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Mcjmetroid

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,843
Limerick, Ireland
Nintendo systems are made to sell Nintendo games. What AAA competition did Mario have on Switch for the holidays?


Are any 3rd parties doing million+ units on Switch?

Ah now I think this is quite the accomplishment.

Star Wars Battlefront II had the benefit of being on 3 systems - all of which have larger userbases,
It is a direct sequel to Battlefront 1,
had a massive movie to tie in with it,
had a price cut relativity soon after released
and I would also argue that Star Wars is the more powerful brand name than Mario overall.

Your arguing from a logic that people who own a Switch ONLY own a Switch which is highly unlikely for the most part considering how late into this console generation we are. Switch games are more or less still competing with games on other platforms.
 

Deleted member 5535

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,656
As a long-time Battlefront fan, at this point I hope they don't make a Battlefront 3, but a Battlefield: Star Wars game. Clearly they don't know what the hell they're doing with the franchise, and at this point, the thing that no Battlefront fan wanted at the beginning (a re-skinned Battlefield) would be way fucking better than this game, and DICE are just fine at making those.....right?

Such a damn disappointment. And now reports are showing that EA is going to be putting MTs back in. It's almost like they hate Disney or something and want to tank their franchise in the games sphere. If I were Disney I'd get the fuck out of dodge once this contract is up. Create a game publishing unit and let developers pitch games to them and make them the way they want. EA is the fuckin' worst - yes I realize this is nothing new.

Imagine if the Factor 5 guys (who are still buds and developers) got back together to do a new Rogue Squadron? Or that Darth Maul game resurfaced? Or they got Crytek UK or whatever to bring back their dead Battlefront 3?

So many awesome games that fell by the wayside once EA took over and gave us.................shit.

It's almost strange how clueless EA and DICE were with this game. "We want to sell lots of copies, but we want to make this game the antithesis of what gamers like."

they said since the beginning that they would put the MTX back because they would change the progression system to other monetization.

Also, Disney is part of it along EA. They're in a partnership with these games. You can be sure that in 2023 this is going to be renewed.
 

Uno Venova

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,858
Today is a great day, MH and Odyssey being consumer friendly runaway successes, and this attempted trojan horse of the worst microstransactions in AAA gaming performing well below expectations.
 

Nome

Designer / Self-requested ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,312
NYC
It's unfortunate because buying FIFA points is an awful value proposition. As someone that plays FIFA and spends no money what you get in packs for 20 dollars is fucking insane.

But you're right, the audiences are different.
I think what you'll find is that a lot of MTX services have very poor value propositions on purpose.
I've just started playing CoD WW2, and it's about $20 to get 10 loot boxes. I can get 10-12 by playing 2 hours, which makes it seem like an exceptionally poor value proposition, yet I'm pretty certain that they're still selling well.

When loot boxes are integrated into the F2P progression loop (as they should be), the designers will generally put a cap on the number you can earn for free, then depend on the consumer's impatience to sell them more. I think it works pretty well since it feels fair to the F2P players, but is still effective on highly-engaged players, who are the most likely to monetize anyway.
 

OrdinaryPrime

Self-requested ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
11,042
I think what you'll find is that a lot of MTX services have very poor value propositions on purpose.
I've just started playing CoD WW2, and it's about $20 to get 10 loot boxes. I can get 10-12 by playing 2 hours, which makes it seem like an exceptionally poor value proposition, yet I'm pretty certain that they're still selling well.

When loot boxes are integrated into the F2P progression loop (as they should be), the designers will generally put a cap on the number you can earn for free, then depend on the consumer's impatience to sell them more. I think it works pretty well since it feels fair to the F2P players, but is still effective on highly-engaged players, who are the most likely to monetize anyway.

Do the loot boxes in WW2 change gameplay? Or are they simply skins for guns, etc?
 

ByWatterson

▲ Legend ▲
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
2,302
Yeah sorry, poor choice of words. What I meant was this being more of a disaster, or that the game ultimately bombed in a manner that was really hoped for by a lot of people protesting against, culminated in a middling and disappointing release, and the fact they could off-set the money they lost their at all through other means just means this isn't in any way gonna kill off this franchise. It's why I said that I really want to see how much this affects III, which I still wholeheartedly believe will come out under EA, even after all this.

Yeah, that makes sense. It's not a killer, but it is a moment upon which EA is going to reflect because their practices have finally hurt more than just their reputation, customers, and product - they have finally hurt their bottom line.

