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Can Nintendo's conservatism end up hurting them?

fireflame

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,275
People often say that if something new is introduced by any competitor, it will always take Nintendo 10 years more to introduce it. E.G: decent online, achievements. Is it an approach that can remain in te long term, or is it possible that it could end up turning people away from it.Online is the first example coming to mind, but I think we all have examples in mind examples of a form of "Nintendo conservatism".The quality of their games is said to make it for all those problems, but will this always be the case?
 
onpoint

onpoint

Neon Deity Games
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Oct 26, 2017
14,964
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So long as the quality of their games remains high the audience will continue to come.
 

Deleted member 58846

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5,086
It has in the past, and it will in the future.
But conversely, it has also helped them in the past, and it will also help them again in the future.
 
Seesaw15

Seesaw15

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,819
RingedFarawayCricket-small.gif
 
Chojin

Chojin

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,625
Warchest tho.

Can't they turtle up and stay in business for like 30 years without releasing anything? Granted extreme end of conservativism. But. Yanno. I think they'll be okay.
 

Deleted member 43

Account closed at user request
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Oct 24, 2017
9,271
Nintendo is conservative in some ways, and quite daring in others.

It seems to be working fine for them.
 
Empyrean Cocytus

Empyrean Cocytus

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
18,720
Upstate NY
To be fair, it has in the past. Online with the GameCube, HD with the Wii, and the entirety of the Wii U debacle.

Fortunately Nintendo has the ultimate ace up their sleeves: The best development houses and the most-beloved, best-selling franchises in all of the industry.
 
Santar

Santar

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,006
Norway
I've always seen it as more of an ego thing. Like since they were at the absolute forefront of gaming and invented so many new trends in the past, they absolutely won't just sink down to the levels of the likes of Sony and Microsoft and just copy what somebody else is doing, no matter how much people want them to. They will create the next new and better thing because they are Nintendo and they know best.
Just to clarify I don't agree with their thinking, it's just what I imagine they might think of themselves.
 
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robot

robot

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,470
We don't really have a way of definitively answering that. Either it will work or it won't, and the company will change or it won't.

Though it's no guarantee, Nintendo has been in this business longer than most and are still quite stable so something seems to be working.
 
LumberPanda

LumberPanda

Member
Feb 3, 2019
6,357
Yes. I'm a huge Nintendo fan but they're walking on pure luck at this point. The Wii U showed exactly what happens when they don't hit the jackpot. And it's not just system sales that hurt when that happens, their software sales get capped (see: MK8 sales on Wii U vs Switch).

They can "survive" multiple Wii U's in a row, but that's not quite what you're asking. The fact that they're so behind on so many things means that they're relying on hitting the jackpot, like they did with the Wii and the Switch. The more behind they are, the harder it will be for them to sell their next Wii U.
 
werezompire

werezompire

Zeboyd Games
Verified
Oct 26, 2017
11,377
fireflame said:
achievements
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I feel like they're just fundamentally against having system-wide achievements and as a developer, I think that's the right choice. They're not opposed to putting achievement-style systems in their own games when they think they'd be a benefit. In fact, they had a rather intricate achievement system in use way back when with Kirby Air Ride (which came out before the X360).
 
-PXG-

-PXG-

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,186
NJ
Ever since the launch of the Switch, Nintendo has been on fire. Whatever mindset and approach they have right now, it's working. I'd say, keep it up. Online needs to still catch up, but overall, they're fine.
 

mrmoose

Member
Nov 13, 2017
21,190
Chojin said:
Warchest tho.

Can't they turtle up and stay in business for like 30 years without releasing anything? Granted extreme end of conservativism. But. Yanno. I think they'll be okay.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

That's part of why they do what they do. They don't have the backing of a huge corporation with hands in a dozen other businesses to keep them afloat, so they are super conservative in their main domain, games, and focus on making games with the quality they believe people want. If they were forced to take on a huge amount of risk and develop like cutting edge technology for their next platform and invest a ton of money in their games, that warchest could shrink faster, but otherwise, playing it safe is the way to go.
 
