Chinese vaccines sweep much of the world, despite concerns

SilentPanda

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Nov 6, 2017
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The plane laden with vaccines had just rolled to a stop at Santiago’s airport in late January, and Chile’s president, Sebastián Piñera, was beaming. “Today,” he said, “is a day of joy, emotion and hope.”

The source of that hope: China – a country that Chile and dozens of other nations are depending on to help rescue them from the COVID-19 pandemic.

China’s vaccine diplomacy campaign has been a surprising success: It has pledged roughly half a billion doses of its vaccines to more than 45 countries, according to a country-by-country tally by The Associated Press. With just four of China’s many vaccine makers claiming they are able to produce at least 2.6 billion doses this year, a large part of the world’s population will end up inoculated not with the fancy Western vaccines boasting headline-grabbing efficacy rates, but with China’s humble, traditionally made shots.
It’s a potential face-saving coup for China, which has been determined to transform itself from an object of mistrust over its initial mishandling of the COVID-19 outbreak to a savior. Like India and Russia, China is trying to build goodwill, and has pledged roughly 10 times more vaccines abroad than it has distributed at home.
China has targeted the low- and middle-income countries largely left behind as rich nations scooped up most of the pricey vaccines produced by the likes of Pfizer and Moderna. And despite a few delays of its own in Brazil and Turkey, China has largely capitalized on slower-than-hoped-for deliveries by U.S. and European vaccine makers.

Like many other countries, Chile received far fewer doses of the Pfizer vaccine than first promised. In the month after its vaccination program began in late December, only around 150,000 of the 10 million Pfizer doses the South American country ordered arrived.
In Europe, China is providing the vaccine to countries such as Serbia and Hungary -- a significant geopolitical victory in Central Europe and the Balkans, where the West, China and Russia are competing for political and economic influence. This stretch of Europe has offered fertile ground for China to strengthen bilateral ties with Serbia and Hungary’s populist leaders, who often criticize the EU.

Serbia became the first country in Europe to start inoculating its population with China’s vaccines in January. The country has so far purchased 1.5 million doses of Sinopharm’s vaccine, which makes up the majority of the country’s supply, and smaller amounts of Russia’s Sputnik V and Pfizer’s vaccines.
Neighboring Hungary, impatient over delays in the European Union, soon became the first country in the EU to approve the same Chinese vaccine. On Sunday, Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban got the Sinopharm shot, after recently saying he trusted the Chinese vaccine the most.

Many leaders have publicly supported the Chinese shots to allay concerns. Early on, “people had all these microchip theories in their heads, genetic modification, sterilization, running around on social media platforms,” said Sanjeev Pugazhendi, a medical officer in the Indian Ocean island nation of the Seychelles, whose president recently received a Sinopharm shot on camera. “But the moment we started giving out the vaccines to leaders, religious leaders and health workers, that started to subside.”

Beijing’s vaccine diplomacy efforts are good for both China and the developing world, experts say.

“Because of the competition for influence, the poor countries can get earlier access for vaccines,”
said Yun Jiang, managing editor of the China Story Blog at the Australian National University. “Of course, that’s assuming that all the vaccines are safe and delivered in the right way.”
 

NHarmonic.

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
8,620
I'm from Chile, and i was administered the Sinovac vaccine...

Piñera is a terrible president, though. One of the most awful heads of state that we've ever had, unable to deliver on any front and only defended by the vanilla right clutching to power.
 

Faddy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,089
The article doesn't seem neutral on the scientific merit of China's various vaccines.

"China’s humble, traditionally made shots. "
"fancy Western vaccines"

The Chinese vaccines are similar to the British (Oxford-Astra Zenica) or Russian (Sputnik) vaccines. It is not RNA based. This allows it to be transported across the globe with ease.

The BBC have gathered some data on China's vaccines.
 

squeakywheel

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Oct 29, 2017
2,690
User Banned (2 Weeks): Xenophobic Drive-By
I just hope there are no strings attached. Knowing China, there probably is.
 

Xando

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,578
This is what happens when the west bunkers all for itself.

EU is exporting only 1/3, US/UK export nothing
 

Firestorm

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,328
Vancouver, BC
The article doesn't seem neutral on the scientific merit of China's various vaccines.

