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Congresswoman Omar ignites new anti-Semitism controversy with comments on AIPAC

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marrec

marrec

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junomars said:
Tough shit? I get the stigma behind the Jewish and money but does that mean we have to pretend that Israeli lobbies don't have or use any fucking money? Fuck out of here.
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No, that means you don't make a flippant tweet that could just as easily be used as language the alt-right puts in an attack ad versus Soros.

The congresswoman should be held to a higher rhetorical standard so that there is no mystery to her intent. If you want to criticize israeli lobbying money in politics, be specific and precise.
 
julian

julian

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mugurumakensei said:
That's still a drop in the bucket for PAC money when overall PAC expenditures reach into over $1b.

Money isn't why politicians support Israel.

Republicans support Israel due to geopolitical ambitions in the area and end of times prophecy.

Democrats support Israel out of lack of democratic options in the Middle East, religious identity, and diplomacy.
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I would also throw in military, intelligence and technology support - which seems to get ignored on here a lot in favor of the end times narrative.

But to your larger point, the same could be said of the NRA yet they have had a lot of influence despite their low dollar count. You just have to point to the recent anti-BDS legislation to know they must hold a lot of sway.
 
junomars

junomars

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marrec said:
No, that means you don't make a flippant tweet that could just as easily be used as language the alt-right puts in an attack ad versus Soros.

The congresswoman should be held to a higher rhetorical standard so that there is no mystery to her intent. If you want to criticize israeli lobbying money in politics, be specific and precise.
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I've already said that she expressed herself in the wrong way. This issue is serious and nothing to be trolling about. But forgive me if I don't clutch my pearls.
 
Royalan

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marrec said:
No, that means you don't make a flippant tweet that could just as easily be used as language the alt-right puts in an attack ad versus Soros.

The congresswoman should be held to a higher rhetorical standard so that there is no mystery to her intent. If you want to criticize israeli lobbying money in politics, be specific and precise.
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Exactly, and honestly this isn't that hard.

As a Black American I call out people who use sloppy language with racist connotations even if I don't believe they're racist.

As a Gay American I call out people who use sloppy language with homophobic connotations even if I don't believe they're homophobic.

Calling the shit out, even among your allies, is how society moves forward.

Omar deserves all the smoke she's getting right now, and she needs to stop being so damn dumb and meme-happy with her tweets.
 

Razgreez

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Apr 13, 2018
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Tone policing for Israel being poorly masked as tone policing for Jews. Pathetically transparent
 
marrec

marrec

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junomars said:
I've already said that she expressed herself in the wrong way. This issue is serious and nothing to be trolling about.
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Then we agree. Omar needs to do better in the future.

But forgive me if I don't clutch my pearls.
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Everyone pisses themselves when the right tone-policies but how is this any different? People are understandably upset, there's no need to be reductive.
 
Clipjoint

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Mega-donors on both sides of the aisle, from Haim Saban to Sheldon Adelson, openly talk about their support for Israel and their policy objectives pertaining to Israel in conjunction with their donations. This is done out in the open, and should be pointed out and discussed openly without accusations of anti-Semitism.

Whenever there is a mass shooting in this country and members of Congress tweet their "thoughts and prayers" you have a wave of journalists who will point out how much each of those congress members receive in donations from the NRA. This is no different. We need to be able to discuss the role of money in politics without being accused of anti-Semitism.

Also - isn't it in fact accepting of anti-Semitism to point out that white Evangelicals support Israel because of their religious beliefs? You're basically saying "no those people don't support Israel because of lobbying dollars - they support Israel because they believe Jesus is going to return and force the Jews to convert to Christianity or be wiped out and sent to hell."

If you want to point out anti-Semitism, look at the Evangelicals, not those who simply want freedom and equality for the Palestinian people.
 

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Git said:
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not saying that you're doing this but it just made me think of all the instances where this is done

be careful about not being a part of a certain group and then using members of that group to make your opinion seem more legit. there will no doubt be many Jews who support everything she said as there will no doubt be many Jews who were made uncomfortable by the language that she used and everything in between. never think that you're dropping the mic when your message is essentially "well here are some Jews and they don't have an issue with this so none of us should". doesn't work like that.

not saying that's what you specifically were doing and I have no idea whether you're Jewish or not but I do see this tactic employed a lot and it's not ok
 

OtherWorldly

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Jag said:
"Tangentially", "poor judgment", "accidentally" "jokingly". The same excuses the right uses when they peddle their own racist bullshit. It was a clear antisemitic dogwhistle. She knew exactly what she was doing. There is a reason very liberal people are pissed about her language
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wait...so you actually think she is an antisemitic and her tweet meant jews?
 

