Chris Rock new skit materials: "...won't hire women; 'They cry rape for money'"

Aiii · Nov 7, 2017

ashep said:
Nah, it happens. It doesn't mean they're right but there are definitely an increasing number of men who think this way.

On one hand, it suggests a heightened awareness of sexual harrassment which is a good thing, but on the other, assuming that false accusations happen on the regs is pretty silly.

Unless you have some actual sources for this, going "nah, it happens" isn't good enough to support your claim that "a lot of men are scared to talk to women."

Pacote said:
Er... doing that for most workplaces wouldnt work since man treat male colleagues way different, making sex jokes, talking about "crazy bitches" and all...

Doing that to a female worker would be risky as most would consider this type of talk sexual harassment

To be honest. You shouldn't talk like that at your workplace, period. And I doubt you would unless you know said colleague really well, and you can probably gage what to say and what not to say to a female colleague you know really well just as you would with a male colleague.

RockTiddies · Nov 7, 2017

Aiii said:
Unless you have some actual sources for this, going "nah, it happens" isn't good enough to support your claim that "a lot of men are scared to talk to women."

To be honest. You shouldn't talk like that at your workplace, period. And I doubt you would unless you know said colleague really well.

not the same lines but something alluding to it:

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-...agues-according-to-the-research-a6712326.html

ashep · Nov 7, 2017

Aiii said:
Unless you have some actual sources for this, going "nah, it happens" isn't good enough to support your claim that "a lot of men are scared to talk to women.".

Ok, call it anecdotal if you want but the fact i've seen colleagues act like this is plenty good enough for me.

Source: my eyes and ears.

ZeroX · Nov 7, 2017

Aiii said:
Unless you have some actual sources for this, going "nah, it happens" isn't good enough to support your claim that "a lot of men are scared to talk to women."

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/09/...k-men-it-can-backfire-for-women.html?referer=

Are you looking for something like this? I dunno if it's relevant, I just remember the thread from GAF.

My only horse in this race is making sure people give comics the opportunity to develop material before shutting it down.

Transhuman · Nov 7, 2017

excelsiorlef said:
And yet it's brought up within the context and current climate, specifically Harvey Weinstein, where there's no false rape accusations... why in this climate would the go to be I'm scared of women crying rape for my money?

The Harvey Weinstein publicity has emboldened a lot of victims of unreported sexual harassment to come forward, and with all of this happening, if someone were to threaten to falsely accuse a celebrity of rape, the current animosity of the public would make it that much worse for the accused. Not to mention Chris Rock has been accused of rape before. http://gawker.com/5003852/chris-rocks-rape-accusation-phone-call He probably didn't enjoy the experience.

CloudWolf · Nov 7, 2017

Chris Rock has amazing timing.

a.wd · Nov 7, 2017

excelsiorlef said:
I mean we're given decent context... Boos, little laughter, a walk out and Jeff Ross's comments calling him a kid (which implies you know amateur joke telling)

Again he's seemingly not even touching on what you want to touch on.... not highlighting the issue... and where's the satire...

Why the assumption that he's addressing what we all want to address in this current women speaking out movement, when his words are the the opposite.

Because we don't know the full context, I don't want to assume someone who has shouted for women and people of colour and social and financial equality and stood in the spotlight and taken power to task for his whole career hasn't made a bad joke.

I actually said that first, but this 2nd hand reaction to a joke where we don't know the set-up and may have been a joke that just fell flat is not going to help other comedians who want to talk about it feel good.

I may just be talking out my arse, but if I was a comedian and wanted to try out discussing something and as soon as I tried it the whole world called me a rape apologist I would leave that conversation alone and that's the last thing we want people to do.

I am just encouraging the perspective that we need to talk about it and really funny globally known comedians are a great way to move the social needle.

Deleted member 19721 · Nov 7, 2017

pretty fucking crazy to me that the people that try and enforce the most censorship about speech are those who would consider themselves liberal. when i grew up it was the conservatives that were all about shaming people and taboo topics. now its kinda flipped on its head. i really dont know what to make of it.

Transhuman · Nov 7, 2017

excelsiorlef said:
I mean we're given decent context... Boos, little laughter, a walk out and Jeff Ross's comments calling him a kid (which implies you know amateur joke telling)

That's the reception of the joke, not the context of the joke.

excelsiorlef · Nov 7, 2017

trinity said:
pretty fucking crazy to me that the people that try and enforce the most censorship about speech are those who would consider themselves liberal. when i grew up it was the conservatives that were all about shaming people and taboo topics. now its kinda flipped on its head. i really dont know what to make of it.

What censorship?

Deleted member 42 · Nov 7, 2017

If you cannot support your opinion with facts and/or statistics, please don't try to present it as a factual statement. We're not trying to stifle discussion, but if you're speculating or using anecdotal evidence, not admitting that is debating in bad faith.

