Can We Just Admit that Joe Rogan is Alt-Right Already?

[Spirit of Jazz]

I'm sorry but I'm not going to get dragged into this. To be honest I don't like doing it and if you're not going to respond to any of my basic critiques or questions and bury me in an essay of anecdotes I don't see the value in it. I only brought up one anecdote in my last response and it was in regards to how it's possible to cut ties with racists or homophobes outside of a few circumstance, unless for example you're dependant on them somehow. Other than that I don't see how your parents are relevant to this at all, they're clearly not fascist or abjectly prejudice? The people I broke ties with were actively hurting others with their prejudice just as the people we were supposed to be talking about in this topic were, I'm assuming that your parents didn't going that far? e.g. they're not publicly calling trans people the sex they were assigned at birth with the influential reach of Peterson?

I feel that your whole view on this is based around you getting upset at the thought people like me would call your parents/friends with similar views to them Nazis. I wouldn't. Heck, the reason for leaving the EU isn't even as xenophobic as most peoples are, sure it's selfish, but it's understandable in a patriotic sense. But it's not a anecdote relevant to the conversation (beyond you being upset at the idea of me potentially thinking your parents were Nazis) and anecdotes are rarely a good way to argue points as it is. Though this is why I don't like people leaping at purity testing because you have no idea what an individuals limits are and I don't think not associating/platforming fascists is some crazy unreachable purity test.

Oh, and your point was that were fully capable of debating people into rational thought so there's no inherent danger in platforming, right? Well, doesn't your anecdote fly in the face of that? I mean you love your parents, they love you, you've been debating them for years and they still follow "this trajectory http://www.brin.ac.uk/figures/attitudes-towards-gay-rights/" in regards to gay rights? So don't you think the real issue is them being indoctrinated into an homophobic dogma, which is exactly the risk of platforming the alt-right/light.

 

[Andy Mac]

The platform these people have and push has literally led to racial concentration camps in the span of two years. Does someone need to walk up to your face and scream "sieg heil" for you to consider them fascist? Jesus.

Actions speak louder than words and labels.

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I listen to Joe Rogan a lot and after reading the thread I am having a hard time wrestling with the idea that that not only is he alt-right but that he also is some kind of nazi sympathizer or supporter/enabler of fascism.

A big part of this is coming from the idea of the "political spectrum". My understanding is that the alt-right is the absolute far extreme right? So if Joe Rogan is at the very extreme end of the Right then who would be considered a more central kind of right winger?

I think the guys photographed in the tweet with Rogan are right wing to some degree or another but the nature and severity of their beliefs seems variable.

I guess the question is how "right wing" someone is allowed to be before they are considered to be supporting fascism?

If an American voted for Trump then they have to shoulder some responsibility for what's going on right now but what about someone who is against same sex marriage and is deeply racist but who also happened to vote for Hillary?

It would make sense to me that even if Republicans went away completely and there was simply no more right wing then what we would begin to see is divisions in the left. The Clinton vs Sanders battle for the Democrat nomination was still dirty and nasty so wouldn't this continue even in the absence of the Right? There would just be a new enemy?

Will there ever not be a "Left vs Right" situation? Is shutting down opposition and criticizing people for giving a platform to opposition likely to lead us to the ideal goal? What is the goal here anyway?

Is there any right wing view at all that Rogan should be allowed to have aired on his podacast? Is there any right winger who is acceptable guest or does giving ANYONE on the right a platform add up to supporting fascism? What about people who are largely left or centrist but have maybe a few agreements with the right?

When I look at this it really feels like the only acceptable courses of action to Joe Rogan are:

1 - Never allow anyone on the show to state right wing views without offering the strongest possible rebuttal.
2 - Never allow anyone on the show who has right wing views even if you don't talk about those views on the show.

Never talking about politics is not an option because then you are complicit by way of not getting involved.

If he does do that though then the show is basically either a completely non-political discussion that doesn't ever touch on current events or a heavily left leaning show that carefully curates guests based on their political views. Neither of these seem acceptable.

PS. I think this thread is a great example of why Reset Era is absolutely NOT an echo chamber. This place gets a bad reputation sometimes that is absolutely not warranted. It was good to read some very healthy debate and some very good posts.

 

[Hobbesian Thudercat]

The hyperbole is real. No, he's not "alt-right".