Deleted member 8463

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phanphare said:
not saying that you're doing this but it just made me think of all the instances where this is done

be careful about not being a part of a certain group and then using members of that group to make your opinion seem more legit. there will no doubt be many Jews who support everything she said as there will no doubt be many Jews who were made uncomfortable by the language that she used and everything in between. never think that you're dropping the mic when your message is essentially "well here are some Jews and they don't have an issue with this so none of us should". doesn't work like that.

not saying that's what you specifically were doing and I have no idea whether you're Jewish or not but I do see this tactic employed a lot and it's not ok
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I hadn't stated an opinion in this thread yet. Although my thoughts on Israel and their lobbying will be pretty easy to find. (they are cunts)
That definitely wasn't what I was doing, although that Twitter thread seemed an antithesis to the real and faux outrage in this thread. Honestly conflating a tweet about money with antisemitic tropes is pretty antisemitic.
 
Buzzman

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Royalan said:
Exactly, and honestly this isn't that hard.

As a Black American I call out people who use sloppy language with racist connotations even if I don't believe they're racist.

As a Gay American I call out people who use sloppy language with homophobic connotations even if I don't believe they're homophobic.

Calling the shit out, even among your allies, is how society moves forward.

Omar deserves all the smoke she's getting right now, and she needs to stop being so damn dumb and meme-happy with her tweets.
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But...what was the problematic connotation then? Was it discussing money in the context of Israel?
How do you explain the power and problems of AIPAC without invoking the concept of currency?
 

Deleted member 5593

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It's so transparent with how there's more outrage in demanding people have precision in their criticism over Israel than actual criticism towards Israel's apartheid regime.
 
Br3wnor

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BringBackSonics said:
She definitely needs to take care about who she retweets or tweets their positions, even if they happen to agree with her on a specific issue. Don't give platforms to bad actors.
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She's going to become a pretty irrelevant politician if she keeps this rough shot social media "trying for the clap back" strategy going. It's my big concern with AOC as well that she's going to really hurt herself with a careless tweet but so far she seems much better at policing herself than Omar is.

Buzzman said:
But...what was the problematic connotation then? Was it discussing money in the context of Israel?
How do you explain the power and problems of AIPAC without invoking the concept of currency?
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You find a mature way to discuss the issue instead of quoting fucking Biggie Smalls lyrics talking only about money. It's no better than the shit Trump retweeted during his campaign that had dollar signs with stars of David (on original graphic, his version was edited) pictures with Hillary.
 

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Git said:
I hadn't stated an opinion in this thread yet. Although my thoughts on Israel and their lobbying will be pretty easy to find. (they are cunts)
That definitely wasn't what I was doing, although that Twitter thread seemed an antithesis to the real and faux outrage in this thread. Honestly conflating a tweet about money with antisemitic tropes is pretty antisemitic.
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like I said twice I wasn't insinuating anything about you or your intentions just commenting on a common tactic I see in regards to issues like this where people outside of a particular group use members of that group with opinions that align with theirs as a way to stifle discussion and make their opinion seem like it carries more authority

and claiming that calling out an anti-semitic dog whistle is actually what's anti-semitic is pretty fucked up, I hope I'm reading your post wrong because yikes if not
 

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This is fucking stupid. She was totally being flippant with regards to a very serious issue but to assume she's acting in bad faith and willfully or mistakenly propagating anti-semitism is bullshit. This is a smoke screen
 

Deleted member 8463

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I don't think it was a dogwhistle, so nope you read that right.

e: to clarify because this probably needs clarifying: I think many people who suffer from regular antisemitism look to point it out rightfully, because they're ignored. This leads sometimes to incorrectly identifying antisemitism and in cases like this - perceiving antisemitism via an antisemitic trope they are actively looking for. Like David Baddiel recently saying that calling Churchill a white supremacist and a mass murderer was antisemitic because it apparently negated the severity of the holocaust, despite Hitler not being even referenced. It's basically all round depressing, whichever way you slice it.
 
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marrec

marrec

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AAK said:
It's so transparent with how there's more outrage in demanding people have precision in their criticism over Israel than actual criticism towards Israel's apartheid regime.
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You mean in this thread or in general?

I think ERA on the whole has been pretty clear in it's criticism of israel's apartheid regime. However, this specific thread is about what could be interpreted as anti-semitic remarks made by a congresswoman.

Even so, many have been critical of israel in this specific thread, even me.
 
Sokrates

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Royalan said:
Exactly, and honestly this isn't that hard.

As a Black American I call out people who use sloppy language with racist connotations even if I don't believe they're racist.

As a Gay American I call out people who use sloppy language with homophobic connotations even if I don't believe they're homophobic.

Calling the shit out, even among your allies, is how society moves forward.

Omar deserves all the smoke she's getting right now, and she needs to stop being so damn dumb and meme-happy with her tweets.
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It's ridiculous calling out our allies when there's literally the alt-right and Nazis on the March bombing and shooting up synagogues. Meanwhile our shithead president called Neonazis very fine people.

Omar may have worded it awkwardly but those calling it out are acting in bad faith against a Muslim black woman. It's textbook Islamaphobia. But I guess it's fine cause "antisemitism"
 
marrec

marrec

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Sokrates said:
It's ridiculous calling out our allies when there's literally the alt-right and Nazis on the March bombing and shooting up synagogues. Meanwhile our shithead president called Neonazis very fine people.

