Cadence of Hyrule - Crypt of the NecroDancer Featuring The Legend of Zelda announced (spring 2019)

WordAssassin

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,397
Seems like a sheikah jukebox.
Was gonna say the same thing!

I’ll wait for Links Awakening unless this gets some universal praise. Anytime I hear randomly generated I tune out. Especially a game like 2d Zelda that’s always been built around a well thought out and carefully designed world. I’m glad the game exists, it seems like a cool collaboration , but most likely it’s not “for me.” Which is fine. I have enough shit to play already.

Cuphead on the other hand... aw yea. Looks amazing.
If it makes any difference, the first game has gotten a lot of pretty universal praise. And I mean, considering that the dev has literally only made the one game, and they impressed Nintendo enough with it to let the borrow the Zelda IP, that should give some idea of the quality. That and the music posted 10 or so pages back certainly piqued my interest for sure! Just checked and it has an 87% on OpenCritic [96% critics recommend] and an 86% on MetaCritic, too.
 

Zero-ELEC

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,044
México
For me, calling something "mainline" actually has more to do with gameplay than story canonicity. This game has the whole rhythm and roguelike thing going for it, which is different enough from other Zelda games that I'd call it a spinoff rather than a mainline game. Hyrule Warriros, Triforce Heroes, and Four Swords are also different enough gameplay wise that I would classify them as spinoffs.

In my eyes, being mainline/spinoff is completely independent from whether the game is canon or not. Some spinoffs are canon (Four Swords), others are not (Hyrule Warriors). The definition of canon basically just comes down to whatever the people behind the series want it to be. If I had to guess, the owners of Zelda at Nintendo headquarters won't consider Cadence of Hyrule to be canon. But you never know I guess, the possibility is there.
The definition of mainline and spin-off also comes down to whatever the people behind the scenes want it to be.

Tri Force Heroes and Four Swords are mainline.

Hyrule Warriors and Cadence of Hyrule are spin-offs.
 

giraffereyn

Banned
Jan 20, 2019
300
For me, calling something "mainline" actually has more to do with gameplay than story canonicity. This game has the whole rhythm and roguelike thing going for it, which is different enough from other Zelda games that I'd call it a spinoff rather than a mainline game. Hyrule Warriros, Triforce Heroes, and Four Swords are also different enough gameplay wise that I would classify them as spinoffs.

In my eyes, being mainline/spinoff is completely independent from whether the game is canon or not. Some spinoffs are canon (Four Swords), others are not (Hyrule Warriors). The definition of canon basically just comes down to whatever the owners of the series want it to be. If I had to guess, the main Zelda story writers at Nintendo headquarters won't consider Cadence of Hyrule to be canon. But you never know I guess, maybe they will.
I like this approach a lot, but we run into issues with the top-down Zelda and the Third-person 3D games as they play very differently yet are the two formats that retain the most influence over what some people consider the canon that matters.

I wouldn't put the onus on the developers either, as stylish action, survival horror and, lightning speed action were invented to sell more units not to make it easier to find or categorize a game.
 

ILikeFeet

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,010
Ya'll overthinking this whole canon thing. Here's how you tell:
  • Did Nintendo say it's canon?
Boom, problem solved.
 

giraffereyn

Banned
Jan 20, 2019
300
No, it is fairly simple. The Capcom games were directly supervised by Nintendo (and eventually much of the staff of the teams that did those moved on to Nintendo) and had the name. And Nintendo was much loser with their IPs in the 90s, hence the CD-i games, which were unsupervised completely.

As for BS The Legend of Zelda: The Ancient Stone Tablets, the fact that the game could not be played afterwards and was only ever available in a limited add-on to a console during certain periods... gee, I wonder why that didn't stick around? (Also I now realise that the game's title actually doesn't fit with the structure I laid down there, it being BS The Legend of Zelda not The Legend of Zelda, lol)

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

The name is important, is all I'm saying. They've never given the name to something that wasn't cared for properly.
Again not so simple if you have to explain all this to someone asking why some games are or aren't canon, part of the series, or worth ignoring.