"China’s humble, traditionally made shots. "
"fancy Western vaccines"

The Chinese vaccines are similar to the British (Oxford-Astra Zenica) or Russian (Sputnik) vaccines. It is not RNA based. This allows it to be transported across the globe with ease.

The BBC have gathered some data on China's vaccines.
I just hope there are no strings attached. Knowing China, there probably is.
lmao and there are no strings attached to American or European vaccines? China is offering vaccines to developing countries and the west is buying up vaccines and blocking copyright reform that would allow access to vaccines for those countries. China is going to win favour with those countries and they'll deserve to.
 

tokkun

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,205
The article doesn't seem neutral on the scientific merit of China's various vaccines.

"China’s humble, traditionally made shots. "
"fancy Western vaccines"

The Chinese vaccines are similar to the British (Oxford-Astra Zenica) or Russian (Sputnik) vaccines. It is not RNA based. This allows it to be transported across the globe with ease.

The BBC have gathered some data on China's vaccines.
CoronaVac is an inactivated SARS-CoV2 virus, not a adenovirus / spike protein vaccine like ChAdOX or Sputnik V.

An inactivated virus is indeed the simplest and most traditional vaccine method, though I can understand that the language plays into certain stereotypes about Chinese medicine.
 

TheMadTitan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
16,091
I just hope there are no strings attached. Knowing China, there probably is.
There doesn't need to be any strings. The play to move countries out of the the US' sphere of influence would happen on its own. The Chinese government doesn't have to do any of that "I'm going to need a favor later". The more the help out, the less countries will turn to traditional global powers. Or at least that's the hope given that Russia and China want to supplant the US as the world superpower.
 

RRW

Member
Oct 26, 2017
745
ah yes, people are suspicious of china when other "big" country doesn't even want to help poorer since they too busy with themself.
 

Goldfishking

Member
Oct 27, 2017
309
The article doesn't seem neutral on the scientific merit of China's various vaccines.

"China’s humble, traditionally made shots. "
"fancy Western vaccines"

The Chinese vaccines are similar to the British (Oxford-Astra Zenica) or Russian (Sputnik) vaccines. It is not RNA based. This allows it to be transported across the globe with ease.

The BBC have gathered some data on China's vaccines.
The bbc article you posted also says it's more traditional haha.

"CoronaVac is a more traditional method [of vaccine] that is successfully used in many well known vaccines like rabies," Associate Prof Luo Dahai of the Nanyang Technological University told the BBC.
 

Menx64

Member
Oct 30, 2017
5,524
Costa Rica bought 3 million Pfizer doses... In two months they have only sent 300k or so... Sinovac sent 3 million to Chile already.

Many people were criticizing Argentina for choosing Sputnik and Chile for going with Sinovac, but TBH they made the right call. The US, UK and EU grabbing all they can for themselves and fuck everyone else plan is working well for them, but everyone else was left depending on Pfizer sending scraps...

So tired of that BS already.
 

Commedieu

Member
Nov 11, 2017
13,592
There doesn't need to be any strings. The play to move countries out of the the US' sphere of influence would happen on its own. The Chinese government doesn't have to do any of that "I'm going to need a favor later". The more the help out, the less countries will turn to traditional global powers. Or at least that's the hope given that Russia and China want to supplant the US as the world superpower.
.

The opposite of this is... the USA hoarding supplies and saying fuck them so, don't really see the big deal here.
 

GoldenEye 007

Roll Tide, Y'all!
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,838
Texas
Costa Rica bought 3 million Pfizer doses... In two months they have only sent 300k or so... Sinovac sent 3 million to Chile already.

Many people were criticizing Argentina for choosing Sputnik and Chile for going with Sinovac, but TBH they made the right call. The US, UK and EU grabbing all they can for themselves and fuck everyone else plan is working well for them, but everyone else was left depending on Pfizer sending scraps...

So tired of that BS already.
I’m just trying to figure out where people are getting that the US just has spare vaccines to ship out today. Domestic production hasn’t even fully ramped up and a lot of these announcements are about expectations in the coming weeks and months. A massive state like TX is like at 94% non vaccinated. Why would anyone expect there is spare to ship globally at this point?
 

