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Oct 27, 2017
3,483
r even the number of people that work in mainland UK for the week and come back at the weekend.
Do you think more people fly back and forth between Britain and NI to work every week than commute across the border in Ireland? You seem pretty content to fuck those people over. Though at least anyone living in the north and working down south got a nice pay bump thanks to the falling value of the pound.
 

MrKlaw

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,061
If this is a stupid fucking game being played by the government to try and trick MPs into voting for May's deal, then I hope it backfires big time and fucks them all over. Vote of no confidence, whatever it needs.

Labour will just tut as usual and do fuck all
 

rras1994

Member
Nov 4, 2017
5,743
The reason we have MEPs is for them to raise these objections in Brussels. The problem is, the British public have spent decades electing Eurosceptics who have no intention of making the European parliament and (by extension, the EU) look like a functioning governmental body.

Human selfishness explains the problems with Greece and Italy. Dodgy spending promises (and outright fraud, in the case of Greece) have caused their financial woes, compounded by the IMF imposing austerity measures with the complicit backing of German voters who don't want to bail out their neighbours. It's not fair and it's not right but it is not inherently the fault of the EU.

Of course, given that we are in the unusual position of having EU membership without having to have adopted the Euro, we wouldn't have fallen into the same problems as the Greeks.
There's Spain and Portugal that are having a real rough time too. It's not so much that I'm worried the UK will face the same issues (largely cus of the seperate currency like you said) but more that I don't like being part of an organisation that hasn't done anything to ease the people's sufferings. And that's ignoring the problem with the EU having a blind eye to the undemocratic crap going on in Hungary. What's the point of the EU if it never actually does anything to help the countries within it? I'm not entirely sure how long it will survive either as so many countries within it seem to hate it. Or they hate Germany which they consider as pretty much the same thing.
 

Temascos

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,522
I keep getting angrier and angrier the more this goes on. We've had three referendums this past decade and the one that shouldn't have won passed, this one for clarification. I had no opinions either way on Scottish Independence but the one that really stings was the AV Vote Referendum.

We had a chance to change our system to be more fair, but people said NO.

But when it comes to "kicking them all out" oh boy you can count on us, even if it means cutting off our arms and legs in the process.
 

Megabreath

Member
Oct 25, 2018
2,663
Not sure what blows my mind more, the scale of outer space or Brexit.

The whole thought of putting the country on the line to satisfy some Tory backbenchers fantasy is just mind boggling. We are willingly running the country off a cliff edge for what exactly?
 

Dyno

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
13,321
Not sure what blows my mind more, the scale of outer space or Brexit.

The whole thought of putting the country on the line to satisfy some Tory backbenchers fantasy is just mind boggling. We are willingly running the country off a cliff edge for what exactly?

Because otherwise some MP's would have to admit they were wrong.
 

iapetus

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,078
I keep getting angrier and angrier the more this goes on. We've had three referendums this past decade and the one that shouldn't have won passed, this one for clarification. I had no opinions either way on Scottish Independence but the one that really stings was the AV Vote Referendum.

We had a chance to change our system to be more fair, but people said NO.

That was the one that the Lib Dems were willing to sacrifice their credibility for, and frankly it would have been a worthwhile trade-off had it not been plagued with misinformation and fearmongering.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,065
Not sure what blows my mind more, the scale of outer space or Brexit.

The whole thought of putting the country on the line to satisfy some Tory backbenchers fantasy is just mind boggling. We are willingly running the country off a cliff edge for what exactly?

Sad thing is there are people who will benefit from Brexit, and for them the bleaker the better. Disaster capitalists are about to chow down. They're the reason this train won't be stopped.
 