Also the BS Zelda game being unplayable would make a lot of The Legend of Zelda games join it's ranks as time is the only factor that keep that game where it is. The Oracle games and Ocarina and a ton of Zelda game would not be canon under your rule because they would have been stuck on aging hardware had Nintendo not repackaged them on modern consoles like the 3DS and the Switch (with Links Awakening, another game that was just as lost as the BS Zelda.)

What I am getting at is the more rigid you think your rules are, then the more inflammatory you have to get to shut out a game from discussion.

Obviously, I think names are a totally valid way to collect a series of games or media together, but can't cover all the games that people consider mainline or whatever distinction someone might invent. "I only play the 3D Zeldas" or "I play the mainline game, so only the 2D titles that look like the original Legend of Zelda.
 

giraffereyn

Banned
Jan 20, 2019
300
Ya'll overthinking this whole canon thing. Here's how you tell:
  • Did Nintendo say it's canon?
Boom, problem solved.
That's one way to go at it. though whats the purpose of the category? Don't play the games Nintendo doesn't list as canon? When discussing mainline canonicity or story content, should we ignore Triforce Heroes? Does link know anything about Crossbows?
 

ILikeFeet

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,010
That's one way to go at it. though whats the purpose of the category? Don't play the games Nintendo doesn't list as canon? When discussing mainline canonicity or story content, should we ignore Triforce Heroes? Does link know anything about Crossbows?
Now you're talking about a super-small subsection of players who only cares about canon. Not even Nintendo gives a shit about canon. BotW is canon but was made in a way to flip the bird at discussions on canon
 

Vidiot

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,304
Watched some videos of the first but still having trouble wrapping my head around the gameplay. Is it just something you get once you play it?
 

giraffereyn

Banned
Jan 20, 2019
300
Now you're talking about a super-small subsection of players who only cares about canon. Not even Nintendo gives a shit about canon. BotW is canon but was made in a way to flip the bird at discussions on canon
But... you made a post describing yourself as that small subset. You're talking about yourself.

All i'm saying is that the categories are arbitrary and it's weird that people use arbitrary rules to bully games into obscurity or out of top ten lists or canonicity.
 

Droyd

Member
Mar 1, 2018
392
I wouldn’t have given this game a second look otherwise. Power of the Zelda series.
 
May 20, 2018
5,179
Ponds
Saw Link and Zelda and was very confused, but upon watching further I am now sold. Is the first game on the Switch? Will pick it up to try out the game before hand.

Please Nintendo if this becomes a semi-regular occurrence allow Team Cherry to make Metroid Dread, and I’m not even that big of a Metroid fan. Would just love to see what they could do after Hollow Knight using the Metroid IP.
 

Fitz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
47
Watched some videos of the first but still having trouble wrapping my head around the gameplay. Is it just something you get once you play it?
It's basically a typical roguelike, i.e. turn-based, only instead of taking your time with turns, the idea is to play/move/attack to the beat of the music.
 

ILikeFeet

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,010
But... you made a post describing yourself as that small subset. You're talking about yourself.

All i'm saying is that the categories are arbitrary and it's weird that people use arbitrary rules to bully games into obscurity or out of top ten lists or canonicity.
I don't know how you got that out of my post. My point was Nintendo outright tells us in the games are canon or not. And they also stopped caring about canon themselves. BotW pretty much shows that.

People who dont play games that aren't canon is very small, as we can tell by the games' sales. Gameplay style has more an effect on sales than whether or not it slots into the story.
 

giraffereyn

Banned
Jan 20, 2019
300
I don't know how you got that out of my post. My point was Nintendo outright tells us in the games are canon or not. And they also stopped caring about canon themselves. BotW pretty much shows that.
Im not talking about canon. I'm asking why we make our categories. Canon is one way.

I argue that Cadence of Hyrule is also a mainline game, mostly because the Capcom games get to be included in mainline game discussions and those games were made under similar circumstances as Cadence.
 

Noppie

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,815
Im not talking about canon. I'm asking why we make our categories. Canon is one way.

