BREXIT |OT2.0| A parade of endless victories for Boris Johnson

dean_rcg · Sep 19, 2019

Unfortunately I think it could go down fairly badly, especially next to "Brexit on Oct 31st do or die" and "revoke Article 50". We live in entrenched, polarised times so sitting in the middle seems risky to me. I hope I'm wrong but the most recent polls have me concerned.

nature boy · Sep 19, 2019

plagiarize · Sep 19, 2019

But if the UK finally pass the WA, that already gives them until the end of next year to implement a viable alternative to the backstop, and the backstop won't have gone into effect.

So... if they can do it. Why are they against the WA?

And if they crash out, they get no timetable. None. Border is closed at 11pm on October 31st, and if the UK don't implement border checks they are in violation of the law.

phisheep · Sep 19, 2019

plagiarize said:
And if they crash out, they get no timetable. None. Border is closed at 11pm on October 31st, and if the UK don't implement border checks they are in violation of the law.

Genuine question - what law (and whose law) would they be in violation of? It's not something I've paid any attention to.

PJV3 · Sep 19, 2019

nature boy said:

By the 100th time a brexit voter says Juncker is a drunk perhaps they might change the record, it's just a chore to read.

nature boy · Sep 19, 2019

Meh Juncker just says a deal is possible before the 31st

Deleted member 862 · Sep 19, 2019

nature boy said:
Meh Juncker just says a deal is possible before the 31st

They always say that because they never want to be the ones to get the blame (not that it's their fault)

it's pathetic that the press will take this and puff it up as some big win when May was told this literally every time they met.

nature boy · Sep 19, 2019

null said:
They always say that because they never want to be the ones to get the blame (not that it's their fault)

it's pathetic that the press will take this and puff it up as some big win when May was told this literally every time they met.

Yep but Sky made it sound like Juncker had said something substantial.

A deal is always possible lol, but I think at best BJ is waiting for a cave at the last minute - and that's not going to happen

Dinoric · Sep 19, 2019

PJV3 said:
It's a really sensible motion looking at the group, 30,000 members and only 500 vote because the leadership fix it that way, Watson coming up from that group explains a lot. no wonder loads of different associations are pulling out, it's not just a Lansman being petty and on a power trip like Watson is framing it.

I'm curious. How do they get away with only letting 500 members vote and why?

PJV3 · Sep 19, 2019

Dinoric said:
I'm curious. How do they get away with only letting 500 members vote and why?

there's 30,000 labour members who are students, it's a mixture of reasons from the party structure(not strictly the student groups fault although they resisted changing it) and then making people jump through hoops to vote, extra payments, email accounts etc and kinda not highlighting there's an actual election happening at all.

It's shameful for the party and not just the students section to have that kind of thing going on in a democratic organisation.

eonden · Sep 19, 2019

danowat said:
I'm shocked I tell's ya.

Still do or die by the 31st?, or does the hulk now need to find a comfortable ditch?

They never said 31st October 2019 right? Could always be next year!

Funky Papa said:
"how to make friends and influence others"

Cause Spanish people love having english people boss them around, even more when they have been somewhat more politically disfunctional than us when we have had an impeachment and a non government for a while now.

Antrax · Sep 19, 2019

phisheep said:
Genuine question - what law (and whose law) would they be in violation of? It's not something I've paid any attention to.

I don't think they would be. They'd basically be making a one-way free trade deal by letting anyone into the UK without reciprocating. The EU would have to close the border (because otherwise, anyone could just fly their goods into Northern Ireland and drive it all into the Republic of Ireland, and therefore into the EU, bypassing EU agreements/customs/etc..).

It'd be a huge blow to the UK for trade reasons though. No chance any country talks to them while the UK thumbs its nose at the EU (the much larger, much more important trading partner for those other countries).

Lagamorph · Sep 19, 2019

Antrax said:
I don't think they would be. They'd basically be making a one-way free trade deal by letting anyone into the UK without reciprocating. The EU would have to close the border (because otherwise, anyone could just fly their goods into Northern Ireland and drive it all into the Republic of Ireland, and therefore into the EU, bypassing EU agreements/customs/etc..).

It'd be a huge blow to the UK for trade reasons though. No chance any country talks to them while the UK thumbs its nose at the EU (the much larger, much more important trading partner for those other countries).

I think the UK would be in breach of WTO regulations unless they also made the same arrangements for trade with literally everyone. So basically the only way to not be breaking the law would be to have literally totally open borders trade wise.

plagiarize · Sep 19, 2019

Antrax said:
I don't think they would be. They'd basically be making a one-way free trade deal by letting anyone into the UK without reciprocating. The EU would have to close the border (because otherwise, anyone could just fly their goods into Northern Ireland and drive it all into the Republic of Ireland, and therefore into the EU, bypassing EU agreements/customs/etc..).

It'd be a huge blow to the UK for trade reasons though. No chance any country talks to them while the UK thumbs its nose at the EU (the much larger, much more important trading partner for those other countries).

