Chrono Trigger voted the best game of the Heisei era in Famitsu , followed by BOTW and Nier Automata

[Zen Hero]

Why is that arbitrary time frame even relevant here? Obviously games developed a lot over the past 30 years, the fact that they coincide with some other unrelated thing is largely irrelevant to that

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The Heisei era is the reign of a single Japanese emperor. It's just interesting to think he oversaw so much development of the gaming industry. Of course he didn't really do anything and it doesn't really mean much, but it's still fun to think about. I put myself in his shoes, and imagine what it would be like to watch the country develop so much.

 

[Fadewise]

It's like "best game of the 80s", "best game of the 90s", etc.

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Right, but it's a 30 year period that constitutes much of the rise of modern gaming, so it shouldn't be surprising that it cuts a wide swath and encompasses most of the evolution of games....just seems like a meaningless metric when it's that large of span. It inevitably just turns into a "Greatest of All Time" rather than a "greatest of that period" poll.

 

[lowlifelenny]

In no way is CT just "OK" in any way.

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The graphics are very nice and some of the music is great, but by and large I think that Chrono Trigger is just merely OK.

 

[Flevance]

Two of my all time personal top 5, can't agree more with that

Even though I don't agree with Nier being there, still.. I can see the reason for all the love behind it, such as its deep message

 

[Lee Chaolan]

Yep, they got it right. Chrono Trigger is the GOAT.

Those are 3 amazing soundtracks too.

 

[Sumio Mondo]

We're in the minority but I agree. The first game had a bigger impact on me.

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To be fair Automata's fans are incredibly vocal about the game and has a faaaaar bigger fan base so that might be why we're the minority. Ha.

Honestly not exaggerating but NieR changed my life so it's a very important game to me. Not Automata's fault it couldn't meet such lofty standards. Still a good game and all.

 

[ZiggyPalffyLA]

Chrono Trigger is factually the greatest game ever made (and probably ever will be made) and knowing how popular it is in Japan, and that even Sakurai adores it, makes me all the more disappointed that a character like Joker made it into Smash over Crono.

 

[Irikan]

BotW will diminish when Nintendo inevitably make the next Zelda in the same style but better. Automata isn't even better than the original NieR. Outside of combat everything else was better in OG NieR.

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Word. Automata is only better in the graphic and combat department. For everything else, Nier destroys it.

 

[antitrop]

Chrono Trigger is factually the greatest game ever made (and probably ever will be made) and knowing how popular it is in Japan, and that even Sakurai adores it, makes me all the more disappointed that a character like Joker made it into Smash over Crono.

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Nah, it's just a weird American thing.

Americans and their cult obsession over Chrono Trigger will never cease to amaze me

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[Weltall Zero]

Chrono Trigger and Breath of the Wild are each solid contenders for best games of all time. Nier Automata was pretty good, and the music is godly, but I'm not sure it deserves to be mentioned in the same breath (no pun intended) than the other two.

 

[Dreamboum]

Nah, it's just a weird American thing.

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Chrono Trigger being the first in a Japanese poll is not the same thing as folks screaming at every rooftop that Trigger was a revolution for the genre and "factually" the best JRPG to exist. The discourse around CT on the western side is poison.

 

[Soapbox Killer]

I wont argue that.

 

[Crayon]

I take hot on famitsu poll.

Chrono trigger is the spaceballs of rpgs.

 

[Yunyo]

Chrono Trigger being the first in a Japanese poll is not the same thing as folks screaming at every rooftop that Trigger was a revolution for the genre and "factually" the best JRPG to exist. The discourse around CT on the western side is poison.

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More like just a few bad actors. Same for BOTW really.

 

[Bard]

Should have gone to super Metroid.

 

[Ratrat]

Why is that arbitrary time frame even relevant here? Obviously games developed a lot over the past 30 years, the fact that they coincide with some other unrelated thing is largely irrelevant to that

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Eyeball roll. It is relevant to Japan.

