[BuzzFeed] Five Kids Ages 12 To 16 Have Been Charged With Killing Nashville Musician

Elegant Weapon

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Oct 31, 2017
3,443
I don't believe the incident is janky (although there's nothing in the Buzzfeed article beyond a straight recounting of events).

I do believe the black kids are utterly fucked though, because we know how the system works.
They say they found stolen guns but not necessarily the murder weapon. The story didn't mention witnesses or anything like a security camera that captured the murder.

Besides the cops charging the kids(which obviously doesn't mean they're guilty), I'm not seeing anything that proves they are guilty so I'm not going to jump into a fit like some people here love to do before we have any facts but we know how outrage culture is these days and the bloodlust stories like these bring out
 
Dec 6, 2018
291
I don't believe the incident is janky (although there's nothing in the Buzzfeed article beyond a straight recounting of events).

I do believe the black kids are utterly fucked though, because we know how the system works.
Sadly, the kids are likely to become statistics.

And damn, it seems Era is getting heated lately.
 
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Oct 27, 2017
236
Black folks who raised shitty-ass kids like that are obviously a danger to society too. Can't take any chances with us. /s
The anger towards these kids isn’t because they’re black, it’s because they senselessly killed another human being. Their race has no bearing on the conversation.
 
Nov 30, 2017
620
for the people defending the decision to put the mugshots on tv, you do understand that it’s supposed to be innocent until proven guilty and that showing mugshots of anyone until they are tried and convicted should not be allowed at all, right?
 
Oct 25, 2017
14,656
Personally i'm just against the idea of trying kids as adults! Plenty of people find it normal, i just don't

Of course they did something incredibly wrong and deserves some kind of punishement and rehabilitation (especially the younger ones), but they're freaking kids, trying them as adults is just plain wrong to me
"some kind of punishment" ??

dude if they murdered him who cares what age they are. they're monsters.
 
Dec 20, 2018
36
Portland, Oregon
Not going to defend the kids for killing someone. Gun violence is disgusting. Gang violence is disgusting. But a lot of these comments are ignorant. This looks like standard gang violence to me.

I just want to point out that this happens almost every day in Chicago, the big difference being the victim of this crime being a middle-class white person. [0]

This is what gang violence looks like. Kids with guns, the older ones strong-arming the younger ones into participating in the gang.

Saying "they had a choice" isn't fully fair. Kids who do not join the gangs are harassed, beaten, and often killed. This is the cycle that white supremacy, institutionalized racism, and multi-generational poverty creates. There is nobody feeding these people, nobody helping these people, and nobody protecting these kids from the gangs.

The last time these communities tried to organize, the FBI assassinated their leaders [1] and criminalized their recreational drugs [2] in order to stamp out the movement. This is the culture that forms when people have to live in poverty with a boot on their neck.

Recommended reading:

- The New Jim Crow
- Contelpro: The FBI's Secret War on Political Freedom
- Are Prison's Obsolete?


0: https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/ct-chicago-homicides-data-tracker-htmlstory.html
1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Hampton
2: https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/23/poli...chard-nixon-drug-war-blacks-hippie/index.html
 

Nepenthe

When the music hits, you feel no pain.
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
4,163
The anger towards these kids isn’t because they’re black, it’s because they senselessly killed another human being. Their race has no bearing on the conversation.
In none of the threads about white terrorists and serial killers we've had on here have I personally seen anyone go after their parents as deserving of jail time too. They seem to get the privilege of being lone wolves and standing only for themselves. I could be completely wrong, though; I haven't read every post on here.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,913
Switzerland
"some kind of punishment" ??

dude if they murdered him who cares what age they are. they're monsters.
you're fine calling 12-13 y/o monsters, young impressionable kids that have probably been heavily influenced by older ones? Fine suit yourself, humanity is way more complexe than that though, it's not just good and evil
 
Oct 25, 2017
14,656
you're fine calling 12-13 y/o monsters, young impressionable kids that have probably been heavily influenced by older ones? Fine suit yourself, humanity is way more complexe than that though, it's not just good and evil
that’d be fine if we were talking about stealing snacks from the store. but we’re talking about murder.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,853
In none of the threads about white terrorists and serial killers we've had on here have I personally seen anyone go after their parents as deserving of jail time too. They seem to get the privilege of being lone wolves and standing only for themselves. I could be completely wrong, though; I haven't read every post on here.
well if the white terrorists and serial killers were 12 parental responsibility would probably pop up
 
Oct 27, 2017
10,086
Doesn’t the article mention they’re being tried as minors? If so, why are we arguing about them being charged as adults?
Because multiple people have expressed displeasure at the fact that these minors are being charged as minors.