Keep discussion civil as well, or we will have to lock the thread.

Calm Waterfall · Nov 7, 2017

Squarehard said:
In that case, it's just a really poor time to be trying it now.

Why is it a poor time to joke about about that? There's no such thing in comedy. Everything should be made fun of at any time.

Transhuman · Nov 7, 2017

excelsiorlef said:
What censorship?

"A man shouldn't joke about false rape accusations because no-one should acknowledge false rape accusations exist because it's just a patriarchal trick to draw attention away from women".

That censorship.

excelsiorlef · Nov 7, 2017

Transhuman said:
The Harvey Weinstein publicity has emboldened a lot of victims of unreported sexual harassment to come forward, and with all of this happening, if someone were to threaten to falsely accuse a celebrity of rape, the current animosity of the public would make it that much worse for the accused. Not to mention Chris Rock has been accused of rape before. http://gawker.com/5003852/chris-rocks-rape-accusation-phone-call He probably didn't enjoy the experience.

I'm confused earlier you implied somewhat that joke is on Chris Rock for being over the top afraid of false rape accusations and not that women lie about rape... but here you contextualize that a woman could lie about rape and get a celeb in trouble (which is a pretty shitty place to go within the context of what's happening right now) and that he has a very real fear....wouldn't that put it back in the context of his punchline "women cry rape for money"

Transhuman said:
"A man shouldn't joke about false rape accusations because no-one should acknowledge false rape accusations exist because it's just a patriarchal trick to draw attention away from women".

That censorship.

Did I call for legal enforcement against him.

Criticism is not censorship... I have no power to stop him from making that joke... or the next one, or the next after that, saying someone shouldn't do something is not actually censorship.

And the rest is just you reducing my general argument to an absurd strawman.

Yggfk · Nov 7, 2017

Aiii said:
Unless you have some actual sources for this, going "nah, it happens" isn't good enough to support your claim that "a lot of men are scared to talk to women."

To be honest. You shouldn't talk like that at your workplace, period. And I doubt you would unless you know said colleague really well, and you can probably gage what to say and what not to say to a female colleague you know really well just as you would with a male colleague.

Yep. I completely agree. Actually, some sort of commentary should not happen AT ALL. I'm not comfortable when "the boys" in my workplace talk about how some of their women colleagues are hot and what they wish they could do to them. Once I tried to confront them and I was completely ignored, even earning me a nickname; "oooh, here comes the bologna leftist" they say (People who have left wing tendencies are called "bolognas" in Brazil, go figure). This is rape culture at its worst. If losing the "right" to spew this kind of bullshit is what makes them so afraid of talking to women, then they'd do the world a favor by being afraid and shutting the hell up. This shit is so toxic.

Deleted member 9330 · Nov 7, 2017

oldnick said:
a lot of men in the western workplace are legit afraid of interacting with women because of the danger of fake accusations. I think it's way more serious that you guys imagine.

ashep said:
Nah, it happens. It doesn't mean they're right but there are definitely an increasing number of men who think this way.

On one hand, it suggests a heightened awareness of sexual harrassment which is a good thing, but on the other, assuming that false accusations happen on the regs is pretty silly.

This is some next-level FUD

Transhuman · Nov 7, 2017

excelsiorlef said:
I'm confused earlier you implied somewhat that joke is on Chris Rock for being over the top afraid of false rape accusations and not that women lie about rape... but here you contextualize that a woman could lie about rape and get a celeb in trouble (which is a pretty shitty place to go within the context f what's happening right now) and that he has a very real fear....wouldn't that put it back in the context of his punchline "women cry rape for money"

That's not the punchline of the joke, it's the reality the joke is based on.

It is a real fear... not a likely one, like being framed for a murder... but Chris is *so* afraid it will happen he will do anything to prevent it.

That's the joke.

Blader · Nov 7, 2017

Damn, and I have tickets to see him in a few weeks too.

On the other hand, I guess seeing him get booed and people being kicked out would be an interesting show

Cream · Nov 7, 2017

Hey hot take.

If you're a man and you're that scared of false rape accusations, you're a paranoid loser.

Deleted member 1287 · Nov 7, 2017

People are acting like he's testing out fresh, edgy material when this is a tired old joke that should've been retired in 1997

You can tell offensive and dark jokes without diminishing the victims of sexual assault

entremet · Nov 7, 2017

Blader said:
Damn, and I have tickets to see him in a few weeks too.

On the other hand, I guess seeing him get booed and people being kicked out would be an interesting show

He was great with Dave Chapelle at Radio City. Keep the tickets. Him bombing one joke idea doesn't make him a sociopath.

