CNN: Parents want custody to stop transgender teen having hormone treatment

Shuri · Feb 13, 2018

Source: https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/13/health/transgender-teen-medical-custody-fight/index.html

(CNN)An Ohio court will decide the fate of a transgender teen who is in what the judge describes as a "gut-wrenching situation."

The 17-year-old identifies as a boy. Neither he nor his family can be named, according to court instructions. The teen's parents want court authority to stop their child from getting the treatment and therapy that was recommended by his medical team in what it characterizes as a possible life-or-death situation.
Medical experts testified that the father's ongoing refusal to call the child by his chosen name and the parents' rejection of the teen's gender identity have triggered suicidal feelings.

The teen was hospitalized in 2016. He has been diagnosed with depression, an anxiety disorder and gender dysphoria, according to court records. Gender dysphoria is a psychiatric diagnosis the American Psychiatric Association defines as "a conflict between a person's physical or assigned gender and the gender with which he/she/they identify."

The teen is in the temporary legal custody of Hamilton County Job and Family Services and lives with his maternal grandparents, who want custody and are supportive of the teen's gender identity. He wants to stay with them.
https://www.cnn.com/2017/12/29/politics/us-military-transgender-trump-service-courts/index.html
The teen's court-appointed guardian believes that the grandparents, not the parents, should have custody and says they are best suited to help the child.

According to a transcript of closing arguments, the grandparents said they are prepared to make medical decisions with the child, which may include starting hormone therapy.

"We think the grandparents are the ones who have an open mind and will ... make this sort of decision best for the child," argued attorney Paul Hunt, who represents the guardian ad litem, or the child's court-appointed guardian. "The parents have clearly indicated that they're not open to it."

Thumbs up to the grandparents for supporting their grandson!

chefbags · Feb 13, 2018

Damn when the OG parents know what's up.

Good on them!

The actual parents suck though and just close minded af.

Heckler456 · Feb 13, 2018

Tangentially related: How often does it occur that someone in this situation regrets getting the surgery or gender treatment?

Ignatz Mouse · Feb 13, 2018

If the kid is 17, can't he choose to stay with his grandparents?

Blue Sky Noise · Feb 13, 2018

trash 'i know better than trained medical health professionals' parents
kid is 17, give him a fighting chance at living a happy life you miserable fucks

bionic77 · Feb 13, 2018

What a horrible story.

Man I feel for that kid. What a horrible feeling to not be loved or accepted by your parents.

Hollywood Duo · Feb 13, 2018

Ignatz Mouse said:
If the kid is 17, can't he choose to stay with his grandparents?

Have to wait til 18.

deepFlaw · Feb 13, 2018

It’s worth looking at the full article, in that his parents are even worse than they seem just based on this excerpt, wow.

Heckler456 said:
Tangentially related: How often does it occur that someone in this situation regrets getting the surgery or gender treatment?

I’m sure someone can bring up stats, but though it does sometimes happen, it’s not that significant and probably not a concern when his dysphoria is affecting him to this degree.

Also, someone can probably clarify, but since he’s 17, would “treatment” in this case even be testosterone, or just hormone blockers?

theinternetman · Feb 13, 2018

Do the parents have to pay for the treatment? How does the kid pay for everything in a situation like this?

Platy · Feb 13, 2018

I don't understand what is the problem .... WHY would they give the kid to the dad?

Heckler456 said:
Tangentially related: How often does it occur that someone in this situation regrets getting the surgery or gender treatment?

Less than people regretting other stuff like ... appendicitis

SilentRob · Feb 13, 2018

Shuri said:
The teen's parents want court authority to stop their child from getting the treatment and therapy that was recommended by his medical team in what it characterizes as a possible life-or-death situation.

Case closed, nothing more to say here. Fuck those transphobic parents.

Just_a_Mouse · Feb 13, 2018

17 years is old enough that the parents should not be allowed to have any say in the matter. The medical team has spoken, fuck the parents for trying to interfere.