A lot of timeframes in your culture may seem arbitrary from the outside. Think before you post.

 

[Weltall Zero]

Depends who you ask. It ranges from hot trash to genre defining must-play.

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So in other words, like every other videogame piece of media ever created. :)

 

[Soapbox Killer]

BOTW is Japan's GTA4

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Fuck Me dead*








*Learned this watching Conan in Australia

 

[kpaadet]

Chrono is a solid pick, I can see an argument being made for BoTW although I would not put it that high. But Automata please that game has so many flaws I wouldn't even put it on a top50 list, and this coming from someone that enjoyed Automata at the time. The music and story is good, but the rest...combat, the world, the RPGlite stuff nah really doesn't belong there.

 

[Deleted member 5535]

Good ranking from the gaming otaku

 

[i'm not a rob0t]

the japanese really love the japanese.

 

[LavaBadger]

Love it. Chrono Trigger remains my favorite game of all time. I haven't played anything as consistently good since playing it as a kid.

 

[Fadewise]

Eyeball roll. It is relevant to Japan.

A lot of timeframes in your culture may seem arbitrary from the outside. Think before you post.

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I'm not saying it's arbitrary to their culture, obviously it has significance. Doesn't change the fact that the scope of the timeframe diminishes the meaningfulness of the poll beyond just "greatest of all time", which is what it clearly has turned into. My initial comment was in response to the notion that "wow, isn't it amazing that almost the entirety of the evolution of modern gaming occured within past 30 year period", which is bordering on a tautology.

 

[ZiZ]

BotW is my pick for GOAT, and I can see CT being up there, but surprised Nier made the list. I liked it but I wouldn't put it anywhere near the top 10.

 

[Ratrat]

I'm not saying it's arbitrary to their culture, obviously it has significance. Doesn't change the fact that the scope of the timeframe diminishes the meaningfulness of the poll beyond just "greatest of all time", which is what it clearly has turned into. My initial comment was in response to the notion that "wow, isn't it amazing that almost the entirety of the evolution of modern gaming occured within past 30 year period", which is bordering on a tautology.

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No, it doesn't. Everything made after it will be in a different era. This has HUGE significance to those in Japan, you know, the place where this pole was made. In Japan, all media including movies, music, games, and books will be divided into these eras like they are by decade. Saying 'Heisei era game' may not carry much meaning now, but it will very soon.

 

[petethepanda]

Can't say I disagree.

 

[Hailinel]

I'm not saying it's arbitrary to their culture, obviously it has significance. Doesn't change the fact that the scope of the timeframe diminishes the meaningfulness of the poll beyond just "greatest of all time", which is what it clearly has turned into. My initial comment was in response to the notion that "wow, isn't it amazing that almost the entirety of the evolution of modern gaming occured within past 30 year period", which is bordering on a tautology.

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Well, this is the dumbest and most ignorant post I'll likely read today.

"Culturally significant touchstone of Japanese society, history, and culture" = "Meaningless tautology"

What the fuck.

 

[Glass Arrows]

This is alright. I'm not as passionate about CT as most people but I understand why it would be number one, so I have no qualms. I haven't played BotW for more than like 2 hours, so I have no opinion on that front.

Automata is definitely a flawed game, but it goes back to something I learned about the original Nier: it's not always about what's "the least flawed", or the most polished or well-rounded, sometimes it's about what's INTERESTING and what speaks to you. There are "better" games than the two Niers in multiple areas, but it's those two games that have stayed with me, flaws and all. I'll never forget when I saw Ending D in the original game, it's one of the few moments in any game that managed to make me cry, I had to go sit down and have a think afterwards. In terms of story and characters (and music) I legitimately prefer them to any Final Fantasy, Chrono, Breath of Fire, Persona, etc. It's true that a lot of fans prefer the first game's story and characters, and I kind of do as well, but Automata has a lot of merit to it and a number of things it does better beyond the gameplay and graphics.

