Can a video game with horrible gameplay be truly considered good?

[Dust]

Something on my mind lately.

I like everything about Rule of Rose's presentation. Music, story, characters, themes even puzzles are all there. But the gameplay.
The fucking combat/gameplay, it's not even in the servicable ballpark, it's in the "I am never replaying this" tier. Downright the worst of all survival horror games I have played, Silent Hill feels like DMC in comparison.
But that conflicts with everything else I like about it, can a game be considered "good" even if the game part falls apart completely?

People often bring up Deadly Premonition or NieR Gestalt/Replicant but those are seriously just janky but servicable gameplay systems.

 

[DiipuSurotu]

Xenogears

 

[Deleted member 8196]

People find Quantic Dreams games good so i'd say yes it is possible.

 

[fracas]

If you like it, it's good

 

[jorgejjvr]

to each their own, but I prefer my games with good gameplay...since they are games

Many of my friends prefer stories in games. For example, to me botw was a 10/10, but I do not look for story in a zelda game, but that was a big let down to them.

A mix is always nice gameplay + story, but the most enjoyment I have with a games, is how much fun I spend actually playing it, working with its systems, its combat etc

 

[Gilver]

If the "gameplay" doesnt get in the way of the games focus then sure.

 

[Funkybee]

Xenogears

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I remember Xenogear's combat to be good enough back in the day. Specially those special moves with combos & stuff.

 

[Deleted member 10737]

People find Quantic Dreams games good so i'd say yes it is possible.

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i don't think the issue with QD games is the gameplay, it's the dumpster fire stories and writing

 

[MrNewVegas]

Last of us is like that. Gameplay was just blah.

 

[Deleted member 679]

If you like it, it's good

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.

 

[TheMadTitan]

We all seem to love Vice City, so sure. 3D GTA ganmes pre-5 never actually had good gameplay, they just had varied gameplay which made the entire package good. Except for GTA4, that was just ass. But the rest of them were essentially good in spite of their gameplay mechanics.

 

[Soulflarz]

Servicable yes
Bad no

Depends how much you can suffer

 

[Deleted member 1849]

I quite like a number of video game stories, but honestly I feel that if the game has a great story but intertwines that with hours of awful gameplay, the entire thing falls apart. The same thing happens in reverse too, if a game has amazing gameplay but tries to distract you with absolutely awful story telling, the great gameplay is never allowed to shine.

Not to say that such games are "bad", but it makes it harder for the good to stand out. Diamond in the rough situation.

I would much rather that if your story really is that great, you simply not have any gameplay at all, or at least heavily de-emphasize it to a point where only the parts necessary for the game to function are intact. Basically, the approach taken by visual novels, certain adventure games, etc.

 

[Deleted member 48897]

The problem is that decades of weird (frequently advertorial) discourse has convinced people there's a clear and definite answer to what constitutes good gameplay in the first place.

 

[ASaiyan]

Skyrim?

I'm not even trolling, lol. The actual gameplay in Elder Scrolls (combat, etc.) is abysmal. But the story and world-building is superb and more than compensates. Overall, I enjoy the games, as do millions of others.

 

[Bomblord]

A book with a bad story is just bad, multipe games with bad or even no story are masterpieces. A game with bad gameplay can be amazing because the story, visual design, and characters make it so. Mediocre games can have brilliant moments where the mechanics and even the mediocrity are used as elaborate metaphors. You can get lost in a game with bad mechanics and focus exclusively on the good ones and still enjoy it immensely.

What is great about games is their are so many individual metrics to judge them on that they can still be good even if multiple aspects of them are objectively bad.

 

[Canucked]

This is gonna turn into a "lol people like <<inset popular game>> so I guess so!" thread.

If you like it, it's good.

 

[plié]

Games are always subjective to the person playing them, there is no objective measurement to a "good game"

Like someone said:

If you like it, it's good

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[Nec]

The Witcher 1. Perhaps its why I find combat in 3 decent.

 

[Barrel Cannon]

This is going to be a thread full of hot takes.

As for OP's qusetion, everything is subjective but even overall there are plenty games that many people consider good despite the overall loop being trash or unfulfilling.

 

[Kolx]

Of course. Otherwise most visual novels are hot garbage.

 

[Saikyo]

Yes people like dark souls

Spoiler

 

[Pancracio17]

Well yes. Games are more than just gameplay nowadays, despite the name. RDR2 is a good example, as it succeeds in basically everything it wanted to, making it a fantastic experience, but it doesnt play very well.

 

[Clive]

As long as it's not so bad that it ruins the game and makes it a frustrating experience. Just finished four seasons of The Walking Dead and I enjoyed them. The exploration and action gameplay are downright poor though IMO but it was generous with checkpoints so it didn't turn into a frustrating experience.

I rate my game on a website and I rate games I enjoy as "good" (or better).