I think BF III is less the one to watch, and more Anthem. We should know quite a lot about its monetization model by fall of this year, at latest, and I'm guessing it's a hard pivot away from predatory pay-to-win practices, and closer to the cosmetics with which few have a problem (on their own).
 

Nome

Designer / Self-requested ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,312
NYC
Do the loot boxes in WW2 change gameplay? Or are they simply skins for guns, etc?
WW2's progression model is beautiful, but that's to be expected given how long the series has been around.
Loot boxes basically give you a mixture of emblems, calling cards, player skins, and weapon skins.
Emblems and calling cards are the "trash loot", player skins are medium tier, and weapon skins are high tier in terms of player-perceived value--though the actual loot is graded from Common to Heroic independent of player-perceived value.
The only progression-impacting items are the weapon skins, which give the player bonus XP on kill. What's interesting is that unlike Counterstrike, the low TTK and life expectancy, combined with the lack of spectators in core game modes, means that your skins are really there for you to see, not for everyone else. So the social value of these skins is quite low.

This is where prestiging comes in. If you've ever played a COD game, you'd know that the amount of time required to get to max level is quite short; I'd say I generally hit max around 10-15 hours of MP gameplay. Of course, the grind is in prestiging. So the gameplay value of getting 10-15% bonus XP on kill is quite low for players who don't care about prestiging, but the intrinsic social value of having high prestige levels motivates players to want to use these skins, which gives them greater value to the highly engaged players who are more likely to monetize anyway.

In addition to this, WW2's loot box system has duplicates, which award a small amount of soft currency. This soft currency is used to buy contracts which award more lootboxes (re-engages you in the progression loop) and also to directly purchase items to complete your collection. Completing a set of items awards unique awards, some of which are time-limited to seasonal events--which puts time pressure on engagement or monetization.

Mobile games have perfected the progression and retention loop, and WW2 is probably the first AAA boxed product that's not strictly a live service (e.g. MMO) that I've seen to really capitalize on a lot of these things. That's why WW2's retention numbers seem to be among the highest of recent CODs.
 
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GamerEra

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,096
It's a gargantuan step back compared to BF1, but still let's not kid ourselves that 7 million sold is in any way indicative that EA sees all this as a failure. I am fascinated to see what becomes of the BF IP by the time III rolls around.
It's 7 million shipped. I imagine retailers will do aggressive price promotions to try and move their shipments.

7million is not very much for a Star Wars game aimed at the mass market FPS crowd.
 

Osiris397

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,455
I've heard "shipped" not sold and then there's the 882K sold in the first week compared to the 4 million COD WWII sales that same week makes those numbers look highly suspicious. I call BULLSHIT on the 7M "sold" number. Battlefront 2 is $30-$40 now, which speaks to the idea that the game is overstocked everywhere and retailers are discounting early to move the skids of stock they have. I think they only sold 2-3M copies and it wouldn't surprise me if it's down to $20 before the end of February. I suspect retailers will downgrade their orders for Anthem behind this and ME:Andromeda, and TitanFall 2.
 
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Keikaku

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,769
TQhHj3I.gif
 

The Artisan

"Angels are singing in monasteries..."
Moderator
Oct 27, 2017
8,112
The latest Star Wars movie also didn't outperform the previous installment, maybe it's connecyed?
 

NinjaCoachZ

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,777
It's all relative. 7m would be GREAT by normal standards, but doing almost half the original game is bad and raises a lot of questions about where to go from there.
 

Hailinel

Shamed a mod for a tag
Member
Oct 27, 2017
35,527
I'm baffled that the Wall Street Journal had the wrong numbers. seven million sales for this game, with microtransactions turned off, has got to be a massive disappointment for EA. Given this correction, it really doesn't surprise me that they've told people not to expect another Battlefront in the near future.
 

firstadopter

Member
Oct 25, 2017
241
The Wall Street Journal reporter confirmed that EA admitted their CFO "misspoke" with the incorrect 9 million number instead of the accurate 7 million number.
 

MisterHero

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,934
Thank you for playing Battlefront II.

Pay $$$ for Star Wars

Edit: I'm actually interested in giving this game a shot on PC. Do I need an EA account to buy/play it?
 

Fairy Godmother

Backward compatible
Moderator
Oct 27, 2017
3,289
I'm not hoping they'd remove MTX entirely from their line-up, at the least EA should learn from the sales decline and develop a less intrusive MTX scheme for their other upcoming games like Anthem.

What a shame though, I really liked the beta of this game.
 

