CDPR and Mike Pondsmith have for few years now said that cyberpunk as genre is inherently political and CP77 is political.
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CDPR is a transphobic company. It's time we stop making excuses for them.
- Thread starter Kyuuji
- Start date
CDPR and Mike Pondsmith have for few years now said that cyberpunk as genre is inherently political and CP77 is political.
They (CDPR, not Pondsmith) just said it was a work of art and not a political statement.
More proof that this game is cyberpunk only on the surface level, and not in any sort of ethical or political angle.
They = quest designer in interview where he was asked if they will remove content and/or make explicit political statement just about death of Geroge Floyd.
There has been other designers from CDPR who have underlined it hard that game is political and will talk about topics that will make a lot people uncomfortable.
"It isn't political, just neon" is more meme than anything else when so many developers from the team don't shy away from saying they are tackling issues and talking about them in the game aka they are going political.
Will they succeed at it and pull it off well or fuck it all up is whole other thing.
And licensed cars and stuff. It's hilariously tonedeaf. Literally "look at this cool
I think someone mentioned in the Night Wire thread that the source material is also all style no substance wrt its approach to the genre as an excuse for all this and, yeah, I don't fundamentally have any issues with just taking the visual style of something completely made-up like Blade Runner-esque cyberpunk and doing whatever with it, the issue is more the fact that CDPR seem to think they're making the Ultimate Cyberpunk Game here - even going as far as just, you know, calling it "Cyberpunk" - and that comes with a LOT of baggage and expectations.
Even with CDPR's corporate culture and messaging being the absolute shit it has been, I'm sure they have at least some sensible writers and yeah, maybe they will indeed manage to tackle some interesting philosophical and sociologial issues and questions in the quests, but I genuinely don't understand how a person could see all this pre-release PR and go "oh fuck yeah, this is gonna be the perfect Blade Runner game!" Nothing we've seen would inherently suggest that, and a lot of what we've seen would suggest the exact opposite of that.
They can talk about racism, oppression of minorities, abuse of power by law enforcement, corruption of law system etc etc without making quest explicitly about George Floyd.
You really think they wont go into any of these things in the game because his answer to this particular question Vs. everything else said about game over multitude of interviews?
Why anyone would expect this to be "Blade Runner game"? 😕
Tonedeaf 2077. It's so frustrating because the graphics and gameplay look awesome. But everything else looks more disappointing each reveal/ info released about cdpr .
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This might be the most disappointed I've been about a game before it's been released . I still think the gameplay will be fun, but im just expecting sci-fi GTA rpg at this point. I really wanted a cyberpunk game, especially because of what happened to Deus Ex. I probably wouldn't even get the game at this point if I didn't preorder from where I preordered
Tonedeaf is such a bizarre accusation to hurl against the project under the basis that it doesn't match a self imposed preconception of what should or shouldn't constitute as not only cyberpunk; the genre but also Cyberpunk 2077; the video game. CDPR do not exist to nor should be under any expectation to match some concept of cyberpunk any of you or I have in our heads or preference based on the medium or genre as a whole, not when the project has ever been presented as such. I've been saying this for almost seven years; Cyberpunk 2077 is explicitly based on and draws from, stylistically and conceptually, the Cyberpunk table top roleplaying game by Mike Pondsmith. Not Neuromancer, not Blade Runner, not Deus Ex, nor the anything else. Irrespective if Pondsmith's own work, the game is and was always going to be resonant with its source material and the role playing genre as a whole, which is all encompasses of thematic bravado and playful theatrics.
If this alone is an issue is a consequence of preference, not the title itself. If this appears to be a kitschy, gaudy, bastardised manifestation of the worth found within the cyberpunk genre as outlined by your own standards, that's fine too. But the project is what it is based on principles set long before anybody decided to huff and puff because it's a stupid dumb action game that tells you chrome and wires and big guns are cool. Memes and all.