 

[Deleted member 10737]

to answer the question, i'm not sure about horrible, but there are so many games these days with truly bland, unremarkable, barely serviceable and completely boring gameplay that people consider to be good or even fantastic and goat-worthy, so i think the importance of gameplay for many people is secondary as long as they're entertained and impressed with the visuals and narrative.

 

[Deleted member 17388]

As other said, the game mechanics have to be at least serviciable.

Like, in a visual novel, maybe you can only push a button and select between options, but if the pressing has lag or something well... I doubt it would be considered "good".

 

[Ravelle]

Yes, otherwise Smash Brothers wouldn't be loved as much. ;p

 

[Odesu]

Drakengard, Rule of Rose, Deadly Premonition - yes, of course. These are all amazing, singular, endlessly interesting games that play terribly. That doesn't matter too much to me, because everything else elevates them so far above countless "better playing" games that bore me to death.

 

[RPGam3r]

Xenogears

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WTF? Xenogears does not have horrible gameplay. I don't think you know what horrible means.

 

[Big G]

I look at a game in its totality, so if one aspect of it is bad, I believe it can make up for it in other areas and end up being a good game overall.

Gameplay is the most important element of a game to me, so if that's bad, a game has its work cut out for it.

However, Deadly Premonition is a game that I really do believe to have bad gameplay. At the very least, the combat is downright ghastly. But it really brings it in so many other areas that it's one of my favorite games ever.

 

[Phantom88]

We all seem to love Vice City, so sure. 3D GTA ganmes pre-5 never actually had good gameplay, they just had varied gameplay which made the entire package good. Except for GTA4, that was just ass. But the rest of them were essentially good in spite of their gameplay mechanics.

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Of course they did have good gameplay. The trick was to play them on PC with mouse and keyboard. They control like any game from today.

The PS2 versions though - auto centering camera with no control. Lock on shooting. I honestly have no ideea how the series became what it became with how horendous they played on consoles

 

[Servbot24]

Sure if gameplay is not the point of the game

 

[Stryder]

Metal Gear Solid 2 has never felt great to play.

Yet Metal Gear Solid 2 has been the game of the year for the last 18 years so...

 

[JayCB64]

You miss all of those GOTY nominations for Red Dead Redemption 2?

 

[Captain of Outer Space]

The problem is that decades of weird (frequently advertorial) discourse has convinced people there's a clear and definite answer to what constitutes good gameplay in the first place.

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Yeah, I've seen people that think "gameplay" is killing enemies, so adventure games, puzzle games, etc where that's not a thing apparently don't have gameplay.

 

[Deleted member 35077]

Yeah, Witcher 3 won many GOTY awards despite its bad gameplay.

 

[PrimeBeef]

In my opinion no. In my opinion, the gameplay is the only thing that matters. Yes FPS to a degree (I don't consider that part of gameplay). Shitty stories, bad dialogue, bad VA, and everything else won't ruin good gameplay for me. As long as it runs, handles well, and the loop is entertaining it is good. Any one of those three are bad, it's not a good game.

 

[RPGam3r]

So many hot takes already. Its just another flavor of "What's the worst game you ever played?" where [insert your favorite game] is for sure to be listed.

 

[Haze]

Alpha Protocol

 

[Eumi]

Yes, because putting limitations on art is really stupid and usually only done to win internet arguments.

 

[Deleted member 2620]

Any game's mechanics in isolation aren't gonna be shit, and plenty of great games have extremely basic mechanics that don't really do anything noteworthy aside from provide the thinnest way to deliver aesthetics/narrative/whatever. Phoenix Wright, Rez, and so on.

 

[Tommi]

The Witcher 1 is one of my favorite games, so I'd say yes.

 

[Acquiescence]

Absolutely.

Silent Hill 2.

 

[theotherMittens]

Definitely yeah. Every game has different focuses and sometimes whatever is great about a game can outweigh something it does poorly.

 

[Mack]

I really enjoyed the story of Deadly Premonition and the game itself (graphics and gameplay) is a steaming pile of shit. So I guess the answer to OP's question is yes.

 

[PrimeBeef]

Servicable yes
Bad no

Depends how much you can suffer

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I don't suffer. If it plays bad, I drop it. Don't care how critically acclaimed it may be or may have been. The one and only time was when you assholes convinced me I needed to finish Nier multiple times to get all the endings. The gameplay was so bad that after the first ending, I went to Youtube. I wasn't going to bother with that shit anymore.

 

[Murfield]

Witcher 2 had a terrible terrible combat system, which accounts for most of the gameplay.. Rest of the game was good though.

I liked combat in witcher 1 and loved it in 3. Though I suspect all three entries will show up in this thread.

 

[night814]

For me gameplay is usually the deciding factor so I would have a hard time saying something was still good if I hated the gameplay.

 

[Ushojax]

Sometimes. Grand Theft Auto has horrendous gameplay and mission design but there's still fun to be had, I'd just never describe it as a great game.

 

[Torpedo Vegas]

Resident Evil survived the PSX era. The most dangerous enemy until RE 4 was the camera and controls.