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I just can't, with this website and its "politics".

 

[Dragoon]

I hadn't listened to his podcast in a while. Gotta look who he's interviewed the last few weeks and give it a listen. thnx OP

 

[TyrantGuardian]

I listen to Joe Rogan a lot and after reading the thread I am having a hard time wrestling with the idea that that not only is he alt-right but that he also is some kind of nazi sympathizer or supporter/enabler of fascism.

A big part of this is coming from the idea of the "political spectrum". My understanding is that the alt-right is the absolute far extreme right? So if Joe Rogan is at the very extreme end of the Right then who would be considered a more central kind of right winger?

I think the guys photographed in the tweet with Rogan are right wing to some degree or another but the nature and severity of their beliefs seems variable.

I guess the question is how "right wing" someone is allowed to be before they are considered to be supporting fascism?

If an American voted for Trump then they have to shoulder some responsibility for what's going on right now but what about someone who is against same sex marriage and is deeply racist but who also happened to vote for Hillary?

It would make sense to me that even if Republicans went away completely and there was simply no more right wing then what we would begin to see is divisions in the left. The Clinton vs Sanders battle for the Democrat nomination was still dirty and nasty so wouldn't this continue even in the absence of the Right? There would just be a new enemy?

Will there ever not be a "Left vs Right" situation? Is shutting down opposition and criticizing people for giving a platform to opposition likely to lead us to the ideal goal? What is the goal here anyway?

Is there any right wing view at all that Rogan should be allowed to have aired on his podacast? Is there any right winger who is acceptable guest or does giving ANYONE on the right a platform add up to supporting fascism? What about people who are largely left or centrist but have maybe a few agreements with the right?

When I look at this it really feels like the only acceptable courses of action to Joe Rogan are:

1 - Never allow anyone on the show to state right wing views without offering the strongest possible rebuttal.
2 - Never allow anyone on the show who has right wing views even if you don't talk about those views on the show.

Never talking about politics is not an option because then you are complicit by way of not getting involved.

If he does do that though then the show is basically either a completely non-political discussion that doesn't ever touch on current events or a heavily left leaning show that carefully curates guests based on their political views. Neither of these seem acceptable.

PS. I think this thread is a great example of why Reset Era is absolutely NOT an echo chamber. This place gets a bad reputation sometimes that is absolutely not warranted. It was good to read some very healthy debate and some very good posts.

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In terms of the echo chamber criticism - I think that's mostly coming from people who have been banned for posting sexist/racist/trans/homophobic garbage or obviously arguing in bad faith. Those people are so used to that sort of shit being allowed everywhere else on the internet that they flip out in complete snowflake outrage instantly. It's kinda amusing to be honest.

Anyway, my problem isn't what Rogan should be labeled as - the fact of the matter is that he is giving a major platform to right wing people (including some people actively spreading hateful ideas and in some cases even fascism). Some people defend this with the claim that he's "just interested in knowledge and debates" but that defense falls incredibly flat when he has had little to no actual socialist thinkers/personalities on his show, nor does he hang out with any of those people. You'll have a hard time convincing me he doesn't agree with any of the extreme right wing stuff when he is clearly comfortable hanging out with those people both on air and in private while seemingly having no genuinely leftist people around him.

He's doing actual damage to democracy by spreading some of those ideas and that is in and of itself fascist action - whether he personally holds those beliefs or not. I honestly don't care what he thinks. I only care about what he does, and what he's doing is problematic at the very least.

 

[Deleted member 888]

I'm sorry but I'm not going to get dragged into this. To be honest I don't like doing it and if you're not going to respond to any of my basic critiques or questions and bury me in an essay of anecdotes I don't see the value in it. I only brought up one anecdote in my last response and it was in regards to how it's possible to cut ties with racists or homophobes outside of a few circumstance, unless for example you're dependant on them somehow. Other than that I don't see how your parents are relevant to this at all, they're clearly not fascist or abjectly prejudice? The people I broke ties with were actively hurting others with their prejudice just as the people we were supposed to be talking about in this topic were, I'm assuming that your parents didn't going that far? e.g. they're not publicly calling trans people the sex they were assigned at birth with the influential reach of Peterson?