HStallion · Feb 13, 2018

Parents sound like they're trying to kill their kid with all the shit they're putting him through. Good on the grand parents.

Krejlooc · Feb 13, 2018

Platy said:
Less than people regretting other stuff like ... appendicitis

Are there seriously people who regret having an appendectomy?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ · Feb 13, 2018

Garbage ass parents, on the plus side 18 is around the corner and the parents can fuck right off.

Son Lamar · Feb 13, 2018

Shuri said:
Source: https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/13/health/transgender-teen-medical-custody-fight/index.html

Thumbs up to the grandparents for supporting their grandson!

Wow the grandparents are the open minded ones lol that’s great

I hope it all works out for him with that being said I hope I’m not speaking out of turn I do believe they should wait until they are 18 to do this simply because it’s so life changing it’s not something that one can take back , with that being said 17 is close enough
And
Shame on the parents I’m sure they coulda came up with a compromise with him agree maybe to wait until 18 and actually treat him as a male and not be dicks but I’m failing to understand the point of this lol like he gonna be 18 soon enough so what’s the point to delay for a year just to be controlling and vindictive?

Deleted member 15737 · Feb 13, 2018

The 0arents going through all this trouble to show theit hatred when they will have no say in less than a year.

Good on the grandparents.

Son Lamar · Feb 13, 2018

HStallion said:
Parents sound like they're trying to kill their kid with all the shit they're putting him through. Good on the grand parents.

I truly believe that’s the point drive him to kill himself before he starts treatment

HStallion · Feb 13, 2018

Nicktals said:
The 0arents going through all this trouble to show theit hatred when they will have no say in less than a year.

Good on the grandparents.

Not to mention they don't seem to care that it will drive their own child to suicide. What the fuck

RationalGinger · Feb 13, 2018

Just_a_Mouse said:
17 years is old enough that the parents should not be allowed to have any say in the matter. The medical team has spoken, fuck the parents for trying to interfere.

Eh, 17 year olds can be really stupid. In this case however the medical professionals have diagnosed the teen with this problem; and the parents' refusal to help their child means I'm all for the grandparents taking over.

Deleted member 4367 · Feb 13, 2018

HStallion said:
Parents sound like they're trying to kill their kid with all the shit they're putting him through. Good on the grand parents.

I'm guessing they would prefer him dead than alive and embarrassing them. It's just so horrible what parents can do to their children by withholding love and support.

Kmonk · Feb 13, 2018

Saw the thread title, and knew that this could have totally opposite outcomes depending on which state it was in.

It's a little crazy how much different your life can be, based on where in the US you're born.

Kylac · Feb 13, 2018

Can't treat a 17 year old as an adult when it comes to a medical case but there's no problem trying 14 years as adults in criminal cases. Hopefully he can make it until he is 18.

captive · Feb 13, 2018

my wife works in mental health specifically eating disorders and its really amazing how often she sees teens and then meets the parents in discussion and or family therapy and its clear that the kid is fucked up mostly because of the parents.

Platy · Feb 13, 2018

Krejlooc said:
Are there seriously people who regret having an appendectomy?

There is a minimal regret % of every medical procedure. Even with uncommon complications excluded.

Krejlooc · Feb 13, 2018

Platy said:
There is a minimal regret % of every medical procedure. Even with uncommon complications excluded.

That is insane to me, aren't most appendectomies not by choice?

deepFlaw · Feb 13, 2018

Krejlooc said:
That is insane to me, aren't most appendectomies not by choice?

I guess the argument would be that there’s people who don’t believe in certain medical procedures and so would regret being forced to have it? And so on.

That’s only explanation that I can guess at.

KDR_11k · Feb 13, 2018

Heckler456 said:
Tangentially related: How often does it occur that someone in this situation regrets getting the surgery or gender treatment?

Considering dysphoria is a condition that makes you go insane if you don't obey it and cannot be gotten rid of I don't think any dysphorics regret that change.

