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DukeBlueBall

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
9,059
Seattle, WA


His explanation is that some folks who worked on Warcraft 3, chief among them is Samwise Didier, are still there and want to work on Warcraft IV. Under their eventually new leadership, Blizzard teams will work on projects they want, so Warcraft IV has high priority in the pipeline.
 

Ojli

Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,652
Sweden
It's nice to hear that there might be people who actually want to make a game a lot of players are wishing for. Do not force anyone to make a game they have no passion for
 

Elven_Star

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,966
Sorry, but that ship has sailed. WoW destroyed the plot, and MOBAs destroyed the competitive scene. No SP, No MP. It's too late.
 

Snozz

Member
Dec 6, 2020
168
Definitely keeping expectations low on this one being as the lore has been absolutely decimated over the past few years. Even so, great if they can product the games they want to.
 

vegtro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
717
Wonder how a WC4 would coexist with WoW. Prequel of some sort or something from a different parallel universe?
 

rude

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,812
how big is blizzard? they're making diablo 4, overwatch 2, that survival game and an unannounced pen and paper style RPG on top of that.

i personally don't see modern day blizzard making an RTS even though I'd be interested in playing Warcraft 4.
 

Napalm_Frank

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
5,735
Finland
If it does happen I feel like one of the best approaches would for it to be sort of alternative take on WOTLK. It is a fan favourite expansion for the WoW crowd and is a direct continuation for the story where WC3 left off.

WoW continuity has been quite wacky lately and trying to fit both "canon" Warcraft 4 and retail WoW into a neat package could get messy.
 

Raide

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
16,596
After the WC remastered trouble, I am not sure this would work but maybe with MS involved, a good cleanup of ActiBlizz, maybe they can refocus on making good games again.

They should reboot Warcraft RTS and pull away from WoW.
 

Mbolibombo

Member
Oct 29, 2017
7,043
I just want a new multiplayer Warcraft so that wow ruined the story does not really matter for me personally.

Or just go way way back to pre current Warcraft lore
 

Brrandon

Member
Dec 13, 2019
3,073
how big is blizzard? they're making diablo 4, overwatch 2, that survival game and an unannounced pen and paper style RPG on top of that.

i personally don't see modern day blizzard making an RTS even though I'd be interested in playing Warcraft 4.
Blizzard has over 5,000 employees.
 

ehhsobee

Banned
Nov 11, 2019
95
United Kingdom
Cautiously optimistic about the future of Blizzard. Really hope this turns out to be true as I'd love nothing more than to get into some Warcraft/Starcraft again. I personally don't give a shit about the story of those games whatsoever, just give me some good RTS action.

Also, they could just make up some wacky Chromie shit and say it's an alternate history before the story got bad if the story beats put people off it.
 

//ARCANUM

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,404
I'd love for WarCraft 4 to just be a reboot of the whole story. Start fresh, clean slate. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 

Budi

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,883
Finland
I'm up for new Warcraft. I played a lot of Wow, for a long time too and I don't give a damn about the lore, never did. So bring it on!
 

ShinobiBk

One Winged Slayer
Member
Dec 28, 2017
10,121
Sorry, but that ship has sailed. WoW destroyed the plot, and MOBAs destroyed the competitive scene. No SP, No MP. It's too late.
And yet AoE came out (a far smaller ip than Warcraft) and has been a huge success with a healthy player base.
I can't stand when people talk in absolutes like this based on absolutely nothing.
If Blizzard were to make an actual good Warcraft game again people will play it
 

Raide

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
16,596
And yet AoE came out (a far smaller ip than Warcraft) and has been a huge success with a healthy player base.
I can't stand when people talk in absolutes like this based on absolutely nothing.
If Blizzard were to make an actual good Warcraft game again people will play it
Agreed. Done well, Warcraft RTS could be amazing.
 

grand

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,979
Summary: people there want to do it but Activision didn't want to but a console owner like Microsoft is likely to follow up on it

Not surprising. Could be applied to nearly all of Activision's IPs. Console owners always have an extra incentive to produce titles that aren't the most profitable.
 