Nothing is to be gained for critiquing the work for not meeting an arbitrary expectation it never intended to meet. It's a hollow criticism, a construct that only has weight if we take preconceptions and preference as authoritative value, which they are not. Creators are free to take whatever genres, tones, styles, and tropes and do with them whatever the fuck they want, as they have always done. If it's shit to you it's shit to you. If it's a bland, sterile, gross version of cyberpunk that misses a point you'd prefer it to make, that's fine too. But it's a game that has worn its intentions on its sleeve from the moment we got a title card and explicit statement it was based on Pondsmith's work.
It will, in most likelihood, balance a combination of dumb gaudy sterile superficial action idiocy and glorification of its setting alongside contextual commentary, criticism, and exploration of the setting as most writing like this tends to. Real criticism is not in it meeting an arbitrary self imposed standard it never aimed to be, but how it expresses the ideas, concepts, and content it aims to represent. Ergo, the disappointment and insult of trans representation.
If this alone is an issue is a consequence of preference, not the title itself. If this appears to be a kitschy, gaudy, bastardised manifestation of the worth found within the cyberpunk genre as outlined by your own standards, that's fine too. But the project is what it is based on principles set long before anybody decided to huff and puff because it's a stupid dumb action game that tells you chrome and wires and big guns are cool. Memes and all.
Nothing is to be gained for critiquing the work for not meeting an arbitrary expectation it never intended to meet. It's a hollow criticism, a construct that only has weight if we take preconceptions and preference as authoritative value, which they are not. Creators are free to take whatever genres, tones, styles, and tropes and do with them whatever the fuck they want, as they have always done. If it's shit to you it's shit to you. If it's a bland, sterile, gross version of cyberpunk that misses a point you'd prefer it to make, that's fine too. But it's a game that has worn its intentions on its sleeve from the moment we got a title card and explicit statement it was based on Pondsmith's work.
It will, in most likelihood, balance a combination of dumb gaudy sterile superficial action idiocy and glorification of its setting alongside contextual commentary, criticism, and exploration of the setting as most writing like this tends to. Real criticism is not in it meeting an arbitrary self imposed standard it never aimed to be, but how it expresses the ideas, concepts, and content it aims to represent. Ergo, the disappointment and insult of trans representation.
Honestly, point taken, you are correct - I'm not a native speaker so tonedeaf probably wasn't a great choice of words and while I, for some reason, have been under the impression that CDPR is trying to go for the sort of heavy-hitting cyberpunk with this game that unsubtly beats you over the head about the perils of capitalism, prejudices etc. and doing the cake thing by also including fucking influencers and licensed cars and whatever from The Real World which already Fucking Sucks, it's all likely in my head. It's just... Frustration bubbling to the surface.
That said, I don't understand why you felt the need to go this hard at calling out my and killlacam's criticism - which was, like I said, really more like frustrated venting rather than a genuine attempt at meaningful critique, at least on my part - in this thread of all places. Yeah, it's not the thread for miscellaneous venting, but it's even less the thread for this.
I understand and I apologise if I came across as antagonistic. It wasn't my intention. I, much like many, would adore a more generous exploration of the cyberpunk genre in a video game so I can empathise with the frustration. My reaction was more the tiredness of how some of the response to Cyberpunk has been, when for me the implications of its tone have been evident since the announcement. Which is a luxury I have from being familiar with the material and shaping expectations accordingly, and I shouldn't fault others for not.
And you're right. Probably not a good derail on my behalf for this thread.
Just extraordinarily dishonest to claim this question and answer were about a George Floyd quest.
C'mon now.
"The art is the stories we tell, that's the most important"
"For me, the most important thing is that our game is not a political statement"
Interview was conducted month after his death and month-ish into BLM movements protests. To me question is as much about him as it's about BLM movement that became globally and loudly recognized movement soon after.
Google translated from source, like are all Western articles about this question. Also very intentionally I included full answer and not select quotes.
Draw your own conclusion.
Source: https://spidersweb.pl/2020/06/cyberpunk-2077-questy-pawel-sasko-wywiad.html
Yeah I think a lot of people are gonna be disappointed if they go in expecting Blade Runner, Deus Ex, or Ghost in the Shell. Everything I've seen from this game for years suggest there might be a little of those things in there, but most of the game seems to be going for a feel more like the first 15 minutes of Akira.