Platy · Feb 13, 2018

Krejlooc said:
That is insane to me, aren't most appendectomies not by choice?

But they leave scars and affects other stuff and I don't know "if I took more pills it would not needed the surgery"
Could not find an article about appendectomies specifically (most surgerical regrets don't sell as many newspapers or helps agendas as the insanely rare trans regrets) but here is an article about regrets in Prostate CANCER surgeries

Geirskogul · Feb 13, 2018

Heckler456 said:
Tangentially related: How often does it occur that someone in this situation regrets getting the surgery or gender treatment?

Nowhere near as high as the regret of not getting treatment done earlier when it would have been most effective. The changes of puberty cannot be reversed, and equally important, by not allowing trans youth access to treatment and not allowing them to express their true selves you're forcing them to spend some of the most important developmental and formative years suffering in the closet, which causes serious psychological harm.

As someone who waited too late to start their own transition and will likely be dead in short time as a result , I just want to offer a huge FUCK YOU to anyone who thinks it's justified in any way to deny treatment to trans kids and teens.

Deleted member 4413 · Feb 13, 2018

Parents are literally trying to kill their child. Fuck em.

18 is sooo close and it seems like his grandparents are awesome. Just hang in there a little longer.

Ketkat · Feb 13, 2018

Son Lamar said:
Wow the grandparents are the open minded ones lol that’s great

I hope it all works out for him with that being said I hope I’m not speaking out of turn I do believe they should wait until they are 18 to do this simply because it’s so life changing it’s not something that one can take back , with that being said 17 is close enough
And
Shame on the parents I’m sure they coulda came up with a compromise with him agree maybe to wait until 18 and actually treat him as a male and not be dicks but I’m failing to understand the point of this lol like he gonna be 18 soon enough so what’s the point to delay for a year just to be controlling and vindictive?

You actually are missing the point if you think that people should wait until 18 before starting this. Gender dysphoria is crushing and being forced to go through the wrong puberty can destroy mental health to the point of it being a mental health crisis. No matter what choice is made, irreversible changes will happen. You're just making a decision based on ignorance of how it works.
FYI, people can discover that they're trans pretty early on.

This doesn't necessarily mean that people are questioning for a much longer time either. For me, I knew I wanted to be a girl by the time I was 8. But growing up in the 90's, I didn't even know trans people even existed until I was 13 or so.

Codeblue · Feb 13, 2018

Platy said:
But they leave scars and affects other stuff and I don't know "if I took more pills it would not needed the surgery"
Could not find an article about appendectomies specifically (most surgerical regrets don't sell as many newspapers or helps agendas as the insanely rare trans regrets) but here is an article about regrets in Prostate CANCER surgeries

Not super familiar with appendectomies, but I've also seen people blame beneficial procedures for other health issues that happen to pop up after the time of surgery.

RDreamer · Feb 13, 2018

Ketkat said:
FYI, people can discover that they're trans pretty early on.

Not only can people discover it but it's not like it's something they just go do on their own. Doctors assess them! This treatment was recommended by a medical team!

Wonder if people seem to think we should wait until 18 for all medical procedures?

Volimar · Feb 13, 2018

Honestly pleasantly surprised that Hamilton County is dealing with this as delicately as it is. Also, props to the grandparents for being more open minded than the father. I guess the older generation isn't so bad after all. Hope he gets to be with them and gets to start hormone therapy soon.

Geirskogul · Feb 13, 2018

Son Lamar said:
I do believe they should wait until they are 18 to do this simply because it’s so life changing it’s not something that one can take back , with that being said 17 is close enough

"We should not allow trans kids to go through a desired and recommended medical treatment because it produces irreversible desired changes that they might regret, but we should also simultaneously force them to endure irreversible, unwanted changes from puberty that they are guaranteed to regret"

Fuck You

The blood of all the Trans kids who kill themselves because they cant get treatment is on your hands and the hands of all the other assholes who think its appropriate to deny medical treatment for a life-threatening condition because "lol it's just a phase".