Feb 16, 2018
2,685
it would be a good project for them imo

unlike some other blizzard sequels, wc4 could justify its existence even if the budget is smaller and the game doesn't revolutionize anything

it also makes more sense for potential console versions than SC3, even though i'd prefer SC3 get developed instead
 

BobLoblaw

This Guy Helps
Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,302
Even if it's not WC4, it's cool that they're looking forward to the fresh start.
 

Edward

▲ Legend ▲
Avenger
Oct 30, 2017
5,114
Sorry, but that ship has sailed. WoW destroyed the plot, and MOBAs destroyed the competitive scene. No SP, No MP. It's too late.
I've heard this about battle royal games, FPS games that aren't battle royals, MMOS and at one point the MOBA genre

No ship has ever sailed. Hell, look a the CRPG market over the last few years after it had been in a graveyard for so long.
 

Mivey

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,826
Sorry, but that ship has sailed. WoW destroyed the plot, and MOBAs destroyed the competitive scene. No SP, No MP. It's too late.
As for the plot, couldn't they pull something something similar to what Bethesda did with Elder Srolls Daggerfall, where they had six very different endings, that each affected the world in huge ways. So they just came up with some magical nonsense that said all of those things happened at the same time, somehow, and resolved contradictions where they came up in the plot of the next game.

Blizzard could just say how via some magical event, a lot of the things in WoW were undone or reshuffled, bringing the setting to wherever they need it to be for a WoW4 to make sense.
 

PianoBlack

Member
May 24, 2018
6,645
United States
Cool, I'd like to see it. Lots of paths they could take here without getting into conflict with WoW.

- prequel
- Reboot that reimagines the initial opening of the portal and then the flight to Lordaeron with separate factions for high elves or whatever.
- Parallel world/timelines
- Pretend WoW plot never existed and see if anyone cares.
 

LossAversion

The Merchant of ERA
Member
Oct 28, 2017
10,712
What kind of state is the Warcraft lore in right now? I moved on from WoW around the time of Cataclysm. Would they need to like... move into the distant future or do a soft reboot for Warcraft IV and/or WoW 2 after everything that has happened in WoW? I just know that people have been really underwhelmed with the way major characters have been treated and it sounds like the horde vs. alliance thing doesn't even make sense moving forward. Then again, I did not play the Warcraft games so I don't know how connected they are to WoW and I'm really asking this thinking about the prospect of a WoW 2. Assuming that Warcraft IV will connect to, if not lead into WoW 2.
 

MaxAugust

Member
Jan 28, 2018
3,149
I mean, that'd be great, but his reasoning sounds a bit overly optimistic honestly. Even still, it probably wouldn't come out for 4-5 years even as a smaller project.
 

Omnipotent

User requested ban
Banned
Feb 28, 2021
1,428
What kind of state is the Warcraft lore in right now? I moved on from WoW around the time of Cataclysm. Would they need to like... move into the distant future or do a soft reboot for Warcraft IV and/or WoW 2 after everything that has happened in WoW? I just know that people have been really underwhelmed with the way major characters have been treated and it sounds like the horde vs. alliance thing doesn't even make sense moving forward. Then again, I did not play the Warcraft games so I don't know how connected they are to WoW and I'm really asking this thinking about the prospect of a WoW 2. Assuming that Warcraft IV will connect to, if not lead into WoW 2.
Depending on the way things go in the next patch which is out in like a bit over a week, if they were really ballsy they have everything set up to really flip the script and start fresh. But given the way the last few years of the narrative have been going I really doubt that they will do anything interesting. Though they're holding back the last 2 bosses of the raid until the week after release cuz story spoilers or something, so who knows. But I have 0 faith in the current narrative team, though according to rumors a lot of the reason for the way things have been going is due to internal friction and the previous creative director, who has since been fired.
 

RelaxedOtter

Member
Oct 27, 2017
357
Microsoft paid to have Halo Wars 2 developed, where HW1 was massively smaller than Warcraft 3 or Starcraft 2. It is pretty much a given that Microsoft will be looking to fully explore the IPs they will get from this purchase - I would be astounded if a Warcraft 4 or another Starcraft doesn't get greenlit. It'll take a hell of a long time to release, though.
 

lvl 99 Pixel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,705
Not going to reinstall BNET, but the concept of genres being dead because another game exists is laughable.
 