Yeah law is perhaps the wrong word. Rules would have been better.

WTO rules is precisely what the UK will be abiding by should they crash out, and refusing to control trade from one specific country is against the rules which mandate that trade from any country you don't have a deal with should be treated equally.

I suppose they could get around it by removing any control on imports from any country though, but I don't think that's the plan.

Maledict · Sep 19, 2019

plagiarize said:
Yeah law is perhaps the wrong word. Rules would have been better.

WTO rules is precisely what the UK will be abiding by should they crash out, and refusing to control trade from one specific country is against the rules which mandate that trade from any country you don't have a deal with should be treated equally.

I suppose they could get around it by removing any control on imports from any country though, but I don't think that's the plan.

That is precisely the idea behind the lunatic Mumford's model which brexiteers love. He assumes the UK unilaterally drops every tariff to 0.

Zutroy · Sep 19, 2019

Everyone brings up how bad the Irish boarder is gonna be (quite rightly so), but it's odd how you rarely hear just how absolutely fucked Gibraltar will be with a no deal exit.

tuxfool · Sep 19, 2019

Zutroy said:
Everyone brings up how bad the Irish boarder is gonna be (quite rightly so), but it's odd how you rarely hear just how absolutely fucked Gibraltar will be with a no deal exit.

That's because nobody gives a shit about Gibraltar.

Tzarscream · Sep 19, 2019

Zutroy said:
Everyone brings up how bad the Irish boarder is gonna be (quite rightly so), but it's odd how you rarely hear just how absolutely fucked Gibraltar will be with a no deal exit.

tuxfool said:
That's because nobody gives a shit about Gibraltar.

Out of sight, out of mind.

Gernau Morat Gurgeh · Sep 19, 2019

tuxfool said:
That's because nobody gives a shit about Gibraltar.

It's kind of funny. I just read a book about the great siege of Gibraltar, which was such a massive propagandistic thing for the UK for a century or more. And now, the very same nationalists who make their appeals to British imperialism don't give the the tiniest shit about it.

IpKaiFung · Sep 19, 2019

Maledict said:
That is precisely the idea behind the lunatic Mumford's model which brexiteers love. He assumes the UK unilaterally drops every tariff to 0.

And because of the most favoured nation rule it's in no ones interest to sign a free trade arrangement with the UK.

I wonder who the hell in government thought unilateral reduction of duties to 0 would be a good idea. There should be some senior civil servants who know better, I work (soon to be worked next tuesday)for the civil service (HMRC) but I didn't think SCS would be that inept.

Ravensmash · Sep 19, 2019

Watching Politics Live now, and Faiza Shaheen is actually coming across fairly well for the Labour pov.

It's still muddled, and there are serious questions regarding how viable their tactic will be in Lib Dem/Tory marginals, but she seems fairly clued on.

I just don't know how sensible it's going to be during an election campaign - people are too entrenched. And any Labour deal is not going to be appealing to those in the Brexit now crowd.

I mean, neither is the Lib Dem policy either, so fuck knows.

Edit: In more exciting news, Faisal Islam is presenting Politics Live tomorrow!

Joni · Sep 20, 2019

Zutroy said:
Everyone brings up how bad the Irish boarder is gonna be (quite rightly so), but it's odd how you rarely hear just how absolutely fucked Gibraltar will be with a no deal exit.

It is because Gibraltar is exempt from the WA anyway. The UK will need a separate deal with Spain on Gibraltar as part of the EU strategy. I'm sure Spain will be very easy to deal with.

Deleted member 835 · Sep 20, 2019

Not really Brexit... but man it reminds me how this country is getting worse

Funky Papa · Sep 20, 2019

A splash of saltwater is probably good for curing gammons.

Deleted member 44129 · Sep 20, 2019

Beefy said:
Not really Brexit... but man it reminds me how this country is getting worse

Oooh, racist holidays where you get to go abroad but you don't have to mix with any mucky foreigners. This reminds me of the time my parent's got a brochure boasting the town's "British Curry House with British Chefs!"...Hmmmmm...... I think we can all read between the lines here.

CampFreddie · Sep 20, 2019

The mind boggles at what sort of kinky shit goes on in an explicitly "adult only" event for the over 50's.
I didn't realise Saga were into that type of cruising.

jelly · Sep 20, 2019

Even tv adverts are pulling the good old days and not in the cool remember that fun advert way, it's gone all simpler times.

Uzzy · Sep 20, 2019

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-japan-trade-idUSKBN1W435F

The British government said on Friday it wanted to hear from businesses and members of the public what their priorities were for a post-Brexit trade deal with Japan.

The government said its "call for input" to help it prepare for post-Brexit trade negotiations with Japan, would be open until Nov. 4, with anyone able to take part online.

Free trade in waifus pls.

SvennusDemonicus · Sep 20, 2019

Uzzy said:
https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-japan-trade-idUSKBN1W435F

Free trade in waifus pls.

