Cohen: "I take full responsibility for each act that I pled guilty to, the personal ones to me and those involving the President of the United States"

8byte · Dec 12, 2018

see5harp said:
36 months? Yo fuck that shit people go to jail for longer for selling weed. Fuck this dude's whole life up for now and for the foreseeable future.

I mean this essentially will fuck up his life forever, but I agree with you in that the charges comparatively to minor "drug offenses" is bullshit.

That said, Cohen is done for professionally, he'll leave prison without money or a job, and literally no one in his "circles" will touch him with a ten foot pole. I'm not even sure he'll ever be able to practice law again.

OMEGALUL · Dec 12, 2018

But what happens if Trump himself co-operates and gets a light sentence? wouldn't the investigation be for nothing?

TheGhost · Dec 12, 2018

Just 3 years? He won't serve the full sentence probaby

Cake Boss · Dec 12, 2018

The dude will come back from his 36 month vacation with book deals, exclusive interviews, movies/ TV shows lined up for him.

Cocaloch · Dec 12, 2018

Chirotera said:
Yeah, but then you can also go out and commit any white collar crime you want knowing you'll get a slap on the wrist sentence by cooperating. How is that justice?

Anyone whose sense of how the justice system should work revolves around slamming people with sentences instead of actually improving society has a problem with being vindictive. You can't sit here and hope this leads to Trump getting impeached or something and also not have a system that rewards this kind of behaviour.

I know this isn't popular here, but the point of justice systems is to benefit society, not to make you feel emotionally good about people that transgress norms whatever they be getting punished.

Pockets · Dec 12, 2018

collige said:
I wonder what jobs he'll be able to still land once he gets out.

CNN already has the contract written I'd bet.

Randomly Generated · Dec 12, 2018

Dr.Acula said:
People on this board are so hard, three years in prison is a long time. So is one month in a pitch-black bathroom.

Three weeks without games and internet and most people here would turn states evidence against their closest family.

daveo42 · Dec 12, 2018

Shoeless said:
Stuff like this does make wonder how fickle Trump supporters are. I mean, how do you ALWAYS go from, "YEAH! TEAM REPUBLICAN! THAT'S MY BOY!" to "Oh, he was never important. In fact, he was a Democrat? What, no I NEVER trusted that guy, I always knew he was no good for Trump!" And they go through this with every. Single. Person. That Trump cuts loose, somehow never realizing that they're always going through this, "I love this guy/I hate this guy" phase with so many of the people on "their own team." Their only real emotional fidelity, ironically, is that their feelings towards Libtards never changes. That's the one area they're NOT hypocritical.

Trump supporters will forever twist themselves into knots to downplay anything negative, discredit naysayers, and prop up the president and themselves as "intelligent individuals" to protect their warped sense of reality and pride. Just listen to this guy defend Trump and downplay the current investigation, being proven wrong time and time again:
NPR interview from this morning

ElectricBlanketFire · Dec 12, 2018

The Albatross said:
Still, also, people like Cohen aren't out of the woods yet. Cohen has a history of being involved in illegal activities as a lawyer and fixer, not just for Trump, but for other powerful people

see5harp · Dec 12, 2018

8byte said:
I mean this essentially will fuck up his life forever, but I agree with you in that the charges comparatively to minor "drug offenses" is bullshit.

That said, Cohen is done for professionally, he'll leave prison without money or a job, and literally no one in his "circles" will touch him with a ten foot pole. I'm not even sure he'll ever be able to practice law again.

Yea, I assume he's disbarred. But you gotta imagine people like this have so many assets here and abroad. Like even CEO's that they charge for securities frauds. Nothing we fine them will ever make a bit of difference for them or their family or children or children's children.

Saya · Dec 12, 2018

Deleted member 12224 · Dec 12, 2018

Lifendz said:
Damn. A lot of hardened gangstas on this forum. Three years in federal prison for a dude like Cohen is going to be a nightmare.

Three years in federal prison for 99.999% of people is a nightmare.

Movies, TV shows, etc. have people buying into the Club Fed myth too much, like it's sleepaway camp adjace.

White collar crime or not, it's still a fucking federal penitentiary.

Nepenthe · Dec 12, 2018

Cocaloch said:
Anyone whose sense of how the justice system should work revolves around slamming people with sentences instead of actually improving society has a problem with being vindictive.