JonJonesateyourbabies · Nov 7, 2017

Shitty comedian tells shitty joke

Kreed · Nov 7, 2017

ZeroX said:
Which is them spreading a story that they didn't need to. This shouldn't be a thing. It wasn't a tour or a Netflix special, it's an environment where recording is strictly prohibited because comics are trying new material. The only person who should have access to any recording is Rock himself, if he wants it.

I agree that "this shouldn't be a thing" in regards to comedians testing their material and second hand accounts on the material becoming a news story without much else, but that's how things work now with social media/etc... Maybe this story won't get to the point where Chris Rock has to respond and he can ignore it, but if audio could reverse the negative reactions to the story before it gets to that point that would ultimately be better.

Ferrs · Nov 7, 2017

Are we really comparing criticism with censorship now?

ashep · Nov 7, 2017

Zeyphersan said:
This is some next-level FUD

It's not really. I mean, it depends on how you interpret "a lot" but there are certainly more men with a heightened sensitivity to this today as opposed to a decade, or even a few years ago.

It's sad that it's a kneejerk reaction based on a false premise but it's a nice change from "I'm a man so I can do/say whatever the fuck I want".

Deleted member 888 · Nov 7, 2017

I've posted that video a few times. You can tell an offensive joke if you set it up well and land it. Sometimes there's some debate on how much time you need to wait after an tradgey/situation before you crack jokes, but good comedians can often work quickly.

Sounds like Rock tried to deliver something and it failed badly. If there was no malice or ill intent, he learns and moves on.

ashep · Nov 7, 2017

Cream said:
Hey hot take.

If you're a man and you're that scared of false rape accusations, you're a paranoid loser.

Hey congrats on figuring out the joke.

Deleted member 9330 · Nov 7, 2017

Ferrs said:
Are we really comparing criticism with censorship now?

You must be new to the internet. Go check out a games forum sometime when Feminist Frequency posts a new video

ZeroX · Nov 7, 2017

Kreed said:
I agree that "this shouldn't be a thing" in regards to comedians testing their material and second hand accounts on the material becoming a news story without much else, but that's how things work now with social media/etc... Maybe this story won't get to the point where Chris Rock has to respond and he can ignore it, but if audio could reverse the negative reactions to the story before it gets to that point that would ultimately be better.

He might have it, could release it if he wants but it should never have to come to that. Maybe it is as bad as people are saying, which I think is also fine assuming Rock isn't trying to sell that material in shows.

Comedian tries material at club drop in. Bombs. It happens every day. And it's the Cellar, most people attending are aware of that. I'm sure media outlets are too. They don't need to fan the flames of a few angry people on social media.

Shelbyville Milhouse · Nov 7, 2017

HAHA
Fucking hilarious
Those krazy women and their rape accusations, I love rape jokes. Always a banger.

AnansiThePersona · Nov 7, 2017

I didn't hear the the joke but goddamn it must of been bad if Chris Rock was booed and walked out on. It sounds like a subject matter that Rock could make a good joke out of, but going by the quotes, needs much more tuning.

Transhuman · Nov 7, 2017

Ferrs said:
Are we really comparing criticism with censorship now?

There are people who believe no variant of the joke is acceptable because any joke mentioning false accusations must be trying to convince the public false accusations are widespread. Earlier someone called Chris Rock a "rape advocate".

These people aren't offering criticism.

necrosis · Nov 7, 2017

808s & Villainy said:
Be honest, you don't watch much comedy, do you? Some jokes fall flat. Some try to tip toe around controversial topics and completely fuck up and end up offensive and unfunny. Claiming a comedian is an "advocate" of something based on a joke is a bit absurd. Dave Chappelle literally joked about what if Michael Jackson sucking dick cured AIDS and how he was a hospitable host at his house. I don't think anyone would think he's advocating child sexual abuse because of that

i watch plenty of comedy

the comedians i watch tend to tell jokes that are actually funny, however, and which don't consist of whining about rape accusations with no punchline

Blader · Nov 7, 2017

entremet said:
He was great with Dave Chapelle at Radio City. Keep the tickets. Him bombing one joke idea doesn't make him a sociopath.

ha, well I wasn't planning on ditching them, especially since part of my Thanksgiving weekend is planned around the show.

Even before this I'd heard some mixed things about his current tour, but good to hear he's still delivering

excelsiorlef · Nov 7, 2017

Transhuman said:
These people aren't offering criticism.

Yes we are, and one person saying something extremism doesn't really make the rest of it not criticism.

36 Chambers · Nov 7, 2017

Id have to see this is context.

Chris delivering it on stage, and not me just reading it in text.

