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Reinhard

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,604
Yeah, Nott doing the potion was fine because Nott still fired her sneak attack damage that round, and the next round she still would have been able to do sneak attack damage + pour the potion down the throat as a bonus action. A smarter move than Command would have been to use a healing word on Beau to ensure she wouldn't have to roll another death save, but Command wasn't a bad choice as it would have gotten Cad out who also heals. The only really stupid move was Yasha, her doing damage x 2 would have killed Obann the punished before he got off his final AOE Attack that almost wiped out half the party ;p. Moving an unconscious body does absolutely nothing unless you are moving someone out of AOE range, which Yasha didn't even accomplish.
 

SilentMike03

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,083
Holy fuck that throne room scene was sooooooo tense. I had my hands covering my mouth the entire time.

I think Trent knowing about Bren is a positive. A lot of the anxiety Caleb had was about Trent finding out and now he knows that Trent knows. And now that M9 are working for the king, I think that gives them a little bit of a shield from Trent, at least for now.
 

Reinhard

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,604
Holy fuck that throne room scene was sooooooo tense. I had my hands covering my mouth the entire time.

I think Trent knowing about Bren is a positive. A lot of the anxiety Caleb had was about Trent finding out and now he knows that Trent knows. And now that M9 are working for the king, I think that gives them a little bit of a shield from Trent, at least for now.
Not really, the King seems like a real dickhead who is probably conspiring with the Cerebus Assembly to attack the Bright Queen at the "peace" conference. I wouldn't be surprised if the Beacon has been modified with a soul trap spell that activates once the Bright Queen touches it, and then the Scourgers come in and execute everyone else from the Dynasty at that conference, including the M9 for daring to conspire with the "enemy".
 
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Dream Machine

Dream Machine

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,085
So is Trent working on behalf of the chained oblivion in some way too? Why lie about "discovering" the beacon when he stole it? Seems like he could convince the king it was valuable and not have to do the whole ruse of pretending the Krynn made up the fact that he stole their holy artifact. Just wanting to learn dunamancy seems like kind of low stakes, so I wonder what the end game of his research on the beacon is.
 

timedesk

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,937
So is Trent working on behalf of the chained oblivion in some way too? Why lie about "discovering" the beacon when he stole it? Seems like he could convince the king it was valuable and not have to do the whole ruse of pretending the Krynn made up the fact that he stole their holy artifact. Just wanting to learn dunamancy seems like kind of low stakes, so I wonder what the end game of his research on the beacon is.

I don't think Trent is working for the Chained Oblivion. I think the Assembly is just interested in expanding their own power, and are just being infiltrated by people like Vence. The Chained Oblivion cult gave the Beacons to the Assembly to help start a major war that would hide the symptoms of the Chained Oblivion's influence seeping into the world.

I think Trent either doesn't know that the Beacons were given to them, or just didn't want to admit that to the King. I have no idea what they really want to do with dunamancy, but it could be a situation like Halas. Maybe they are looking for a way to achieve true immortality. If Caleb's research is relevant to the story, they could even be searching for a way to control fate and time, either to ensure the Empire lasts forever, or so that the Assembly can become a world power. Either way I get the feeling that Trent's faction at least isn't looking to end reality, but probably shape or rule it somehow.
 

Naijaboy

The Fallen
Mar 13, 2018
15,297
This was how I pictured the climax of that fight:


3iot0i.jpg
 
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Dream Machine

Dream Machine

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,085
I'm not sure how pumat primes duplicates work, but I feel like matt could have at least given us a prime death, after which he still lives on in a reduced form via his clones. At least have him just passed away as tehy come up and they need to do a skill check revivify to try to save him.

I'd like a little consequence, and he feels a little too Gilmore-y at this point, even repeating plot beats from campaign 1.
I don't think Trent is working for the Chained Oblivion. I think the Assembly is just interested in expanding their own power, and are just being infiltrated by people like Vence. The Chained Oblivion cult gave the Beacons to the Assembly to help start a major war that would hide the symptoms of the Chained Oblivion's influence seeping into the world.

I think Trent either doesn't know that the Beacons were given to them, or just didn't want to admit that to the King. I have no idea what they really want to do with dunamancy, but it could be a situation like Halas. Maybe they are looking for a way to achieve true immortality. If Caleb's research is relevant to the story, they could even be searching for a way to control fate and time, either to ensure the Empire lasts forever, or so that the Assembly can become a world power. Either way I get the feeling that Trent's faction at least isn't looking to end reality, but probably shape or rule it somehow.
yeah, I'm just spitballing on what the overall plot could be and how/if this all ties together. There's a lot of converging paths that could all be connected, or just be unrelated other than having to do with the M9. It feels like the pace is picking up—even with their pace of leveling up— so I have to imagine we're going into the final big bad plot soon
 

Wunder

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,797
I'm not sure how pumat primes duplicates work, but I feel like matt could have at least given us a prime death, after which he still lives on in a reduced form via his clones. At least have him just passed away as tehy come up and they need to do a skill check revivify to try to save him.

