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BREXIT |OT2.0| A parade of endless victories for Boris Johnson
- Thread starter Uzzy
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Heh, some good stuff there. We are in the midst of Tory meltdown. Dems and TIG will try the damnedest best to get people to show up at the polls and others will get the reamainer word out
Not too concerned with the ukippers leaving the Tories and going back to garbage and ukip. Splits the right-wing vote three ways. This was inevitable from the day May lurched her party to the right.
Big question is labour, what with the ever increasing majority for remain. It's serves them well to delay the official backing for a second ref until the last minute before the EU elections. But play it wrong and there is a chance this will benefit the brexit party.
First things first, labour is playing for time knowing damn well the talks for a brexit deal will break down.
EU elections are proportional, splitting the vote is less relevant. It just means a lot of brexiteers in the Parliament showing why most Europeans want the UK to leave.
The UK EU elections use D'hondt and split the UK into regions with very small numbers of seats each, giving not particularly proportional outcomes.
It effectively creates a minimum vote share threshold, depending on the region, of 10%. In the smaller regions, this is closer to 20%
Splitting the vote is still very much an issue, depending exactly how it splits.
Between this and David Blunkett's recent "Why hasn't the full force of the law been used against these eco anarchists who fill me with contempt?" article in the Daily Mail a few days ago, it's probably time to remember New Labour had something of an authoritarian/social Conservative streak in certain areas.
While westminster is on vacation it seems EU line is hardening with october becoming a hard deadline. Seems like Macron is doing lots of convincing behind the scenes and he convinced germany and a few others.
Seems like they also want to force out the brexit party as soon as possible.
https://www.ft.com/content/f064d5fc-61b8-11e9-b285-3acd5d43599e
Seems like they also want to force out the brexit party as soon as possible.
https://www.ft.com/content/f064d5fc-61b8-11e9-b285-3acd5d43599e
Great, but with Lega polling at near 40% (which is majority territory) I'm legit terrified for the future of the Union (and Italy...)
Yeah I believe it, there's an Italian lady at the place I work, and she basically said she moved to the UK because of what the EU is doing to Italy, she hates the EU.
Uses EU privileges to move countries, and would probably vote out if it came to it? What a fucking asshole
Does she realize she was able to simply move to the UK and work there because of the EU?
Probably not, and she probably doesn't realise she might have to go back if/when we leave the EU.
Man, that's like the antimatter universe version of my Aunt. She's lived in Italy so long it's degrading her English.
How have I never seen this?!
Just after the referendum apparently, not a quote, just Marr spouting this absolutely fucking disgusting rhetoric at the beginning of the show.
Just after the referendum apparently, not a quote, just Marr spouting this absolutely fucking disgusting rhetoric at the beginning of the show.
Unfortunately, terms like 'net benefit' are lost in our current taste for Manichean bullshit.
Nah, new labour was perfect, it's only us bitter impotent lefties who give a shit about things like half a million dead Iraqis, the massive expansion of anti terror legislation and the normalisation of right wing rhetoric.
I'm not sure anyone (sane) thinks New Labour was perfect. I think people get irritated at Corbyn worship and ignoring the various good things NL did do, as if it's all a zero-sum game.
I'm also not sure anyone thinks Iraq was a good idea, and I'm pretty sure many on the left think Labour moving leftwards is welcome, and that those who don't like its current course aren't necessarily social fascists who love killing Iraqi children.
You might think this is facile, but I've read enough of Twitter.
Fair, I don't do twitter, but whenever the reanimated corpse of Blair comes back to vomit his bile on us I become somewhat bitter. I've also heard a lot of Blair era worship when I was volunteering with labour locally, so I am somewhat salty about the whole thing.
Honestly? If I thought we'd be better off out of the EU I absolutely would have voted for it. But I guessed we wouldn't and here we are.
It was a selfish vote on my part to remain, I'll admit. Knowing that me and my family would be better off (despite what some of the more conservative members of my extended family might think).
Also fair. I am no fan of Blair.
I shouldn't read Twitter, it's often so... stupid. So so so stupid...
Also, digression, but I see the largest number of utterly unfunny wannabe comedians on Twitter. I guess it's a function of the medium, but nowhere else do I read so many desperately unfunny political 'jokes'...
I only read it via peoples reposts on the forum, but even that tends to piss me off- especially around Brexit, so many people who are anti Brexit and I guess I fundamentally agree with, but who's attitudes, and as you say attempts at humour get right on my tits.
Coming from Marr it doesn't surprise me in the slightest. Just another one of these twats that seems to forget that he's part of the elite that he's railing against.
But that's the point he's one of the elite telling the little people that all their problems are to do with the foreigners and nothing to do with him and his mates that are in power.
Rose-tinted Blairism is definitely a thing, and not even as a rejection of Corbyn worship. Some people just associate it with better times, or at least times where they were less politically aware so ignored a lot of the dirty details, or because they prospered during that pre-crash period and were insulated from the worst of the mid/late New Labour rot.
Even crazier, in this age of massively accelerated nostalgic feelings, are people wanting the "good old days" of 2012 back.
Even crazier, in this age of massively accelerated nostalgic feelings, are people wanting the "good old days" of 2012 back.
American outsider here. Two questions:
1. Now that Brexit negotiations seem to be on an endless trail of extensions because no one seems to be willing to commit to even the idea of leaving the EU outside of taking points... will Brexit ever actually happen?
2. Maybe I'm just used to the banal appearance of the modern American politician sans Trump... but it's it just me, or does everyone involved in this seem a bit... odd? Like, there's the whole pig-fucking thing with David Cameron. Then there's Boris Johnson, who actually looks & carries himself like a madman. And then there's the whole Bucket Head thing. It's actually quite... entertaining to watch play out. All of your politicians seem like real characters.
