Spider-Vice

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22
Greenrock, is still the greatest gta forums member ever
Greetings, you probably know me well.

As for CP2077, even with it being alpha footage it looked really damn solid. I was stoked all the way through and I really thought the gameplay and the mechanics were great. I hope CDPR doesn't cut too much, but I was absolutely satisfied. These guys could be serious competition in the open world genre in the future, tbh.
 

Yuuber

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,561
I know I'm late to the discussion, but I'd just like to point out the graphics and world building look absolutely amazing, but the gameplay itself did nothing for me.

Really excited nevertheless. I just hope to Glob it isn't as medicre as TW3 gameplay wise.
 

RalchAC

Member
Oct 27, 2017
825
What connotation? I asked other posters to somehow try and explain to me why calling two characters, one who is male and one who is female, cunts, is an example of some sort of targetted gender discrimination.

I also suggested, as I'm sure it will be the case, that if the MC was male "cunts" would still be said to the two attackers.

Also, if people in the topic are going to argue to remove context, then wouldn't bitch also be off-limits?

Words have meanings, connotations and origins. In Spanish, people use a pejorative synonym of way to indicate cowardice, to give a different example. The word itself may be used without malice (hell, if done it quite a bit in the past and it's something that I try to avoid now), but there is still much more behind the curtains.

I'd say, yeah, again, bitch would probably be something to be careful about. The problem is the continuity and naturalization of those words, especially when there are alternatives that exist and lack those kind of connotations. If they used a neutral insult, you wouldn't have noticed. But words are perpetuated by its use, and as such its us, the speakers, to decide what are kept and which aren't.

Writers must pay attention, think of what they're writing and not just follow what everyone else says. Changing cunt for a synonym takes a few seconds, makes no difference, and keeps a more consistent and inclusive power fantasy for all parts involved.

Again, if the use of sexist language and language with sexist connotations is something that's actually important, or necessary to the character, then go ahead. Awful people are allowed and should exist in narratives. Hell, Donald Draper (Mad Men, TV series) its one of my favorite characters in media and he's definitely not a good person. But that character, flawed as he was, made sense and those more unsettling parts of him were important to the story the series was trying to tell.

A writer has a duty to the language he uses, because the use he gives to it can influence how it will be shaped and used in the future. Everyone is free to write however they please, but they're equally free to critizise something they don't like.

Not to derail this convo further but...son of a bitch? How is that not sexist?
I'd argue son of a bitch is more related to being low class, and associated with crime (most of them would end up in low class orphanages), so I'd say the connotation is different, but I may be wrong and I can stand corrected.
 

Marossi

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,806
I find it funny when people say there's no problem with the word and that Era is turning into whatever extremist view they have

They are the same persons who 10 years ago would say there's no problem with the N word.
 

Benji

Self Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,114
1.2 million views and almost 110k likes in 6 hours

The thirst for this game is very real
 

n00bs7ay3r

Attempted to circumvent ban with an alt-account
Banned
Aug 21, 2018
1,159
I did not have a problem with the language specifically but I did take issue with the fact that V wakes up next to Jackie in that early scene. They focused so much on your character being YOUR character. What if my character is not attracted to Jackie and doesn't want to sleep with him?
 

Deleted member 1041

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,725
More annoyed the stereotypical Spanish speaker just has to throw in Spanish words in every damn sentence. Shits in TV, movies, games, etc. In my experience we don't speak that way unless it's with other Spanish speakers. As for the cussing, if it's done well it's fine otherwise it's try hard af.

Kinda bummed it's locked to first person but can't wait for this.

seriously, as someone who hangs out with alotta Mexican friends and am hispanic myself, I don't randomly spout spanish words.
 

Aldi

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,567
United Kingdom
Just to be clear, we're ok with people murdering others of different race and sexualities in cold blood? Just not with the offensive language they use before they plunge the knife/swing the bat/pull the trigger?

It's late, I'm tired, and I've a had a drink. This thread has confused me.
 

Rayne

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,607
My best friends are Mexican. Some things they refer to, they always refer to in Spanish even when they're speaking to me.

Yep alot of the mexicans I know speak like this too. (Though they're usually speaking to audience that sometimes only speaks english so they translate themselves before anyone can ask).
 