 

[Arthoneceron]

BOTW is Japan's GTA4

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And it seems that RDR 2 is the GTA4 of the late 2010 decade.

Or I understood this whole discussion of Zelda being this, or being that wrong.

 

[Deleted member 15395]

I'm super glad about Automata getting so much recognition. Absolutely deserved and definitely one of the best games of the generation.

BOTW I didn't like but I respect and understand why It got #2 and while I honestly think Cross is the better game, Trigger is to JRPG what Mario is to platformers, so much deserved as well.

 

[Shoozle]

I'm playing Super Mario RPG for the first time as of right now, and I think it could be one of my favourite games of all time, meanwhile I have started Chrono Trigger about 3 different times but never made it far! I'm hoping with SM RPG out of the way, I like CT as much as everyone else seems to but I dunno, the start doesn't hook me.

 

[Deleted member 10629]

Well, this is the dumbest and most ignorant post I'll likely read today.

"Culturally significant touchstone of Japanese society, history, and culture" = "Meaningless tautology"

What the fuck.

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Some people have a hard time thinking outside their surroundings. I read a reply to someone complaining about the Europe's heat wave with something like 'well that's nothing we have it every day in Texas'. Like they couldnt fathom that certain weather conditions can be abnormal in other parts of the world.

 

[Phoenix Splash]

I finished Chrono Trigger for the first time over a year ago and I do think it's the best RPG I've ever played, even by today's standards so I don't feel like I disagree, tbh. Not even nostalgia googles or anything like that.

To me, it was a really well told and paced story. When I played it, unlike most other japanese RPGs, I didn't feel like they were trying to "up my hours played counter" by having me grind or something like that, which is probably one of the reasons why so many people replay it over the years. I didn't really need to grind, at all and yet it still felt like an absolute challenge to me. I remember beating the bosses with just a bit of health left or with only one-two characters alive remaining and no potions left. A very fun, memorable and overall enjoyable journey!

Mitsuda is probably my favorite video game composer too, soooo

Instead of discussing it, I'd like to celebrate the game's greatness so there we go:





Just so awesome. I still gotta play Chrono Cross.

 

[Fadewise]

Well, this is the dumbest and most ignorant post I'll likely read today.

"Culturally significant touchstone of Japanese society, history, and culture" = "Meaningless tautology"

What the fuck.

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The comment I was replying to, specifically the assertion that "Crazy that tech developed all the way from Chrono Trigger to BotW " was a tautology, not the initial poll.

 

[DiipuSurotu]

I think Fadewise's point is that the Heisei era is so long that it encompasses almost all video game history anyway. Kinda like if you were making a poll asking "What's the best game of the Holocene?".

However, the poster is still wrong because Heisei does NOT actually encompasses all video game history, and some of Japan's most popular games do pre-date this era (Super Mario Bros., Dragon Quest III, etc.).

 

[RelaxItsJustMe]

To be fair Automata's fans are incredibly vocal about the game and has a faaaaar bigger fan base so that might be why we're the minority. Ha.

Honestly not exaggerating but NieR changed my life so it's a very important game to me. Not Automata's fault it couldn't meet such lofty standards. Still a good game and all.

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That's because as you said most Nier Automata fans probably haven't played Nier or Drakengard for that matter. The franchise got "big" with Automata and it's really not that easy for those people to go back. I much prefer the story and soundtrack of the original Nier too, but I'd still call Automata a better game. The gameplay in Nier is mediocre at best and I found replaying the game to get all the main endings more tedious than in Automata (playthrough B is from what I remember literally the same as playthrough A but with a cutscene here and there for the bad guys showing they're actually not bad at all. It was even worse than Automata's much dreaded playthrough B to me). Alongside some things like the text only novels really dragging out.

That being said the story of Nier also had a much bigger impact on me and I'd put it leaps and bounds ahead of Automata. But a story isn't everything in a game and there's other things to factor in too.