1. Now that Brexit negotiations seem to be on an endless trail of extensions because no one seems to be willing to commit to even the idea of leaving the EU outside of taking points... will Brexit ever actually happen?
2. Maybe I'm just used to the banal appearance of the modern American politician sans Trump... but it's it just me, or does everyone involved in this seem a bit... odd? Like, there's the whole pig-fucking thing with David Cameron. Then there's Boris Johnson, who actually looks & carries himself like a madman. And then there's the whole Bucket Head thing. It's actually quite... entertaining to watch play out. All of your politicians seem like real characters.
2012 was the olympics so it doesn't surpise me when especially many liberals point to that as the good old days because the country actually felt very open, understanding and progressive atleast in the media.
1. Probably, but right now it's hard to tell. It would take something akin to a revolution to stop any type of Brexit actually happening.
2. The people they've managed to drudge up in support of Brexit are the fringe politicians the established ones have always tried to keep in the basement (back-benches) that because of Brexit have been given credence and soapboxes. They include Victorian erudite Jacob Rees Mogg and madder-than-a-bag-of-spanners and now apparent leader of the House of Commons Andrea Leadsom. The people May has had to surround herself with to get through this mess have been nothing short of a rogue's gallery and the worrying thing is they are actual politicians, not actual joke characters like Lord Buckethead. The pig thing was just an odd and outlandish smear campaign, there are likely far more horrific stories from Cameron's time in the Bullingdon Club that are kept under wraps.
But they can't have another no confidence vote until next year under their own rules. The only thing they can do is a no confidence vote in the entire government and trigger a General Election, and even then I don't think May would actually have to resign.
https://www.ted.com/talks/carole_cadwalladr_facebook_s_role_in_brexit_and_the_threat_to_democracy
Please just watch this talk.
Please just watch this talk.
Well the article implies that grassroots pressure would make MPs change the rules to oust her earlier, I'm not sure how she remains in office if she has no support
If they lived in a bubble, sure. Which admittedly many of them did before Brexit.
Even looking back at the Olympics feels spectacularly hollow given the G4S scandal around its security, and the opening ceremony's gushing love for the NHS coming at a time when Tory austerity was starting to bite and the top-down reorganisation was kicking in (deemed a disaster by 2015, and pretty sure there have been calls for reversal now). The only saving grace was George Osborne getting booed.
Like, shit was coming off the rails in regards to the far right even before that point too. I spent 2008-2010 watching the EDL march through a local town protesting over a new mosque that still hasn't been built, to the best of my knowledge.
I think looking at the Olympics in terms of G4S and Tory austerity is to look at only part of the picture.
Middle class - rather than liberal per se (we aren't in America, I think class is much more useful than extremely broad political terms) - bubbles are of course a feature of our society and politics, but to ignore the narrative of positivity is missing some of the power of the event.
Middle class - rather than liberal per se (we aren't in America, I think class is much more useful than extremely broad political terms) - bubbles are of course a feature of our society and politics, but to ignore the narrative of positivity is missing some of the power of the event.
This is literally their pitch
August 2018
March 2019
The American political establishment has been, until recently, artificially narrowed by a powerful 2-party system denying voices to anyone deemed "unelectable".
The Tea Party, The DSA, Trump and Justice Democrats are starting to change that, and you can feel how hard it chafes against the existing structure. The very existence of Ilhan Omar seems to cause many otherwise "sensible" people to lose their goddamn minds.
Over in the UK, we've always had the fringe as part of the establishment. Lord Buckethead is in the Monster Raving Looney tradition of minimising dissent through co-option.
You think democracy in the UK is a corrupt farce? Okay, then why not vote for the party that treats it as a corrupt farce? Ah, you voted? Thank you for participating and further legitimising the thing you think is a corrupt farce, no, we wont be paying attention to you or your concerns, have a nice day.
Jeremy Corbyn as Leader of the Labour Party has ruffled a fair few feathers, but Jeremy Corbyn as a Labour MP has been normal and uncontroversial since 1983.
The Tories have always been the party of toffs, even hilarious caricatures of toffs like BoJo and JRM. It's their USP.
Christ.
Meanwhile ~ the UK was in a double dip recession in 2012 and communities were still reeling from the crash in 2008, but that's okay, because the fucking Olympics were on.
But what about the progressive reforms of the Welfare Bill (2012), we need to remember things like the Bedroom Tax is what made Britain great
Heh, of course there will be. More concessions will be given by us, and the eu will lay out the hard, concrete rules for us to follow by the letter. It's no accident Tusk and Juncker left the end date fairly nebulous. They pitched March, and that will be the true end date come the end of October. Sure it'll be fucking hard and positively humiliating for the UK to get another extension, but everyone, even if France is giving the impression it does not care and playing bad cop, is trying to avoid no deal.
Speaking of shit pitches, here's the Lib Dems:
Not sure they thought this one through, considering it implies a horseshoe equivalence of the mega-wealthy/privileged and those struggling beneath them. Basically the #AllLivesMatter of parties. One Twitter take pegged it as "actually, we are the party of the fox AND the henhouse".
Another pointed out this is an example of the "true Lib Dem way of feigning going after both main parties but only explicitly Labour", and I kind of agree to be honest. Though maybe it's because the Conservatives don't have a slogan besides "dear God please let it end soon".
Not sure they thought this one through, considering it implies a horseshoe equivalence of the mega-wealthy/privileged and those struggling beneath them. Basically the #AllLivesMatter of parties. One Twitter take pegged it as "actually, we are the party of the fox AND the henhouse".
Another pointed out this is an example of the "true Lib Dem way of feigning going after both main parties but only explicitly Labour", and I kind of agree to be honest. Though maybe it's because the Conservatives don't have a slogan besides "dear God please let it end soon".
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