I'd like a little consequence, and he feels a little too Gilmore-y at this point, even repeating plot beats from campaign 1.

If they are Simulacra, which I believe they are, then they would have Pumat's original capabilities from when they were first made. He said they'd used all their spell slots so they are probably pretty useless and would melt after reaching 0 hitpoints or whenever the 3 wizards that cast the spell either died or dispelled them. I think Matt could've easily fucked with them by having Pumat die and then reconstitute into a Clone back in Zadash, but I'm not too fussed. CR isn't really the best campaign for that kind of stuff so I'm not too bothered.
 
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Dream Machine

Dream Machine

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,085
Hm. I hadn't considered a love story between Caleb and Pumat until now, but yeah, I'd be into that.
After Pumat Swole, how could you not? lol
If they are Simulacra, which I believe they are, then they would have Pumat's original capabilities from when they were first made. He said they'd used all their spell slots so they are probably pretty useless and would melt after reaching 0 hitpoints or whenever the 3 wizards that cast the spell either died or dispelled them. I think Matt could've easily fucked with them by having Pumat die and then reconstitute into a Clone back in Zadash, but I'm not too fussed. CR isn't really the best campaign for that kind of stuff so I'm not too bothered.
It's fine. I'd just like a gut punch every now and then to make consequences like death (even of fan faves) seem possible. Molly was an incredible moment for this campaign, and I think they can afford more than one of those per campaign. Especially in one specifically set in the middle of a war.
 

Wunder

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,797
After Pumat Swole, how could you not? lol

It's fine. I'd just like a gut punch every now and then to make consequences like death (even of fan faves) seem possible. Molly was an incredible moment for this campaign, and I think they can afford more than one of those per campaign. Especially in one specifically set in the middle of a war.

Yeah I agree, nothing happened with Dairon or Pumat, and while the group seems to be in a precarious situation, I feel like they've completely done a 180 and have now solved everything in one fell swoop
 
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Dream Machine

Dream Machine

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,085
Yeah I agree, nothing happened with Dairon or Pumat, and while the group seems to be in a precarious situation, I feel like they've completely done a 180 and have now solved everything in one fell swoop
I do like how Trent is just there like a sword a damocles waiting to ruin their neat and tidy plan to end the war, though.

It feels like some meta mind games matt is doing with the players and the audience that are very fitting for what we know about Trent
 

Wunder

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,797
Yeah I have to rewatch the episode because I only caught the tail end of the Dwendal convo so I don't actually know the full details of what happened. Do they have time to go to Travelercon before the meeting, or are they being sheparded back to Xhorhas now?
 
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Dream Machine

Dream Machine

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,085
Yeah I have to rewatch the episode because I only caught the tail end of the Dwendal convo so I don't actually know the full details of what happened. Do they have time to go to Travelercon before the meeting, or are they being sheparded back to Xhorhas now?
they're being led to rest at an all expenses paid fancy hotel in rexintrum and then planning what to do after that.

I'm a little shaky on the timeframe of travelercon, but I think they still have a few weeks.
 

timedesk

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,937
It's fine. I'd just like a gut punch every now and then to make consequences like death (even of fan faves) seem possible. Molly was an incredible moment for this campaign, and I think they can afford more than one of those per campaign. Especially in one specifically set in the middle of a war.

A very dark part of me wants the M9 to find out Kiri is either dead or severely injured from the attack on Hupperdook. As for Pumat, Matt probably could have gone further in the name of consequences. As it is, the party could have just held onto his body and tried to revive him over the next few days. It would honestly have been kind of funny if the first Resurrection Ritual of Campaign 2 had been for the friendly shopkeep they have spent maybe a few hours with over the entire year.

Yeah I have to rewatch the episode because I only caught the tail end of the Dwendal convo so I don't actually know the full details of what happened. Do they have time to go to Travelercon before the meeting, or are they being sheparded back to Xhorhas now?

I think they are being housed in some fancy part of the capitol. My impression was that they were expected to contact the Dynasty and start the process of brokering a peace deal as soon as they had recovered. Travelercon is like a little over a month away I think, so they might deal with that after the Dynasty negotiations. It feels like the Empire is going to put pressure on the M9 to prove themselves quickly, or they will label them traitors or something.
 