Does that have anything to do with the race of these children? Statistics would suggest yes, given that black children are far more likely to be charged as adults compared to white children.
 

rpm

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,080
Why do they deserve to be tried as adults? Did their brains magically mature after committing the crime?
No, their brains naturally matured before the murder, at least to the level of being able to understand the ramifications of murder
 
Oct 26, 2017
1,523
Once you get to high school you know what is right and wrong
This is unfortunately not the way a lot of things work anymore. My mom is a high school teacher and not even allowed to fail kids for cheating anymore. The guidelines for her school say the kids might not know what they were doing is wrong.
 
Oct 27, 2017
10,086
This is unfortunately not the way a lot of things work anymore. My mom is a high school teacher and not even allowed to fail kids for cheating anymore. The guidelines for her school say the kids might not know what they were doing is wrong.
Turns out we know a lot more about brain development now than we did 20 years ago. Are you advocating we ignore scientific research?
 
Oct 25, 2017
762
Need more facts before condemning childred, but I think the most likely scenario is that the eldest of the group was the leader and main driver here. If that were to be the case, I’d be okay with them alone being charged and treated as an adult and the rest being seen as minors under the law.

The legal system has flexibility to try minors as adults under exceptional circumstances. Leading younger, more impressionable kids to murder someone is a pretty grave offense.
 
Oct 26, 2017
1,332
It's really really fucking strange that you seem angrier at the release of their mugshots and the reaction from Trump supporters than you are at the fact that they murdered a man.
Boom. There it is. Well said.

Fucking strange, but expected reactions here.
 
Oct 25, 2017
8,743
Nothing
I would prefer it if we did not allow newspapers to publish photos of juveniles. I'd also like it if we didn't demand kids be locked away for life for crimes committed while they are not adults. Rehabilitation would kinda be the big hope here since again they are still kids.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,729
Yeah because it's the only angle I care about, Why should I care about these kids? Why should I show them empathy? Especially the shooter.
Unless you're familiar...i doubt there's any real empathy for the victim beyond the punishment you want being served.
 
Oct 27, 2017
973
Scotland
Stealing a car, threatening someone to hand over their wallet - Juvie

Shooting someone dead - Absolutely jail time/most serious punishments.

I don’t know what we are fighting for here. When I read the thread title I didn’t realise the op was going to be about MAGA and race I thought it was going to be about how tragic and scary something like this can happen.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,649
They killed a man. They knew what they were doing. Agree 100%.
They don't belong in general society at the very least. Don't know how you can course correct this, with whatever rehab they get they still killed someone in cold blood. And of course Maga idiots are co opting this for their own gross reasons. The story here is how these kids got to the point where they thought killing this poor dude was a good idea. Fucked up.
 
Oct 27, 2017
10,086
I honestly don’t get what you are trying to say. What does brain development have to do with kids cheating in school.
It has to do with the guidelines for discipline you were complaining about. Yes, it turns out that teenagers may not have a clear idea of the consequences and ramifications of, say, cheating on a test, due to their brains not being fully developed. Thus the approach to discipline and teaching has changed along with the knowledge we have about the brain development of children.
 
Oct 26, 2017
1,523
It has to do with the guidelines for discipline you were complaining about. Yes, it turns out that teenagers may not have a clear idea of the consequences and ramifications of, say, cheating on a test, due to their brains not being fully developed. Thus the approach to discipline and teaching has changed along with the knowledge we have about the brain development of children.
But would you say that the children should be taught what they are doing is wrong? Or teachers let it slide because the kids dont know what they are doing is wrong?
 