You're confusing an ought with an is.

Of course, we ought to work towards a society where rehabilitation is the number one goal.

However, the way society is currently set up today is fundamentally unfair even in the context of a retributive system. If you are white, rich, and surround yourself with notable people, then you will do less time by destroying the fabric of the country or wiping out billions of dollars from the economy on a whoopsie-oopsie than a poor black dude selling dope to get a few extra bucks in his pocket.

Hint: This is why black people are cynical with "the system," btw.

Xx 720 · Dec 12, 2018

He bought this on himself, he has to do the time... but saw a pic of his kids, hate when there's young kids, a shame. I fear Trump wont ever see justice, if nothing else Pence will pardon.

lunarworks · Dec 12, 2018

He doesn't have to turn himself in until March. I wonder what the delay is about.

KoopaTheCasual · Dec 12, 2018

OMEGALUL said:
But what happens if Trump himself co-operates and gets a light sentence? wouldn't the investigation be for nothing?

Co-operate to implicate who?

You guys need to understand that cooperation is a means to indicting a 'bigger fish'/network. Trump sits at the top of the US side of the investigation. There's nothing he can 'cooperate' with that will reduce much of anything.

Wyman Manderly · Dec 12, 2018

Saya said:

Mmm that sounds good, I'll have that

daveo42 · Dec 12, 2018

ElectricBlanketFire said:

Man, this could be even sweeter if this could also rope in Hannity. Talk about a person I'd love see go to jail.

8byte · Dec 12, 2018

see5harp said:
Yea, I assume he's disbarred. But you gotta imagine people like this have so many assets here and abroad. Like even CEO's that they charge for securities frauds. Nothing we fine them will ever make a bit of difference for them or their family or children or children's children.

Fair enough, I'm not really well versed enough to know what Cohen has stashed away. The only thing I genuinely hope for is that his cooperation leads to real results with our current POTUS. If it doesn't lend us the power we need to "fix" this problem, then it feels like it was for nothing.

Deleted member 2533 · Dec 12, 2018

dabig2 said:
Mueller recommended some leniency given Cohen's singing. But even then, white collar crime isn't prosecuted as harshly as others.

Actually the SDNY recommended "substantial" jail time, and Mueller purposely did not comment on sentencing.

https://globalnews.ca/news/4741870/michael-cohen-prison/

In a separate filing, Mueller's office said on Friday that it would not take a position on Cohen's sentencing, scheduled for next Wednesday.

https://boingboing.net/2018/12/07/michael-cohen-sentencing-memo.html

Federal prosecutors in New York request a "substantial" prison sentence for Michael Cohen, who pled guilty to violating campaign finance laws. Sentencing guidelines suggest that could mean 46 to 63 months.

collige · Dec 12, 2018

see5harp said:
Yea, I assume he's disbarred. But you gotta imagine people like this have so many assets here and abroad. Like even CEO's that they charge for securities frauds. Nothing we fine them will ever make a bit of difference for them or their family or children or children's children.

He's not CEO rich, he was just a rando attorney before he got hired by Trump.

Deleted member 4976 · Dec 12, 2018

3 years? Good enough I suppose given the cooperation.

Officer Big Mac · Dec 12, 2018

The twisted knot you get in your stomach when the idea that Republicans are built on hypocrisy is proven again and again never goes away. Party of law and order? Seemingly indictments drop weekly. Voter fraud? Republicans are the ones doing it on large scale. Fiscal responsibility? The debt hasn't been larger than it is now.

And yet nearly half of all voters dont care. The absurdity of it all must be evidence none of this is real. I'm in a computer simulation.

digitalrelic · Dec 12, 2018

Saya said:

Every single sign I'm seeing makes it so clear that Trump is fucked... Yet I can't help but feel, against all rationality, this slightest inkling that he's still going to get away with it & be exonerated somehow. It's probably because I've been so disheartened over the past few years, and I've been following this closely for so long. I can't wait for the Mueller investigation to conclude. It's becoming physically painful to continue to wait.

Lumination · Dec 12, 2018

Nepenthe said:
You're confusing an ought with an is.

Of course, we ought to work towards a society where rehabilitation is the number one goal.