SilentMike03

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,083


Everyone leveled up!

During the convo in the throne room, it was surmised that the Cult attached itself to the attack on the city. My initial thought was that whomever convinced the Bright Queen to attack the city was their mole and had overplayed their hand. But maybe it's just coincidence? I have to wonder what the original goal was in the attack. There wasn't sufficient forces to sack the enemy capital, so maybe it was just a psychological move? To let the Empire know that the Dynasty can strike them right in the heart whenever they want?
 

Cwyll

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
165
Still unsure about how many layers there are to this deception. Pumat is a popular NPC, and it's not a killer campaign, so I doubted he'd die off screen. I did think he's lose an eye or something though. Trent will head off now and set up a subtle spell or two on the (real or fake) beacon, and send someone along with it to distract Brenn (such as Astrid).
 
Oct 29, 2017
13,513
Still unsure about how many layers there are to this deception. Pumat is a popular NPC, and it's not a killer campaign, so I doubted he'd die off screen. I did think he's lose an eye or something though. Trent will head off now and set up a subtle spell or two on the (real or fake) beacon, and send someone along with it to distract Brenn (such as Astrid).
This is me when someone is brought bellow 1 HP. Where are the scars?!
 

Luigi87

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,105
I was hoping Pumat would be captured or something, just so I could make the joke the last Pumat is in captivity.
 

SilentMike03

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,083
"She wants her fucking Beacon back." - Beauregard to King Dwendel. What a legend.

Seriously though, Dwendel sucks. #TeamXhorhas #BrightQueen4lyfe #FuckTheEmpire
 

Cwyll

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
165
Get Dwendel and the bright queen in a room together and lock the door.
Let them sort it out ;)
 

eyeball_kid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,236
I'm a little shaky on the timeframe of travelercon, but I think they still have a few weeks.

Hm, I feel like it's a lot closer than that, since they burned what...over a month in the Happy Fun Ball?

There's so many plots and political machinations in this campaign that I'm feeling like I did when I played FFXII -- kind of detached from what's going on and wanting more emotional weight. It felt like Yasha was so glossed over in that episode so they could move on to the next bit of political drama. I don't really care what the Assembly is doing or about Trent; they're all theoretical baddies who I've told do bad things, but I haven't SEEN any of that. That's storytelling 101; show, don't tell.

I feel like the height of this campaign so far was the Iron Shepards arc because there were personal stakes. A player was dead, others kidnapped to be sold into slavery. We haven't felt any real personal consequences since then, other than worries about loved ones of the characters. And I don't totally feel like Yasha counts for that because it's too meta -- she was deliberately taken off the board by Matt because of her IRL schedule. For me, I didn't feel the weight of that because Matt wasn't going to put her in a position where she'd lose her character over it.

The M9 -- by deciding to play both sides -- have certainly set themselves up to be royally fucked, but I question whether Matt will really bring the consequences of their actions to bear upon them.
 

Sensei

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
6,525
I like Jester a lot but i couldnt care less about travelercon or any of Jester's plot threads

its hard to get excited at the idea of them taking more detours so that Jester can *checks notes* reunite her parents with each other and *checks notes again* go to her cult convention
 

SilentMike03

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,083
Maybe I'm getting my expectations too high, but I have to think that Matt's got something up his sleeve with TravelerCon. After all the stuff they've been through, to have it just be like a mixer for Traveler followers would be a letdown. Either we're going to find out that the Traveler is up to No Good or something bad is going to happen.
 

Reinhard

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,604
Maybe I'm getting my expectations too high, but I have to think that Matt's got something up his sleeve with TravelerCon. After all the stuff they've been through, to have it just be like a mixer for Traveler followers would be a letdown. Either we're going to find out that the Traveler is up to No Good or something bad is going to happen.
I hope the ancient white dragon attacks it. Jester left a Traveler statute in her lair.
 

timedesk

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,937
Maybe I'm getting my expectations too high, but I have to think that Matt's got something up his sleeve with TravelerCon. After all the stuff they've been through, to have it just be like a mixer for Traveler followers would be a letdown. Either we're going to find out that the Traveler is up to No Good or something bad is going to happen.

Travellercon feels like it is going to be something unsettling at the very least. Jester has an idealized view of the Traveler based on how lonely her childhood was, but the Gnoll follower specifically called him one of the "Fair Folk". Matt has never shied away from how freaking dangerous the Fey are in his setting. Hell, one of the biggest Traveler theories is that he is Artagan, AKA let me strangle you to death just for kicks.

