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British schoolgirl that left to join ISIS in 2015 says she has no regrets but wants to return home to the UK
- Thread starter AcademicSaucer
- Start date
I'm a little surprised, as back in the summer their standpoint was that "The security minister, Ben Wallace, said: "Prosecution and conviction is always our preference for dealing with terrorists." I don't support her just going home and living free of course, but I imagine there is a process for putting her on trial for the crimes she's committed. Don't really care either way tbh. Kid sounds fucked regardless though.
Agreed. She still has a right to appeal and I imagine the family will likely help her do that (for the babies sake at least)
I doubt the decision will stand under scrutiny
does she have a dual citizenship with another country ? because making a person stateless is pretty much forbidden by international law (UN 1961 convention, Article 8). There are a few exceptions, including disloyalty to the state, but you'd have a hard time claiming a 15 years old, whatever she did, qualify for such accusations.
Not that the uk cares about international agreements nowadays anyway.
Not that the uk cares about international agreements nowadays anyway.
Don't think the UN will fight for a 19 year old who says she doesn't regret joining isis
This is a complex situation.
I have no sympathy for her, personally. I have a huge amount of sympathy for her innocent child. I would've been OK if they had taken her back and made her face justice in the UK courts.
The cynic in me almost feels this is a political point-scoring move, but maybe that's too harsh of me.
Either way, I can't say I'm sad she's no longer a British citizen.
I have no sympathy for her, personally. I have a huge amount of sympathy for her innocent child. I would've been OK if they had taken her back and made her face justice in the UK courts.
The cynic in me almost feels this is a political point-scoring move, but maybe that's too harsh of me.
Either way, I can't say I'm sad she's no longer a British citizen.
She was made an example of.
"Kids, do not join ISIS, look what happened to Shamima Begum."
It's a harsh ruling but it's a harsh world.
"Kids, do not join ISIS, look what happened to Shamima Begum."
It's a harsh ruling but it's a harsh world.
She wouldn't get life so in 10-20 years you'd have a 40 year old women with a radical ideology running around freely in a state she left to become and enemy of the state.
She chose to fight against the state so why should the state care for her well being? Let her rot in a refugee camp or even better Iraqi/Syrian prison.
International treaties supersede national law. if you agree to shit on such agreements, do not pretend to be a democratic, ruled by law country.
So have they made her stateless and are we just dumping this responsibility onto another country?
More importantly, the baby is a British citizen and we should have at least taken the baby back.
More importantly, the baby is a British citizen and we should have at least taken the baby back.
How are the U.K. laws regarding that? A baby born in foreign soil to a national citizen with a foreign father.
So those 400 or so other UK fighters Trump was banging on about the other day, they will all get revoked too surely or is this just Sajid doing his usually PR tour shite.
I feel sorry for the baby honestly. Nobody is born evil, I wonder if she will hand the baby over for adoption.
Kid was born before they revoked citizenship, which I presume was deliberate as to allow the kid into the country.
I hope so. From the way she's spoken, she's unfit to be a parent.
Jesus we support arbitrarily stripping people of their citinship now do we? That is deep, deeply wrong, and probably illegal.
I wouldn't say it's arbitrary. I think it's creepy and reactionary, though.
Yep, she gave up any rights when she fucked off to join ISIS.
Absolutely fuck all wrong with what has happened.
The UN might actually object - it did launch a campaign against statelessness a while back. Theresa May as Home Secretary was on record admitting that making people stateless is illegal (assuming this woman doesn't have citizenship elsewhere), so this one is a bit of a volte face.
It's a shame for her child that this woman engaged in such a fiery set of interviews. If she focused more on remorse or disorientation in those conversations, I wonder if the government would have had a harder rhetorical case to make in repatriating her.
It's a shame for her child that this woman engaged in such a fiery set of interviews. If she focused more on remorse or disorientation in those conversations, I wonder if the government would have had a harder rhetorical case to make in repatriating her.
She hasn't been convicted of anything, though, hence arbitrary. I think that is terrifying
So we don't believe in either domestic or international law or the right to a fair trial? Christ
I honestly thought it was one of those things the EU allegedly stopped us doing or I've heard the rags say crap like so many times I've got my wires crossed. Guess not.
It's not arbitrarily in this case though is it? The lack of remorse and continued support of ISIS alone is enough to make it clear this person doesn't deserve the right to return to the UK.
The precedent of NOT fucking off to join a terrorist army? Seems like a perfectly fine precedent to me.
Did Britain ever officially recognise ISIS as a state? No. Therefore we have made her stateless and violated intenational treatise and are shirking our responsibilities.
Why should Syria have to keep her?
If a paedo was over molesting kids in cambodia we don't revoke their citizenship. The Home Secretary is saying he does not believe in the British Justice System.
She hasnt even had a trial, let alone been convicted of anything. Her lack of remorse or continued support for ISIS should be issues for the legal system.
I'd say get it to the UK to have a chance at a decent life.
I imagine quite a lot of people opposed to ISIS in the region want her dead, the camp is really her only safe haven.
If she does find another country that supports her I don't think it will go down well for the UK in the long run, she will be an asset for propaganda. I suppose that's why the IC people said it's better to take her back, they can see the blowback of a young western figure head. Sure she gets stuck in prison here, no remorse, who knows, gets out, preaches crap. I dunno, rock and a hard place?
If she does find another country that supports her I don't think it will go down well for the UK in the long run, she will be an asset for propaganda. I suppose that's why the IC people said it's better to take her back, they can see the blowback of a young western figure head. Sure she gets stuck in prison here, no remorse, who knows, gets out, preaches crap. I dunno, rock and a hard place?
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Hahaha, wow, in that sense this sets up really egregious precedent. Implicitly recognizing ISIS as a state seems like a really stupid thing to do just to tell a teenager to fuck off
She should have thought about that before she became friends with terrorists.
She can live and die in the Sahara for all we care.
Only reason she should be back is for the child imo. The little one shouldn't suffer a life of this shit because of their mother's crimes.
She is our problem after all. Have her tried and sentenced.
Suggestions that other countries should take care of this problem is idiotic.
A lot of this thread reads like some shit out of the Daily Mail. Civilisation, eh...
She is our problem after all. Have her tried and sentenced.
Suggestions that other countries should take care of this problem is idiotic.
A lot of this thread reads like some shit out of the Daily Mail. Civilisation, eh...
Why would that be the UK's problem? She joined the Islamic state, so she can apply for citizenship with that state.
This is great all around, the less Jihadis in the UK the less genuine muslims in the UK have to suffer prejudices.
Actually, looking at the law it might be legal under Article 8 Paragraph 3 b:
"3 . Notwithstanding the provisions of paragraph 1 of this Article, a Contract- ing State may retain the right to deprive a person of his nationality, if at the time of signature, ratification or accession it specifies its retention of such right on one or more of the following grounds, being grounds existing in its national law at that time:"
"(b) that the person has taken an oath, or made a formal declaration, of alle- giance to another State, or given definite evidence of his determination to repudiate his allegiance to the Contracting State."
One could argue that when she joined ISIS she pledged allegiance to the "Islamic State in Syria".
Or even based on Article 8 paragraph 3 a II:
"(ii) has conducted himself in a manner seriously prejudicial to the vital interests of the State;"
One could argue that her joining a terrorist force that is threatening western soicety is a manner prejudicial to the interests of the state.
Source for the law:
https://www.unhcr.org/ibelong/wp-co...ion-on-the-reduction-of-Statelessness_ENG.pdf
A bunch of Cunty Europeans invaded another country, fucked it up beyond repair, and now we are dumping responsibility to deal with them on the locals.