Oct 28, 2017
848
There's Spain and Portugal that are having a real rough time too. It's not so much that I'm worried the UK will face the same issues (largely cus of the seperate currency like you said) but more that I don't like being part of an organisation that hasn't done anything to ease the people's sufferings. And that's ignoring the problem with the EU having a blind eye to the undemocratic crap going on in Hungary. What's the point of the EU if it never actually does anything to help the countries within it? I'm not entirely sure how long it will survive either as so many countries within it seem to hate it. Or they hate Germany which they consider as pretty much the same thing.
So you're solution to the problem is to leave the organisation and not be able to do anything about how it's run instead of staying in it and campaigning for change within it. Leaving is the worst decision in all cases. With the UK leaving they've resigned all rights to try and change the EU. You're essentially leaving something which you think is "unstable" or "in the wrong" to do what it wants and running off into you're own corner to ignore them, or even worse continue to complain about something you volunteered to give up the right to interfere with.
 

DeltaRed

Member
Apr 27, 2018
5,746
Not sure what blows my mind more, the scale of outer space or Brexit.

The whole thought of putting the country on the line to satisfy some Tory backbenchers fantasy is just mind boggling. We are willingly running the country off a cliff edge for what exactly?
I really wish I could find the video but the day after the referendum channel 4 went around some Northern English town to ask people on the street why they voted how they did and literally the very first guy replied bluntly "Muslims", and went on to say he didn't care about economics or anything like that, it's all about muslims. And that is why we're running off the edge of a cliff.

Found it: https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/eu-referendum-muslims_uk_576e558ce4b08d2c563937ff

And as someone who comes from Northern England who knows a great number of people from there who voted to Leave, this is genuinely why people voted the way they did.
 
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Bleu

Banned
Sep 21, 2018
1,599
What's the point of the EU if it never actually does anything to help the countries within it?
This is the most ignorant shit.
Who do you think paid for the infrastructure and pretty much every fucking thing in the newest EU countries, or hell, even The uk poorest regions westminster shits on.
Who cleaned the UK beaches so that they are no longer covered in shit ?
That is pretty much all the EU can do, members are sovereign, It cannot replace local shitty politicians and policies.
The EU is bad at letting people know what it does for them, that's a given..
 

Megabreath

Member
Oct 25, 2018
2,663
I really wish I could find the video but the day after the referendum channel 4 went around some Northern English town to ask people on the street why they voted how they did and literally the very first guy replied bluntly "Muslims", and went on to say he didn't care about economics or anything like that, it's all about muslims. And that is why we're running off the edge of a cliff.

For sure, that is what it boils down to. When you explain that the majority of Muslims come from outside the EU they have no answer.
 

rras1994

Member
Nov 4, 2017
5,743
So you're solution to the problem is to leave the organisation and not be able to do anything about how it's run instead of staying in it and campaigning for change within it. Leaving is the worst decision in all cases. With the UK leaving they've resigned all rights to try and change the EU. You're essentially leaving something which you think is "unstable" or "in the wrong" to do what it wants and running off into you're own corner to ignore them, or even worse continue to complain about something you volunteered to give up the right to interfere with.
I think it's got too big to move or change, even the threat of their third biggest payer in (in a system were only three countries actually pay more in then get out) did nothing to move it. The sufferings of 4 large countries have done nothing to move it. The growing rise of far-right in pretty much every country in the EU has done nothing to move. The growing movements in many countries of wanting to leave the EU has done nothing to move it. I'm at the pount where I don't think it can change.
 

invid02

Self requested ban.
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
61
2016: "We are great britain, they need us more than we need them"

*facepalm*
 

LL_Decitrig

User-Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
10,334
Sunderland
Uninformed US citizen here, but man, how do you get to the point where you're talking about reserving ferries to hold some food without recognizing how fucking insane it is to go through with it?

No. You're right. I would love to say this is just brinkmanship and the wiser heads will prevail, but I really haven't seen any wise heads in the UK since 2010.

The government is on an emergency footing at if a war were coming. They're stockpiling essentials and they have no idea how even basic travel arrangements will work beyond March.

Fucking wankers.
 