I feel that your whole view on this is based around you getting upset at the thought people like me would call your parents/friends with similar views to them Nazis. I wouldn't. Heck, the reason for leaving the EU isn't even as xenophobic as most peoples are, sure it's selfish, but it's understandable in a patriotic sense. But it's not a anecdote relevant to the conversation (beyond you being upset at the idea of me potentially thinking your parents were Nazis) and anecdotes are rarely a good way to argue points as it is. Though this is why I don't like people leaping at purity testing because you have no idea what an individuals limits are and I don't think not associating/platforming fascists is some crazy unreachable purity test.

Oh, and your point was that were fully capable of debating people into rational thought so there's no inherent danger in platforming, right? Well, doesn't your anecdote fly in the face of that? I mean you love your parents, they love you, you've been debating them for years and they still follow "this trajectory http://www.brin.ac.uk/figures/attitudes-towards-gay-rights/" in regards to gay rights? So don't you think the real issue is them being indoctrinated into an homophobic dogma, which is exactly the risk of platforming the alt-right/light.

Click to shrink...

My parents dabbling with homophobia does hurt others, even if they are very respectful and decent in public. They carry prejudice based on religious intolerance. My overarching point is possibly not for you but others who on one hand express upset at how some people think in the world but then struggle to grasp with how to get incremental change as time passes. It's one method to scream at my parents, throw around tables and have ran away from home earlier than I did saying I hate them there will be zero relationship. That's one way of handling right-wing/Conservative views or prejudice. I tried another and I'd argue for me anyway its worked a little bit better than scorch the earth. Dealing with religions is tough at the best of times.

One of the most powerful tools we have is our voice and part of that is conversation and debate. Anecdotes are worthwhile because they are lived experiences. Collectivism when it is used without any nuance leads to forgetting people are individuals and while you can be pretty on the ball broadly generalising just don't be alarmed if every so often someone says well I done that or I think that way and it's for a different reason than you're accusing me of.

This topic is largely founded on the idea of the alt-right and Nazis so it's why I've been discussing things framed under that lens. I'm also not saying dangers don't come with platforming, but suggesting at times there is some over the top hyperbole that because someone gets onto a podcast a great seismic shift has happened. A lot of these internet based culture wars are very insular. Some definitely have a totally warped view of what fascism actually is as well. Then again I'd make that claim for the flippant use of calling certain people Nazis.

 

[Kurona]

It doesn't really matter what he believes. What matters is how the majority of his audience perceives his words and actions, and if those encourage their extreme views. I don't give a shit what his intent is, it's the effect that matters.

 

[HellforLeather]

South Americans? Cages? You living under a rock or something?

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Illegal immigrant detention centers are not concentration camps and they arent thrown in there based on race. Regardless of anybodies feeling on the matter this is hyperbole at best and downright malicious lying at worst. If you want to make a point about these centers there is plenty to use without resorting to hysterics.

 

[Dook's Revenge]

I realized that Rogan is most likely second only to Stern in number of hours of entertainment he has provided me.

 

[Fairxchange]

Are there any particular things he has said to categorize him as such? His guests are varied and come from lots of different political and social backgrounds. He let's conservative thinkers on his show, so by that accord is he alt-right? I disagree unless you're far left and view interaction with conservatives as an affront to your values.

 

[corn93]

So many folks see him as "Centrist" and hating the "extremes of both sides".

Dude's a fucking alt-right shithead and needs to be called out as such.

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"Centrist" in American English means "Republican but I'm fine with weed and gays".

 

[Slayven]

"Centrist" in American English means "Republican but I'm fine with weed and gays".

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"I am find with gays as long as they aren't too loud and want rights"

 

[corn93]

"I am find with gays as long as they aren't too loud and want rights"

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Well too loud goes without saying. "Centrists" and people on the Right typically detest protest because it threatens the status quo. "Both sides"ism/centrism is all about keeping the same shitty status quo while still feeling morally superior to the Right.

 

[TyrantGuardian]

Illegal immigrant detention centers are not concentration camps and they arent thrown in there based on race. Regardless of anybodies feeling on the matter this is hyperbole at best and downright malicious lying at worst. If you want to make a point about these centers there is plenty to use without resorting to hysterics.

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Lol. Yes, plenty of white people in these detention centers. You are the one doing the malicious lying mate. They are literally concentrating people in small spaces based on race and nothing else. These people aren't illegal immigrants either, most of them are asylum seekers trying to enter legally but being rejected en masse at the checkpoints because the regime in the US are literal nazis. If you refuse to accept that I don't know what to tell you other than you should be ashamed as fuck over your country and over the fact that you are trying to legitimize what your regime is doing.