Ensorcell

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,203
There doesn't need to be any strings. The play to move countries out of the the US' sphere of influence would happen on its own. The Chinese government doesn't have to do any of that "I'm going to need a favor later". The more the help out, the less countries will turn to traditional global powers. Or at least that's the hope given that Russia and China want to supplant the US as the world superpower.
True with China but Russia trying to be a superpower deserves nothing but a good chuckle.
 

Menx64

Member
Oct 30, 2017
5,524
I’m just trying to figure out where people are getting that the US just has spare vaccines to ship out today. Domestic production hasn’t even fully ramped up and a lot of these announcements are about expectations in the coming weeks and months. A massive state like TX is like at 94% non vaccinated. Why would anyone expect there is spare to ship globally at this point?
Everybody bailed of producing vaccines in the US for exports because Trump was a thread to vaccine exports. Then everything went to EU and the UK... And we know how good of a job they are doing.
 

RRW

Member
Oct 26, 2017
745
I’m just trying to figure out where people are getting that the US just has spare vaccines to ship out today. Domestic production hasn’t even fully ramped up and a lot of these announcements are about expectations in the coming weeks and months. A massive state like TX is like at 94% non vaccinated. Why would anyone expect there is spare to ship globally at this point?
They don't expect any "spare". They just expect any delivery that they order being fulfilled in which US and EU fail to deliver. Compare to China who only has 40 Million vaccinated (which is lower than US despite China having a bigger population) yet the send their vaccine around the world and fulfilling their client order.
 

mieumieu

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Oct 25, 2017
476
The Farplane
Vaccine reporting has never been neutral on the Chinese ones (edit: on any vaccines tbh). On both sides. Just do a search with “sinopharm vaccines” on google and scroll down a few page and you’ll know what I mean. I hate this.

personally I took both shots of the sinopharm vaccine and my concern is about how do I prove to people in other countries that I took them when the inevitable arrives (situations when we’ll need to prove that we’re vaccinated).

They don't expect any "spare". They just expect any delivery that they order being fulfilled in which US and EU fail to deliver. Compare to China who only has 40 Million vaccinated (which is lower than US despite China having a bigger population) yet the send their vaccine around the world and fulfilling their client order.
The Chinese can do it with lower percentage of population vaccinated because there isn’t an outbreak in the country atm. Not the case in US and EU. How do we interpret this is another matter.
 
OP
OP
SilentPanda

SilentPanda

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Nov 6, 2017
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Vaccine reporting has never been neutral on the Chinese ones. On both sides. Just do a search with “sinopharm vaccines” on google and scroll down a few page and you’ll know what I mean. I hate this.

personally I took both shots of the sinopharm vaccine and my concern is about how do I prove to people in other countries that I took them when the inevitable arrives (situations when we’ll need to prove that we’re vaccinated).
Yes, I dont know how to say it.
But the word and feeling from the varoius article is not...nice.
Even if it is saying different thing, but the feeling it give is opposite of it.
 

RRW

Member
Oct 26, 2017
745
The Chinese can do it with lower percentage of population vaccinated because there isn’t an outbreak in the country atm. Not the case in US and EU. How do we interpret this is another matter.
Yeah, China has the advantage in term controlling the spread of Virus which give them some breathing space. Still, it doesn't change the fact that it makes US and EU look bad while China look good in term of delivering vaccine to other countries.
 

samoyed

Member
Oct 26, 2017
14,670


West only has itself to blame for going with the sophisticated but hard to produce/transport/store moonshot they're claiming for themselves. Global saturation should always have been the target because this is a global problem. Gotta secure those profits tho.
 

Lagspike_exe

Member
Dec 15, 2017
1,656
My dad got the Chinese vaccine in Serbia and my mom will probably get it soon as well. They're both very thankful to China since China actually wanted to provide a significant quantity of them unlike the others (although the government got Pfizer, Sputnik V and Astra Zeneca shots as well).
 

