Clotilda wreck: 'Last US slave ship' found in Alabama

JonnyDBrit · May 23, 2019

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-48377930

The last ship known to have smuggled slaves from Africa to the US is said to have been discovered after a year-long investigation.

"The discovery of the Clotilda is an extraordinary archaeological find," Lisa Demetropoulos Jones, executive director of the Alabama Historical Commission (AHC), told the Associated Press (AP) news agency.

The ship's journey "represented one of the darkest eras of modern history" and the wreck provides "tangible evidence of slavery", she said.

The Clotilda was discovered by archaeology firm company Search Inc, which was called in to help by the Alabama Historical Commission to investigate the hulk, says the National Geographic Society, which reported the find.

Researchers discovered a ship with its identifying features under water in a section of the Mobile river, says National Geographic.

The dimensions and construction of the wreck matched those of the Clotilda, as did building materials, the commission said.

Given that interview from a survivor which surfaced last year, I thought some here would be interested. Also something else sordid out of Alabama to talk about.

Kalentan · May 23, 2019

Is there any pictures of what they found?

Son Lamar · May 23, 2019

BRUH ALABAMA HAS NEVER BEEN MORE FAMOUS IN MY LIFE AND WE ON A ROLL

Fuck Alabama

BringBackSonics · May 23, 2019

That is crazy that they found the wreck in the River. Its been sitting there for 200+ years?

Walter White Walker · May 23, 2019

Kalentan said:
Is there any pictures of what they found?

190522-clotilda-africatown-last-slave-ship-ac-2018-801p_231d99b106c9450ffef4d85b8bf3d264.nbcnews-fp-1024-512.jpg

kVH2LpZd · May 23, 2019

JonnyDBrit said:
and the wreck provides "tangible evidence of slavery", she said.

Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

Scarecrow · May 23, 2019

Tomorrow: Alabama to recommission wrecked Clotilda ship

ParanormalFupa · May 23, 2019

Wow! I remember learning about this from Finding Your Roots on PBS. Questlove's fam was on that ship.

Sunster · May 23, 2019

Firokese said:
Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

It's Alabama, I guarantee there are people there that do.

LegendofJoe · May 23, 2019

BringBackSonics said:
That is crazy that they found the wreck in the River. Its been sitting there for 200+ years?

159 years, it was burned to get rid of the evidence because the importation of slaves was banned in the early 1800's (over 50 years prior).

808s & Villainy · May 23, 2019

Firokese said:
Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

I don't even know what to think anymore

collige · May 23, 2019

Firokese said:
Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

There's a classic thread on GAF involving just this actually (The Lionel Mandrake summary at the end links to all the crazy bits)

Ms.Galaxy · May 23, 2019

Firokese said:
Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

Space Moors.

collige said:
There's a classic thread on GAF involving just this actually

There we go, that's the thread.

Yasuke · May 23, 2019

Talked about this with one of my cousins last year, when they'd started looking.

This is like, a mile away from where my grandmother lives.

Rover · May 23, 2019

Firokese said:
Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

Well...

JonnyDBrit · May 23, 2019

BringBackSonics said:
That is crazy that they found the wreck in the River. Its been sitting there for 200+ years?

150-ish. The Clotilda operated in the 1860s.

Deleted member 1086 · May 23, 2019

collige said:
There's a classic thread on GAF involving just this actually

holy cow

Joe · May 23, 2019

collige said:
There's a classic thread on GAF involving just this actually

First thing this thread made me think of lol

Powdered Egg · May 23, 2019

Firokese said:
Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

Phew! I was on the fence of whether or not my white DNA was consensual. This discovery finally proves slavery happened!

Nacho Papi · May 23, 2019

collige said:
There's a classic thread on GAF involving just this actually

Off topic:

Fuck...everytime I somehow, be it by accident or morbid curiosity, I end up on that site I have a quick glance at things...I don't understand how it has been cultivated into the absolute cesspool that it is now. Like where the hell did everyone come from? Anyways, fuck it.