Most businesses will be like. Can we just have what we have already....

Simon21 · Sep 20, 2019

Funky Papa said:
A splash of saltwater is probably good for curing gammons.

Just want to let you know that this gem hasn't gone unnoticed.

War Peaceman · Sep 20, 2019

Beefy said:
Not really Brexit... but man it reminds me how this country is getting worse

Missed opportunity by Saga for a leave joke.

Koukalaka · Sep 20, 2019

Funky Papa said:
A splash of saltwater is probably good for curing gammons.

God-DAMN.

Uzzy · Sep 20, 2019

Fresh Brexit talks row as UK asks EU to keep its proposals secret

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/sep/20/fresh-brexit-talks-row-uk-eu-proposals-secret

Specfic papers that the Government doesn't want in the public domain? Is that the Humble Address's music I hear?

ss1 · Sep 20, 2019

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49727121

The Tories going to be competing with the Brexit party for the over 45 vote. If your parents start spouting more tory talking points/propaganda than usual you now know why.

Deleted member 13077 · Sep 20, 2019

Ravensmash said:
Watching Politics Live now, and Faiza Shaheen is actually coming across fairly well for the Labour pov.

It's still muddled, and there are serious questions regarding how viable their tactic will be in Lib Dem/Tory marginals, but she seems fairly clued on.

I just don't know how sensible it's going to be during an election campaign - people are too entrenched. And any Labour deal is not going to be appealing to those in the Brexit now crowd.

I actually don't see any other way forward that won't either cause riots (Lib Dem), destroy our economy (Tory), or possibly both. At some point you have to accept that the lunatic fringe on both sides are a lost cause, and aren't going to be satisfied unless they get the pleasure of watching the other side suffer.

I'm also absolutely fine with Corbyn being neutral. It's entirely likely we would have had a different outcome in 2016 sold the opportunity to give the pig fucker a bloody nose wasn't there.

Timmm · Sep 20, 2019

eonden said:
Cause Spanish people love having english people boss them around, even more when they have been somewhat more politically disfunctional than us when we have had an impeachment and a non government for a while now.

These are the same people who think the Commonwealth was a good thing and the citizens of commonwealth countries liked having the Brits around stealing all their resources. Their reality is entirely constructed by jingoistic English newspapers and only ever talking to other old white English people. So they probably actually think that

Beefy said:
Not really Brexit... but man it reminds me how this country is getting worse

Those cruises always looked like hell, I can think of very few things worse than being trapped with a load of right wing olds in the middle of the ocean

SMD · Sep 20, 2019

Timmm said:
Those cruises always looked like hell, I can think of very few things worse than being trapped with a load of right wing olds in the middle of the ocean

The fact that they manage to return to port.

IpKaiFung · Sep 20, 2019

CampFreddie said:
The mind boggles at what sort of kinky shit goes on in an explicitly "adult only" event for the over 50's.
I didn't realise Saga were into that type of cruising.

Depends how they vote

Koukalaka · Sep 20, 2019

IpKaiFung said:
Depends how they vote

A lot to unpack from this... good to see that Labour supporters are both into giving and taking.

WillyGubbins · Sep 20, 2019

Koukalaka said:
A lot to unpack from this... good to see that Labour supporters are both into giving and taking.

Where's the SNP???

Protome · Sep 20, 2019

Hamrub said:
Where's the SNP???

Too rude to be published.

WillyGubbins · Sep 20, 2019

Protome said:
Too rude to be published.

Is it key parties with the Krankies?

Protome · Sep 20, 2019

Hamrub said:
Is it key parties with the Krankies?

Oh god, Wee Jimmy Krankie (Janette Tough) was my dad's babysitter growing up.
So this is even grosser to me than you intended.

Facism · Sep 20, 2019

That saga cruise sounds like Kenilworth on a boat.

WillyGubbins · Sep 20, 2019

Protome said:
Oh god, Wee Jimmy Krankie (Janette Tough) was my dad's babysitter growing up.
So this is even grosser to me than you intended.

O_O

nature boy · Sep 20, 2019

Flammable D · Sep 20, 2019

IpKaiFung said:
Depends how they vote

There's a pithy tweet in Labour supporters wanting to distribute their partners and Lib Dems wanting to restrict themselves, get off on looking at themselves, and fetishising other races and trans people

That wasn't very pithy by the end, sorry

Dirtyshubb · Sep 20, 2019

IpKaiFung said:
Depends how they vote

This actually says a lot and is pretty damn fitting for each party.

The biggest lol is from the Lib Dems being having sex with someone of a different ethnicity which hilariously plays into the white, middle class bubble image many have of them.

Salty_Josh · Sep 20, 2019

That ukip one seems so tame until you realise that, between men and women, using a vibrator or dildo is more statistically over-represented than passionate kissing

RellikSK · Sep 20, 2019

nature boy said:

Corbyn breaking records.

BREXIT |OT2.0| A parade of endless victories for Boris Johnson

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