shrink...

Well put.

 

[BarringGaffner]

You could have gone and defeated the final Boss. I think you felt you had to check boxes for no reason.

 

[Asbsand]

I get it, believe me. I just kind of looked at it as a "Greatest Hits" Hyrule since I gave up on the timeline a long time ago.

Click to shrink...

I also gave up on the timeline because I recognized that it's not the reason why Zelda is special, and entries like Spirit Tracks are so goofy it doesn't even matter what placement they have, because it adds no value, but I'll never forget the feeling that something might be connected in a game like Wind Waker which is pretty direct about the existence of OoT's iteration of Link and even seemed to canonize the scenario where Link beat Ganon and left to never return because he stopped thinking about Destiny (Majora's Mask). Admittedly the Hyrule Castle in Wind Waker and Ganondorf's Tower do not seem familiar to what was in Ocarina of Time but I could somewhat let that slide. I suppose with Lon Lon Ranch ruins in BotW I had the same feeling but that's why the almost 1:1 layout only irritated me. Temple of Time on the other hand feels as it should, to me. It's the BotW version of what a Temple of Time of a destroyed Hyrule looks like, but whenever it seems to drag in previous games' like the Rito, the Koroks and the ruins it feels like it's pandering, and I hate that.

I always feel like a franchise has run out of idea once it begins to get too self-referential and dabble in nostalgia in the product itself. I kinda hope they don't do these things too often. I'm much more for other "uncanon" ideas like Master Cycle Zero, which is a completely original thing but it's just really dumb.

 

[Asbsand]

Wait, who said this game takes place in New Hyrule from Spirit Tracks?

As for Rito and Zora, can a new species not emerge from an existing one without wiping out the old one? I don't think it's that weird in a fantasy context. If anything, it made less sense that Zora became birds after Hyrule became 90% water.

Click to shrink...

I just realized after I posted that the lack of Kokiri while referencing Zora actually makes sense for a timeline. They're underwater creatures, I'm stupid.

That said, I think it feels un-earned still, because Wind Waker was very overtly implying that Zoras had somehow evolved into, or become reincarnated as, the Rito and now suddenly I have to see them exist side by side as if that wasn't significant.

But I digress. I appreciate BotW better as a reboot or where timeline doesn't matter, I was never too hung up on how things connected anyway... but then, that's also why it bothers me. I wish this was just a clean slate but they insist on inserting "fan-favorite" stuff that doesn't feel original. I'm sort of torn on the other hand because I actually liked the Zora area a lot, and when it comes to the Gerudo, much like Ganondorf I'm completely okay with it arbitrarily existing in a reboot because idk, it doesn't feel like such a stretch to say there's women-only towns in the desert where things are really exotic.

 

[TheRulingRing]

For BOTW fans it's the journey not the destination, and I enjoyed every minute of my 300 hours of the game and didn't even beat Ganon until the 300th. Anything can be "Designed for" anything and find a different end user result or a previously unseen aspect gain traction.

Click to shrink...

But the journey also breaks down. You're acting as if you're the only one who appreciated the journey rather than the end.

I too appreciated "the journey", at least the beginning, because of the reasons that you've mentioned.

However, there's only so many times that the gameplay loop of "the journey" up yet another barren hill can be appreciated.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

But the journey also breaks down. You're acting as if you're the only one who appreciated the journey rather than the end.

I too appreciated "the journey", at least the beginning, because of the reasons that you've mentioned.

However, there's only so many times that the gameplay loop of "the journey" up yet another barren hill can be appreciated.

Click to shrink...

But nobody forced you to do more. Were you not aware you can basically skip everything and rush the boss? You don't need the guardians, you don't need the sword, you don't need a minimum health requirement if you're good enough.

Even if you wanted the perfect ending you could rush to the 4 guardians do their missions, find the picture locations with the hint of the guy near the stables throughout the land plus a guide, and then head to the castle where you're guaranteed to get the best generic weapons (knight/castle guard/w.e. It's called).

If someone is a completionist then that's on them as it has been known and memed on for years now that the reward for getting every single one of the main collectibles was a golden turd with no use besides a laugh.