My bet is Travelercon is going to start off very cordial and friendly, and shift into something darker. It feels like its going to be where he announces what the cult is going to do moving forward. A sort of come out of the shadows moment where he gives them orders to attack or something.

I hope the ancient white dragon attacks it. Jester left a Traveler statute in her lair.

That would be kind of amazing. I wonder if the Traveler would be strong enough to make the fight winnable. If he is that just makes the Traveler even creepier.
 
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Dream Machine

Dream Machine

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,085
Can you fucking imagine if The Traveler is another guise of The Chained Oblivion like The Angel of Irons? Tricking Jester and others into doing its will under the guise of another "god"s cult, and we're watching a new faction for it being formed in real time. Big chaotic energy, after all

That would be an amazing reveal that takes advantage of what we've learned about how the Chained Oblivion operates. Matt would ascend somehow further into DM godhood.
 

Wunder

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,797
Can you fucking imagine if The Traveler is another guise of The Chained Oblivion like The Angel of Irons? Tricking Jester and others into doing its will under the guise of another "god"s cult, and we're watching a new faction for it being formed in real time. Big chaotic energy, after all

That would be an amazing reveal that takes advantage of what we've learned about how the Chained Oblivion operates. Matt would ascend somehow further into DM godhood.

Well unless Matt has somehow tricked Jester into leaving dicks in key, various locations that turn out to be runes and symbols for Tharizdun, I don't think that twist would be that meaningful. Jester hasn't done anything for the Traveler yet and we have no idea who the other followers are
 
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Dream Machine

Dream Machine

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,085
Well unless Matt has somehow tricked Jester into leaving dicks in key, various locations that turn out to be runes and symbols for Tharizdun, I don't think that twist would be that meaningful. Jester hasn't done anything for the Traveler yet and we have no idea who the other followers are
I don't know man, there's very creepy vibes with the traveler just under the surface. The way he took advantage of a lonely little girl to make her completely loyal to him. The way Matt plays him. There's just something... off

That's why I said we're seeing the beginning of a new cult for him. They haven't done much yet because Jester's literally out gathering members for herself before they do whatever it is he wants from them.

Even if it's not the chained oblivion and is actually artagon or something similar, we're definitely in for a twist or a reveal, right? It would be so weird if the traveler is just a cool guy after all of this. The Traveler and Jester's whole domain is about trickery and causing chaos.
 

Wunder

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,797
I don't know man, there's very creepy vibes with the traveler just under the surface. The way he took advantage of a lonely little girl to make her completely loyal to him. The way Matt plays him. There's just something... off

That's why I said we're seeing the beginning of a new cult for him. They haven't done much yet because Jester's literally out gathering members for herself before they do whatever it is he wants from them.

Even if it's not the chained oblivion and is actually artagon or something similar, we're definitely in for a twist or a reveal, right? It would be so weird if the traveler is just a cool guy after all of this. The Traveler and Jester's whole domain is about trickery and causing chaos.

Yeah there's definitely been a feeling of the other shoe dropping, but it's been expected since the start I hope Matt has something else up his sleeve. He also talked about The Purple Man and how that relationship was similar to Yasha and Obann. I don't know if having yet another creepy, abusive relationship is that great
 

Reinhard

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,604
This would be great, but aren't white dragons like super dumb compared to other dragons? Hopefully this one is at least smart enough to figure out how to find them.
They are much dumber than other dragons, but aren't feral beasts, especially not an ancient version which have an average intelligence of 10. Also, white dragons are famous for holding grudges forever and know every piece of their treasure horde. So I imagine some items missing plus the appearance of the Traveler statute means the dragon will be on the hunt for vengeance. Although I imagine she would need some aid in tracking down Traveler Con.
 

Belfast

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,883
Hm, I feel like it's a lot closer than that, since they burned what...over a month in the Happy Fun Ball?

There's so many plots and political machinations in this campaign that I'm feeling like I did when I played FFXII -- kind of detached from what's going on and wanting more emotional weight. It felt like Yasha was so glossed over in that episode so they could move on to the next bit of political drama. I don't really care what the Assembly is doing or about Trent; they're all theoretical baddies who I've told do bad things, but I haven't SEEN any of that. That's storytelling 101; show, don't tell.

I feel like the height of this campaign so far was the Iron Shepards arc because there were personal stakes. A player was dead, others kidnapped to be sold into slavery. We haven't felt any real personal consequences since then, other than worries about loved ones of the characters. And I don't totally feel like Yasha counts for that because it's too meta -- she was deliberately taken off the board by Matt because of her IRL schedule. For me, I didn't feel the weight of that because Matt wasn't going to put her in a position where she'd lose her character over it.