He literally goes on to expand the scope of the answer from the BLM protests in the USA to "religion" "political sympathies" "sexual orientation" while saying their games represent "their vision". His vision is that the game is not a political statement.
There's no "drawing your own conclusion" here.
Johnny Silverhand driving a Porsche actually comes from Cyberpunk 2020.
I find it incredibly unappetizing and unappealing when marketing for the game has gone this route. You can defend all of that stuff in your game and by god they've tried but the moment they brought that out to the real world the developers themselves have become hypocrites. It's hitting a stage of every action taken by marketing for the game has signal booster bad people as well as shown that they are incredibly ignorant on social issues as well as suspect stuff like the car. Its frustrating because when I think about cyberpunk sure bad shit abusive cultures people trying to survive in a world where they can't. But we're also looking at the game childishly mocking trans people with the ads and exploitations of the characters themselves. This isn't a representation of cyberpunk it's a toxic aproximation of what people think cyberpunk is which has bastardized the genre itself.
I wonder if it might help to raise these issues to influential elected officials like Ocasio-Cortez. She has been actively involved with gamers before, and cares for the LGBTQ community and issues. If more awareness could be raised there, I think it may help raise awareness abroad. Failing real change, provided the senate and presidency flips, they might be willing to place sanctions on Poland until they relent.
I don't think putting this on the US government to deal with is the solution, here. This is something that affects trans people all over the world, and it's up to CDPR and its project leads to change -- which they don't seem willing to.
It doesn't have to be the US Government. I'm from there, and was giving a hypothetical where I saw some progress might be made. I'll sign petitions and speak out, but I think pressure from government may help too. We live in an international community now. Sanctions can have a big impact on countries.
Beyond CDPR, if Poland is forcing LGBTQ people out of their communities, they are violating human rights, and something should be done.
Or maybe we can reach out to the ESRB to tag all games with Transphobia as AO.
I don't disagree with anything in your post, nor implied as such (the marketing is gross), explicitly because of examples like the trans representation and bewildering ignorance on social issues. My fundamental disagreeance was on the expectations of explicitly uniform cyberpunk genre representation which in of itself is not total or absolute, and especially not in the case of a video game that is built from Pondsmith's 32 year old table top game which did and does readily and wholly embraced theatrical character roles and playful embracement of a cyberpunk aesthetic and tonal template for no reason other than "cool laser". It was never going to be Neuromancer nor did it have to.
But you're absolutely right about the general cyberpunk genre template CDPR are working with and how inherent at odds it is with their attitudes towards social issues.
It honestly feels like they want their cake and get to eat it too.
Yes, apparently I have been misunderstanding the direction they'd be taking this game, since I wasn't at all familiar with the source material and the word "cyberpunk" conjured up a very specific image in my mind.
I don't think they really know what they want beyond "this is our game and we think it's great and we want it to sell well". It's what I resent most about this situation. There's obviously systemic ideological issues within CDPR that run, most likely, through a chain of management overseeing swaths of production, PR, and marketing. There's also a strain of social ignorance running through some of the creators, which is probably a combination of deliberately malicious ignorance and disappointingly archaic ignorance, a product of Poland's awful social and political climate and the absence of having values appropriately challenged and explored. And then you have another strain of developers who most likely do not agree with this content at all, are far more progressive than expected, and contributed to the work in their own capacity in meaningful ways.
In a broader sense, I really feel the parts of Cyberpunk 2077 and CDPR's behaviour that sting the most are really indicative of...Poland, more than anything. And more broadly the struggles of conservative Eastern Europe ideologies that are certainly not excusable but more readily exposed when placed on a world stage. CDPR hires from all around the world but they're still fundamentally a Polish developer made up (AFAIK) of Eastern European staff. If Cyberpunk were a blip in the region that nobody knew about we probably wouldn't be having this discussion. But here we are, because Cyberpunk is a "big deal", CDPR are an enormously prolific dev on a global stage, and their dirty laundry is out for all to see.