Rappy

Member
Oct 28, 2017
846
I get the feeling the press saw something different to this. It's the only explanation I can come up with. Maybe that's why the video took so long to be shown publicly? They were re-recording the demo with console visuals and the press saw something closer to high end PC?

It at least gives us a more realistic idea of how it will look. Instead of having another Witcher 3/watchdogs situation.
Most people did not praise the graphics. They praised the design and ambition on what the game is supposed to have. A city full of people like that has not really been done yet.
 

B.O.O.M.

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,945
Watched it. Game looks very interesting. Lots of details on many aspects of gameplay. But I do feel like there was a bit of overhyping by media outlets on this one. Perhaps I'm in the minority with that sentiment. But either way should be a solid game
 

PSqueak

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,464
I always thought Pussy, as an insult came from "pussy cat" and was completely independent of Pussy also becoming slang for Vagina, but we cannot ignore that both meanings are widely used causing this whole new layer of potential misogyny.
 

Shy

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
18,520
Post on your actual account.
NtUg6k9.gif

has gamersyde gotten the footage up yet?
Not yet. I keep refreshing, and will post the link as soon as it goes up on the site.
 

janusff

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
16,947
Austin, TX
So just saw the complete demo play through and I thought it was impressive as hell. Great art direction. Game felt super dense and kinda wonder how they’ll pull it off. And how big the map is. I mean, it seemed like we didn’t hit up that large of a section of the city. All the destinations seems pretty close to one another.

But yeah the world building they’re doing here is super impressive. Haven’t seen anything like it. Seems incredibly thorough, and fleshed out.

That brief nighttime footage looked hype as hell.

Graphics look great but I don’t think it’s something that can’t run on current gen consoles. Perhaps the number of npcs on screen though, that shit will buckle the consoles for sure. But in regards to raw graphics, game looked great and completely doable on PS4.

Loved the look of the menus as well. And customization looked good too. Gunplay looked good, particularly the latter portion where you got to double jump and shit. And yeah the claw arms where hype.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,481
United Kingdom
It's also borderline impossible to have discussions on game design when 80% of the thread is focused on arguing over who said a bad word or a random joke in the Doom Eternal gameplay video a few weeks ago. It's beyond tiring.
Stupid politics first, always.

Are you like me delighted this game is delivering the third instalment of the Deus Ex trilogy?

Mankind Divided's cliffhanger finally wrapped up.
 

tuxfool

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,841
I did not have a problem with the language specifically but I did take issue with the fact that V wakes up next to Jackie in that early scene. They focused so much on your character being YOUR character. What if my character is not attracted to Jackie and doesn't want to sleep with him?
That wasn't Jackie
 

StuBurns

Self Requested Ban
Banned
Nov 12, 2017
7,273
I did not have a problem with the language specifically but I did take issue with the fact that V wakes up next to Jackie in that early scene. They focused so much on your character being YOUR character. What if my character is not attracted to Jackie and doesn't want to sleep with him?
Then you probably don't have to?

The VO straight away talks about social options. The implication being the player decided to sleep with him the night before.
 

jelly

Member
Oct 26, 2017
29,730
Altered Carbon on Netflix suffers from that not so great dialogue and delivery. I don't think it's that bad in this video, maybe it's just that new feeling and you'll settle into it.
 

KORNdog

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
8,001
Regarding cunt. If the character that said it was written as a sexist, because sexists exist and would exist in the dystopian shit scape that is cyberpunk. Wouldn't it be acceptable and understandable for that character to then say cunt? Like I understand being offended by the word or not liking the word, that's the point, but in regards to the character that's been written, it seems weird to want to censor them. The whole point of that character being so repugnant is because he uses that language. If he called them "meanies" instead it doesn't have the same effect.

I mean, its not like the protagonist is using the word. It's some shit stain bad guy trying to provoke the player into a boss fight in a world that is clearly morally bankrupt. THAT is the story. THAT is the characters. I expect the worst kind of language in a world like that filled with people like that. Its 's no different to the hound in game of thrones to me
 

TheDave545

Member
Nov 4, 2017
694
Jesus Christ, that was like Dredd x Blade Runner x Shadow Run x Ghost In The Shell all rolled into one....I'm fuckin there day one.

And the comments about the word cunt are hilarious in here...my faves are, the developers should show more authenticity seeing as they've set it in America (that's the gist of it from a load of different comments).......AUTHENTICITY?