 

[HellforLeather]

Lol. Yes, plenty of white people in these detention centers. You are the one doing the malicious lying mate. They are literally concentrating people in small spaces based on race and nothing else. These people aren't illegal immigrants either, most of them are asylum seekers trying to enter legally but being rejected en masse at the checkpoints because the regime in the US are literal nazis. If you refuse to accept that I don't know what to tell you other than you should be ashamed as fuck over your country and over the fact that you are trying to legitimize what your regime is doing.

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Citizenship is not race. Yes, the vast majority of the people in these centers are of Latin American origin...but did you ever stop to think that maybe its because our border with Mexico is 1 of only 2 land borders? Where else is illegal immigration going to come from? There's not many refugees or people fleeing economic hardships from Canada and Its a little difficult to cross the border when you have to pass through customs at an airport or port.

 

[Rinse Bassfunk]

Citizenship is not race. Yes, the vast majority of the people in these centers are of Latin American origin...but did you ever stop to think that maybe its because our border with Mexico is 1 of only 2 land borders? Where else is illegal immigration going to come from? There's not many refugees or people fleeing economic hardships from Canada and Its a little difficult to cross the border when you have to pass through customs at an airport or port.

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https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/world-us-canada-44588643

Seems you can cross the border, even accidentally from Canada. Strange how there's no wall being proposed for that border. Oh and hey, she was a visible minority....strange that

 

[Rivenblade]

Out of morbid curiosity, I watched an Alex Jones video yesterday, and there are Alex Jones viewers/commenters who are calling Rogan "a sell-out," so it seems like he has detractors on all sides.

 

[HellforLeather]

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/world-us-canada-44588643

Seems you can cross the border, even accidentally from Canada. Strange how there's no wall being proposed for that border. Oh and hey, she was a visible minority....strange that

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Estimates in 2015 put the number of unauthorized immigrants at 11 million, representing 3.4% of the total U.S. population.[7] The population of unauthorized immigrants peaked in 2007, when it was at 12.2 million and 4% of the total U.S. population.[7][8] Since the Great Recession, more undocumented immigrants have left the United States than have entered it, and illegal border crossings are at the lowest levels they have been in decades.[9][10][11][12] In 2014, unauthorized immigrant adults have lived in the U.S. for a median of 13.6 years, with approximately two-thirds having lived in the U.S. for at least a decade.[7] In 2012, 52% were from Mexico, 15% from Central America, 12% from Asia, 6% from South America, 5% from the Caribbean, and another 5% from Europe and Canada.[13]

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal_immigration_to_the_United_States

If you were trying to prevent people from illegally entering the US...where would you put your resources? (not that I am defending a multi-billion dollar wall, there are several reasons why this is a dumb idea) Whats funny about your story about a single person accidentally crossing from the Canadian border is that she still got caught and there are plenty of places on the southern border that does not have a fence so Im not sure what point you are trying to make.

 

[Polaroid_64]

Out of morbid curiosity, I watched an Alex Jones video yesterday, and there are Alex Jones viewers/commenters who are calling Rogan "a sell-out," so it seems like he has detractors on all sides.

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When you give a huge platform to the alt right as well as hang out with them, they tend to expect you to push their bullshit 24/7.

 

[Miggytronz]

 

[Thornton Reed]

As far as I’m concerned alt right means far right, so Nazi and facist. No OP we can’t just call rogan alt right because if you actually listen to him he’s not a racist, facist or white suprematist. This website continues to dilute terms and embarrass itself.

 

[hydrophilic attack]

"Centrist" in American English means "Republican but I'm fine with weed and gays".

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i'd say someone like joe biden is a genuine centrist in american politics

a very rare breed

 

[36 Chambers]

Rogan is a bit of an anomaly in that the cogs of the Universe turned in such a way for him he ended up with what is seemingly the most popular podcast in existence. He has over 1000 podcasts of roughly over 2 hours each with varying guests. Literally no one else has that. If you ignore everyone he's ever spoken to you don't mind and just zone in on select people you hate you can confirm your own biases in suggesting he must be one of the most damaging people on the planet. In reality, it's a little more complex than that, in so far as quite a few decent people have gone on his platform due to how large it is. Audiences/guests will come to him. Others will run a mile because they're scared of 2~3 hours of exposed conversation where they can't hide or fully control the dialogue. As I said myself Rogan is many things, some unflattering, but the topic began on the basis of not here's some things wrong with Rogan, like a racist joke, but just right to he's alt-right (and others said Nazi).