However, the way society is currently set up today is fundamentally unfair even in the context of a retributive system. If you are white, rich, and surround yourself with notable people, then you will do less time by destroying the fabric of the country or wiping out billions of dollars from the economy on a whoopsie-oopsie than a poor black dude selling dope to get a few extra bucks in his pocket.

Hint: This is why black people are cynical with "the system," btw.

Then argue for more lenient sentencing for drug offenses (which I know people do too), not the other way around.

Also, this isn't "just" white collar crime. Cohen's testimony is going to play a big role in implicating the POTUS. Can't just drop all context here.

Nepenthe · Dec 12, 2018

Lumination said:
Then argue for more lenient sentencing for drug offenses (which I know people do too), not the other way around.

I want weed legalized entirely because I don't think the drug is harmful. I also want white collar crime prosecuted more harshly because, obviously, it's extremely harmful to untold amounts of people.

These are not all that conflicting things.

I also said I already understand the context that is Cohen's cooperation within a larger investigation that isn't ultimately about him. That doesn't mean I'm not allowed to roll my eyes given the even bigger context of America's dearths in punitive measures across centuries.

Geist · Dec 12, 2018

Dreams-Visions · Dec 12, 2018

Let's hope whatever he was honest about will allow the dominoes to continue to fall on their way to the White House.

JJH · Dec 12, 2018

collige said:
I wonder what jobs he'll be able to still land once he gets out.

Dude is going to get paid on his inevitable book deal.

Freewheelin · Dec 12, 2018

Trump is going to be like "I DIDN'T DO ANYTHING (nothing that was illegal). WITCH HUNT!"

Surfinn · Dec 12, 2018

OMEGALUL said:
But what happens if Trump himself co-operates and gets a light sentence? wouldn't the investigation be for nothing?

There's no one higher than Trump. Flipping him benefits nobody

Shoeless · Dec 12, 2018

Teh Hamburglar said:
The twisted knot you get in your stomach when the idea that Republicans are built on hypocrisy is proven again and again never goes away. Party of law and order? Seemingly indictments drop weekly. Voter fraud? Republicans are the ones doing it on large scale. Fiscal responsibility? The debt hasn't been larger than it is now.

And yet nearly half of all voters dont care. The absurdity of it all must be evidence none of this is real. I'm in a computer simulation.

Someday, the Republican party is going to declare that honesty, Jesus, the 10 commandments, compassion, and goodness are ALL sins against God, and that lying, criminal acts, fear, intimidation and breaking the law are all doing The Lord's Works. I think it's what a lot of Americans are praying for; many of them are beginning to realize that being a good person is really interfering with who they actually are.

Lumination · Dec 12, 2018

Nepenthe said:
I want weed legalized entirely because I don't think the drug is harmful. I also want white collar crime prosecuted more harshly because, obviously, it's extremely harmful to untold amounts of people.

These are not all that conflicting things.

I also said I already understand the context that is Cohen's cooperation within a larger investigation that isn't ultimately about him. That doesn't mean I'm not allowed to roll my eyes given the even bigger context of America's dearths in punitive measures across centuries.

Hey I agree with you, but bringing up this specific problem in this specific thread seems a bit out of context.

Lifendz · Dec 12, 2018

cagey said:
Three years in federal prison for 99.999% of people is a nightmare.

Movies, TV shows, etc. have people buying into the Club Fed myth too much, like it's sleepaway camp adjace.

White collar crime or not, it's still a fucking federal penitentiary.

Exactly. There's a weird notion here that's its summer camp. People watch too many movies. It's three years of having every minute of your day controlled by Correctional Officers.

Garlador · Dec 12, 2018

Freewheelin said:
Trump is going to be like "I DIDN'T DO ANYTHING (nothing that was illegal). WITCH HUNT!"

He already has.

But we're now at the point where, even yesterday, he was saying what he did wasn't illegal, and yet his attorney is going to prison for three years for the VERY THING he says he did that wasn't illegal.

wisdom0wl · Dec 12, 2018

OH ME OH MY

NealMcCauley · Dec 12, 2018

lunarworks said:
He doesn't have to turn himself in until March. I wonder what the delay is about.

I've heard (and someone is free to correct me if I'm wrong) convicted lawyers need time to dissolve their practices.

Lifendz · Dec 12, 2018

JJH said:
Dude is going to get paid on his inevitable book deal.

