Wouldn't they still get those things after messaging first?
Yeah but only circumstance where that would happen on early contact would be if there is exchange of money.
This definitely isn't true. She's giving you a way to contact her directly, OUTSIDE of the dating app. You don't need a phone number to flirt or setup a date. Anyone having confidence issues or trouble with dating should check out Corey Wayne. He's a trumper dude, but his advice on women is super solid. I'd also recommend his book 3% man to kind of understand what mental state women are into.
Hmmm...
What's the reason to avoid a phone number, for security? Fair enough, if people are getting dates through Snapchat, and things go from there where if things work out they exchange phone numbers, great.
Well when reading some of these posts, it's way better than the alternative that they have, which is figuring it out on their own and being anxious. Not trying to brag, but a first date kiss for me is literally the equivalent of a handshake, so that's the mindset I'm coming from. Whether you want to admit it or not, these coaches (the good ones anyways), are talking from experience. They can get with girls. Tune their advice to your own moral compass or just deal with seeing everyone else get with girls. /shrug (Not you specifically)Hmmm...
Generally, I tell people do avoid these types of dating coaches. They usually have a very limited view on what makes a "man" with pretty toxic views on masculinity. They also tend to be pretty misogynistic and talk about women as if they're strange creatures that don't operate on human logic.
Yeah, it's mainly security. Some girls just don't want to give their number to some stranger they've never met before and that's perfectly fine. It's still an olive branch to get to know them better, see what they do with their lives, and vice versa. The number isn't the end all be all.
Yeah, I could totally cherry pick some stuff too. Also he's on Youtube so he's gotta generate clicks somehow. Those titles are usually pretty appealing towards dudes who just got dumped, fucked up a relationship.
I think it's a dangerous mindset and philosophy to promote. They can get with girls. So? Too many guys focus so hard on getting with girls no matter what that they stop seeing them as people and instead goals in a complicated game and this type of dating advice reinforces that mindset.
There are plenty of online resources that give good advice for dating that aren't poisoned with misogynistic viewpoints and toxic masculinity. You recommended Corey Wayne specifically so I just pointed out that I don't think he's a good idea.
Not trying to shit on you personally, because your point is sound. There's plenty to learn from guys like these when you're inexperienced. I just wish most of them didn't fall into the RedPill / PUA tropes.
Yeah, I feel that. Corey W was basically the dude who pulled me out of said dumps, which is why I mention him. I make sure to say: "dude is a weird trumper". I also agree of the slight PUA mindset of practice makes perfect, so they can figure out on their own what works for them and what doesn't, but obviously treating women like pieces of meat is a major no go from me. Like you said, I can just tune out the bullshit and take the actual good bits of advice that they offer.
Ouch, did you move because of her in the first place? If you 2 were no living next to her parents for all those years, I fail to see how them not liking you was such a big deal, but wtv. I think that all that you can do is move on, she's clearly not ready/doesn't want a serious relationship with you, best of luck.
I also was in the dumps of dating at one point in college. Googled some basic dating advice questions, which led to finding dating coaches like Corey Wayne (not sure if it was him specifically) and eventually found myself browsing a redpill reddit. While I didn't quite know what it was exactly when I went in there and I never actually made an account and joined that community, I read the posts and the toxic mindset creeped into my head. The fact that there were other guys there who were failing at dating made it an echo chamber of negative mindsets and an ultra focus on getting women no matter what. It had a way of reinforcing my negative feelings and justifying them. "Oh I'm not getting women because they're all like this!" or "Oh I'm not getting women because I'm not enough of a man!"
So even though I was in the dumps, my logic by default is "How can I fix this weakness of mine", not in a negative sense, but in a constructive kind of way. The streak of 3 women that I fumbled through, were super hot and smart. The fact that they were all really into me, but weren't shortly after hooking up / lots of text from me, sent me a clear message on what the issue was. So it wasn't that I was hopeless with women, but that I didn't know how to keep them around after I had initiated/hooked up with them a few times. Corey Wayne is actually really good in regards to this process, since he coaches to date/wife and not to PUA, at least in his first book.
Oh for sure, there are better dating coaches out there. There are just those ones that you look at their stuff and you can just tell there's a toxic mindset behind it.
Well, incels are one thing. If you become a full blown incel, there's definitely more to it but when it comes to taking in certain toxic PUA/Red Pill opinions, that's a real possibility. A guy can change for the better overall when it comes to dating but still believe in something like "shit tests" without even knowing it by that term. Which is why, at least for me, I don't feel comfortable suggesting a source of information that requires you to maneuver through so much toxic waste. I'd much rather just explain what I feel is a good lesson to take from there.
