BREXIT |OT2.0| A parade of endless victories for Boris Johnson

dean_rcg

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,214
Cunning, give MP's the chance to vote down No Deal, then tell all the brexiteers its not their fault they couldn't get us out??
 

null

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,793
"It is basically a Northern Ireland only backstop but with a time limit in the form of consent for Northern Irish people - unthinkable just a few months ago "

It's the original backstop then because it creates a border down the Irish sea and requires both parties to agree to end it.

 

Garfield

Member
Oct 31, 2018
1,222
Stupid question, but we all agree a GE is risky as if Boris gets a majority will almost certainly be a no deal, so in many ways having an election is a big risk

At the moment we have a majority remain parliament or more a majority against no deal parliament, why do they not pass a law banning no deal ever, and put a stipulation in that if the EU ever refuses an extension then parliament must revoke Article 50
 

CeeCee

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,042
Stupid question, but we all agree a GE is risky as if Boris gets a majority will almost certainly be a no deal, so in many ways having an election is a big risk

At the moment we have a majority remain parliament or more a majority against no deal parliament, why do they not pass a law banning no deal ever, and put a stipulation in that if the EU ever refuses an extension then parliament must revoke Article 50
Because there’s not a majority in favour of revoking Article 50.

There’s this weird thing where there’s a minority who support No Deal, a minority who support revocation to avoid a No Deal, and then an unhelpful group who don’t support No Deal but also don’t support revocation.
 

kmag

Member
Nov 5, 2017
1,840
Cunning, give MP's the chance to vote down No Deal, then tell all the brexiteers its not their fault they couldn't get us out??
Weirdly enough you could end up in a situation where a resolution supporting no deal passes with those 20 odd Labour leavers making a symbolic gesture but the Benn Act remaining in place and the extension being sought. A resolution not having the same weight as law. Then the Parliament collapsing for a GE where the virtue signallers on all sides have put their line in the sand with the resolution vote. Then we do a no deal election which the Tories will win.
 

null

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,793
If you want to revoke you need a mandate to do it. You have to remember that a lot of these MPs are against no-deal but also represent areas that did vote leave.
 

eonden

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,380

kmag

Member
Nov 5, 2017
1,840
I'd be cautious of Waterfield's sources. He talks a lot of shit.
Waterfield is basically used to float UK government shit to Brussels. He's a terrible journalist. Funny enough some of the better European journalists are from the shittiest papers: Nick Gutteridge from the Sun seems sensible on twitter (but he writes for the Sun and his written output is the usual Sun dreck), the same with James Crisp from the Telegraph.

Belfast (shockingly) says no.
Remember folks it's about democracy or something

 

kmag

Member
Nov 5, 2017
1,840
Anything about "major concessions" that comes from the Times should be quarantined at this point.
I agree but to be honest, this is the way I expected the EU to go. The principle of consent is not a bad one. But turning it around to say ok you need to opt out is smart, even putting aside having essentially a unionist veto on staying in, having an opt-in via an institution which is not currently sitting is madness.

The basic offer Waterfield is describing is something I can see the EU offering

A NI only backstop, with an Irish sea customs border and Stormont having the ability to vote to leave that arrangement if both communities agree. Is probably the least objectionable position for the EU to be honest.
 

Batatina

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,536
Edinburgh, UK
That special parliament session is obviously to make MPs vote between Boris deal (which EU has rejected) or No Deal, so that they can blame No Deal on both the EU and MPs. The Guardian listed out reasons for this session and I don't understand how they missed that one.
 

jelly

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,522
How can they vote on something the EU has rejected. It seems like such a pointless day to have other than oooh, big fake moment rather than get on your bike and ask for an extension already you buffoon. It just a complete joke at this point.
 

peekaboo

Member
Nov 4, 2017
314
They can't vote for one or another, Parliament votes don't work that way. They can offer several different votes but even this can be amended so the majority of Parliament could add "vote to delay" as an amendment as well.

RINSE AND REPEAT AD INFINITUM.
 

Unclebenny

Member
Oct 28, 2017
465
How can they vote on something the EU has rejected. It seems like such a pointless day to have other than oooh, big fake moment rather than get on your bike and ask for an extension already you buffoon. It just a complete joke at this point.
Remember when the Tories spent a week having a hearty back slapping session over getting the Malthouse compromise through parliament? Despite the EU having declared it unacceptable before it had even been voted on.

This entire Brexit fiasco has been run as if the EU and Ireland basically don't exist.
 

CampFreddie

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,025
this is worse than "insider leaks" before E3
I'm waiting for Cummings to claim that he can solve the Irish border problems with the power of the cloud. Every truck just needs a permanent internet connection. Hardware raytracing will be used to solve rules of origin queries in realtime. Top-secret 3D stacked border posts will allow the UK to beat the raw trade power advantage of the EU27. Meanwhile border disruptions caused by latency issues on cross-Channel ferries will be fixed by new SSD tech that reduces loading/unloading times to a fraction of a second while also reducing the storage size of the goods.
 

PJV3

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,783
London
Those polls plus the generational shift will probably mean at least a decade of going around in circles at great expense and effort, to achieve nothing at all, longer if you add on the austerity years. think of what we could be doing instead that might improve the country.
 

PJV3

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,783
London
Boris wouldn't campaign for no deal brexit in an election, what a fucking carry-on.
and EU-friendly tory mp's are satisfied with that answer. fuck off.
 

kmag

Member
Nov 5, 2017
1,840
Boris wouldn't campaign for no deal brexit in an election, what a fucking carry-on.
and EU-friendly tory mp's are satisfied with that answer. fuck off.
I actually don't think Johnson would go unambiguously no deal, he'll couch it as "no more extensions" we'll get a deal or we'll leave no deal on X date. i.e roughly what he's been doing until now as it's just about holding the party together.
 

Funky Papa

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,044
It's hard to believe how badly the Tories boxed themselves by turning No Deal into an acceptable default. All the Brexit Party has to do is to turn the screw each time they try to walk away from it and back to square one they go.

And vehement, unrestrained language like "surrender act" is not helping them at all.
 

PJV3

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,783
London
I actually don't think Johnson would go unambiguously no deal, he'll couch it as "no more extensions" we'll get a deal or we'll leave no deal on X date. i.e roughly what he's been doing until now as it's just about holding the party together.
But then he behaves like a complete tit offering nothing of substance and ruining the relationship with europe, i'd prefer it if he just said no deal instead. The Tory MP's just want him to say the words but behave in completely the opposite way, it's weird and doesn't benefit anyone, who believes it?
 
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Funky Papa

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,044

The way things are going with Turkey and Trump, there are significant odds of the EU being more stringent than previously expected. Brexit is a time sink at a moment when time and proper coordination may be precious.
 

PJV3

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,783
London

The way things are going with Turkey and Trump, there are significant odds of the EU being more stringent than previously expected. Brexit is a time sink at a moment when time and proper coordination may be precious.
Please don't behave like a two year old child at an international meeting, can't he just have a tantrum at a Tesco?
 

jelly

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,522
The UK would side with Turkey and the US anyway so not surprised they would feel that way. Brexit is sucking air but the UK is a basket case at the moment and a lapdog.
 

Funky Papa

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,044
The UK has a good number of special forces deployed along the French in support of the Kurds, so Boris is probably in a huge bind there.

Trump has sold every ally in the region.