Mavis

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,476
Blue Mountains
I really wish I could find the video but the day after the referendum channel 4 went around some Northern English town to ask people on the street why they voted how they did and literally the very first guy replied bluntly "Muslims", and went on to say he didn't care about economics or anything like that, it's all about muslims. And that is why we're running off the edge of a cliff.
The irony being that Brexit will ensure we see an increase in migration from Muslim countries to make up for lost EU workers.
 

Antrax

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,286
I think if all you've got is the threat that we will make it really hard for you if you leave

You misunderstand Brexit here. You've triggered A50, you're jumping off the cliff in a few months. The onus is entirely on you to figure out what you want, not on the EU to coddle you as you jump off the cliff. The EU has never said they'll make it harder for you; they've said they're under no obligation to make it easier for you. This is all on you; as far as any other country is concerned, you've voted to go it on your own.

As the PM and hard Brexiteers are fond of saying, Brexit means Brexit.
 

Red or Alive

Member
Oct 28, 2017
312
There's Spain and Portugal that are having a real rough time too. It's not so much that I'm worried the UK will face the same issues (largely cus of the seperate currency like you said) but more that I don't like being part of an organisation that hasn't done anything to ease the people's sufferings. And that's ignoring the problem with the EU having a blind eye to the undemocratic crap going on in Hungary. What's the point of the EU if it never actually does anything to help the countries within it? I'm not entirely sure how long it will survive either as so many countries within it seem to hate it. Or they hate Germany which they consider as pretty much the same thing.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/12/world/europe/hungary-eu-viktor-orban.html

The idea that the EU isn't doing anything with regards to Hungary isn't quite true. Without the Brexit sideshow, there's a (small) chance we'd be further along the road to sanctions.

Germany's the dominant member of the EU. That's life and, to be fair, the Germans never deliberately set out to be the most influential member. There will always be more and less significant member states.

However, it cannot be denied that membership provides influence, too:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46528952

This is why leaving is guaranteed to put us in a weaker position when negotiating new trade deals. We will no longer have the backing power of an additional 27 states. Ironically, we will likely sacrifice more sovereignty when making new deals with the US, Canada, etc. than had we stayed in the EU. Which is bad for the UK economy and consumers. For example, EU regulations mean we don't have to worry about salmonella the way the Americans do. It's a small example but it's only of potentially millions of sacrifices that might be made to finalise a trade deal with the US.
 

Noodle

Banned
Aug 22, 2018
3,427
I don't like being part of an organisation that hasn't done anything to ease the people's sufferings. And that's ignoring the problem with the EU having a blind eye to the undemocratic crap going on in Hungary. What's the point of the EU if it never actually does anything to help the countries within it? I'm not entirely sure how long it will survive either as so many countries within it seem to hate it.

oh for fuck's sake, could you be any more uninformed? Literally every single post of yours has compounded the false information on display. Someone could take the polar opposite of what your posts say and come out with a reasonably accurate picture of the EU.

On "not easing people's sufferings":
All those laws that stop you being worked to death or gouged by companies? The lion's share come from the EU and have had a measurable effect on the quality of life.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...rights-in-danger-european-union-a7531366.html
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...legal-protection-products-services-eu-traders
Worker's rights, human rights, consumer protection...

On "ignoring Hungary":

EU parliament votes to punish Hungary over 'breaches' of core values

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-45498514

On the EU not surviving because "so many countries hate it":
aHR0cDovL2Fzc2V0cy5wZXdyZXNlYXJjaC5vcmcvd3AtY29udGVudC91cGxvYWRzL3NpdGVzLzIvMjAxNy8wNi8yOTE2MjIzMS9QR18yMDE3LjA2LjE1LkVVLUJyZXhpdC0wMC0wMC5wbmc


Seriously, take everything you think you know about the EU and assume the opposite is true. It'll save us all a lot of time.
 