Omnipotent

User requested ban
Banned
Feb 28, 2021
1,428
Microsoft paid to have Halo Wars 2 developed, where HW1 was massively smaller than Warcraft 3 or Starcraft 2. It is pretty much a given that Microsoft will be looking to fully explore the IPs they will get from this purchase - I would be astounded if a Warcraft 4 or another Starcraft doesn't get greenlit. It'll take a hell of a long time to release, though.
Hopefully MS will allow Blizz teams to receive actual budgets and resources and with everything moving around, decent management that isn't pulling resources and team members away from projects as well as an environment where people aren't being harassed. Maybe then they'll develop their games quicker.
 

Sterba

Member
Oct 25, 2017
268
Blizzard could just say how via some magical event, a lot of the things in WoW were undone or reshuffled, bringing the setting to wherever they need it to be for a WoW4 to make sense.

The big bad guy in WoW currently is trying to rewrite reality. While the heroes will clearly defeat him, could just say he did make a split universe or some stupid liner note shit.
 

Mirado

Member
Jul 7, 2020
1,187
Sorry, but that ship has sailed. WoW destroyed the plot, and MOBAs destroyed the competitive scene. No SP, No MP. It's too late.

I don't have a solution for the competitive stuff (but I honestly think you are overselling it, AoE did just fine and you don't need this to be some kind of hardcore esport to keep a MP playerbase, just give us good custom map tools and people will play ElementTD until they croak), but they can just toss out the WoW lore. Say it's in a different timeline, or WoW's in a different timeline, or whatever. There's no reason they need to twist themselves in knots trying to incorporate the WoW lore, especially if they take the stance that not all returning Warcraft players will have spent any significant time in WoW (myself included) so why waste the time trying to explain nearly twenty years of WoW story developments when you can just say "that shit isn't canon" or "this shit isn't canon" or "who the fuck cares what's canon and what isn't, we just want to make the best video game possible."
 

craven68

Member
Jun 20, 2018
4,550
how big is blizzard? they're making diablo 4, overwatch 2, that survival game and an unannounced pen and paper style RPG on top of that.

i personally don't see modern day blizzard making an RTS even though I'd be interested in playing Warcraft 4.
5k devs, they Can Do a lot of games ! ( It's the size of zenimax + Xbox game studio )
 

PapaDev

Member
Oct 26, 2017
574
How about they work on games they can get out in 2-3 years before attempting something like that. Rebuild confidence.
 

horkrux

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,733
We live on a timeline where AoE4 was just released last year and AoE2 recently got another addon. I think Warcraft 4 is a given under these circumstances
 

Protoman200X

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
8,563
N. Vancouver, BC, Canada
What kind of state is the Warcraft lore in right now? I moved on from WoW around the time of Cataclysm. Would they need to like... move into the distant future or do a soft reboot for Warcraft IV and/or WoW 2 after everything that has happened in WoW? I just know that people have been really underwhelmed with the way major characters have been treated and it sounds like the horde vs. alliance thing doesn't even make sense moving forward. Then again, I did not play the Warcraft games so I don't know how connected they are to WoW and I'm really asking this thinking about the prospect of a WoW 2. Assuming that Warcraft IV will connect to, if not lead into WoW 2.

At this time, the development team behind WoW have basically exhausted every possible avenue they have in the current state of the game and lore, outside of the Horde to focus on rebuilding after the Fourth War, the state of the Korkorn Elite, and the Echo Isles. They are literately running out of gods, established characters, and things to do because we as players have either slaughtered them in raids, have died off-screen, or have been unceremoniously turned evil. And quite honestly, we need NEW characters, not the same cast we've been lumped with for 20-odd years and to expand the factions we currently have.

Speaking personally, the story for Warcraft IV should focus on telling a narrative of a world weakened by constant war and all sides are just focusing on cleaning up the mess left behind. Its devastating effects, how leaders and heroes are made from commoners to a newly raised undead who are trying to make a difference. The story should have threats that are simply regular dragons or power hungry tyrants, just to lower the stakes and keep things at a reasonable level from how the MMO kept raising them to such comical extremes that it has diminished players interest.

A reformed horde, and the conflict that would arise from it, would be great storytelling material.
 
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ShinobiBk

One Winged Slayer
Member
Dec 28, 2017
10,121
Cool, I'd like to see it. Lots of paths they could take here without getting into conflict with WoW.