It's fine. A very large volume of people felt the same way, particularly those who mainly source Blade Runner as their exposure to the genre. It was immediately apparent when that very first in-engine trailer dropped at Microsoft's presser and a lot of people were vocally taken back by how bright, colourful, theatrical, and playful the presentation seemed to be. Hence the whole "GTA with wires" criticism.
But that's just been Pondsmith's rendition of a cyberpunk world. It absolutely has the trappings of what the genre encompasses, but it was a built not as thought provoking literature but a table top role playing experience for people to have fun. It was an embrace of the tropes that make up cyberpunk as a genre; the serious stuff and the dumb stuff. And being a table top RPG meant people could have very serious games or very over the top ones. Maybe they wanted to role play as CEOs versus punks. Maybe they wanted to role play as dumb shit. Either or, that was the template and the game seems to be following through.
My thing with all of that is, If you make a game you are making art. Whether you like it or not, the interpretation of the art is up to the consumer, not the creator. Saying a game is not a political statement is flawed as a concept because of that.
But again, it isn't usually a viewpoint, just a dogwhistle
Very much agree. Didn't bring the whole art aspect of the quote up to not hijack the discussion (and possibly the thread) with yet another argument about art in a gaming forum, but a hundred percent yes.
Just wanted to say thank you again Kyuuji for the fantastic write up on this whole situation. It's easy to write off individual incidents as they come up, but it's pretty damning when it's all laid out like this. Already know a few people who have changed their opinion specifically because of this thread. So, uh.
Thanks <3
Thanks <3
It's the extremely few situations like like this that make me wish I was back in the journo seat and interviewing devs. Five years ago I had the opportunity to speak with Mateusz Tomaszkiewicz at PAX AU about then Hearts of Stone and Blood and Wine, and he was nothing short of lovely and decently candid all things considered. He's been at CDPR since the first Witcher and played a very, very significant role in every game since, peaking as quest design lead for The Witcher 3 and the expansion packs, game director for Thronebreaker, and quests director Cyberpunk. He's openly queer and doesn't shy from talking about the gay romances available in Cyberpunk, and has made his feelings towards the trans community clear on twitter.
I could understand a lower level creative employee having their feelings towards CDPR's trans representation easily lost amidst the 100s of other employees and senior management ultimately controlling the shots, but Tomaszkiewicz is pretty high up the chain. I'd love to pick his brain and see how he feels about CDPR's attitudes towards trans, since more or less all their worst efforts have also been outside of his departments (art, PR, character creation, etc). I'd love to know how he really feels, how comfortable he is with his employer, if he's had the opportunity to speak up about these things and how that went, etc.
But I also know realistically that while he's there even if he does have a lot to say on the matter he probably wouldn't, and couldn't, without jeopardising his role. If the trans issues continue to blow up, particularly post release exposure from Western media, I'll be fascinated to see if he sticks with the company or if someone can squeeze him for thoughts.
I could understand a lower level creative employee having their feelings towards CDPR's trans representation easily lost amidst the 100s of other employees and senior management ultimately controlling the shots, but Tomaszkiewicz is pretty high up the chain. I'd love to pick his brain and see how he feels about CDPR's attitudes towards trans, since more or less all their worst efforts have also been outside of his departments (art, PR, character creation, etc). I'd love to know how he really feels, how comfortable he is with his employer, if he's had the opportunity to speak up about these things and how that went, etc.
But I also know realistically that while he's there even if he does have a lot to say on the matter he probably wouldn't, and couldn't, without jeopardising his role. If the trans issues continue to blow up, particularly post release exposure from Western media, I'll be fascinated to see if he sticks with the company or if someone can squeeze him for thoughts.
It's the extremely few situations like like this that make me wish I was back in the journo seat and interviewing devs. Five years ago I had the opportunity to speak with Mateusz Tomaszkiewicz at PAX AU about then Hearts of Stone and Blood and Wine, and he was nothing short of lovely and decently candid all things considered. He's been at CDPR since the first Witcher and played a very, very significant role in every game since, peaking as quest design lead for The Witcher 3 and the expansion packs, game director for Thronebreaker, and quests director Cyberpunk. He's openly queer and doesn't shy from talking about the gay romances available in Cyberpunk, and has made his feelings towards the trans community clear on twitter.