Now, an issue here is many subscribe to you must never give anyone a platform who is deemed as controversial or an asshole. Eh, you'll find most libertarians rightly or wrongly will value conversation with their enemies/the public enemies. It is what it is, Rogan's hardly the only person on the planet who will talk to some of the dregs of society.

The thing with Peterson and some of the voices he has on like Harris and even Weinstein is like it or not, you won't be able to make yourself pure enough to have zero overlaps with them on some things. Even Peterson who is undoubtedly a Conservative, more than the others who seem to be further left on the political compass. That doesn't mean you need to like them, or you are guilty by association, it means you as an individual will have to accept in the real world, you can overlap with people you don't like on some important political or social issues. If you are mentally fragile (not aimed at you as a derogatory statement) that might mean you fold in on yourself and give yourself 1000 lashes for daring to think like someone you hate. If you have confidence in your own beliefs you'll be able to accept what I've argued in here, like it or not you will overlap at times with your perceived enemy. It just happens and more people need to learn to deal with it. Ultimately, I'm happy if Conservatives and Religious people can become more tolerant around certain things, even if I'm an atheist and vote for left parties all my life. Just because a genuine Republican might exist who is for gay marriage doesn't then mean me as leftie for gay marriage is 100% behind said Republican. That's toxic reductive thinking.

When people fail to understand that will happen (overlaps) it results in a never-ending feedback loop where you have to find a way to call someone the worst thing imaginable to distance yourself as much as possible. You can't be seen as even having 1 thing in common with the person, or you're complicit by association. THAT can occasionally cause the beloved "purity test", when it gets soo bad even generic people on the left who genuinely stand alongside you have to be cast out in your never-ending persecution complex where anyone who doesn't think 100% the same as yourself might lead others to think lesser of you. Nah, real life doesn't strictly work like that, you only have control over your own mind and actions, and if someone else you hate thinks like you on some subjects, tough, you're going to have to find a way to accept that. Sometimes it is objectively good if even your "political enemies" end up in agreement with some things you think.

We can't line up and shoot everyone we hate, or in a less satirical remark (advocating violence is rhetorical here), lock them all up. Unfortunately part of living in a democracy is trying to debate in ways which change the minds of our opponents, even if it's incremental steps forward. It can be done and will be done as science and reason often do win out with a large enough collective, even if some people take longer to be dragged forward. What's a better alternative right now? A genuine dictatorship where there is no vote, no debate, no challenge, no conversations and so on, as long as it's your side in charge of the dictatorship? Yeah, that's never happening, for either side. Although some of our Governments are trying to slowly erode the power/laws/equality the people have. Or they're trying to block progress going forward.

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Very well said. Great post man. Id have made about 20 bad posts jusy trying to say this.

 

[Polaroid_64]

As far as I’m concerned alt right means far right, so Nazi and facist. No OP we can’t just call rogan alt right because if you actually listen to him he’s not a racist, facist or white suprematist. This website continues to dilute terms and embarrass itself.

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Just a very convenient wise middle man who gives a huge platform to the alt-right and is buddies with them.

But not alt-right.

Ok, you fight that good fight.

 

[Rinse Bassfunk]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal_immigration_to_the_United_States

If you were trying to prevent people from illegally entering the US...where would you put your resources? (not that I am defending a multi-billion dollar wall, there are several reasons why this is a dumb idea) Whats funny about your story about a single person accidentally crossing from the Canadian border is that she still got caught and there are plenty of places on the southern border that does not have a fence so Im not sure what point you are trying to make.

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You seemed to be implying that the only way to cross from Canada to the US was through border check points so I remembered the story about someone being detained for two weeks for essentially going for a jog in an unfamiliar location across the border.

I take you didn't like the fact I was inferring a racial element to this situation, but what do you think would happen if the level of illegal immigration increased from the Canadian end to more than that of the southern border?

Edit - also, fleeing a country for asylum/refugee status is not illegal as far as I am aware

 

[Polaroid_64]

And what is truly embarrassing is those who think giving a platform to hateful rhetoric is ok as long as you also have some time slots for puppies and sunshine.