BringBackSonics · May 23, 2019

LegendofJoe said:
159 years, it was burned to get rid of the evidence because the importation of slaves was banned in the early 1800's (over 50 years prior).

JonnyDBrit said:
150-ish. The Clotilda operated in the 1860s.

Wow. Thanks for clearing that up.

Dark period in our countries time for sure.

Savinowned · May 23, 2019

Rover said:
Well...

Is this sketchy because is uses the term "workers" rather than saying something like "colonists forced millions of innocent Africans to work on their plantations"?

JonnyDBrit · May 23, 2019

Savinowned said:
Is this sketchy because is uses the term "workers" rather than saying something like "colonists forced millions of innocent Africans to work on their plantations"?

Yeah, it was accused of downplaying the whole 'forced labour' aspect of things by making it seems like people had come along willingly.

Jesse_and_the_rippers · May 23, 2019

Firokese said:
Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

I think it's suggesting that the boat itself has evidence of slavery, which is further proof it's the Clotilda.

IggyChooChoo · May 23, 2019

Rover said:
Well...

That shitty Texas (?) textbook is even wrong about the numbers. The slave trade brought under half a million slaves to the American South. Most slaves were sent to far more lucrative and more lethal work in the sugar colonies of the Caribbean and Brazil.

https://www.pbs.org/wnet/african-am...oss/history/how-many-slaves-landed-in-the-us/

There did come to be millions of slaves in the US, but it wasn't because they were brought over; it was because cotton and tobacco plantations were relatively less lethal than sugar plantations.

J-Skee · May 23, 2019

Firokese said:
Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

....if this is an actual thing, that people don't think slavery actually happened, I'll.... I... I don't even know, man.

IggyChooChoo · May 23, 2019

J-Skee said:
....if this is an actual thing, that people don't think slavery actually happened, I'll.... I... I don't even know, man.

I have not encountered people arguing slavery didn't happen, but there have been variations of the argument that slavery was a good deal for the slaves continuously for the past 400 years, from Virginia planters of the 1600s to the alt-right and "race realists" of today. I wouldn't be surprised if Joe Rogan's already had a podcast with them.

Greg NYC3 · May 23, 2019

IggyChooChoo said:
That shitty Texas (?) textbook is even wrong about the numbers. The slave trade brought under half a million slaves to the American South. Most slaves were sent to far more lucrative and more lethal work in the sugar colonies of the Caribbean and Brazil.

https://www.pbs.org/wnet/african-am...oss/history/how-many-slaves-landed-in-the-us/

There did come to be millions of slaves in the US, but it wasn't because they were brought over; it was because cotton and tobacco plantations were relatively less lethal than sugar plantations.

This is misleading. It's saying that's how many slaves were brought directly to the US but the vast majority of US slaves were taken to Jamaica first and then brought to the US in the Triangle Trade. Slaves were smuggled here directly after Britain banned slavery in it's colonies which ended the Triangle Trade.

Powdered Egg · May 23, 2019

J-Skee said:
....if this is an actual thing, that people don't think slavery actually happened, I'll.... I... I don't even know, man.

"Black people were better off under slavery, they had free housing and free food" -- this thought is more popular than it needs to be.

IggyChooChoo · May 23, 2019

Greg NYC3 said:
This is misleading. It's saying that's how many slaves were brought directly to the US but the vast majority of US slaves were taken to Jamaica first and then brought to the US in the Triangle Trade. Slaves were smuggled here directly after Britain banned slavery in it's colonies which ended the Triangle Trade.

I don't think it is misleading. If you have better figures on slave importation to the American South, please do share them.

I am no expert, and it has been a while, but in my college history class on slavery in the new world, I distinctly remember the professor saying the American South received under half a million slaves total — in part due to slavery being more sustainable (I know) in tobacco/cotton plantations, which reduced demand; and partly because those plantation owners had less money to spend compared to the sugar plantations.