Omar may have worded it awkwardly but those calling it out are acting in bad faith against a Muslim black woman. It's textbook Islamaphobia. But I guess it's fine cause "antisemitism"
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We can police ourselves while rallying against our adversaries.

Not all of those calling it our are acting in bad faith, that is a paranoid assumption.

SaveWeyard said:
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So which one are those posting in this thread? Bad faith, or really fucking stupid?
 

Deleted member 1476

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On one hand, fuck the government of Israel.

On the other hand, this is as far as I recall the second time this congresswoman makes a mess about something foreign and she's on the Foreign Affairs Committee for crying out loud.
 
Sokrates

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User Banned (1 Month): Inflammatory commentary and numerous accumulated infractions.
marrec said:
We can police ourselves while rallying against our adversaries.

Not all of those calling it our are acting in bad faith, that is a paranoid assumption.
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True the above post shows that's Omar's critics are useful idiots for apartheid and so are some posters here.
 
Tomohawk

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marrec said:
You mean in this thread or in general?

I think ERA on the whole has been pretty clear in it's criticism of israel's apartheid regime. However, this specific thread is about what could be interpreted as anti-semitic remarks made by a congresswoman.

Even so, many have been critical of israel in this specific thread, even me.
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In this thread its understandable but the media in general focuses on comments critical of Israel lobbying is criticized more than the politicians who prop up apartheid through that lobbying.
 
Clipjoint

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"I sure hope that Israel's prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu , understands that the standing ovation he got in Congress this year was not for his politics. That ovation was bought and paid for by the Israel lobby. "
-Noted anti-Semite Thomas Friedman, writing in the anti-Semitic New York Times.
 
marrec

marrec

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Sokrates said:
True the above post shows that's Omar's critics are useful idiots for apartheid and so are some posters here.
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I don't appreciate being called an idiot simply for disagreeing with your position.

We're talking about one of America's highest public offices. Congresswoman Omar is no longer just an activist and if she wants to advance the cause of Palestine she needs to be careful and less flippant.
 
Calamari41

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The gaslighting is crazy around this issue. As if AIPAC isn't buying support, but sitting everyone down and showing them Ben Shapiro Youtube videos, and legitimately convincing them to support them through logic and reason.

Of course they're buying support. That's what all of these lobbying groups do.
 

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marrec said:
You mean in this thread or in general?

I think ERA on the whole has been pretty clear in it's criticism of israel's apartheid regime. However, this specific thread is about what could be interpreted as anti-semitic remarks made by a congresswoman.

Even so, many have been critical of israel in this specific thread, even me.
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Everybody? Has there ever been a thread on ERA or a Democratic movement for signatures to denounce the stuff compiled from this post:

Jas said:
Yep...





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Royalan

Royalan

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Sokrates said:
It's ridiculous calling out our allies when there's literally the alt-right and Nazis on the March bombing and shooting up synagogues. Meanwhile our shithead president called Neonazis very fine people.
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To be blunt, I don't give a shit about what Republicans do. They're on the whole terrible. It's like when I was a child and being scolded by my mother and responding with "B-b-but my friend Joey's parents let him _____________!" The response to that was usually a quick "I don't care one bit what Joey's parents let him do."

I can hold on to be the undeniable fact that Republican morals reside in the same place shit goes after I flush the toilet, while expecting better from people who claim to represent me. Omar knows better, and she needs to do better, regardless of what's happening on the other side of the aisle.
 
marrec

marrec

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AAK said:
Everybody? Has there ever been a thread on ERA or a Democratic movement for signatures to denounce the stuff compiled from this post:
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I wouldn't know specifically, but I'm sure there has been some kind of "democratic" movement to denounce specific anti-Palestinian positions. As for the videos you posted, they total around 60 minutes of speeches given to AIPAC. There is a stark contrast between ~60 minutes of general speeches and a tweet about attacks on Israeli policies boiled down to the flippant and vague "It's all about the Benjamins baby".

There is a reason this controversy has taken off, because her language can be interpreted in numerous ways, and many of those interpretations are wholly unflattering.

If there are specifics in those speeches that you would like people to be aware of, by all means parse them out for those who don't have the time or knowledge so that we can shine a spotlight.
 
Chikor

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Clipjoint said:
"I sure hope that Israel's prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu , understands that the standing ovation he got in Congress this year was not for his politics. That ovation was bought and paid for by the Israel lobby. "
-Noted anti-Semite Thomas Friedman, writing in the anti-Semitic New York Times.
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Way to take this out of context.
The context is of course that he's not a Muslim woman, so he can say that.
 

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Royalan said:
I can hold on to be the undeniable fact that Republican morals reside in the same place shit goes after I flush the toilet, while expecting better from people who claim to represent me. Omar knows better, and she needs to do better, regardless of what's happening on the other side of the aisle.
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She's representing you by being the only individual from Congress (aside from Rashida) brave enough to call out AIPAC and USA's incessant defense on the apartheid regime Israel is pioneering.

I never hear this vast public rhetoric of "I expect better from the people who claim to represent me" when they line up in defense of Israel.
 
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