Johnny Blaze

Avenger
Oct 29, 2017
4,167
DE
There's Spain and Portugal that are having a real rough time too. It's not so much that I'm worried the UK will face the same issues (largely cus of the seperate currency like you said) but more that I don't like being part of an organisation that hasn't done anything to ease the people's sufferings. And that's ignoring the problem with the EU having a blind eye to the undemocratic crap going on in Hungary. What's the point of the EU if it never actually does anything to help the countries within it? I'm not entirely sure how long it will survive either as so many countries within it seem to hate it. Or they hate Germany which they consider as pretty much the same thing.
Where does this come from? Polls across Europe show a majority of people favor and are pro EU, maybe not in the way it is now and there will be problems that need to be addressed.

But most people are aware that this childish "burn it all down" behaviour and stance doesn't lead to anything.

You fix it from within and work towards a better EU, not pull a shitshow like brexit. Brexit is what a toddler would do when he doesn't get his way.

Get more informed what the EU does and how it works.

This also goes to all people ignorant regarding the EU. Then we can avoid a mess like Brexit in the future. Let's work together to fix issues within, not have a temper tantrum as a country and shit our pants.
 

Cup O' Tea?

Member
Nov 2, 2017
3,603
What's the bet when the whole country goes up in flames, the poms will blame the EU for that too? "The evil EU are treating us like shit because we left" etc.
 
Oct 26, 2017
6,574
What's the bet when the whole country goes up in flames, the poms will blame the EU for that too? "The evil EU are treating us like shit because we left" etc.
That's already the narrative. If only the EU would recognise Great Britain's errh "greatness" they'd let us have our pie and eat it too.


People are already suffering from mad delusions so I don't see that changing one iota.
 

Calabi

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,490
I don't understand why May is still so staunchly against a 2nd referendum at this point. If she's not gonna lead them into the next election then why not just do the right thing for the country? She was a remainer originally, surely she can't think this deal of hers is a legacy that will be looked fondly upon in years to come.

Personally I think she's scared, the public fucked it up the first time so how likely is it to do it again. Who knows, no knows really how the public will choose, its a hell of a gamble, plus she doesn't really want to stay, she's clearly more on the side of leaving now on her deal. If the decision stays within the government things are much more certain.

She's doing everything she possibly can to get her deal through, which is mostly just through the usage of fear and threatening. I think that's the only method she really knows, that's all she did throughout the EU negotiations. I don't see why anyone will believe her now, she's given in so many times before.
 
Oct 27, 2017
373
oh for fuck's sake, could you be any more uninformed? Literally every single post of yours has compounded the false information on display. Someone could take the polar opposite of what your posts say and come out with a reasonably accurate picture of the EU.

On "not easing people's sufferings":
All those laws that stop you being worked to death or gouged by companies? The lion's share come from the EU and have had a measurable effect on the quality of life.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...rights-in-danger-european-union-a7531366.html
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...legal-protection-products-services-eu-traders
Worker's rights, human rights, consumer protection...

On "ignoring Hungary":



https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-45498514

On the EU not surviving because "so many countries hate it":
aHR0cDovL2Fzc2V0cy5wZXdyZXNlYXJjaC5vcmcvd3AtY29udGVudC91cGxvYWRzL3NpdGVzLzIvMjAxNy8wNi8yOTE2MjIzMS9QR18yMDE3LjA2LjE1LkVVLUJyZXhpdC0wMC0wMC5wbmc


Seriously, take everything you think you know about the EU and assume the opposite is true. It'll save us all a lot of time.
The ultimate thing driving this poster is their Unionist agenda. I don't know if they actually believe their spiel about the EU, but it's not what's driving their posting.
I don't care about a potential border between down south and Northern Ireland, I care about a border between the same country of Northern Ireland and the UK, I view that as much more inflamatory.
It's Northern Ireland, not the "North", say that in the wrong part of Belfast, you'll get beat up.
Look at this. We're "down south" (don't even get capitalization, mind) while you shouldn't dare refer to their "country" as "the North". The fact being separated from the UK is "inflammatory" but not the actual country you are attached to speaks volumes.