SteelBeast6Beets · May 23, 2019

Powdered Egg said:
"Black people were better off under slavery, they had free housing and free food" -- this thought is more popular than it needs to be.

Pretty sure that I recall Uncle Ruckus from The Boondocks singing about that.

TalonJH · May 23, 2019

Firokese said:
Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

I kind of thought this as well when I read that line. I assume they just mean something that still physically exist but there are still plantations and old slave houses dotting the south so it was a strange line.

Ensorcell · May 23, 2019

The timing is just too coincidental.

PHOENIXZERO · May 23, 2019

Firokese said:
Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

I'm pretty sure she was talking about the remains of the ship.

Euler.L. · May 23, 2019

Firokese said:
Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

No, but evidences that the wreck was indeed a slave ship are relevant.

Sparkedglory2 · May 23, 2019

LegendofJoe said:
159 years, it was burned to get rid of the evidence because the importation of slaves was banned in the early 1800's (over 50 years prior).

Oh they burned it? Guess we need to finish the job

Soundscream · May 23, 2019

Firokese said:
Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

Years ago comidan Faizon Love was on the show dinner for five and said he didn't believe slavery happened because there were no slave ships still around.

Stinkles · May 23, 2019

Firokese said:
Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

I mean there are reams of court and financial documents listing who owned who and what kind of tortures were used. I don't think a single Alabama politician would try to go full flat earth on it but no doubt a few citizens are into total denial.

Actually I realize I am giving them too much credit but I'm scared to google it.

platocplx · May 23, 2019

JonnyDBrit said:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-48377930

Given that interview from a survivor which surfaced last year, I thought some here would be interested. Also something else sordid out of Alabama to talk about.

It's an excellent book. Called barracoon by zara neale Hurston. Really details just how Ugly slavery was.

Teh_Lurv · May 23, 2019

Firokese said:
Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

Sadly, your question isn't too far off the mark. There are taxpayer-funded Confederate history sites across the south that present a distorted and sanitized version of the pre-Civil War South.

IggyChooChoo · May 23, 2019

Stinkles said:
I mean there are reams of court and financial documents listing who owned who and what kind of tortures were used. I don't think a single Alabama politician would try to go full flat earth on it but no doubt a few citizens are into total denial.

Actually I realize I am giving them too much credit but I'm scared to google it.

I think the "we were good to our slaves/treated our slaves like family" is the most common form that Southern denialism takes.

Powdered Egg · May 23, 2019

IggyChooChoo said:
I think the "we were good to our slaves/treated our slaves like family" is the most common form that Southern denialism takes.

"We treat our slaves like family!"

*rides carriage to go purchase nigg3rskin shoes*

Prolepro · May 23, 2019

collige said:
There's a classic thread on GAF involving just this actually (The Lionel Mandrake summary at the end links to all the crazy bits)

What in tarnation

Melody Shreds · May 23, 2019

Firokese said:
Does that suggest anyone was doubting the existence of the practice before?

Space Moors.

Damn, beaten.

Charcoal · May 23, 2019

How big was this ship? The pictures posted earlier make it look like a row boat.

Necromanti · May 23, 2019

I was half-expecting it to be a recent wreck.

Inugami · May 24, 2019

Something important to take away from this find...

https://www.cnn.com/2019/05/23/us/clotilda-last-slave-ship-trnd/index.html

Many of the ship's slaves, freed five years later at the end of the Civil War, settled a community north of downtown Mobile that became known as Africatown. Some descendants of the original slaves still live in the area. Now that the ship has been found, the descendants will be consulted on decisions about its future.

"This would have obvious impacts on them, and we would work with them to get a sense of their feelings, what they would like to see occur with the site, and have them involved in the research as much as they would like to be," Gregory D. Cook, an assistant professor of maritime archaeology at the University of West Florida, told CNN last year.

The researchers are making sure that known descendants are aware of this find, and at the very least talking to them.

Clotilda wreck: 'Last US slave ship' found in Alabama

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