Redcrayon

Patient hunter
Administrator
Oct 27, 2017
12,253
UK
What the hell does "traditionally made" vaccines mean
From the article:
The bulk of Chinese shots are from Sinovac and Sinopharm, which both rely on a traditional technology called an inactivated virus vaccine, based on cultivating batches of the virus and then killing it. Some countries view it as safer than the newer, less-proven technology used by some Western competitors that targets the coronavirus’ spike protein, despite publicly available safety data for the Pfizer, Moderna and AstraZeneca vaccines and none for China’s.

“The choice was made for this vaccine because it is developed on a traditional and safe inactivated platform,” said Teymur Musayev, an official with the Ministry of Health in Azerbaijan, which has ordered 4 million Sinovac doses.
 

Seductivpancakes

user requested ban
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,790
Brooklyn
Yeah, China has the advantage in term controlling the spread of Virus which give them some breathing space. Still, it doesn't change the fact that it makes US and EU look bad while China look good in term of delivering vaccine to other countries.
No other country in the world is needed to make the US and the EU look bad. They do it themselves.
 

Aske

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
3,048
Canadia
lmao and there are no strings attached to American or European vaccines? China is offering vaccines to developing countries and the west is buying up vaccines and blocking copyright reform that would allow access to vaccines for those countries. China is going to win favour with those countries and they'll deserve to.
Yep. China's a scary country that is doing horrendous things to human beings, but they're not hiding nanobombs or spy cameras in their vaccine shots.
 

captmcblack

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,241
However and wherever vaccines come from, anything apolitical that results in people getting them is fine with me. Companies and nations getting their stuff to other nations at lower costs is good, right?
 

R2RD

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Nov 6, 2018
1,711
My country received 768k Sinovac vaccines last week and we are supposed to receive 50k more that were gifted by the chinese government. Our government bought 10 million doses of AstraZeneca and we are expected to receive just 500k of those in March. Because of that Delay we also have an order with Pfizer and also Covax.
 

Lagspike_exe

Member
Dec 15, 2017
1,656
wow......disnt rhey make this super fast?

wtf was our hold up? USA)
Russia has a significant bio-tech sector left over from the USSR's bio-weapon program. They probably had a vaccine for something similar to COVID for bio-weapon defense reasons (like SARS) but never reveled so they had the know-how to quickly make the COVID one.
 

GMM

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,843
The rest of the world aren’t really given choices when the the US, UK and EU is hoarding whatever supply major western pharmaceutical companies can produce, so obviously many countries will prefer the Chinese or Russian vaccines to prevent further deaths as they are actually accessible in meaningful quantities.

The way the western world has been treating poorer countries in terms of access to vaccines and it’s pricing has been shameful, we need to do better as a collective society if we want to move on.
 

Lonely1

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
5,195
Better than no vaccine IMHO. If the Western powers don't want this, they know what they need to do.
 

SirDante

Member
Sep 20, 2020
652
How effective are the chinese vaccines with the newer strains though? (UK, South African strain?) I hear Astra Zeneca is being thrown out of South Africa, and Johnson and Johnson being brought in because it seems to have higher efficacy against the newer strains.
 

ccbfan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,292
Such a colonizer mindset to be pissed when another country tries to help countries you been fucking over the last century.
 

mieumieu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
476
The Farplane
I do think people can and do have legitimate concerns about Chinese related issues but some are quick to unveil their true intentions.

back to my more practical concern: I’ve already seen news where people need to show that they’re vaccinated in order for entry (for example, Mecca):


I wonder how different countries would cooperate on that. Like I’ve taken a vaccine that’s not approved in the destination country, what should I do?
 

Dis

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,919
It's almost as if ignoring all the other countries and just deciding that your population was more worthy of a vaccine because you could flash some cash at the big companies has a bad effect to trying on convince other countries that you're a good ally in this fight.....who could have guessed?

I still find it insane that people expected the poorer nations to just sit around and wait while people die because western rich countries have decided to buy up all the stock they can of the western vaccines. Racism of the takes in articles about vaccines from elsewhere in the world aside, if these vaccines don't actually work and cause huge issues later down the road due to not stopping covid correctly then rich western countries have no one to blame but themselves for leaving other nations little choice. Not to mention that expecting huge populations of poorer nations to go without is going to lead to more mutations and make it harder for everyone.