How does the mindset go with "I'm starting to get tired of the loop and the discoveries. Should I keep pushing or just go to finish the game? Well clearly push for more until I grow to dislike it even further."

 

[MidnightCowboy]

I agree that it starts to falter the more you play due to recycled enemies/rewards, but it wasn't enough to deter me from putting 165 hours into the game.

 

[Dice]

A few discoveries definitely left me just soaked in and pondering about the world. But stuff like the Lon Lon Ranch is also immediately met with the contradiction that they're basically not doing the timeline in this game but they're also architecturally recreating relics of past games, and so it's nothing more than a cute reference because it can't really have any significance to the world since virtually everything else is changed and not to mention that this supposedly happens after Wind Waker, on a new Hyrule but also why are the Zoras living alongside the Rito when they were initially implied to be their descendants, and yet the game features Koroks but not Kokiri?

Click to shrink...

First I'm just gonna preface and say I give very few fucks about the timeline (mostly since Nintendo has only put a fraction of thought into making said timeline compared to the fandom). But I really get the emptiness of a lot of references. Like you said, they're "cute", but hardly substantial.
Few quests didnt really reference areas that much and unfortunately a lot of the story feels like it starts and stops that "it existed --- till Ganon fucked it all up".

Even if a small "Hyrule Sights" compendium thing that you fill out and it gives you some scarce info might be nice. But other than that most locations felt like visual easter eggs and amounted to very little (and sure, going by the Zelda Timeline, cause even more questions/confusion).

 

[henhowc]

This is me with any open world game

 

[night814]

The best part about BotW is you can play it anyway you want; after the great plateau the entire game is at your disposal and you have all the tools needed to do anything. If you don't like the repetition of going from tower to tower or shrine to shrine then do something else, go off in a direction you've not gone before for instance.

 

[Buff Beefbroth]

I loved the open world

Click to shrink...

I dropped it. Mainly due to the open world.

Click to shrink...

uh

 

[balgajo]

A few discoveries definitely left me just soaked in and pondering about the world. But stuff like the Lon Lon Ranch is also immediately met with the contradiction that they're basically not doing the timeline in this game but they're also architecturally recreating relics of past games, and so it's nothing more than a cute reference because it can't really have any significance to the world since virtually everything else is changed and not to mention that this supposedly happens after Wind Waker, on a new Hyrule but also why are the Zoras living alongside the Rito when they were initially implied to be their descendants, and yet the game features Koroks but not Kokiri?

All I'm saying is, I feel the game is both pandering to, but also not respecting story-fans of the franchise and not just timeline nerds. I don't particularly care for the timeline, but there's such obvious attempts at hinting at a timeline connection with some of these things and yet none of it adds up, even when it seems like just maybe it would.

And that honestly frustrates me. I think the game would've been much better off with less fanservice and instead of Koroks there'd be a new race, let's call them Sproutwings or something, lol, and instead of Rito there would be Drakers, a new race that can fly or something. A lot of the "in-world" stuff in BotW comes across as perfunctory to me. The effort was clearly put into creating the functionality of everything but the story they slapped over it really leaves something to be desired.

Click to shrink...

I had this feeling too. Most of what could be environmental storytelling felt like fanservice/cheap reference to the other games. To the point I couldn't take it serious. Ignoring stuff from other games would be a much better solution imo. I didn't like the way they handled the lore.

Wait, who said this game takes place in New Hyrule from Spirit Tracks?

As for Rito and Zora, can a new species not emerge from an existing one without wiping out the old one? I don't think it's that weird in a fantasy context. If anything, it made less sense that Zora became birds after Hyrule became 90% water.

Click to shrink...

Lol, never thought about the bolded.

 

[Mr Spasiba]

130 hours and you still have unexplored areas? You counting the blades of grass my guy?

 

[LonestarZues]

uh

Click to shrink...

Lol that was worded incorrectly. I meant I played it that long mainly due to the open world.

 

[TheRulingRing]

But nobody forced you to do more. Were you not aware you can basically skip everything and rush the boss? You don't need the guardians, you don't need the sword, you don't need a minimum health requirement if you're good enough.