Servbot24

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
43,107
I know they wanted way more sales than this, but I wonder how much of a profit they still turned on it.
 

SapientWolf

Member
Nov 6, 2017
6,565
It's still is the big Star Wars game for a holiday that has a big new numbered movie so is understandably that it would sell, with that said it is still a big drop from the first EA Battlefront and the controversy probably played a part on that (what parent would want to buy their kid a game that has been on the news so much for bad reasons?).
Controversy didn't seem to hurt GTA much. Loot boxes didn't seem to hurt CoD much. Seems like Battlefront was already on the wane.
 

FormatCompatible

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,071
Controversy didn't seem to hurt GTA much. Loot boxes didn't seem to hurt CoD much. Seems like Battlefront was already on the wane.
Don't think those games and situations are comparable, Battlefront is still a Star Wars product so that has much more scrutiny on itself, besides the fact that the Battlefront situation has been worldwide news with the government wanting to intervene and the thing being multiple times classified as outright gambling. The CoD situation barely left reddit and gaf in comparison, and the GTA one is about sex and violence, I'm sorry but that just makes it more enticing to people not less.
 

xvr

Member
Oct 27, 2017
103
Good to see that EAs biting it on this one. Not sure if they'll be cooling down their practices too much, but this is much, much better than people letting it go. Telling it with your wallet seems to have worked this time.
 

SHØGVN

Member
Oct 29, 2017
258
The controvery hasn't even taught EA a lesson because the losses were recouped by other micratransaction-fuelled games. So what is the lesson here? Include aggressive monetisation in your games, but not too much that you offend players?
 

Dekuman

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,026
The latest Star Wars movie also didn't outperform the previous installment, maybe it's connecyed?

Movie released Dec 15, so it had 2 weeks to underperform based on the movie alone. As the financials ends Dec 31st

At the same time, BF II was heavily promoted before the film, which was always the point of launching this game and BF 2015 to coincide with the mainline Star Wars films. Every showing of TLJ I went to, there was a BF II advert attached, regardless of the theatre chain I went to.

So it would have received lots of eyeballs from unsophiscated consumers and kids who would want to buy the game.

I think the damage was done long before the film premiered. If the 'fan backlash' to Last Jedi has any bearing at all, it will simply cut any legs this game have after Dec 31st further.

And as noted by many others, the game was on sale pretty quickly in December, so for it to under-perform despite being on sale is even worse.
 
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Penny Royal

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
4,158
QLD, Australia
ZhugeEX - was that 8m guidance for Q3 an adjustment after the Loot boxes thing blew up, or was that EA's guidance prior to Q3?

Because while falling short of their own target isn't great, if they had already factored in reduced numbers compared to SWBF1 it should really be tempering the 'OMG look at how far it's fallen!' comments.
 

skeezx

Member
Oct 27, 2017
20,144
not a tire fire but enough for suits to be spooked by the whole ordeal. personally feel a lot better about the industry's near future going forward though i'm aware it won't be happily ever after either
 

Illusion

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
8,407
I was shocked when I heard 9 million. I felt like our outrage was for nothing when I heard that.

But I wish it was lower, say 3 million-ish.
 

Lappe

Banned
Nov 1, 2017
1,651
I'm baffled that the Wall Street Journal had the wrong numbers. seven million sales for this game, with microtransactions turned off, has got to be a massive disappointment for EA. Given this correction, it really doesn't surprise me that they've told people not to expect another Battlefront in the near future.

There will be one in fall 2019 before the release of the new movie, this is a pretty sure bet.
They clearly have somekind of roadmap with Disney and the movies, and they aren't going to stray from that because of some arguably disappointing sales.

Oh my my. It seems the notion "speak with your wallet" does not really work in gaming industry

Actually this show that it does, the sales are significantly lower than expected, and It ain't because the game is bad, It's mainly because the controversy.
 

mingo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
815
London
Those saying that it sold 7mil so it's not really a failure don't know how businesses are run. They would have projected a certain amount they expect to sell, if the company misses the projection, that is a failure. 7mil compared to 13mil of the original is bad in units sold, but when you actually convert that into revenue then the figures are huge.
 

OléGunner

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,276
Airborne Aquarium
So... People actually managed to make a significant impact on EA's bottom line? Awesome. I really do hope they turn it around because man... I wanna play this game.

I want to play it too, Star Fighter Assault especially because I really enjoyed that in the beta.
But let us hold the line until we see how EA and DICE revamp progression and implement the new mtx.

I'd still suggest finding the game dirt cheap too thanks to their shenanigans.