Poltergust

Poltergust

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,832
Orlando, FL
At least they're doing better at leveraging their IPs outside of gaming. There's the new theme parks, the Mario movie, and the Kirby Cafe in Japan, for example.

I want them to reach out a bit more, though. A Zelda/Metroid TV series would be fantastic if it's up to the same level of quality as the Castlevania TV series, for example.
 
WestEgg

WestEgg

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,047
fireflame said:
People often say that if something new is introduced by any competitor, it will always take Nintendo 10 years more to introduce it. E.G: decent online, achievements. Is it an approach that can remain in te long term, or is it possible that it could end up turning people away from it.Online is the first example coming to mind, but I think we all have examples in mind examples of a form of "Nintendo conservatism".The quality of their games is said to make it for all those problems, but will this always be the case?
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Remember how Nintendo chucked traditional console gaming out the window in favor of motion control dominated experimental software? Or invested in exercise games multiple times? They aren't as risk averse as you might think just because they don't follow the lead of their competitors.
 
Jaded Alyx

Jaded Alyx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
35,378
Sure, let's ignore all the times Nintendo wasn't conservative and focus on the times they were.
 
Piston

Piston

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,170
I think Online is the only area they are really that conservative in and I think that really stems from them preferring local multiplayer experiences. Achievements aren't necessary. They take more risks than Microsoft and Sony in many more major ways.
 
Gundam

Gundam

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
12,801
While Nintendo fans have a propensity for ridiculous as shit gamer outrage (Pokemon), my perception is that Nintendo fans have a higher tolerance for these sorts of shortcomings. I don't know why.

So, no, although I wish it would.
 
mute

mute

â–˛ Legend â–˛
Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,097
I don't know if I'd call what they are doing now conservative, but it seems to be working for them.

Online quality will always be limited by whatever HW Wifi solution they go with. Achievements, does their absence (at least system level) really correlate with lost sales? Not sure.
 
Skittzo

Skittzo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
41,037
Matt said:
Nintendo is conservative in some ways, and quite daring in others.

It seems to be working fine for them.
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A fitness RPG is the definition of conservative, don't you know? /s

But yeah they clearly have a different philosophy than other platform holders, not that I'd necessarily call it conservative overall. But yes that philosophy will certainly hurt them in some ways and help in other ways. That's the nature of the business.
 

Deleted member 16365

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Oct 27, 2017
4,127
There are franchises that from now until the end of time will only be available on Nintendo platforms. So long as that remains true Nintendo will be fine.
 
Puroresu_kid

Puroresu_kid

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
9,465
Nintendo will always do their own thing. It means sometimes they will release a platform that bombs but I don't think they will ever release a platform again where bombing means they lose money like the Wii U did.

That should never of been given the green light simply because of how much it cost them to produce.
 
HaL64

HaL64

Member
Nov 3, 2017
1,821
Empyrean Cocytus said:
To be fair, it has in the past. Online with the GameCube, HD with the Wii, and the entirety of the Wii U debacle.

Fortunately Nintendo has the ultimate ace up their sleeves: The best development houses and the most-beloved, best-selling franchises in all of the industry.
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Click to shrink...

Exactly. They are still riding on the coattails of the company that was called Nintendo did from 1985-1995.
They have Billions in the bank and no matter how hard they screw up as long as they don't make trash out of the beloved characters then they are golden for awhile.
 
WestEgg

WestEgg

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Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,047
HK-47 said:
I don't know what else you call their online strategy.
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Something they aren't prioritizing, and a bit underwhelming for sure. But to me the conservative move would have been to follow market trends, push GAAS and micro transactions (which they dabble in, but it's not a focus), and cater more towards third party friendly hardware.
 
MP!

MP!

Member
Oct 30, 2017
5,198
Las Vegas
I just think that they don't want to invest heavily in something that could only last 5-10 years...
ironically they end up doing just that in many cases... Like mii verse or nintendo TiiV
 
Xaszatm

Xaszatm

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,903
HaL64 said:
Exactly. They are still riding on the coattails of the company that was called Nintendo did from 1985-1995.
They have Billions in the bank and no matter how hard they screw up as long as they don't make trash out of the beloved characters then they are golden for awhile.
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Click to shrink...

