She's not wrong in the idea that the Grieve amendment might make a few Brexiteers think that May's deal is the hardest they'll get, but I'd be surprised if more than a handful actually changed their mind, given that that was the case before Grieve's amendment.
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BREXIT |OT| ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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She's not wrong in the idea that the Grieve amendment might make a few Brexiteers think that May's deal is the hardest they'll get, but I'd be surprised if more than a handful actually changed their mind, given that that was the case before Grieve's amendment.
So is Norway basically full EU membership (IE, free movement etc), but without any say in the rules?
It's shit compared to what we have now, but I could live with it.
It's shit compared to what we have now, but I could live with it.
Pretty much, yeah.
It's not ideal but it's the 2nd best thing we could hope for outside of remaining.
More or less. Norway is in the single market, in Schengen, under the ECJ, in a few EU programmes but doesn't have any voting rights and does all its international trade deals through the EU (so no independent trade policy). Norway is outside CAP and CFP, though, so we'd have some freedom there.
It's completely pointless and worse than what we have now, but I think some are looking at it as a way to discharge the referendum mandate with minimal damage, since we would technically have left the European Union.
I'd prefer remaining but I'd take that over the other options.
Yes, and it is Parliaments way out, you will hear a big shift now since the Grieve amendment, all those clambering for a second vote will go quiet now. They have been given a get out
The only issue is will the EU accept it (can't see why not) May wins as she gets to use this against Labour for the next millennium
My issue is we are about to give up a seat at the top table to join a Norway model which removes all of our priveliges and we gain nothing
Exactly, May has weaponised the Brexit vote calling anyone a democracy destroyer who votes against her deal, Parliament can now say 'we honoured the referendum'
She's a bit of entertainment sometimes, on the beeb earlier she was warning that ministers are going to have to start thinking seriously about things in future because of the vote.
The horror.
That's a good thing when your influence has been as toxic as Britain's has been for some time now. The UK can always re-join as a full member when May's generation is cold in the ground and sane millennials have taken over.
Leadsom just sounds evil in everything she says. Truly a detestable individual, how can anyone vote for her as MP.
Was always going to be like that, when this is all over there will be careers in ruins, careers ruined deliberately, repucussions on rebel MP's
Yep, and there are some good things the EU can do, if I recall they wanted to put a 1p tax on all share dealings, but back then the UK blocked it
Yep here it was
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/dec/09/david-cameron-blocks-eu-treaty
She's joining in the Grieve amendment doesn't mean anything group, it's a bit worrying, she's nuts but she's a minister.
Only legislation can prevent a no deal seems to be the argument. i assumed legislation would follow a future decision, but May just needs to show nerve(hide in number 10) and face parliament down.
So what's the difference between May's deal and Norway? And does that Norway type deal clear up any problems with Ireland?
Don't forget though The EU is not so keen on Norway for the UK, and neither is Norway, as the UK is considered to big for a efta type deal
And crucially it would require the acceptance from the four countries in the efta deal at present, so this is not over, people thinking we will just rock up Jan 1st and order a Norway please, are in for a rude awakening
"A Norway deal will allow us to set our own immigration policies" is also a cart of manure, but we already knew that.
The biggest issue is not even the money, but the untold damage being done to the democratic system and how the lack of real statespeople is going to make it rot and stink for many, many years to come. Generations, even.
I only use Brexit lulz as a escape valve. As somebody from a country currently undergoing its own constitutional crisis of sorts due to nationalist pulsions and amateur politicians I feel for all of you.
Liam Fox continuing the rhetoric that Parliament may be about to destroy democracy
International Trade Secretary Liam Fox suggested the PM's deal was the only way of guaranteeing the UK leaves the EU, as scheduled, on 29 March 2019.
"When you are in prison and someone offers you a key, you take it," he told a committee of MPs.
While a no-deal exit would be "disorderly", he suggested the UK being kept in the EU against the will of the British people would be even more damaging.
"I think that there is a real danger that the House of Commons which has a natural remain majority may attempt to steal Brexit from British people which would be a democratic affront."
International Trade Secretary Liam Fox suggested the PM's deal was the only way of guaranteeing the UK leaves the EU, as scheduled, on 29 March 2019.
"When you are in prison and someone offers you a key, you take it," he told a committee of MPs.