Oh I definitely agree with that. It's just that I can't expect people who are striving to self-improve to strictly rely on my posts on Era, so unfortunately, the best avenue is to follow people who have a lot of content and pick the values that most fit with their lifestyle. As far as shit tests go, I kind of like the term, since it's essentially identifying a specific behavior women have, but I guess I like the fact that it's a specific term than the term itself.
I see dating as a skill you can get better at, just like literally anything else. In the end, getting good at it has a positive effect on you and all the women you take out on dates as well, since you both have a great time. Eventually you find a girl that sweeps you off your feet or you just stay single forever, whatever floats your boat. This may be a bit risque on this forum, but girls do want guys who know what they're doing.
See, you and these dating gurus talk about "girls" like they are this monolithic entity that are the there for you, the "alpha male", to pick up as long as you know how to press the right combination of buttons. Basically, among other things, removing any agency that girls have in any of this. I hope you can see how this is extremely sexist.
That's my problem with it; "a specific behavior women have." Why do you think that? "Shit tests" are something anyone can do to you. Men do it too.
The craziest part to me is, like you said, sometimes the woman is viewed as enemy. Yet, they want to get with a woman. What kind of relationship are they even trying to get to if they view what they want as a game or enemy? The entire philosophy is just 'does not compute' for me, even if for some in-explainable reason I were to say 'ok so let's say they are a game instead of a person.' (Which I would never do, just to make doubly clear)
Ruh-roh... I don't like the sound of this. #team-airplanegirl ;)
I think you have it twisted around. Women are people, they are not the enemy. I love spending time with them. They also have all the right in the world to tell you to fuck off if you do something stupid or offensive.
So it's things that dude's do as well, but in general guys deal with "guy shit tests" differently, because it's one of the guys. However when it's a girl, they get anxious and lose their composure. That's basically the lesson in all of this, women are people too, not some superior (or inferior) life form. Just human beings. That's the #1 reason why guys have problems with girls, because they see them as another species entirely. My entire point is just that some of the shit that PUA dudes spew is complete sexist shit, but there are nuggets of wisdom that really do help with confidence / self-improvement, etc. It's up to the person doing the learning not to become a sexist douche.
Yeah, the common discourse about these "shit tests" is that women will throw them your way at some point and you need to pass them to prove your masculinity or worth or whatever. I just question why I'd ever want to be with someone (even casually) who is constantly testing me like that. I can only imagine that the guys who believe this aren't in healthy relationships but instead ones where they're always needing to maintain control. Sounds exhausting.
Marsha better stay off Airplane Girl's turf. She had her chance. #teamairplanegirl
I don't think people are saying that you can't talk about what you should do to have a better dating experience or how to be more attractive to people. Earlier you said something about it being "risque" to say guys should know what they're doing with dating. I don't think that's really the case or else this entire thread would not exist. It's just, like you said, PUA/coaches in general take it too far.
Yeah, I get that. Just bringing it up in here though stirred up the hornet's nest. Then people post they're having issues with self-confidence / anxiety / performance. They best way to overcome all of these things is learn and keep trying. While you're at it might as well steal some info from dudes who throw themselves into the "game" without subjecting yourself to the sexist shit they do to find out what works and what doesn't. Just because their angle is wrong, doesn't mean the information is worthless.
Don't drop everyone and don't uninstall the apps. It's way too early to fall this hard for a girl (the last one) and way too early to kill your app since you've been on 1-2 dates with those first girls. It's cool to think that last girl is definitely your type, but you never want to put all your eggs in one basket without even meeting her in person. Just keep going out on dates and being yourself, since I can guarantee that if you listen to those first girls and kill your app, they will lose interest quickly. Things will work themselves out.
I think how they word them is incredibly important. Like the image quote I posted earlier "women are constantly testing their (men) strength and worthiness to determine if they are confident and alpha or indecisive and beta."
Well, thank you for saying this so I don't have to spend the time saying it myself.
I probably get the most likes on Hinge and most of the girls are down to Earth which is nice. I guess it must be a location thing.
I feel like it's bugged or something. I'm bummed about it because I too have met great people off of it. Hinge is also one of the only apps that will ban you for repeatedly deleting your profile. Kind of annoying. I live in NYC and I'm fairly attractive with good success on the other stuff.
It might be or maybe something with the algorithm is only giving you really highly liked profiles. I've never used Hinge in NYC but I've used Tinder multiple times there and I always got the impression that being the big destination city that it is, you tend to see more people who live the high life than usual. At least for me, I saw a bunch of model-looking girls on Tinder there.
