I hope Rachel and Momiji return. I really enjoy both of them since I'm also a huge fan of the NG series.
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Dead or Alive 6 Discussion Thread - Roster, Stages, DLC, etc
- Thread starter Tyaren
- Start date
Here are my E3 build impressions: https://www.primagames.com/games/dead-or-alive-6/tips/dead-or-alive-6-e3-2018-in-depth-preview
TL;DR
New or Changed in DOA6
At the moment, as someone who does not like the rampant guessing and severe lack of guaranteed damage in DOA as a series, DOA6 has the same problems as DOA5. I don't see that changing, but I'll still give it a shot when it releases. I won't be going to Evo, so it's unlikely I'll play again until close to release, but I do hope we get at least some changes. As it stands I think people who enjoyed DOA5 will still like DOA6, but if you didn't like DOA5, I don't think DOA6 will change your mind.
I don't think so. The build I played at E3 was different than the build they've been using at interviews. There was no Hayate or Hayabusa in the build they had playable for press. At the very least I would expect Hayabusa and Hayate playable at Evo, and probably at least one or two more characters depending on what gets announced between now and Evo.
TL;DR
New or Changed in DOA6
- Sidestep Attacks are extremely evasive.
- Throws no longer track.
- Slow Escape is gone or drastically toned down.
- Movement seems slightly improved.
- Meter gain is very fast, favoring the offensive player.
- Meter carries over from round to round.
- Break Blows replace Power Blows.
- Fatal Stun replaces the Critical Burst mechanic.
- Fatal Rush starts with a moderately slow high attack and leads into an unholdable Fatal Stun.
- You can switch between a 3-way hold system and a 4-way hold system.
- Most attacks are still negative when blocked.
- The main form of punishment is throws, not attacks.
- Only neutral throws can be broken.
- Ground game.
- Wake-up options.
- Countering out of stun.
- Buffer window for attacks and blocking.
At the moment, as someone who does not like the rampant guessing and severe lack of guaranteed damage in DOA as a series, DOA6 has the same problems as DOA5. I don't see that changing, but I'll still give it a shot when it releases. I won't be going to Evo, so it's unlikely I'll play again until close to release, but I do hope we get at least some changes. As it stands I think people who enjoyed DOA5 will still like DOA6, but if you didn't like DOA5, I don't think DOA6 will change your mind.
I don't think so. The build I played at E3 was different than the build they've been using at interviews. There was no Hayate or Hayabusa in the build they had playable for press. At the very least I would expect Hayabusa and Hayate playable at Evo, and probably at least one or two more characters depending on what gets announced between now and Evo.
Egh. A random huge ass rip makes no sense. Even the more fanservicey "rips conveniently over the breasts and ass" makes more physical sense than that, given the chest being a common target.
Also those bruises look like dirt. Make them denser: cover less space but deeper colors.
Seems like the Fatal Rush combo will give you more guaranteed damage, more than the CB.
Seems like that alone can provide more guaranteed damage in the game, just gotta mix it in the combos, of course there's the Break Hold.
Seems like the special button will be used a lot.
2 wake-up kicks mid and low?
I'm actually excited now after reading real gameplay info, thanks!
Seems like that alone can provide more guaranteed damage in the game, just gotta mix it in the combos, of course there's the Break Hold.
Seems like the special button will be used a lot.
2 wake-up kicks mid and low?
I'm actually excited now after reading real gameplay info, thanks!
The clothing damage looks dumb. Not as bad as Injustice 1 but still not good at all.
Might be useful to put this in the OP as well.
Thanks for sharing your impressions. I'm still not sold on the whole meter thing and i'm no fan of auto combos. But your last part makes me hopeful that i'll still like 6 since i love DOA5, despite the things i'm not into at the moment. Still enough time for stuff to get changed too, even though i'm 100% sure they wont just throw those new systems away.
Might be useful to put this in the OP as well.
Wake-up options are the same as DOA5. Mid/low wake-up kicks that track and stun on hit.
I definitely see competitive play evolving into: Initial Stun > Fatal Rush to get Fatal Stun > Launch > Juggle. We just need to figure out how to get a deep enough stun to guarantee the Fatal Rush. I don't think it'll be that difficult once we have frame data.
Also, with the nerf/removal of slow escape, sitdown stuns now grant guaranteed followups in many cases. Things can and likely will change before early 2019, but it's a decent start.
With how meter gain works right now, you almost don't have to pay attention to it. You'll have full meter more often than not, and with Break Blows going through attacks, you can use them in more situations than Power Blows.
That clothing damage might be just a first pass, because yeah, it's arguably even worse than in DOA5 there...
Did you notice any difference (damage, etc) between 3-way and 4-way hold? That's my main question at the moment, what is the point of using 4-way if 3-way does exactly the same with no penalties?
Should be like using stylish controls in a game.
I'm not sure that meter carrying into the next round is a good idea considering how quickly it fills up. They should nerf one or the other...
Wow, that's a ton of info, thanks for that!