While a no-deal exit would be "disorderly", he suggested the UK being kept in the EU against the will of the British people would be even more damaging.
"I think that there is a real danger that the House of Commons which has a natural remain majority may attempt to steal Brexit from British people which would be a democratic affront."
A disorderly no deal Brexit probably means people dying from lack of medicines, vastly reduced supplies of fresh food across the country and power generators and water purification systems being flown in in extremis to avoid (if not reduce) an humanitarian catastrophe. Also, a return to bloody sectarian violence in NI and the rise of smuggling crime lords across the borders. From ciggies to fuel, everything and anything will become a profitable business for the worst kind of people.
No deal Brexit advocates cannot go unchallenged like that.
No deal Brexit advocates cannot go unchallenged like that.
Leadsom "Going forward, not only will government ministers be very careful about what they ask law officers to give advice on, but law officers themselves will be very reluctant to give any advice to government that they might then see published on the front pages of the newspapers, so it's the principle of the thing.
And frankly I think any parliamentarian who wants at some point in the future to be in government is going to live to regret their vote last night."
Imagine her in a dictatorship. Yikes. What a lunatic.
Fox "There is a risk MPs could "steal Brexit from the British people" if Theresa May's proposed deal is rejected, a senior cabinet minister has warned.
Liam Fox said there was "natural Remain majority" in Parliament and any attempt to overturn the 2016 referendum vote would be a "democratic affront".
In reality, you're making it hard for me to be filthy rich by selling out you plebs.
Raab "We should go back to the EU, stop being blackmailed and bullied, make our best final offer, the terms that would be palatable to this country, that would give effect to the Referendum." He added that if that failed, Britain should be prepared to walk away without a deal.
Why is he even in the contention for leadership in any role.
And frankly I think any parliamentarian who wants at some point in the future to be in government is going to live to regret their vote last night."
Imagine her in a dictatorship. Yikes. What a lunatic.
Fox "There is a risk MPs could "steal Brexit from the British people" if Theresa May's proposed deal is rejected, a senior cabinet minister has warned.
Liam Fox said there was "natural Remain majority" in Parliament and any attempt to overturn the 2016 referendum vote would be a "democratic affront".
In reality, you're making it hard for me to be filthy rich by selling out you plebs.
Raab "We should go back to the EU, stop being blackmailed and bullied, make our best final offer, the terms that would be palatable to this country, that would give effect to the Referendum." He added that if that failed, Britain should be prepared to walk away without a deal.
Why is he even in the contention for leadership in any role.
Well, at least now it's obvious why they didn't want this published.
Paragraph 16! The Protocol will "endure indefinitely"
Hit!
Paragraph 33! There is a legal risk that UK could become stuck in "protracted and repeating rounds of negotiations"
Hit!
You sunk the Government's argument!
Paragraph 16! The Protocol will "endure indefinitely"
Hit!
Paragraph 33! There is a legal risk that UK could become stuck in "protracted and repeating rounds of negotiations"
Hit!
You sunk the Government's argument!
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Hahaha they only got legal advice because they had to produce something and then the lawyers are like "in my professional opinion, y'all fucked it up"
Lol
The agreement means if an agreement is not reached the backstop happens, if parliament can say no,then The agreement is null and void
EU will never allow that
Yeah, I still really don't understand why people are struggling to understand the concept of a fucking backstop.
If nothing else can be agreed... that's what happens. If there's a way out of it by one side then it's completely pointless.
It's like a safety net that some fucker can take away at will.
If nothing else can be agreed... that's what happens. If there's a way out of it by one side then it's completely pointless.
It's like a safety net that some fucker can take away at will.
They are EU citizens per the good friday agreement, so ...
Who is this person. A politician that seems to know what she's talking about and has done her homework?!
SECURITY!!!
Norway is not in the customs union and is able to negotiate its own trade agreements as I understand it. It just cannot participate in any EU decision making and the ECJ is the final arbiter in any disputes.
All in all not a bad deal, but there's FOM and the ECJ which are both brexiteer red lines.
I mean it's consistent at least, this is the same government that thought putting a backdoor into encrypted communication was feasible.
Apparently JC really pulled his punches during PMQ, even though the legal advice has been released.
Did anyone watch PMQ?
Did anyone watch PMQ?
Doesn't May's deal still have the ECJ taking authority on many things?
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