 

[Hesemonni]

Nier: Automata deserves all the praise it receives.

 

[Glass Arrows]

That's because as you said most Nier Automata fans probably haven't played Nier or Drakengard for that matter. The franchise got "big" with Automata and it's really not that easy for those people to go back. I much prefer the story and soundtrack of the original Nier too, but I'd still call Automata a better game. The gameplay in Nier is mediocre at best and I found replaying the game to get all the main endings more tedious than in Automata (playthrough B is from what I remember literally the same as playthrough A but with a cutscene here and there for the bad guys showing they're actually not bad at all. It was even worse than Automata's much dreaded playthrough B to me). Alongside some things like the text only novels really dragging out.

That being said the story of Nier also had a much bigger impact on me and I'd put it leaps and bounds ahead of Automata. But a story isn't everything in a game and there's other things to factor in too.

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I think the NG+ implementation in the original Nier is both better and worse.

What you said about the cutscenes with the Shades is technically true, but those cutscenes are a lot more impactful towards the story and the player's perception of events compared to Automata's playthrough B, which doesn't drop significant bombshells until near the end. And this is coming from someone who didn't mind Route B all that much (I especially enjoyed Simone's backstory).

On the other hand, Automata's route C is way more significant than playthrough B in og Nier because it adds new areas and considerably more story by continuing the events of the first playthrough.

I guess in summation, the issue is that Automata does a lot more but it takes longer to get to the "good" part. But one thing Automata also does a lot better is the chapter select. Getting endings C and D in Gestalt was incredibly tedious because you needed to play through the second half of the game a THIRD time and without any new stuff until literally the end. Whereas in Automata once you get ending C you can just quickly reload and get endings D and E no problem.

 

[PrimeBeef]

Nier Automata as a whole is maybe 25 hours long (including the chapter A, the "replay" that is chapter B, and the conclusion that is chapter C/D/E). Compared to most RPGs, that's not much of a time commitment.

And as a piece of art, as a commentary on the medium of video gaming, it's absolutely worth it, regardless of any debate about plot or characters.

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I can usually handle a game with bad story, characters I don't care for if I like the game play. For the first game the gameplay was so bad to me it wasn't worth it at all to even finish it the first go around. For Automata, the gameplay was definitely better, but I just didn't like like it. I don't care what it has to say, if I don't like playing the game, the game is not worth it to me.

 

[Deleted member 925]

Well, this is the dumbest and most ignorant post I'll likely read today.

"Culturally significant touchstone of Japanese society, history, and culture" = "Meaningless tautology"

What the fuck.

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Best to just ignore that clown.

 

[stan_marsh]

Nier: Automata deserves all the praise it receives.

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GOTG

 

[RelaxItsJustMe]

I think the NG+ implementation in the original Nier is both better and worse.

What you said about the cutscenes with the Shades is technically true, but those cutscenes are a lot more impactful towards the story and the player's perception of events compared to Automata's playthrough B, which doesn't drop significant bombshells until near the end. And this is coming from someone who didn't mind Route B all that much (I especially enjoyed Simone's backstory).

On the other hand, Automata's route C is way more significant than playthrough B in og Nier because it adds new areas and considerably more story by continuing the events of the first playthrough.

I guess in summation, the issue is that Automata does a lot more but it takes longer to get to the "good" part. But one thing Automata also does a lot better is the chapter select. Getting endings C and D in Gestalt was incredibly tedious because you needed to play through the second half of the game a THIRD time and without any new stuff until literally the end. Whereas in Automata once you get ending C you can just quickly reload and get endings D and E no problem.