I argue that Cadence of Hyrule is also a mainline game, mostly because the Capcom games get to be included in mainline game discussions and those games were made under similar circumstances as Cadence.
I'd say most people use the gameplay of the games as an indicator for mainline or not. Hyrule Warriors? That's a spin-off Warriors game. OoA/OoS? Mainline, traditional gameplay. In the end it doesn't matter and you do you.
 

jariw

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,659
Yep the youtube description says a random generated overworld and dungeons! (Wich is pretty neat imo)
I think "random generated" is the wrong description here. Just like in all good rogue-lite games, there are so many algorithmic parameters that controls how worlds will look, and what kind of enemies you would encounter at a specific place, etc. "Procedurally generated" is a better term IMO.

Watched some videos of the first but still having trouble wrapping my head around the gameplay. Is it just something you get once you play it?
The concept is very simple, but tricky. You have one available action at each beat of the music. But your action can only be performed at that point, so you must make decisions constantly.

As I wrote earlier in the thread, it seems like my biggest issue with CotN is fixed in Cadence of Hyrule: the graphics size/style. IMO, the graphics was too retro and too small to work on the Switch screen, for a game that demands such precise synch to each beat. The graphics in Cadence of Hyrule is much larger and better.
 
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giraffereyn

Banned
Jan 20, 2019
300
I'd say most people use the gameplay of the games as an indicator for mainline or not. Hyrule Warriors? That's a spin-off Warriors game. OoA/OoS? Mainline, traditional gameplay. In the end it doesn't matter and you do you.
Gameplay is one of the better ways to describe what kind of game you like because categorizing preference is one of the fastest ways to get across what you like about a series, especially with a series as broad as The Legend of Zelda.

However, i have a problem with pretty much every argument everyone makes in an attempt to simplify things. In the case of Hyrule Warriors, calling it a spin-off based on the gameplay means that there is a main series at all, and that there is a default gameplay. So if HW is a spin-off so are all the 3D Zeldas as the original Zelda is a top-down game.
 

Noppie

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,815
Gameplay is one of the better ways to describe what kind of game you like because categorizing preference is one of the fastest ways to get across what you like about a series, especially with a series as broad as The Legend of Zelda.

However, i have a problem with pretty much every argument everyone makes in an attempt to simplify things. In the case of Hyrule Warriors, calling it a spin-off based on the gameplay means that there is a main series at all, and that there is a default gameplay. So if HW is a spin-off so are all the 3D Zeldas as the original Zelda is a top-down game.
Like I said, you do you. If you don't agree, that's fine. You're more of an exception and honestly making something an issue that isn't one at all.
 

Cocobani

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
207
Sweet, picking up tomorrow then, thanks!
I believe there's a demo on the Japanese eShop. I would try it before plunging down the money for it. Not that the game isn't good but the concept takes a couple of runs to get used to and it's not everyone's cup of tea. I love the game though, the music is amazing. Love finding that shop keeper.
 

giraffereyn

Banned
Jan 20, 2019
300
Like I said, you do you. If you don't agree, that's fine. You're more of an exception and honestly making something an issue that isn't one at all.
Haha I don't have an issue with any of this, it's fun to talk about this stuff. Though saying I am an exception to some imaginary rule is the type of category bullying that takes place when people think that a series is only one thing and can't be another because it has a name or plays a certain way.
 
May 20, 2018
5,179
Ponds
I believe there's a demo on the Japanese eShop. I would try it before plunging down the money for it. Not that the game isn't good but the concept takes a couple of runs to get used to and it's not everyone's cup of tea. I love the game though, the music is amazing. Love finding that shop keeper.
Oh nice, I’ll check out the demo then if there is one. Hearing the OG game is $20 is slightly hard to swallow, but if I love it, I’ll have no issue supporting the devs in that case.
 

FreddeGredde

Member
Oct 27, 2017
816
So if HW is a spin-off so are all the 3D Zeldas as the original Zelda is a top-down game.
I'd say the mainline 2D Zeldas and the 3D Zeldas are very similar and definitely the same genre, compared to spin-offs like Hyrule Warriors and Crossbow Training.