Volimar · Feb 13, 2018

Ketkat said:
You actually are missing the point if you think that people should wait until 18 before starting this. Gender dysphoria is crushing and being forced to go through the wrong puberty can destroy mental health to the point of it being a mental health crisis. No matter what choice is made, irreversible changes will happen. You're just making a decision based on ignorance of how it works.
FYI, people can discover that they're trans pretty early on.

Forgive my ignorance, but would you say it's harder to go through the therapy as a teen with the therapy hormones fighting the puberty hormones? Not that that would be an excuse to delay it. I'm completely in favor of the boy being able to start therapy as soon as he and his therapists agree it is safe, just wondering from a biochemical standpoint.

Luchashaq · Feb 13, 2018

Codeblue said:
Not super familiar with appendectomies, but I've also seen people blame beneficial procedures for other health issues that happen to pop up after the time of surgery.

Not to mention a hospital stay for an appendectomy can be 100k+ and completely destroy a family's future. (MERICA!)

Geirskogul · Feb 13, 2018

Volimar said:
Forgive my ignorance, but would you say it's harder to go through the therapy as a teen with the therapy hormones fighting the puberty hormones? Not that that would be an excuse to delay it. I'm completely in favor of the boy being able to start therapy as soon as he and his therapists agree it is safe, just wondering from a biochemical standpoint.

No. Your body's naturally produced sex hormones are easily blocked with medication. For optimal results the earlier you start the better.

The treatment is considerably less effective the older you are.

Volimar · Feb 13, 2018

Geirskogul said:
No. Your body's naturally produced sex hormones are easily blocked with medication. For optimal results the earlier you start the better.

The treatment is considerably less effective the older you are.

Oh that's great to hear. I was worried because you always hear how rough puberty hormones can be. It's heartening to hear that they're not much of an issue.

Son Lamar · Feb 13, 2018

Ketkat said:
You actually are missing the point if you think that people should wait until 18 before starting this. Gender dysphoria is crushing and being forced to go through the wrong puberty can destroy mental health to the point of it being a mental health crisis. No matter what choice is made, irreversible changes will happen. You're just making a decision based on ignorance of how it works.
FYI, people can discover that they're trans pretty early on.

This doesn't necessarily mean that people are questioning for a much longer time either. For me, I knew I wanted to be a girl by the time I was 8. But growing up in the 90's, I didn't even know trans people even existed until I was 13 or so.

Again I was genuinely asking a question this attacking needs to chill in no way did I come off as belittling or anything clearly I agree the kid should do it based on the very post you quoted but I see I know a lot of people know at a younger again I’m just saying it shouldn’t be rushed into the parents

Chose not to at the very least call him by that gender I’m saying
Hmm actual ima drop this don’t want to be banned

Geirskogul said:
"We should not allow trans kids to go through a desired and recommended medical treatment because it produces irreversible desired changes that they might regret, but we should also simultaneously force them to endure irreversible, unwanted changes from puberty that they are guaranteed to regret"

Fuck You

The blood of all the Trans kids who kill themselves because they cant get treatment is on your hands and the hands of all the other assholes who think its appropriate to deny medical treatment for a life-threatening condition because "lol it's just a phase".

Again same to you don’t attack me I was asking a question i genuinely don’t know I don’t know any trans people personally but I don’t agree with how people treat them and again clearly I was in agreement with the kid so again don’t attack me grow up , this was a chance to educate one on the matter

But again I ageee with the kid like I said and think his parents are monsters

Ps: right back at ya

Kirblar · Feb 13, 2018

Heckler456 said:
Tangentially related: How often does it occur that someone in this situation regrets getting the surgery or gender treatment?

It can happen, but normally it's never going to get to surgery because if it's not actually gender dysphoria the hormone change is not going to feel very good and they're going to figure it out before that point.

Mammoth Jones · Feb 13, 2018

17 years old is old enough to make this decision for oneself.