Seriously, get a fucking grip. Northern Ireland itself doesn't agree with you (voted remain), and for good reason.
 

TheGreekFreak

Alt account
Banned
Dec 16, 2018
34
I think if all you've got is the threat that we will make it really hard for you if you leave to keep people in, then you probably have much bigger issues. I would actually be fine with remaining in the EU if I felt like they were capable of changing but nothing they've done so far has shown that. I hate whats' happening to the Southern European countries economically, and there doesn't seem to be much will to change it, it doesn't feel like the EU actually makes countries follows it's rules (the stuff in Hungary scares me and the EU is doing nothing to stop it), and I feel like companies abuse the freedom of movement to abuse workers from countries with lower currencies and then call poor people in the UK lazy for not taking the low paid, often abusive jobs. And nothing seems like it's done to tackle these issues. Nor do I feel like my vote means much in EU elections. If I felt like the EU could change I'd go back to the EU but it feels like it won't and I could see these issues that they aren't facing ending up destroying it more than Brexit ever could.

There isn't a single person who cares about jobs being underpaid and abusive that also votes Tory or leave unless they literally enjoy being a hypocrite.

The Tories want to turn the UK healthcare and job laws into a recreation of the U.S. hell hole.
 

PJV3

Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,676
London
I kind of enjoy that "take back control" ended up being blackmailed into an unpopular option by a PM without a majority in Westminster.
 
Oct 27, 2017
4,645
Yep, as Unit & Mega implied, they have already been setting that up so they don't have to take the blame for this shitshow and can keep playing EU as the boogeyman.

Jeremy Hunt on Brexit: 'We are heading for no deal by accident' [The Guardian, Aug 2018]
UK public will blame EU for no-deal Brexit, says Jeremy Hunt [The Guardian, Jul 2018]


They will have no intention of taking any responsibility. I suspect that's all why many of them allowed May to continue being PM for now, so they can pin most of this on her and try to keep their names clean for their own leadership bids before next election
 
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rras1994

Member
Nov 4, 2017
5,743
The ultimate thing driving this poster is their Unionist agenda. I don't know if they actually believe their spiel about the EU, but it's not what's driving their posting.


Look at this. We're "down south" (don't even get capitalization, mind) while you shouldn't dare refer to their "country" as "the North". The fact being separated from the UK is "inflammatory" but not the actual country you are attached to speaks volumes.

Seriously, get a fucking grip. Northern Ireland itself doesn't agree with you (voted remain), and for good reason.
I don't refer to it as the "North" that's what the other poster did. I've mostly referred to the country as ROI cus Republic of Ireland is a long name but you are right referring to it simply as down south is dismissive. I apologise. I would normally refer to it as Ireland but that can get confusing as some take that as referring to both countries
 

Deleted member 5028

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
9,724
It's Northern Ireland, not the "North", say that in the wrong part of Belfast, you'll get beat up.
As an ex-pat of Belfast, fuck off with that shit. Attitudes like yours only propagate that train of thought that divide people.

It doesn't matter where you put the border. Between north and south, Britain and Northern Ireland there's gonna be a flare up. By whom depends on who gets the border.
 

Deleted member 9237

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
1,789
I think if all you've got is the threat that we will make it really hard for you if you leave to keep people in, then you probably have much bigger issues.
It's not like the EU is salting the earth and making an example of Britain. All the countries within the EU operate under a certain set of rules, why should the UK get all the perks with none of the downsides? If you want to regulate all your industries and products yourself, then don't expect to sell them to a single market that follows different rules. It's simply obstinance on the UK's part.

Look at how Iceland, Norway etc. deal with the EU. For the most part they acquiesce to everything.