Even if you wanted the perfect ending you could rush to the 4 guardians do their missions, find the picture locations with the hint of the guy near the stables throughout the land plus a guide, and then head to the castle where you're guaranteed to get the best generic weapons (knight/castle guard/w.e. It's called).

If someone is a completionist then that's on them as it has been known and memed on for years now that the reward for getting every single one of the main collectibles was a golden turd with no use besides a laugh.

How does the mindset go with "I'm starting to get tired of the loop and the discoveries. Should I keep pushing or just go to finish the game? Well clearly push for more until I grow to dislike it even further."

Click to shrink...

But nobody wants to do that. If I have to ignore 50% of the map so it doesn't wear down on me that's a flaw in the game (from my perspective).

 

[BarryFishFinger]

I think I'm done with the game now. I've been playing for a few hours over the last few days and I'm just kind of bored.

Figured I'd head for the closest divine beast quest which was the Zora and the walk up there was a bit of a chore with the lightning lizards (I made an anti lightning elixir and even so) and it's raining all the time which I know is related to the divine beast, but it's tiresome already; and then I have to go and kill the manbeast dude to get the shock arrows and I just can't be arsed anymore. The manbeast centaur guy kills me in a single hit most times - problem is (and I assume this is my fault), I still only have really low level weapons, and I only have 3 hearts and I'm not quite sure how to get more. I'm doing zero damage with melee, with my arrows and with my bomb skills. It seems I need to get 4 spirit orbs to upgrade my health by one heart? But not sure where to go once I've done that (maybe I missed something) and that also means I have to do 4 shrines and ugh, they're dull. They look visually dull, they're not much fun to play in and I haven't got much out of them in terms of satisfaction. I've done a few and have no enthusiasm to do any more but they seem to be fundamental to the upgrading? Unless I'm misinformed?

So I reckon it's just not for me. Shame as I was expecting to be blown away given the effusive praise literally everywhere, but although it has its high points (there are some delightful touches) for the most part it's been a fairly average slog. I'll give it back to my mate, glad I only borrowed and didn't pay £49 for it.

Gonna trade Links Awakening (which was brilliant and I've completed it) in for Switcher 3, I love Witcher 3 so I'm hopeful that will fill my open world game requirements.

 

[LumberPanda]

I think I'm done with the game now. I've been playing for a few hours over the last few days and I'm just kind of bored.

Figured I'd head for the closest divine beast quest which was the Zora and the walk up there was a bit of a chore with the lightning lizards (I made an anti lightning elixir and even so) and it's raining all the time which I know is related to the divine beast, but it's tiresome already; and then I have to go and kill the manbeast dude to get the shock arrows and I just can't be arsed anymore. The manbeast centaur guy kills me in a single hit most times - problem is (and I assume this is my fault), I still only have really low level weapons, and I only have 3 hearts and I'm not quite sure how to get more. I'm doing zero damage with melee, with my arrows and with my bomb skills. It seems I need to get 4 spirit orbs to upgrade my health by one heart? But not sure where to go once I've done that (maybe I missed something) and that also means I have to do 4 shrines and ugh, they're dull. They look visually dull, they're not much fun to play in and I haven't got much out of them in terms of satisfaction. I've done a few and have no enthusiasm to do any more but they seem to be fundamental to the upgrading? Unless I'm misinformed?

So I reckon it's just not for me. Shame as I was expecting to be blown away given the effusive praise literally everywhere, but although it has its high points (there are some delightful touches) for the most part it's been a fairly average slog. I'll give it back to my mate, glad I only borrowed and didn't pay £49 for it.

Gonna trade Links Awakening (which was brilliant and I've completed it) in for Switcher 3, I love Witcher 3 so I'm hopeful that will fill my open world game requirements.

Click to shrink...

You don't have to kill him (nor can you really at this point). Just collect enough arrows from around and peace out of there and enjoy the view from the top.

 

[BarryFishFinger]

You don't have to kill him (nor can you really at this point). Just collect enough arrows from around and peace out of there and enjoy the view from the top.

Click to shrink...

Ah, interesting, thanks! I've found one or two scattered about, didn't occur to me there would be 20 of them. What view, it's raining so hard I can't see anything.