Oh and then when you do find it pay $10-15 just to get it shipped to you. More if you don't live in the US
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Can we have a talk about video games music, youtube, and piracy?
- Thread starter Kaivan
- Start date
Most I've imported have been through CD Japan, to Latin America, and I haven't had issues. I've never used Amazon Japan, but I've heard good things about it.
The stores that have restrictions in japan are usually for digital downloads, and that is no different from how american websites work.
Edit: Forgot about Amiami. They sell CD's too.
The argument that piracy boosts legitimate sales always needs to come with a big, glowing neon [Citation Needed] attached.
Yet, it's still available. We're not talking about buying a Ferrari and having it sent to Peru.
I do agree with parts of the Op but these companies need to make their music more available. There's no reason why a lot of these OSTs aren't available digitally on iTunes or Amazon, I know some are but it's not nearly enough.
Do they have Mega Man XZ Tunes or ZX Advent Tunes? Those are arranged albums of the games including character songs that were only available in the Japanese version of the games. It's very hard to find as Capcom has never re-released them, unfortunately. Don't even think they're on Spotify either.
CD Japan has the Rockman ZX Advent Tunes one, it seems. I'm not sure if its the one you´re referring to, though.
As does the argument that it hampers legitimate sales. There's a distinct lack of research in the area.
A lot of these songs can't be purchased and if they can they're often Japan only and on a CD.
These companies could always just use the Content ID feature on YouTube to claim ad revenue if they just want to get paid without doing the work of releasing the song.
These companies could always just use the Content ID feature on YouTube to claim ad revenue if they just want to get paid without doing the work of releasing the song.
It's 30 bucks, and usuallt it's another 10 for registered shipping... Not that bad.
Don't forget customs charges.
When it's starting to cost more than the game itself, yes, it kinda is. Especially if you want to buy more than one soundtrack a year. It mounts up. I think all of these should be available digitally, not just limited to Japan (and sometimes US only too).
And we're done here.Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't this bit mean that the video is automatically licensed and the money goes to the licensor?
That's the reality of the market.
These people aren't suddenly going to pay for this music if Nintendo or whoever makes it impossible to listen to without importing a CD.
Part of the reason piracy had gone down is that better paid options exist now compared to when piracy was either the easiest or the only way to listen to some music.
Would it be better that they were not available at all?
Yeah, it would be comfortable, but unless companies change their stance on the topic, it's the only option to get the soundtrack. XC2's OST, for example, is 40 bucks, digitally, on Amazon. For that price, I'd prefer to have something physical.
Barely anything. Most artists barely get anything from streaming services compared to those actually buying albums directly.
No one (beside HUGE fans) is paying 40$ for a OST in 2019...people don't even have systems that plays CD's anymore.
Consumers have decided for convenience, if they refuse to accept it it's their loss.
So, basically, unless it's streaming it doesn't count and gives the people the right to pirate?
The music IS available to purchase. If you disagree with the price or the way its available, its fine, and while your criticism is valid, it doesn't excuse that most people looking for the music in youtube has a - legal - alternative to access that music.
"People don't have systems that play CD's anymore!" is a person's problem. It's, still, a widely used media format.
There was that 300 page, EU commissioned study that they never published because they couldn't find a link that piracy affects sales negatively aside for recent top movies:
The study itself: https://cdn.netzpolitik.org/wp-upload/2017/09/displacement_study.pdf
From the summary:
I really don't see the point in defending the takedown of video game music. It isn't like anyone isn't buying a game because they're listening to the soundtrack on Youtube. Music has gotten me INTERESTED in games, not listening to music has never made me uninterested. There's literally nowhere to buy lots of Nintendo music, or even to listen to it other than in the game. It isn't like these people were monetizing videos either. I just don't see the appeal in defending what Nintendo is doing and I say that as a huge Nintendo fanboy lmao
It'd still cost me more to import the CD thanks to custom charges. Here in the UK they gouge it out if you import anything that's a certain price. Digital is just better for taking the music with you. I don't have a CD drive on my computer so it's kinda useless to me unless I play it on my PS4 or Xbox One lol.
It's normally because they've not tied their identity to the companies that make TV shows and movies
what i want to know is does anyone running defense for massive corporations here care about the artists who made this music getting properly compensated, or do they just get off on the law bring followed to a tee. because if you wanna talk about artists getting their fair share for the music they make hell yeah i'm right there with you, artists should be paid better by streaming services and the record deals their parent companies make. something tells me that this isn't the prevailing ideology at play here however
the word "right" keeps coming up in these discussions as if the letter of the law is what matters here. no, nobody has the legal """right""" to stream or download music they can't afford or don't have a player for, but guess what: they're not going to give a shit. companies can adapt to this fact and offer services that people will pay for or they will always face the problem of piracy/gray market solutions.
the word "right" keeps coming up in these discussions as if the letter of the law is what matters here. no, nobody has the legal """right""" to stream or download music they can't afford or don't have a player for, but guess what: they're not going to give a shit. companies can adapt to this fact and offer services that people will pay for or they will always face the problem of piracy/gray market solutions.