- prequel
- Reboot that reimagines the initial opening of the portal and then the flight to Lordaeron with separate factions for high elves or whatever.
- Parallel world/timelines
- Pretend WoW plot never existed and see if anyone cares.

This is the best option imo
Just treat them as different series with different stories. No reason to even say anything about parallel timelines, they're just separate cause they are and that's it lol.
 
OP
OP
DukeBlueBall

DukeBlueBall

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
9,059
Seattle, WA
I don't have a solution for the competitive stuff (but I honestly think you are overselling it, AoE did just fine and you don't need this to be some kind of hardcore esport to keep a MP playerbase, just give us good custom map tools and people will play ElementTD until they croak), but they can just toss out the WoW lore. Say it's in a different timeline, or WoW's in a different timeline, or whatever. There's no reason they need to twist themselves in knots trying to incorporate the WoW lore, especially if they take the stance that not all returning Warcraft players will have spent any significant time in WoW (myself included) so why waste the time trying to explain nearly twenty years of WoW story developments when you can just say "that shit isn't canon" or "this shit isn't canon" or "who the fuck cares what's canon and what isn't, we just want to make the best video game possible."

I don't have a bead on the competitive scene, but I feel like RTS in general has too much of a skill gap for its own good. In my opinion the cognitive load you have to bear in competitive games at all levels is unwelcoming to new players and imo not fun. A lot of the individual skill gap need to be trimmed and instead the genre have to evolve to emphasize team games. All the popular online games, with the exception of a few genres (racing, fighting), are team based.

I've brainstorms a list of mechanics for the mp for Warcraft IV that addresses my issues with RTS, and if executed correctly would revolutionize the RTS genre.
  1. Instead of three-four factions, in multiplayer you pick a hero like in Halo Wars 1+2 that has their own unit composition. Some heroes are support heroes, others are carry heroes. This would balance the game towards team games. Additional heroes can be purchased as DLC.
  2. Main source of gold are not mines, but respawning creeps, enemy heroes, enemy units, bounties, etc. This encourages players to engage in constant action around the map. The stronger creeps / hero creeps on the map would need two or more teams to farm. I would also fix creep pulling so that creeping is fighting creeps not kiting creeps.
  3. Victory condition is the destruction of the main stronghold building in 1v1. In team games, it's a shared neutral building, similar to the throne in mobas. This would allow comebacks to be possible if one or multiple teammates were ganged up on and demolished. Teams should win together or lose together.
  4. The hero building that allows buy back of your hero can also teleports your units, perhaps only biological units, directly to your hero. This should greatly improve one of the biggest issues that plague every RTS game, pathfinding, as most of your units should be rallied to your hero anyways.
  5. No more artificial APM sinks like farms, and burrows. Supply is tied directly to your stronghold / keep level.
  6. To improve accessibility and adoption by new players, all hero, unit, and structure abilities can be set to be auto-casted intelligently by the AI. Obviously higher level players will disable this option, but this should greatly improve the barrier of entry by new players into the genre. They would only need to focus on troop positioning, and strategy. Warcraft's macro is already very simple.
  7. End game unit will a mechanic to end a stalemate, sort of like the Aegis of Immortality in Dota. The idea is that a boss creep can drop an item (Azerite?) that allows you to construct a super unit that if used correctly can tip the scales greatly. Killing the boss creep would require a major commitment allied forces, so it's a risky move that can lose the game, as the boss would be in a chokehold where the enemy can easily trap you in. Additional end game units type can be purchased DLC. You can pick a different end game unit the same would you can pick unit skins outside of the game. Balance should not be an issue because the unit is supposed to be unbalanced.
Example of end game units:

Alliance Skyship.

Draenei Dimensional Fortress.

Alliance Mobile Fortress on wheels.

Horde Red Dragon.

Horde Mounted Beast.

Horde Juggernaught. (Steam powered battlewagon)

Horde Black Dragon.

Undead Ariborne Citadel. (Final upgrade to the Undead HQ)

Undead Slaugher House on Wheels.

Undead Frost Wyrm.

etc.
 
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Acidote

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,974
Samwise Didier was talking a few days ago about selling NFTs... I hope Microsoft does not let the teams do what they want if it goes in that direction.