 

[Deleted member 4518]

I thought this was largely known? I've never listened to his podcast and have even less desire to do so after what I see in the OP.

 

[Book One]

That photo in the OP tells you all you need to know, regardless of how people attempt to spin it in this thread.

 

[Gwenpoolshark]

Joe Rogan is a useful idiot for sure, which in many ways is just as bad or even worse. He gives these dudes so much fucking cover.

 

[eclipze]

I’ve never heard him ever say anything that would come close to espousing white ethnocentric ideals. Definitely not alt-right if we are going by it’s actual definition.

 

[HellforLeather]

You seemed to be implying that the only way to cross from Canada to the US was through border check points so I remembered the story about someone being detained for two weeks for essentially going for a jog in an unfamiliar location across the border.

I take you didn't like the fact I was inferring a racial element to this situation, but what do you think would happen if the level of illegal immigration increased from the Canadian end to more than that of the southern border?

Edit - also, fleeing a country for asylum/refugee status is not illegal as far as I am aware

Click to shrink...

Nope, I wasnt intending to imply that at all and i apologize if thats how it came across. Just stating that there is a huge order of magnitude greater levels of immigration coming from the southern border compared to the northern. As far as the immigration levels switching, I think the same thing would play out on the northern border but its really a moot point since its a hypothetical. I will say that there are without a doubt people who like this policy for racist reasons but there is no proof of TyrantGuardians claims that we are locking up people in "concentration camps" just because of their race.

 

[Rinse Bassfunk]

Nope, I wasnt intending to imply that at all and i apologize if thats how it came across. Just stating that there is a huge order of magnitude greater levels of immigration coming from the southern border compared to the northern. As far as the immigration levels switching, I think the same thing would play out on the northern border but its really a moot point since its a hypothetical. I will say that there are without a doubt people who like this policy for racist reasons but there is no proof of TyrantGuardians claims that we are locking up people in "concentration camps" just because of their race.

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Fair play, my intention wasn't to put words in your mouth.

I do disagree however regarding the current administrations reason for what they are doing. I believe they are in fact systematically attempting to demonise and use scaremongering tactics to reduce the amount of immigration, legal or not, from countries with majority people of colour. Trump's language certainly seems to indicate as much. The end result being what can very fairly be labelled concentration camps

Regardless, we are veering off topic. I'm not saying I won't engage with you, but what we are talking about is somewhat off the point of whether Joe Rogan is alt-right/neo-nazi. I don't see him as that, but the fact he gives his platform to them for financial gain and associates with them he ranks about the same to me

 

[sleepInsom]

I don't think Joe's alt-right, but I do think he's incredibly stupid regarding anything that has to do with politics, social issues, economics. Hell, let's be honest and take it a step further: he's a complete imbecile with anything outside of his hobbies and career. He's also gullible and tends to believe things that are outside common knowledge or generally accepted as truth. But I also believe he has racist tendencies insofar that he's unwilling to recognize how bad things are for a lot of people and has constantly made a fuss about keeping things civil. Basically, he's a rich, sheltered white guy who lives in a gated community, doesn't have to work for a living, is a fervent believer in capitalism and "bootstraps", and mainly surrounds himself with yes-men who use him to catapult their careers. Combine all this, and you've got a recipe for disaster.

I've listened to Joe for years, but in the past few years I haven't bothered much unless the guest was interesting. It's obvious that he's ill-equipped to have a conversation with anyone who isn't a comedian or MMA fighter. So when you have people like Milo, Jordan Peterson, Alex Jones, Ben Shapiro, Sam Harris, Eric Weinstein, etc. on reciting their spiel Joe buys into it so convincingly that he'll use their talking points as facts with conversations with other people as well as using that to form his world view. "Hey, did you hear about the racists who were attacking that professor at Evergreen?" "Hey, Alex Jones isn't such a bad guy. I used to party with him. He's just having fun." "People take Milo too serious. He's a troll. He never told his Twitter followers to attack Leslie Jones. She attacked him!" "Have you heard about Jordan Peterson? He's got some really interesting ideas. You should read his book." "Did you hear about that Planned Parenthood is selling fetuses? Sigh. That's fucking crazy, right?"