I could understand a lower level creative employee having their feelings towards CDPR's trans representation easily lost amidst the 100s of other employees and senior management ultimately controlling the shots, but Tomaszkiewicz is pretty high up the chain. I'd love to pick his brain and see how he feels about CDPR's attitudes towards trans, since more or less all their worst efforts have also been outside of his departments (art, PR, character creation, etc). I'd love to know how he really feels, how comfortable he is with his employer, if he's had the opportunity to speak up about these things and how that went, etc.
But I also know realistically that while he's there even if he does have a lot to say on the matter he probably wouldn't, and couldn't, without jeopardising his role. If the trans issues continue to blow up, particularly post release exposure from Western media, I'll be fascinated to see if he sticks with the company or if someone can squeeze him for thoughts.
Even his response to the reply tweet was admirable and genuine.
I can't even imagine the conflict some must go through between their profession or passion and personal beliefs. He seems like an awesome guy.
Did a quick search, out of curiosity, for the most vocal supporters of trans rights within CDPR employee tweets and it seems to be very prominently those in the quest design department that have directly tweeted or retweeted pro-trans statements and LGBT related stuff (like the pride flag shirt).
When I spoke to Tomaszkiewicz all those years ago he did say that CDPR's production pipeline involves a lot of very close working between all the departments, and it was something they learned to be very important during dev of The Witcher 3. Basically ensuring that the quest designers aren't just pissing in the wind, but talking regularly with the art and writing teams to ensure everybody is on the same page and each quest is getting the right amount of attention it deserves to make it feel unique. All this does is make me wonder how often, if at all, conversations around the trans stuff come up between the departments. Or whether or not the public support is really just tokenism.
I think Tomaszkiewicz is just the one that interests me the most. Historic cornerstone of the company's history. Significant contributor on most/all of their projects in a very senior leadership position. And seems utterly earnest in his positive stance towards the LGTB+ community, of which he's a part of. And then in the same breath having his company mangle the perception of trans people through PR and art, and include obtuse-at-best but otherwise utterly offensive representation of trans player inclusivity through the character creator.
We probably won't ever know how he feels unless he leaves.
In what way? I'm not that familiar with the source material.
This is at least promising as far as the game content itself goes and maybe the quests will actually do a good job with the exploration and themes and will be respectful of the issues handled.
Sure would be nice to see after all... this.
I've seen at least a few threads that really made me wonder about this dev (one / two / three / four / five...). Really appreciate this one:
There are more investigative journalists than Schreier in the videogame industry, we used to collate them in games journalism megathreads in the old place. Please don't pin every issue onto him or tag him continuously, just because he's one of the few journalists who's a member here. Read gamesindustry.biz, gamasutra, and other outlets more focused on journalism.
Here's just a few:
Brendan Sinclair
Simon Parkin
Twitch staff call the company out on sexual assault, racism, more
Content warning: The following article discusses sexual assault, verbal and physical abuse, harassment, and suicide.Whe…www.gamesindustry.biz
Gene Park
Matt Leone
Patrick Klepek
Cecilia D'Anastasio
Megan Farokhmanesh
You just need to familiarise yourself more, and look out for the journalism.
These are the stories nominated for 2020 games journalism. You might have read some of these articles:
.
Here are the 2019 Knickerbocker awards for game journalism.
- Will Partin for his story in Vice: 'Artifact' Isn't a Game on Steam, it's Steam in a Game
- Cat DeSpira for her story in Retro Bitch: Pac-Man: The Untold Story of How We Really Played the Game
- Drew Harwell for his story in The Washington Post: Is Your Pregnancy Tracking App Sharing Intimate Data with Your Boss?