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That's part of why I said getting all the endings in Nier felt much more tedious than in Automata. And I do agree that the new cutscenes in playthrough B in Nier are definitely a lot more impactful than honestly anything in playthrough B of Automata yeah. But I really wouldn't be able to fault anyone getting really bored in playthrough B when it is for all intents and purposes 99% the same as playthrough A (again to my knowledge, it's been quite a long time since I played it) with the sole exception being the cutscenes showing the shades. But those cutscenes were as you said absolutely incredible. The thing I really like the most about Nier compared to Automata is

Spoiler: gestalt spoilers

how you are clearly the bad guy. In Automata they showed you that nobody really was the bad guy. But in Nier you are straight up the bad guy and the cutscenes from B really showed that. I thought it was amazing seeing your perception change from a good guy saving the world, to clearly a bad guy destroying everything in his path out of selfishness. It's like how a lot of people call Joel evil but then pushed from 1 all the way to 11.

 

[Deleted member 8860]

.

I can usually handle a game with bad story, characters I don't care for if I like the game play. For the first game the gameplay was so bad to me it wasn't worth it at all to even finish it the first go around. For Automata, the gameplay was definitely better, but I just didn't like like it. I don't care what it has to say, if I don't like playing the game, the game is not worth it to me.

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Different strokes and all, but I find Nier Automata to easily have the best gameplay of any RPG ever created.

Obviously character-action-style combat (and super-fast, agile movement) is not for everyone.

 

[Fadewise]

I think Fadewise's point is that the Heisei era is so long that it encompasses almost all video game history anyway. Kinda like if you were making a poll asking "What's the best game of the Holocene?".

However, the poster is still wrong because Heisei does NOT actually encompasses all video game history, and some of Japan's most popular games do pre-date this era (Super Mario Bros., Dragon Quest III, etc.).

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Yes, we're arguing past each other at this point; i was commenting solely on the original assertion that it's noteworthy that video games have evolved from from Chrono Trigger to Breath of the Wild over the past 30 years (because of course they have), nor about whether or not that constitutes the entire of video game history nor about whether or not that represents a cultural marker in Japan.

 

[Deleted member 13155]

CT is really good. It had great pacing, wasn't too long, fast and fun battles, good score, good story... overall its a perfect RPG to get into and it holds up well because it plays so fluent still. I have issues getting back into FFVI because of the random encounter rate, dungeon design and everything but no problem with CT.

 

[Fadewise]

This has HUGE significance to those in Japan, you know, the place where this pole was made. In Japan, all media including movies, music, games, and books will be divided into these eras like they are by decade. Saying 'Heisei era game' may not carry much meaning now, but it will very soon.

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This is a good point from a broader academic and historical perspective, but it also proves my point as to how arbitrary a metric that is. Would you really argue that the original Final Fantasy has more in common with Computer Space than it does with Chrono Trigger just because the first two were created during the Shōwa era? Those types of epochal distinctions only make contextual sense when they bring meaningful information to the conversation, which becomes less and less useful the larger the time frame used to define them is.

 

[JD_Lars]

Should have gone to super Metroid.

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Japan has never really had much love for the Metroid series. The only reason they keep making those games is because the West adores them and they sell well over here. That's probably why they gave the license over to Retro Studios like "You guys are Western, so you should be able to figure out why people over there love this stuff, because we don't get it".

 

[Deleted member 18161]

The first part of your post was excellent, and then it went downhill fast. In no way is CT just "OK" in any way.

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The first part of the post was just as bad as the rest of the shitpost.

A great top three games. Is there a top ten or just top three?

 

[Dekuman]

Great choices. I love both dearly.

 

[pikachief]

Nier's gameplay isn't lacking? That's not even an uncommon criticism. The combat customization with the chips was cool, but I wouldn't say it makes actually fighting enemies that much more special. The game is basically Bayonetta/MGR but super dumbed down mechanically. I enjoyed everything else about it, and I'm waiting with bated breath for a sequel.

I didn't play CT until it released on the DS, so I was kind of spoiled playing so many better RPGs beforehand. I guess it's just weird when others see you don't have an opinion clouded by nostalgia hahaha :-)

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I doubt nostalgia is the entire reaskn for its praise. I also did not play it till DS and I still think its the best game ever made.