He's a great comedian so Im not gonna judge this outta context

DeathyBoy · Nov 7, 2017

necrosis said:
i watch plenty of comedy

the comedians i watch tend to tell jokes that are actually funny, however, and which don't consist of whining about rape accusations with no punchline

Those funny jokes? Are funny because they worked out the kinks in places like this. I highly doubt this joke gets to any of his specials.

PJV3 · Nov 7, 2017

I don't think any subject is off limits if it is handled properly or is clever enough, it sounds like he is punching down on a group who are currently fighting back, a mixture of weak material and bad timing.

nanskee · Nov 7, 2017

He tried. Could've went with a better joke cause that's something youd hear from a random on the bus and you just pretend to laugh..

Not right timing, that is true, but I'm not sure how you could make it funny in the first place

necrosis · Nov 7, 2017

oldnick said:
a lot of men in the western workplace are legit afraid of interacting with women because of the danger of fake accusations. I think it's way more serious that you guys imagine.

lmfao

if you cant interact with women in the workplace without sexually harassing them then you deserve to be scared

Player 1 · Nov 7, 2017

I'm not offended by any type of jokes because... they are jokes. I'm not a snowflake.

All I can say is that some women do cry rape for money and even revenge.

My best friend got accused of rape back in 2013. His former girlfriend accused him and he could face many, many years in jail but he had an alibi for the day and time and they also found security camera footage that showed that the former girlfriend was walking outside his job on a daily basis stalking him.

She falsely accused him to get revenge because he dumped her and to get some money. In the end she got arrested and sentenced to jail.

Clix · Nov 7, 2017

excelsiorlef said:
People need to stop washing away all responsibility comedians have for the shit they say....

He's just trying out new material... give me a break.

Yeah, that's the way it kinda works. They do smaller acts at clubs to work on material, see what works, what lands, what doesn't, and go from there. It's the way it works.

You may not like it, but that's the way it is and they really don't owe anything to you or have to consider "the climate".

Rackham · Nov 7, 2017

The worst part of that joke is it isn't even original

excelsiorlef · Nov 7, 2017

Transhuman said:
That's not the punchline of the joke, it's the reality the joke is based on.

It is a real fear... not a likely one, like being framed for a murder... but Chris is *so* afraid it will happen he will do anything to prevent it.

That's the joke.

So is it your argument that we're supposed to be laughing at Christ Rock for being so afraid of something rare

Transhuman · Nov 7, 2017

excelsiorlef said:
Yes we are, and one person saying something extremism doesn't really make the rest of it not criticism.

Your criticism is "for the greater good, no comedian should acknowledge that very occassionally women lie about raped. It makes women look bad".

Advocating a subject be completely off-limits because it's obsene to you is you endorsing censorship.

Lenny Bruce is rolling around in his grave, and Harper Lee's decendants are crying because you hate To Kill a Mockingbird. Congratulations.

excelsiorlef said:
So is it your argument that we're supposed to be laughing at Christ Rock for being so afraid of something rare

More laughing at the absurdity and unnecessary complexity he imagines would be necessary too 100% prove his innocence, but basically.

Netherscourge · Nov 7, 2017

Horrible.

To be honest, I haven't found him to be funny in a few years.

These kinds of jokes are a sign of desperation.

PhilosopherDirtBike · Nov 7, 2017

Yikes. Horrible statements, even worse timing.

Dr. Dre's Dr. · Nov 7, 2017

Very very tone deaf. However, comedians are often trying to push the limit with their comedy and Rock is usually one of the major names trying it. This one is a major swing and a miss though. Bad choice Chris.

FormatCompatible · Nov 7, 2017

Player 1 said:
I'm not offended by any type of jokes because... they are jokes. I'm not a snowflake.

All I can say is that some women do cry rape for money and even revenge.

Oh c'mon mate, that's a exception not the rule.

And can we please stop using expressions that are typically used by the alt-right? Thank you.

excelsiorlef · Nov 7, 2017

Transhuman said:
Your criticism is "for the greater good, no comedian should acknowledge that very occassionally women lie about raped. It makes women look bad".

Advocating a subject be completely off-limits because it's obsene to you is you endorsing censorship.

Lenny Bruce is rolling around in his grave, and Harper Lee's decendants are crying because you hate To Kill a Mockingbird. Congratulations.

You're really good at turning my arguments into broad caricatures that don't resemble what I'm actually saying...

But maybe I could have saved the world from Go Set a Watchman

Chris Rock new skit materials: "...won't hire women; 'They cry rape for money'"

何これ

Bad Praxis

user requested account closure

Bad Praxis

User requested account closure

user requested account closure

You wouldn't toast a NES cartridge

The Negro Historian

User requested account closure

User requested account closure

Started a revolution but the mic was unplugged

Bad Praxis

Prophet of Truth

Bad Praxis

One Winged Slayer

Bad Praxis