I dislike streaming for that reason, actually. I don't even have Spotify - if I want a CD from a band I prefer to buy it digitally, since my local CD chain store closed down.
And as for "rights", sure, people will continue doing it, but that doesn't mean I can't be in disagreement with it. If I want to enjoy music, the least that can be done is to pay the artist by buying it, and for me that includes the OSTs.
The only situation I accept is when the OST didn't have official releases, like DKCTF or the music for Mario + Rabbids DLC. If it had an official release, though, I'd rather get it.
the problem is the "least" you can do is not an option for a wide swathe of games. you say "the only situation" like it's rare, but it's the case for a concerning amount of soundtracks. these companies need to get their act together with this stuff. prioritizing proper releases will benefit both the consumer and the artist. it's plain as day nintendo doesn't really care about either right now, and it sucks
Unless you're a really big artist with a favorable contract, you get paid shit for selling music, be either through streaming or direct sales (physical or digital). That's if the artist even managed to fully repay the upfront they got to record the album in the first place - because until you've repaid that, all of the money goes straight to the label.
For soundtrack composers it's even worse, as it's mostly done as contract work and they very seldom get any royalties on sales. Soundtrack music has very little commercial value other than its original and for advertising/marketing purposes. That's why, for the soundtracks I've composed, I've structured my contract so I retain the rights to freely distribute music with a CC license - as an artist, I'd rather have people listening and enjoying my music, even if I don't make an extra cent from it.
For soundtrack composers it's even worse, as it's mostly done as contract work and they very seldom get any royalties on sales. Soundtrack music has very little commercial value other than its original and for advertising/marketing purposes. That's why, for the soundtracks I've composed, I've structured my contract so I retain the rights to freely distribute music with a CC license - as an artist, I'd rather have people listening and enjoying my music, even if I don't make an extra cent from it.
It becomes a company/artist problem when less and less people use that platform some desperately clinch on. CD for music is still widely the standard, but it's getting less and less. CD albums (in the US) had their peak in 2000 with 13,000 million US dollars revenue, with only 1,200 million US dollars in 2016; CD album sales went from 950 million in 2000 down to 52 million in 2018.
If I had a game with the file size of 1MB I could deliver it on floppy disk these days and tell people it's their problem if they can't play it. Or I'm going to release it via GOG/Steam you name it.
Yep, videos can be claimed and monetized by Nintendo if they wanted.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't this bit mean that the video is automatically licensed and the money goes to the licensor?
You are absolutely right. Basically once YouTube detects copyrighted material, they hand the decision about what to do with your upload to the creator of the content you're sharing.
At this point they can opt to share monetization with you, completely take any revenue you would make, block the video in certain countries or take down the video entirely.
OP's whole premise stems from not understanding that an absolute majority of VGM uploads on YouTube are flagged by content ID and thus the money goes to the creators of the content rather than who uploads it. Hell it doesn't even have to be just a straight up music upload, all of my Splatoon and BotW gameplay on my channel is entirely monetized by Nintendo simply because the music playing in the background already triggered a copyright claim before the actual gameplay ever could.
Cant yall just rip the music from the game like yall do when yall rip roms for an emulator? Or is that too real for you guys?
There are a lot of deeply unpleasant, unclean, and downright horrifying things people have to do to get by in life. That's just part of being alive. The copyright system in America and Europe is already balanced extremely far toward the rights of the copyright holders, and shedding tears over someone having to click a mouse button to exercise those rights probably isn't a top priority for most people wanting to listen to music that's readily available on YouTube.
Studies on the area are lacking, but we do have a 300k Euro Study mandated by the European Union about it. Most interesting finding on the matter is that the study couldn't actually find correlation between increased piracy and sales, either positive or negative.
Estimating displacement rates of copyrighted content in the EU said:
Other interesting finding is that piracy is also not dictated by price, at least for music and games.* As follows:
Estimating displacement rates of copyrighted content in the EU said:
So, while we can't say that piracy is entirely a distribution problem, it seems like a logical conclusion that it plays a big part in it. But we can't also reliably say that as a study is needed about it.
*in europe
edit: i'm a dumbdumb and forgot the source: https://cdn.netzpolitik.org/wp-upload/2017/09/displacement_study.pdf
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This. They can straifh
Steam pretty much single-handedly created a market for legit games on Latam. Yes, it's all about accessibility.
I think the users are not to blame.
Youtube is an official service. Anyone watching a video is not doing anything wrong.
If the material is ilegal the original owner should ask youtube to take it down. The end user can "help" if he wants, by reporting the video (if he knows).