Ketkat · Feb 13, 2018

Volimar said:
Forgive my ignorance, but would you say it's harder to go through the therapy as a teen with the therapy hormones fighting the puberty hormones? Not that that would be an excuse to delay it. I'm completely in favor of the boy being able to start therapy as soon as he and his therapists agree it is safe, just wondering from a biochemical standpoint.

I don't know the specifics of the differing hormone levels between puberty and not puberty, but worst case, they would just have to go on a slightly higher dose of blockers. The medications are surprisingly effective at cutting down on the hormones you don't want in your body.

Son Lamar said:
Again I was genuinely asking a question this attacking needs to chill in no way did I come off as belittling or anything clearly I agree the kid should do it based on the very post you quoted

Sorry, I wasn't trying to come off as attacking you. I know its a situation where people are wary to let teenagers go through with it. We just need to keep in mind that they'll be going through a puberty that causes changes either way. We should make sure that its the right one to make the rest of their life easier.

SmokingBun · Feb 13, 2018

If the courts decide to rule in favor of the parents; I must ask one question, "What if it was chemotherapy or something else? Would you let the child suffer with cancer because his parents want to pray it away?"

Son Lamar · Feb 13, 2018

Ketkat said:
I don't know the specifics of the differing hormone levels between puberty and not puberty, but worst case, they would just have to go on a slightly higher dose of blockers. The medications are surprisingly effective at cutting down on the hormones you don't want in your body.

Sorry, I wasn't trying to come off as attacking you. I know its a situation where people are wary to let teenagers go through with it. We just need to keep in mind that they'll be going through a puberty that causes changes either way. We should make sure that its the right one to make the rest of their life easier.

That was my whole point of the wait thing tho if the parents really cared they could have called him the preferred gender and just asked him to wait for treatment until it was time for him to make a decision until he was 18 since it’s such a big decision life altering my point was they could have respected his wishes and maybe compromised with him to wait if they at least showed the valued his choice and feeling is all I was saying

Ketkat · Feb 13, 2018

Son Lamar said:
That was my whole point of the wait thing tho if the parents really cared they could have called him the preferred gender and just asked him to wait for treatment until it was time for him to make a decision until he was 18 since it’s such a big decision life altering my point was they could have respected his wishes and maybe compromised with him to wait if they at least showed the valued his choice and feeling is all I was saying

I understand what you're saying, but personally I don't think that's much of a compromise. Its still forcing him to live with gender dysphoria despite doctors giving a diagnosis and recommending treatment. According to the article, he was already diagnosed with gender dysphoria 2 years ago. And they won't let him transition because they don't feel its best, despite doctors feeling otherwise.

"[The] Parents believe custody of the child should be restored to them, so they can make the medical decisions they believe are in their child's best interest until [the child] turns 18 years of age."

"Father testified that any kind of transition at all would go against his core beliefs and allowing the child to transition would be akin to him taking his heart out of his chest and placing it on the table," according to a transcript of Clancy's closing argument.

People need to be more trusting when trans people tell them what's going on with their identity and the pain it causes to have it not match your body. People also need to be more trusting of what doctor's recommend as a treatment and not go directly against doctor's wishes because they don't feel its right for whatever reason.

Hippo_PRIME · Feb 13, 2018

One of the things that shocks me here is that the kid is 17. Even if the (awful) parents win, he can make his own medical decisions in a year at most. Why risk alienating your child (or worse as the medical team indicates suicidal ideation) for less than a year's time? You'll just lose your child forever over a "win" in the very short term.

mentallyinept · Feb 13, 2018

...This kid has full blown Gender Dysphoria and is a suicide risk and the parents are trying to stop him from getting to a better mental state.

As a father myself, this blows my fucking mind.

Bakercat · Feb 13, 2018

Yeah, this situation sucks and can cause major mental disorders in the boy if not handled correctly. I would at least tell him that if things do go bad he can at least wait a year until he's 18 and be free to do what he wants. Still, parents shouldn't be shitheads to their child.

CNN: Parents want custody to stop transgender teen having hormone treatment

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