- Laurie Penny for her story in Wired: Gaming's #MeToo Moment and the Tyranny of Male Fragility
- Josh Harmon for his story in EGM: The Split-Screen Man
- Christian Donlan for his story in Eurogamer: Night Call Review
- Khee Hoon Chan for her story in Rock Paper Shotgun: China Forced One Horror Game Publisher to Close, But the Whole Region Felt It.
- Anshuman Iddamsetty for his article in The Outline: How Video Games Demonize Fat People
- Jeremy Young for his work in the Donkey Kong forums on the Billy Mitchell Donkey Kong high score story.
- Megan Farokhmanesh for her story in The Verge: Toxic Management Costs An Award-Winning Game Studio Its Best Developers
- Kirk Hamilton for his story in Kotaku: Real Guns, Virtual Guns, And Me
- Giri Nathan for his story in Kotaku: The NBA Really Wants You To Watch People Play A Basketball Video Game
- Ed Smith for his story in Bullet Points Monthly: Far Cry 5's Hyper-Videogamification
- William Audureau, Maria Kalash, Mathilde Goanec and Dan Israel (reporting jointly) for their story in Media Part: Les errements de Quantic Dream, pépite française du jeu vidéo
- Cecilia D'Anastasio for her story in Kotaku: Inside The Culture Of Sexism At Riot Games
- Jennifer Valentino-DeVries, Natasha Singer, Aaron Krolik and Michael H. Keller (reporting jointly) for their story in The New York Times: How Game Apps That Captivate Kids Have Been Collecting Their Data
OP
OP
Pretty much. Speaking to the importance of reflecting various aspects of life and politics in your art while also saying you're not trying to say anything with a spine behind it.
Hey that's awesome to hear and I'm glad for it, thanks anariel <3. Part of that issue around few people knowing someone trans, and the media they consume being the basis of their perception of us, is missing out on a lot of the subtleties as to the issues and problems we face. Having a headline deep awareness of who we are is dangerous when so much out there is content to reduce us to them.
Even those supportive of trans people find themselves lacking that depth and being able to effectively push back against the myriad of comebacks transphobes conjur up; something that has been seen a lot in the case of JKR recently. It's really positive to know people have found this useful in being able to better understand or inform others around these pain points. Responses here and elsewhere has been heartwarming to say the least.
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Regarding the expectations of what Cyberpunk as a game should or shouldn't be that EatChildren brings up.
I understand that kind of viewpoint, but it is missing the cultural context the game is made in and the contemporary audience it is being presented to.
If you take on a project within the vague genre of "distopian-setting" with the addition of Cyber-* then you will have to be judged on the cultural values that these already carry.
The original tabletop is only a small part of it, and probably overshadowed by things like Blade Runner, Neuromancer, RoboCop, etc. - merely because they have a more visible cultural value (not meaning they are more or less important, just more visible).
CDPR has, in itself, a gigantic cultural reach.
Their interpretation of the Witcher has a bigger exposure than the novels it is based upon.
Depending on how successful the Netflix series will be, it might be overtaken by that in terms of cultural visibility (watch out for the backlash of gamers wanting it to be more true to the games due to a mismatch of cultural expectations).
This means for the contemporary audience the CDPR version of Cyberpunk 2077 is the only cultural representation of CP2077.
But as it is released to an already existing cultural expectation of what "distopian fiction" is with the additional modifier of Cyber-*, that is the basis on what this cultural artefact has to be judged on.
Games have such a reach, they cannot hide behind their own standards anymore. They have a cultural impact - so any addition to the library of games will have to be measured by the standard of our entire cultural knowledge.
Especially if you use a title that already come with cultural values.
(Also completely disregarding Punk here, as that's a whole other discussion).
On top of that: look at 2020. It's a real fucking mess we've built towards over decades of structural oppression, passive-aggressive negligence and backward-looking planning of the future.
Of course we all should be looking at what Cyberpunk 2077 presents itself as and scrutinise it with the entirety of our contemporary reality.
If it weren't for CDPR having such a massive reach, that scrutiny would just make it as relevant as "Postal".