There's a law commonly referred to as the "Son of Sam" law that makes it really difficult for criminals to profit off publicity (book, movie, tv deals) of their crimes.

alexi52 · Dec 12, 2018

What are the odds he also takes Pence and Hannity down with him

Wolfgunblood · Dec 12, 2018

Now that he's sentenced, it has to be said- Mueller better deliver and bring the boss down. Trump should face a longer sentence.

lunarworks · Dec 12, 2018

digitalrelic said:
Every single sign I'm seeing makes it so clear that Trump is fucked... Yet I can't help but feel, against all rationality, this slightest inkling that he's still going to get away with it & be exonerated somehow. It's probably because I've been so disheartened over the past few years, and I've been following this closely for so long. I can't wait for the Mueller investigation to conclude. It's becoming physically painful to continue to wait.

Even if Trump is convicted, no one will want to set the precedent of sending a former President of the United States to jail. He'll receive a slap on the wrist or an immediate pardon. The Trump Organization is fucked beyond belief, though.

BWoog · Dec 12, 2018

lunarworks said:
Even if Trump is convicted, no one will want to set the precedent of sending a former President of the United States to jail. He'll receive a slap on the wrist or an immediate pardon. The Trump Organization is fucked beyond belief, though.

As people said about Nixon, his Watergate exploits made him at least an American criminal.

Trump though? Flat out treason. You HAVE to set a precedent that this shit is not tolerable or the GOP is going to do nothing but leverage Russian assistance in all elections moving forward

Garlador · Dec 12, 2018

lunarworks said:
Even if Trump is convicted, no one will want to set the precedent of sending a former President of the United States to jail. He'll receive a slap on the wrist or an immediate pardon. The Trump Organization is fucked beyond belief, though.

I can think of SEVERAL judges who would love to set that precedent, especially ones in New York.

night814 · Dec 12, 2018

GK86 said:
Live updates from CNN:

Awwww yeah

lunarworks · Dec 12, 2018

BWoog said:
As people said about Nixon, his Watergate exploits made him at least an American criminal.

Trump though? Flat out treason. You HAVE to set a precedent that this shit is not tolerable or the GOP is going to do nothing but leverage Russian assistance in all elections moving forward

You need the GOP's cooperation, and why would they shoot down their own advantage?

Pomerlaw · Dec 12, 2018

ElectricBlanketFire said:

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Jmdajr · Dec 12, 2018

Cocaloch · Dec 12, 2018

Nepenthe said:
You're confusing an ought with an is.

Except I'm not doing that at all. People are clearing appealing to a punitive system of justice. They aren't remarking on its existence, they are supporting the normative judgement that it's the right way to do things.

I don't know how you can't see that.

Ironically you seem to be the one mixing them up if you're missing that other people are making normative statements about what should be happening instead of simply observing what is happening. People really need to think more about pretty basic epistemology here. It's not complicated to see the nature of claims being made.

Nepenthe said:
Of course, we ought to work towards a society where rehabilitation is the number one goal.

However, the way society is currently set up today is fundamentally unfair even in the context of a retributive system. If you are white, rich, and surround yourself with notable people, then you will do less time by destroying the fabric of the country or wiping out billions of dollars from the economy on a whoopsie-oopsie than a poor black dude selling dope to get a few extra bucks in his pocket.

Hint: This is why black people are cynical with "the system," btw.

I'm aware of all this. It's a problem with institutional racism, and is in no way shape or form an argument for making a punitive justice system. It's a call to reform what's broken, not make more things broken.

Pointing this out is totally fine by the way. I have no issue with that. It's what you're calling above ought statements, based on punitive ideas of justice system and that are absolutely more common than observations on the topic in this thread, that I'm taking issue with.

BowieZ · Dec 12, 2018

White collar criminals tend to have softer sentences while petty criminals have harsher.

All things considered though, this particular sentence seems appropriate tbh

collige · Dec 12, 2018

Lifendz said:
There's a law commonly referred to as the "Son of Sam" law that makes it really difficult for criminals to profit off publicity (book, movie, tv deals) of their crimes.

Reading the Wiki article on this, it seems like the current incarnation of the law in NY doesn't actually prevent criminals from making money, but instead makes it easier for victims to pursue civil damages against them, but given the nature of his crimes, I'm not really sure who's gonna sue Cohen.

Cohen: "I take full responsibility for each act that I pled guilty to, the personal ones to me and those involving the President of the United States"

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