The difference is that 3D is more complex, so things were added as technology advanced. But at the core, it's the same singleplayer exploring, puzzle solving and combat.
 

giraffereyn

Banned
Jan 20, 2019
300
I'd say the mainline 2D Zeldas and the 3D Zeldas are very similar and definitely the same genre, compared to spin-offs like Hyrule Warriors and Crossbow Training.

The difference is that 3D is more complex, so things were added as technology advanced. But at the core, it's the same singleplayer exploring, puzzle solving and combat.
Yeah! I like this explanation a lot because its why I don't like BOTW. Almost all the Zelda games conform to the same dungeon and boss structure.
 

WestEgg

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,779
All i'm saying is that the categories are arbitrary and it's weird that people use arbitrary rules to bully games into obscurity or out of top ten lists or canonicity.
Eh, not really. There's a pretty clear cut line between what Nintendo considers mainline and what they don't. Check the official source

https://www.zelda.com/

Is Hyrule Warriors a better game than Tri-Force Heroes? Yeah, in my opinion. Does that mean it's more deserving of a spot on the timeline? Nah. It's not like it's placement in the "canon" affects how good the game is or its sales
 
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valinthyne

Member
Oct 25, 2017
212
For those curious about Crypt of the Necrodancers gameplay there is a trial version on the JP eshop with full English text.

In JP eshop click search, pick the bottom left of the 4 boxes and scroll down. On the games page it's the bottom of the two boxes on the left.
 

Kouriozan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,614
Ok, time to replay Crypt of the NecroDancer, I'm in need of hearing more Danny Baranowsky's soundtrack after this.



Only 6 hours of playtime, I need to correct this, I did beat the final boss a few time and unlocked most the characters though.
 

Vern

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,070
Was gonna say the same thing!


If it makes any difference, the first game has gotten a lot of pretty universal praise. And I mean, considering that the dev has literally only made the one game, and they impressed Nintendo enough with it to let the borrow the Zelda IP, that should give some idea of the quality. That and the music posted 10 or so pages back certainly piqued my interest for sure! Just checked and it has an 87% on OpenCritic [96% critics recommend] and an 86% on MetaCritic, too.
I’ll wait for the Zelda version and see what everyone says. Especially from people who are like me, that don’t like randomly generated levels or roguelikes. Like I think I said, I’m sure it’s good just it’s probably not for me.
 
Oct 2, 2018
1,272
Well, that's my GOTY for the switch right there. Adore Crypt of the Necrodancer. Finally a reason to dust it off again
 

B4mv

Member
Nov 2, 2017
898
For those who aren't great at Rhythm games, it's not as difficult as it seems.

Play as Bard for a bit to get a feel for the movement patterns and game play. He doesn't need to follow any rhythm, enemies only move when he does. I do believe that actually beating a zone with him doesn't advance the game, but it helps tremendously for practice, and unlocking items/collecting diamonds.

I played for like 3 hours last night since I realized I never actually got passed Zone 2. Made it to Zone 3 last night lol
 
Oct 25, 2017
56
Ohio, USA
Folks, I realized something a little bit ago:

Gleeokenspiel.

This pun is beautiful.

Also the BS Zelda game being unplayable would make a lot of The Legend of Zelda games join it's ranks as time is the only factor that keep that game where it is. The Oracle games and Ocarina and a ton of Zelda game would not be canon under your rule because they would have been stuck on aging hardware had Nintendo not repackaged them on modern consoles like the 3DS and the Switch (with Links Awakening, another game that was just as lost as the BS Zelda.)
Not really. BS Zelda can't even be replayed on the original hardware because it was only available during select windows, like the Splatoon timed demos. I can still play my original cart of Ocarina on my N64 whenever I want.
 

Brock Reiher

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
28,810
I tried Crypt years ago after hearing amazing things and didn't like it at all, just gave it another chance and I couldn't do it.

Now I'm way less excited. Hopefully the updated visuals make the difference, I tend to put aesthetics over everything else when it comes to enjoying games.