The M9 -- by deciding to play both sides -- have certainly set themselves up to be royally fucked, but I question whether Matt will really bring the consequences of their actions to bear upon them.

yeah but Travis and Laura were taken off the board due to their real life schedule, too. It's possible none of them would have been taken by the slavers and that Molly would still be alive.
 

Deleted member 1190

User-requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,663
So, this has been bothering me. But didn't Jester leave Sprinkle with Yeza, along with Nugget?

When they were with Reani, she even researched what to feed him (instead of candy) in the library, and then sent Yeza a message about it.

Am I completely misremembering things? Did she take him back at some point that I'm just forgetting, or are they the ones that forgot?

Edit: Nope. I misremembered. She just left the dog with him.
 
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Reinhard

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,604
So, this has been bothering me. But didn't Jester leave Sprinkle with Yeza, along with Nugget?

When they were with Reani, she even researched what to feed him (instead of candy) in the library, and then sent Yeza a message about it.

Am I completely misremembering things? Did she take him back at some point that I'm just forgetting, or are they the ones that forgot?
Nah, only Nugget was left there. Sprinkle is always around Jesters neck and assumed to snuggle into her armor during combat, although that doesn't explain how Sprinkle survives any AOE attacks or falling damage, I guess Jester cushions the fall....
 

timedesk

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,937
Does anyone remember where the Stone family lives? It was by the ocean or on an Island right? If so, then maybe when the go to Travelercon they can make a stop there. The Empire/Dynasty storyline is great, but there are a lot of plot threads still hanging on the coast. Attending Travelercon could be the excuse Matt needs to bring reintegrate Uk'otoa and Cad's pilgrimage.

If the Stone family turns out to be dysfunctional, or if any of his family didn't make it to them I could see Cad have a major crisis of faith. Poor guy is really starting to miss his family, and that pain might force him to doubt his views on destiny. I feel awful for saying it, but I want to see what happens when Cad loses that sense of assurance his faith provides.
 
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Dream Machine

Dream Machine

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,085
Is the place with the oasis and crystals from Cad's visions the same island as travelercon? Even if it wasn't meant to be, maybe matt should make it so and merge some plot threads.
 

timedesk

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,937
Is the place with the oasis and crystals from Cad's visions the same island as travelercon? Even if it wasn't meant to be, maybe matt should make it so and merge some plot threads.

That would be a really cool idea. What if the Traveler brought them there to deface/steal a relic from a sacred Wildmother temple? Jester has never had a problem defacing or insulting other deities, but the Wildmother has helped revive her friends, and helped Fjord with Uk'otoa, she might actually have a conflict of loyalty in that situation.
 

Deleted member 55966

User requested account closure
Banned
Apr 15, 2019
1,231
Does anyone remember where the Stone family lives? It was by the ocean or on an Island right? If so, then maybe when the go to Travelercon they can make a stop there. The Empire/Dynasty storyline is great, but there are a lot of plot threads still hanging on the coast. Attending Travelercon could be the excuse Matt needs to bring reintegrate Uk'otoa and Cad's pilgrimage.

If the Stone family turns out to be dysfunctional, or if any of his family didn't make it to them I could see Cad have a major crisis of faith. Poor guy is really starting to miss his family, and that pain might force him to doubt his views on destiny. I feel awful for saying it, but I want to see what happens when Cad loses that sense of assurance his faith provides.
I think the party's grown enough due to Cad's influence that seeing him falter would work fine. Jester and Caleb are on the verge though so we might be close to multi-member emotional breakdowns.

Finally finished this episode and the Darrington brigade one shot. Remember a couple months back when everyone was all upset about how this campaign was handled? Crazy how a couple weeks worth of good episodes can really pick the show back up. Yasha not really being discussed this episode made sense since they were under watch and put in some crucial RP, but I do hope they really start exploring what integrating her back into the group looks like. Ashley was definitely on point with all the questions she asked though. There were a couple times I was like "Oh yeah, she wasn't really there for that moment."

I will say I agree with eyeball_kid; there's so many threads it's hard to feel some of the stakes. Might just be because we're in the middle of a lot of stuff and it'll work itself out through eventual episodes.
 
I've had the notion that although the Traveler is something darker than Jester believes him to be, he almost takes pity on her innocence. As if he really does feel sorry she thinks he's just about leaving graffiti everywhere.

I just feel there's no way that the "convention" isn't being set up to shatter Jester's illusions. Traveler being the Chained Oblivion seems a little too obvious given the reveal about the Angel of Irons though.