Cause the Wii and the Switch and the DS clearly aren't mega successes and are only because of "coattail riding".
 
senj

senj

Member
Nov 6, 2017
4,436
Sure. It has hurt them, multiple times, in the past: the SNES era aversion to blood hurt their reputation a lot when Mortal Kombat came out. Their commitment to ROM media was a big issue with the N64, and to some extent their aversion to standard media was still an issue with the Gamecube. They may well have had even more success with the Wii, with less of a content tail-off, if they hadn't been so slow to move beyond SD resolution. Etc.

But they're also very unconservative in other ways, and that paid off with things like the N64's stick input, their handheld lines, Wii and Switch, and the way some of their gameplay innovations really set the industry standard. They're just conservative and bold in different ways than other companies, and it variously hurts and helps them differently.
 

Deleted member 31923

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They take some pretty big risks actually with their systems, some of them work, like the Switch and Wii, and others fail like the Wii U. I wouldn't call them being behind in things like online the result of them being conservative either. They just don't value online play as much as other companies do, but with the increasing importance of it, they had no choice but to join the party of paid online services. They are conservative with their money, I'll give you that. They could afford to acquire studios like Microsoft and Sony have, but really have avoided it. That may hurt them and likely already has when it comes to development. On the other hand, with Retro Studios going from hero to zero, perhaps that made them gun-shy on acquisition, and they would rather have studios like Bandai that they rely heavily on but don't own.
 
onpoint

onpoint

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SoaringDive said:
Yes. I'm a huge Nintendo fan but they're walking on pure luck at this point. The Wii U showed exactly what happens when they don't hit the jackpot. And it's not just system sales that hurt when that happens, their software sales get capped (see: MK8 sales on Wii U vs Switch).

They can "survive" multiple Wii U's in a row, but that's not quite what you're asking. The fact that they're so behind on so many things means that they're relying on hitting the jackpot, like they did with the Wii and the Switch. The more behind they are, the harder it will be for them to sell their next Wii U.
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"Nintendo" means "leave luck to heaven" right? I think that's in effect here.

I wouldn't call the Wii U unlucky — it was a horrifically marketed and somewhat ill-conceived device. They knew what they were doing. It was simply a miss.

Conversely I would call the Switch a calculated success. They set right many of the wrongs of the Wii U and it's failed strategies and made up ground where it had shortcomings.

Nintendo isn't stupid. They think long and hard about each move. And even if it isn't totally obvious on the outside I'd wager there is a reason for each move they make.
 

Deleted member 19702

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It already did, actually. Nintendo was very resistant to adapt to online gaming, HD development and modern gaming philosophies for way too long and that brought management difficulties when they had no choice but to give in to stay relevant in the market. Those decisions led to two financial failures, making them bleed money for three years and a row, jeopardized their relevance in the gaming biz and scared away third-party support. They tried to force isolate themselves too much from everyone else and that had a consequence. This forced Nintendo to make a whole management and development overhaul after Iwata died. Despite Switch's doing great, there's still scars from those mistakes from the past that might take years, if not decades, to fully heal.
 

Deleted member 11413

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Nintendo isn't actually that conservative of a company in terms of, like, creativity, game development, or hardware. Maybe in terms of their structure or corporate culture, and online functionality.
 
byDoS

byDoS

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Oct 25, 2017
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SoaringDive said:
Yes. I'm a huge Nintendo fan but they're walking on pure luck at this point. The Wii U showed exactly what happens when they don't hit the jackpot. And it's not just system sales that hurt when that happens, their software sales get capped (see: MK8 sales on Wii U vs Switch).

They can "survive" multiple Wii U's in a row, but that's not quite what you're asking. The fact that they're so behind on so many things means that they're relying on hitting the jackpot, like they did with the Wii and the Switch. The more behind they are, the harder it will be for them to sell their next Wii U.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Oh dear... no
 
Deleted member 32106

Deleted member 32106

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Nintendo is so late in motion control with Wii and again with hybrid console Switch.
conservative hurt them a lot.
 
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