But the end user does not have any obligation to know if a video is legal for that channel or not.
And I also seriously think the music industry has to embrace the change. Many already did.
Music piracy is like fighting against drugs, but much worse. It is an impossible job today.
In situations like that the smartest thing to do is to accept the new enviroment and find new ways to take profit from it.
(Free global Awareness of your music, global streaming services, etc)
Many games don't sell their OST, and yet they get free advertisement from youtube music videos and live streaming.
Many musicians today make more money from shows and creating a "brand" than selling the music itself.
Youtube is an official service. Anyone watching a video is not doing anything wrong.
If the material is ilegal the original owner should ask youtube to take it down. The end user can "help" if he wants, by reporting the video (if he knows).
But the end user does not have any obligation to know if a video is legal for that channel or not.
And I also seriously think the music industry has to embrace the change. Many already did.
Music piracy is like fighting against drugs, but much worse. It is an impossible job today.
In situations like that the smartest thing to do is to accept the new enviroment and find new ways to take profit from it.
(Free global Awareness of your music, global streaming services, etc)
Many games don't sell their OST, and yet they get free advertisement from youtube music videos and live streaming.
Many musicians today make more money from shows and creating a "brand" than selling the music itself.
Most musicians make their money from concerts and merch. And it's not a new development, either, been the case since the 90s at least.
I wanted to use the word "most" but since I am not an expert I decided to tone down that affirmation lol
Yeah, I've dealt with the music industry for a while now. It's pretty trash. Got plenty of friends tangled in bullshit contracts, releasing album after album without ever seeing a cent for their music. The sooner labels all cease existing, the better everyone will be.
Yeah, this is becoming more common. My last PC build I didn't even bother with a disc drive of any sort.
But it's not like you can't buy a USB CD drive, and they run for about the same price as an internal CD drive. I had to pick one up so I could keep ripping my games after building my new PC, because the case I chose just didn't have a spot for an internal CD drive.
This is such a slippery slope.
Videogame music is typically viewed as very different than "regular" music because it usually isn't the product in itself. Most perceive listening to video game music to be a sort of "fair use" condition because it's only a little part of what constitutes a video game, which is the product. It's sort of implied that if you're listening to video game music on YouTube, then it's most likely because you bought the game and liked its music in the first place.
And if we go down that slippery slope: Many of you have avatars that contain copyrighted video game art. Are the artists compensated for them? How is it not piracy then? We can take this reasoning to such wild extremes.
There is a reason Fair Use exists as a concept, and it really just hasn't followed up properly with modern technology. If game companies don't want people putting their music up on YouTube, then they should do it themselves. If not, though luck.
Videogame music is typically viewed as very different than "regular" music because it usually isn't the product in itself. Most perceive listening to video game music to be a sort of "fair use" condition because it's only a little part of what constitutes a video game, which is the product. It's sort of implied that if you're listening to video game music on YouTube, then it's most likely because you bought the game and liked its music in the first place.
And if we go down that slippery slope: Many of you have avatars that contain copyrighted video game art. Are the artists compensated for them? How is it not piracy then? We can take this reasoning to such wild extremes.
There is a reason Fair Use exists as a concept, and it really just hasn't followed up properly with modern technology. If game companies don't want people putting their music up on YouTube, then they should do it themselves. If not, though luck.
True enough. I have a similar case, and considered it before, but just wouldn't use it enough to keep around. In this scenario, if I were buying a bunch of physical OST's, it would be worthwhile.
Let's Plays, so long as you're actually doing something other than streaming your own gameplay (view of yourself playing, talking over it, whatever) should be considered derivative works (because they are) just as reviews and other similar things. It really stops being a derivative work once you are just showing the game being played and that is literally it. If WayForward wanted to take down my streams of playing Shantae HGH because I didn't do anything other than play the game (I do this with Destiny sometimes, too) I wouldn't care about it because I was just playing it. One of my friends streams himself playing Spelunky all the time, but he's got a cam and also talks through it, responding to chatters.
That's why you draw your own avatar ;)
But yeah, personally I can't say I'm bothered about it, as far as I'm concerned it can't be piracy if you listen to a stream, it's not full quality and it's not much worse than sitting on a sofa in your friends house listening to music.
I understand how the thinking goes though but this discussion is still weird in my opinion. Coming from Sweden doesn't makes things less weird, here I get laughed at for buying bluray movies and even worse for still buying music CDs, feels like everyone born after 1990 has barely even seen a music CD, the youngsters probably know Lars Ulrich from wanting to stop Napster rather than Metallica :P And game piracy is pretty bad as well, I doubt people here start subbing to Nintendo Online to get NES games :s
i dont know if thats the law but i disagree with it entirely. Reviews dont 100% the entire game. im pretty sure someone cant put up an entire movie and do an MST3K-style show without first purchasing the right to do so but maybe im wrong.