Ultimately, I see him as a dangerous figure. Not because he's alt-right, but because he values loyalty over principles, fringe ideas over objective truth, civility over justice, and profits over compassion. And he has a huge fanbase that will eat out of his hands because they view him as some modern philosopher because he has muscles, smokes weed, and does yoga...oh and he's played Quake in the 90s.

 

[Rinse Bassfunk]

Very well said sleepInsom

 

[ZackieChan]

I’ve never heard him ever say anything that would come close to espousing white ethnocentric ideals. Definitely not alt-right if we are going by it’s actual definition.

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Definitions no longer have meaning

 

[Sothen]

Out of morbid curiosity, I watched an Alex Jones video yesterday, and there are Alex Jones viewers/commenters who are calling Rogan "a sell-out," so it seems like he has detractors on all sides.

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Actual alt-right bigots don't like the people in OP's photo, because at least a few of them are of Jewish descent.

 

[Mahkor]

His podcast with Alex Jones and Eddie Bravo was a classic, he also introduced me to my soulmate the fleshlight.

 

[Coyote Starrk]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal_immigration_to_the_United_States

If you were trying to prevent people from illegally entering the US...where would you put your resources? (not that I am defending a multi-billion dollar wall, there are several reasons why this is a dumb idea) Whats funny about your story about a single person accidentally crossing from the Canadian border is that she still got caught and there are plenty of places on the southern border that does not have a fence so Im not sure what point you are trying to make.

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No you see exactly what point they are trying to make. You are just purposely ignoring it because it doesnt fit the narrative that you are trying to push.

 

[Rivenblade]

I don't think Joe's alt-right, but I do think he's incredibly stupid regarding anything that has to do with politics, social issues, economics. Hell, let's be honest and take it a step further: he's a complete imbecile with anything outside of his hobbies and career. He's also gullible and tends to believe things that are outside common knowledge or generally accepted as truth. But I also believe he has racist tendencies insofar that he's unwilling to recognize how bad things are for a lot of people and has constantly made a fuss about keeping things civil. Basically, he's a rich, sheltered white guy who lives in a gated community, doesn't have to work for a living, is a fervent believer in capitalism and "bootstraps", and mainly surrounds himself with yes-men who use him to catapult their careers. Combine all this, and you've got a recipe for disaster.

I've listened to Joe for years, but in the past few years I haven't bothered much unless the guest was interesting. It's obvious that he's ill-equipped to have a conversation with anyone who isn't a comedian or MMA fighter. So when you have people like Milo, Jordan Peterson, Alex Jones, Ben Shapiro, Sam Harris, Eric Weinstein, etc. on reciting their spiel Joe buys into it so convincingly that he'll use their talking points as facts with conversations with other people as well as using that to form his world view. "Hey, did you hear about the racists who were attacking that professor at Evergreen?" "Hey, Alex Jones isn't such a bad guy. I used to party with him. He's just having fun." "People take Milo too serious. He's a troll. He never told his Twitter followers to attack Leslie Jones. She attacked him!" "Have you heard about Jordan Peterson? He's got some really interesting ideas. You should read his book." "Did you hear about that Planned Parenthood is selling fetuses? Sigh. That's fucking crazy, right?"

Ultimately, I see him as a dangerous figure. Not because he's alt-right, but because he values loyalty over principles, fringe ideas over objective truth, civility over justice, and profits over compassion. And he has a huge fanbase that will eat out of his hands because they view him as some modern philosopher because he has muscles, smokes weed, and does yoga...oh and he's played Quake in the 90s.

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You forgot to mention that he uses a sensory deprivation tank and that he hunts with a bow and arrow.

I think you're not giving some of his listeners enough credit, though. There are some of us who listen to his interviews and who critique his guests and Joe's reactions to them. In the end, only a full-on idiot would believe everything he hears, as Joe himself doesn't agree with everything his guests say or posit. His main failing is not being able to challenge his guests enough on issues because, like you said, I don't think he has the knowledge in all of the areas that his guests are coming from. Most people don't, which I could see as being dangerous if people are swallowing up everything Joe and his guests are saying, which I don't think the majority are.

 

[HellforLeather]

No you see exactly what point they are trying to make. You are just purposely ignoring it because it doesnt fit the narrative that you are trying to push.

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Ahh what narrative am I pushing? and if you saw my response to Rinse, I think there might have been a slight misunderstanding on our points.