Unfortunately that is not the case and their cultural output is doing actual harm to progressive real-world movements.
(Which is also why I think generalising people who look forward to playing it is absolutely fair game.)
I understand that kind of viewpoint, but it is missing the cultural context the game is made in and the contemporary audience it is being presented to.
If you take on a project within the vague genre of "distopian-setting" with the addition of Cyber-* then you will have to be judged on the cultural values that these already carry.
The original tabletop is only a small part of it, and probably overshadowed by things like Blade Runner, Neuromancer, RoboCop, etc. - merely because they have a more visible cultural value (not meaning they are more or less important, just more visible).
CDPR has, in itself, a gigantic cultural reach.
Their interpretation of the Witcher has a bigger exposure than the novels it is based upon.
Depending on how successful the Netflix series will be, it might be overtaken by that in terms of cultural visibility (watch out for the backlash of gamers wanting it to be more true to the games due to a mismatch of cultural expectations).
This means for the contemporary audience the CDPR version of Cyberpunk 2077 is the only cultural representation of CP2077.
But as it is released to an already existing cultural expectation of what "distopian fiction" is with the additional modifier of Cyber-*, that is the basis on what this cultural artefact has to be judged on.
Games have such a reach, they cannot hide behind their own standards anymore. They have a cultural impact - so any addition to the library of games will have to be measured by the standard of our entire cultural knowledge.
Especially if you use a title that already come with cultural values.
(Also completely disregarding Punk here, as that's a whole other discussion).
On top of that: look at 2020. It's a real fucking mess we've built towards over decades of structural oppression, passive-aggressive negligence and backward-looking planning of the future.
Of course we all should be looking at what Cyberpunk 2077 presents itself as and scrutinise it with the entirety of our contemporary reality.
If it weren't for CDPR having such a massive reach, that scrutiny would just make it as relevant as "Postal".
Unfortunately that is not the case and their cultural output is doing actual harm to progressive real-world movements.
(Which is also why I think generalising people who look forward to playing it is absolutely fair game.)
I was a couple of days late listening to it, but Jim Sterling's podcast this week addressed the cosplayer-situation during their News section. Jim stated that he's "just tired of CDPR" now and brought up that they keep getting passes on their behaviour because people just want the game.
Laura Kate Dale hopes that the actual programmers of the game have made the game itself more inclusive away from the marketing team, but realises this is highly unlikely and is just waiting for this game's hype-cycle to come and go so that everybody stops talking about it.
Laura Kate Dale hopes that the actual programmers of the game have made the game itself more inclusive away from the marketing team, but realises this is highly unlikely and is just waiting for this game's hype-cycle to come and go so that everybody stops talking about it.
This post absolutely gets it, you phrased it wonderfully. Nothing exists in a vacuum and it is so important to keep that in mind and not just get defensive and say 'it's just the story/setting, not the company' when people raise very real concerns about the impact this can have on people outside of the setting.
Also, Jim and Laura have good hearts, and I am glad they are talking about this.
Ah good that they're continuing the conversation! Thanks. Do you happen to have a timestamp? It's not listed in their ones.
I knew they would talk about it on the pod, Jim usually actually cares about these sort of things, and Laura also has a personal stake in it like some of us, and I also get how she is just tired and wants it to go away at this point because my feelings are pretty similar.
This is where I'm at.
The thing is even coming here there are just so many threads, by they Nightwire, new threads for new features or even just general hype threads Cyberpunk is always talked about or the most voted and I'm just weary.
I get our communities struggles don't mean shit to most people but damn it can be exhausting to just see how much we don't fucking matter.
Wont lie, a part of me is really selfish and hopes that people have fun but it is not a Witcher 3/GTA where it's going to be talked about across every thread all gen long as I honestly think it will just come down to me leaving the site.
User Warned and Threadbanned: Prompting a derail, vioalting the discussiong guidelines re: metacommentary and site policy discussion
Is anyone else disappointed we allow CDPR's games to be discussed on Era with their record?
its still going to be the biggest game of the year bisides cod. it would be a brave move to ban it, but it wouldnt change much.