AUTHENTICITY.........it's a cyber punk game set in 2077 about a bunch of fictitious characters in a fictional future......WHAT IS THIS AUTHENTICITY YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT?
 

Deleted member 1759

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,582
Europe
I did not have a problem with the language specifically but I did take issue with the fact that V wakes up next to Jackie in that early scene. They focused so much on your character being YOUR character. What if my character is not attracted to Jackie and doesn't want to sleep with him?
That‘ll be up to you in the game. They can‘t show all possible scenarios in the demo.
 

FusedAtoms

Member
Jul 21, 2018
3,198
I did not have a problem with the language specifically but I did take issue with the fact that V wakes up next to Jackie in that early scene. They focused so much on your character being YOUR character. What if my character is not attracted to Jackie and doesn't want to sleep with him?
I don't think that was Jackie based on how he looked and what the commentator says
 

Mik2121

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,706
Japan
Ugh... came to the thread to see what was up after a few hours, and now everybody is talking about swear words...? Why is it that people barely mention it in movies yet in games it’s a massive offense? They are being used in a scene where it sorta “makes sense” (or at least, can be somewhat explained). It’s not like they use those words when doing random chat about the weather.

Edit: and don’t get me wrong, I’m not in favor of using those words (in fact i never do myself and don’t like to see other people around me use them), but criticizing a product like this for using them in certain circumstances feels like a bit too much?
 

Decado

Member
Dec 7, 2017
1,276
So dismemberment isn't model damage now!? Not sure what you mean.
I did not see any dismemberment or any texture/model damage whatsoever. I didn't watch the whole thing, but saw enough that it should have been clear if it was currently implemented. I'd be surprised if the final game didn't have it since it was in TW3, though.

Being story oriented doesn't have to mean making everything take forever just "because"... Fine if you can skip the scenes, I guess.
 

kkutre

Member
May 29, 2018
18
"It's the status quo, therefore not an issue." You know what's also in a ton of media, a dude who speaks Spanglish to the point of parody. That doesn't mean that we should just accept it everytime.

As a Spaniard I can say that you complain too much about this. Jesus, let them create their game. Don't buy it if you think it's not for you, but please stop trying to impregnate your political/ideological/whatever ideas into everything.

It is specially infuriating because this behavior (mainly) comes from Americans, who somehow cannot wrap their heads around the fact that this kind of product has an international audience and, in this case, it is made in Europe. I suppose we have a thicker skin here.
 

TheMango55

Banned
Nov 1, 2017
5,788
Game looks really good, but it's not as mindblowing as maybe I was led to believe by gaming outlets. It's certainly something that could probably look as good as what was shown on a X1X and could probably run with lowered graphics and possibly reduced crowd size on base models. I think this is an Early 2020 game.


You literally did not read my posts if you didn't get my argument.

Once again, I'm sick and tired of gendered insults like "pussy" and "cunt" being normalized, I'm sick of my entire gender being constantly insulted and read as "weaklings" and "cowards", and I don't care about any of the other harsh language being used in the game within this video, so it's not just a matter of fuckin' "pearl clutching" or whatever other stupid straw man you want to put up.

Cunt isn't used to mean weakling or coward though, it's the same generic "jerk" analogue as calling someone a "dick"

And when the main character uses it she isn't even using it as a gendered insult, she is literally talking about the body part.
 

Deleted member 888

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,361
You keep focusing on the fight scene instead of the other stuff. I wonder why? How do you feel about that elevator line?

Remind me of that, or link to it in the video. I seen the last 15 mins or so live, from entering to the trade and had to watch the first 30 mins on recap at a slightly rushed speed before football kicked off.

Words have meanings, connotations and origins. In Spanish, people use a pejorative synonym of way to indicate cowardice, to give a different example. The word itself may be used without malice (hell, if done it quite a bit in the past and it's something that I try to avoid now), but there is still much more behind the curtains.

I'd say, yeah, again, bitch would probably be something to be careful about. The problem is the continuity and naturalization of those words, especially when there are alternatives that exist and lack those kind of connotations. If they used a neutral insult, you wouldn't have noticed. But words are perpetuated by its use, and as such its us, the speakers, to decide what are kept and which aren't.