 

[Mathiu Conel]

So because these people are in a picture together, they all have the same beliefs? Automatically alt-right?

You realize they were all either debating or interviewing one another on their respective shows yeah? So even though the photo is innocent you are projecting your beliefs on to it.

They are celebrating the ability to have civil discourse and debate done in good faith. No matter how heated the discussion gets, they try to get along. This is how you actually pursuade minds that are seemingly entrenched.

This era of mislabeling, outrage, purity testing all targeted at people that don't hold your exact beliefs is pretty fucking bleak if you ask me. Just look at this thread. There's an obsession with purposely misunderstanding positions in the worst way possible just so they can put them in a group they're comfortable hating. It's dangerous thinking and we already have our hands full with the *real* alt right.

Still, Harris and Rogan are better humans than me because there's no way I'd eat dinner with Petersen.

 

[Coyote Starrk]

Ahh what narrative am I pushing? and if you saw my response to Rinse, I think there might have been a slight misunderstanding on our points.

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You seemed to have been trying to say that the detention centers and the current immigration crisis is not race related. Which is obviously bullshit.

 

[Lord Brady]

I thought this was largely known? I've never listened to his podcast and have even less desire to do so after what I see in the OP.

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It's not largely known. For that to be the case it would have to be true.

 

[BossLackey]

I hate how everyone on this board has seemingly the exact same political beliefs. Political discussion doesn't even exist here.

I don't agree with everything the people in the photo have to say (or even very much of it at all, depending on which person), but I do listen sometimes, because I'm open to changing my opinion. That goes for both sides.

Unfortunately, I don't know of very many left-wing debaters and thought leaders. I'd like to listen to them if anyone has any good videos/podcasts or just some names.

 

[sleepInsom]

You forgot to mention that he uses a sensory deprivation tank and that he hunts with a bow and arrow.

I think you're not giving some of his listeners enough credit, though. There are some of us who listen to his interviews and who critique his guests and Joe's reactions to them. In the end, only a full-on idiot would believe everything he hears, as Joe himself doesn't agree with everything his guests say or posit. His main failing is not being able to challenge his guests enough on issues because, like you said, I don't think he has the knowledge in all of the areas that his guests are coming from. Most people don't, which I could see as being dangerous if people are swallowing up everything Joe and his guests are saying, which I don't think the majority are.

Click to shrink...

I mean, I still listen to his show on occassion. I’m definitely going to listen to the new Joey Diaz episode. But I also see the discourse that goes on within his community of fans. Many are eating up everything they think he agrees on. From the stupid stuff like those toe shoes and eating grass fed beef with sliced jalapeños, to more serious things like Russia hasn’t meddled in the election and Hillary had her political opponents assassinated. And while there are a percentage of his listeners who know better, there are a lot of people who don’t. Think about it, Joe Rogan has positioned himself alongside people like Jordan Peterson as a sort of life guru for young men who feel like failures, so there’s undeniably a certain amount of hero worship going on.

 

[Crossing Eden]

Political discussion doesn't even exist here.

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What "discussions" should we be having? That maybe black lives don't actually matter? That LBGT marriage needed an extra ten or twenty years to be become legal to 'avoid backlash?" Don't be this:

What issues deserve to have us hear out "both sides" fam?

 

[Deleted member 4518]

It's not largely known. For that to be the case it would have to be true.

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I mean who you surround yourself with is pretty telling of your views.

 

[Lord Brady]

I mean who you surround yourself with is pretty telling of your views.

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What a load of crap. I constantly hang around with Christians. Am I also a Christian?

 

[Skelepuzzle]

I hate how everyone on this board has seemingly the exact same political beliefs. Political discussion doesn't even exist here.

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2016 gets relitigated constantly. Political threads are full of arguments here. You aren't reading the same forum as me.

 

[BossLackey]

What "discussions" should we be having? That maybe black lives don't actually matter? That LBGT marriage needed an extra ten or twenty years to be become legal to 'avoid backlash?" Don't be this:

What issues deserve to have us hear out "both sides" fam?

Click to shrink...

I'm not going to write out a list of shit to debate, and I have nothing to debate currently.

I'm speaking generally. Every thread that has anything political is EXTREMELY predictable.

Next time there's something I want to discuss, you'll be the first to know.

I bet we agree on more things than you realize.