Elegant Weapon

Banned
Member
Oct 31, 2017
3,443
well if the white terrorists and serial killers were 12 parental responsibility would probably pop up
Dylan Roof was given the murder weapon by his parents there we no resounding call to jail or punishment for them, that I remember

In fact, a significant chunk of school shooters are youthful white males and “lock up the parents” isn’t something we hear after these constant events
 
Oct 27, 2017
874
and I think you are crazy thinking these "kids" deserve any kind of second chance. Once you get to high school you know what is right and wrong
Your post is the literal embodiment of what's wrong with the American justice system and why your incarceration rate is as fucked up compared to other first world countries.
 
Oct 27, 2017
10,086
But would you say that the children should be taught what they are doing is wrong? Or teachers let it slide?
There is a wide gulf between 'automatic failure' and 'letting it slide'. Yes, they should be taught that cheating is wrong. The methods of doing that should be updated as society has more knowledge on how to handle disciplining children in the most effective manner. Used to be that children would get paddled for that behavior, but we learned that such punishments just cause harm and don't solve anything.

Just like there is a wide gulf between 'charge minors as adults' and 'minors face no consequences for murder'. There should be consequences and rehabilitation, but it should differ from the methods used for adults...because they are not adults.
 
Oct 27, 2017
236
In none of the threads about white terrorists and serial killers we've had on here have I personally seen anyone go after their parents as deserving of jail time too. They seem to get the privilege of being lone wolves and standing only for themselves. I could be completely wrong, though; I haven't read every post on here.
Well, I do agree that punishing the parents is extreme
 
Oct 26, 2017
1,523
There is a wide gulf between 'automatic failure' and 'letting it slide'. Yes, they should be taught that cheating is wrong. The methods of doing that should be updated as society has more knowledge on how to handle disciplining children in the most effective manner. Used to be that children would get paddled for that behavior, but we learned that such punishments just cause harm and don't solve anything.

Just like there is a wide gulf between 'charge minors as adults' and 'minors face no consequences for murder'. There should be consequences and rehabilitation, but it should differ from the methods used for adults...because they are not adults.
We agree on bolded, but that is not the case. They have to let it slide every single time. They can bring it up to head faculty and they might get talked to. But all work submitted, even if caught cheating during it, is valid and must be taken. Repeat offenders are not treated differently. I think practices like this are more harmful to kids learning. I think I should of explained my opening post better, my bad for sounding like an asshole.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,461
New York
Fucking sad. Those kids are young and It's sad that their parents failed them. But they killed a man for no fucking reason. So I'm feeling far more sad for the man that was murdered.
 

Elegant Weapon

Banned
Member
Oct 31, 2017
3,443
Boom. There it is. Well said.

Fucking strange, but expected reactions here.

You're more interested in mob justice and outrage than due process, you have no moral standing here

These kids deserve due process, no matter what; no your mob based outrage before guilt is even proven
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,583
In none of the threads about white terrorists and serial killers we've had on here have I personally seen anyone go after their parents as deserving of jail time too. They seem to get the privilege of being lone wolves and standing only for themselves. I could be completely wrong, though; I haven't read every post on here.
Yeah, I certainly don't remember calls to punish the parents of the white supremacists in Charlottesville.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,410
We have 150 years that show our method of punishing criminals is a complete boondoggle but both sides agree that who cares fuck criminals let's keep going.
 

Elegant Weapon

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Oct 31, 2017
3,443
User Banned (1 Week): Inflammatory False Equivalence and History of Similar Behavior
It's "strange" that people in here are calling for outrage culture and mob justice over due process

These kid's have rights as minors and they deserve to be proven guilty in a fair trial before judgement, period

some of you have such a unjustified bloodlust, you're not any better than these kids


Like, I get what you're doing, but a dude is dead so this ain't the one.
I'm not going to apologize for insisting on due process before outrage culture but do you
 

Nepenthe

When the music hits, you feel no pain.
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
4,163
Like, I get what you're doing, but a dude is dead so this ain't the one.
The kids are also in custody. They're going to be handled by the system as the system seems fit regardless of whether or not there are judicial shenanigans afoot; nothing anyone says here is going to change that.