Writers must pay attention, think of what they're writing and not just follow what everyone else says. Changing cunt for a synonym takes a few seconds, makes no difference, and keeps a more consistent and inclusive power fantasy for all parts involved.

Again, if the use of sexist language and language with sexist connotations is something that's actually important, or necessary to the character, then go ahead. Awful people are allowed and should exist in narratives. Hell, Donald Draper (Mad Men, TV series) its one of my favorite characters in media and he's definitely not a good person. But that character, flawed as he was, made sense and those more unsettling parts of him were important to the story the series was trying to tell.

A writer has a duty to the language he uses, because the use he gives to it can influence how it will be shaped and used in the future. Everyone is free to write however they please, but they're equally free to critizise something they don't like.

I'd argue son of a bitch is more related to being low class, and associated with crime (most of them would end up in low class orphanages), so I'd say the connotation is different, but I may be wrong and I can stand corrected.

The mob boss in question is obviously the lowest of the low. He almost chooses to kill you where you stand before being calmed down by the allure of money. Then it appears you double-crossed him, because you yourself were double-crossed. So yeah, he's angry... then you kill him.

Either way I'm happier if you're just moving towards I don't like the word and want it removed, rather than trying to spin elaborate comparisons to real life sexism.
 

Bernd Lauert

Banned
May 27, 2018
1,812
I find it funny when people say there's no problem with the word and that Era is turning into whatever extremist view they have

They are the same persons who 10 years ago would say there's no problem with the N word.

But there is no problem with using the n-word in video games, as long as it's done appropriately. See GTA.
 

Deleted member 19533

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,873
I don't see the problem, and I'm American.

It's a nasty word, sure, but why would using it be off limits?

In a world where people are trying to kill you, isn't it weird that attempting to kill you is fine and fun, but calling a character a mean word is over the line?

It reminds me of Conan playing MK when he pointed out ripping Sonya Blade in half vertically is fine, but if they show a nipple, there'd be hell to pay.

You have to look at context: the setting, the people you're dealing with, how they're reacting to one another. This is a game aimed at mature audiences and it's meant to be harsh. If you can't handle that, it's fine, not every game is for everybody. Things shouldn't be changed to cater to people they're not meant to cater to, and they shouldn't have to censor their vision.
 

bshock

Self-requested permanent ban
Banned
Nov 3, 2017
1,394
Looks like a cool game in the vein of Deus Ex. Not too hyped over it but I’m sure I’ll end up getting it.
 

Vinc

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,955
"Cunt" and "pussy" are inherently gendered and misogynistic pejoratives, denying this is tantamount to denying the use of "gay" as an insult as being inherently homophobic even if you haven't heard it used that way before. Like, I didn't know that using the term gay as an insult was homophobic when referring to things that were decidedly not sexual orientation related when I was a teenager but I'm not a 14 year old dipshit anymore so...

It does make sense for a villain to use it because they're a bad guy using a gendered misogynistic insult, this is part of what makes them shitty. So yeah, I can accept how it's being used in the game but some idiots that can't accept that it's inherently gendered are exceptionally stupid.
1000% this. It's a shitty word to use, but I see nothing wrong with it being used in this game.
 

Deleted member 2913

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,126
So... are we actually able to discuss the game here or is it all just going to be blocked up by some swear words?
 

Stat

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,571
I'm so torn. On one hand, it looks cool.

But on the other hand, I don't get customization for a game that is first person. I won't ever see my character. I kinda wish the game was third person but oh well.

Also, it'd be nice if Jackie toned down the one liners. Feels super canned and I worry about hearing the same one over and over.
 

Eros

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,644
Yeah, I've heard people talking like that before, but every time my brain can't stop thinking 'why?'
It's not like they forget the word, so they must force them in just to sound cool?
It's just personal preference, but to me there is no reason why they should.

Btw, my native language is Spanish and I would never find a good enough reason to mix words from 2 different languages in a single sentence.

Yeah, just saying I see it happen on a regular basis. My friends do the reverse, as well. When they speak to their parents in Spanish, English words will pop up in the conversation.

It is kind of corny in this game, though.
 

ASilentProtagonist

Unshakable Resolve
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,030
I predicted back with the E3 trailer that this game will be huge. Close to 10 million copies within a year, and 95+ MC. Cdprojekt is not disappointing!