Did you notice any difference (damage, etc) between 3-way and 4-way hold? That's my main question at the moment, what is the point of using 4-way if 3-way does exactly the same with no penalties?
Should be like using stylish controls in a game.
I'm not sure that meter carrying into the next round is a good idea considering how quickly it fills up. They should nerf one or the other...
In the case of DOA or SC, it's more of an anime effect. As in "that hit was so powerful his clothes got ripped apart".
I think the game looks glorious. The menus are bright and appealing, much better than the weirdly gloomy ones in DOA5. The whole game looks much more vibrant, a giant step up from the "gritty", boring look of its predecessor. I like the sound of the new mechanics, I just hope they can balance the Break Gauge and Fatal Rush systems enough to make them viable, but punishable. The Break Blows look amazing and hilarious, they will make the game very exciting and watchable.
I cannot wait for this.
I cannot wait for this.
Agree. Nothing to do with fanservice, it just looks terrible.
Questions
Is sidestepping in at all? I got the impression the only 3D movement was those sidestep attacks? Is sidewalking in, and does that work like Tekken? Throws no longer tracking gives me the impression side movement is in and you can evade linear attacks still.
Why would you pick a 4-way hold over a 3-way hold?
Are Break Blows similar to Rage Drive from Tekken? I'm guessing with the metered Hold mechanic that supposedly works all levels,that would be your reversal move and Break Blows would be big damage/safe or plus on block.
Interviewers have mostly discussed the gameplay and have relegated the t&a to one question. Maybe you guys should pay more attention?
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That would be awful and I am sure not something they would ever do. They also confirmed in that Twitch video that they haven't thought about DLC yet, they are just getting the game ready at the moment (not something I usually believe that easily, but they seem to still have a lot to do in about 6 months) and they said that people don't need to worry, Kasumi's classic blue garb is also in the game. That doesn't sound like they are trying to do anything scammy to worried fans. It's likely her second default costume. I wish is was her first. :/
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I admittedly haven't seen any of the interviews after the first IGN one because I've been internally screaming with hype over Cyberpunk since Sunday. My point about the reputation still stands, though. In no other game (beyond one incident with SFV) would this be a topic of discussion. Nobody cares about the others because none of them shoved it in your face anywhere near as hard as DoA.
I heard the Twitch interview was really good. Anybody have a link?
DoA has always had pre-order DLC. Capcom and ASW have embraced it, and Bamco and NRS milk it to death with day one DLC pre-order characters.
OP
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This one?
http://www.twitch.tv/twitch/v/272819634?sr=a&t=29766s
Starts at about 8:15:00.
I am aware of that, lol.
This is about them deliberately selling Kasumi's iconic blue garb as preorder DLC. They said in that Twitch interview that fans don't need to worry, the costume is in the game. That doesn't sound like them considering selling it as DLC.
Just watched the Gamespot Gameplay and man, this sure is a great looking game. The music seems pretty decent so far as well. I'm glad that there's no real Meter management but some of it still seems... i dunno. Maybe i don't like it right now cuz i'm not able to try it.
Tyaren you can reuse the graphics from the first thread if you feel like the OP needs the roster and stages. I'd keep sending you new ones after reveals as well to keep it up to date.
Tyaren you can reuse the graphics from the first thread if you feel like the OP needs the roster and stages. I'd keep sending you new ones after reveals as well to keep it up to date.
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Yes, let's do that. :) I can do the graphics myself or you can send them to me if you already made them and have them hosted online.
The countering out of stuns will probably never go away which is why the whole did discussion is far too premature, however if we can get more defensive options aside from counters that may address things. What I suggest is when the beta comes out, leave feedback, let them know whaybyou would like, they can make a few adjustments.
Can anyone remember the DOA5 pre-release cycle and how they handled new reveals? Hope it's paced better than Injustice 2's lol
Yup. They've shown with Nioh that they actually listen.
Not sure I like the destructible clothing. DoA loves to add costumes (and the main games usually comes with a lot of them for each characters) and I don´t see them taking care to make each costume make sense once a piece of cloth falls or gets shredded. So there is a good chance that some costumes will look unrealistic or just "erased" in some parts showing skin, which is dumb.
Most likely, especially if KT wants to avoid potential backlash from the eSports audience. Capcom adjusted Mika's super cutscene prior to release likely to avoid controversy with that segment.
I'm not opposed to wear and tear on clothing, but it needs to look natural. SoulCalibur has the excuse of featuring sharp weapons. Punches and kicks don't really have the power to make cuts to fabric like that. They could still tear naturally from all the movement, or by getting stuck in the environment. What we see in the picture with Kasumi doesn't look convincing so I hope they work some more on improving that.
The idea of accounting for clothing damage on every single outfit is really stupid, yes. Would rather it be ditched altogether, but I didn't care much for the feature in 5 anyway.
The way clothes seems to gradually lead to one point similar to the Batman Arkham games or newer Mortal Kombat is kinda off-putting. I honestly liked the clothing explosion style they had in some costumes for Dead or Alive 5 and wish they went in that direction still. I guess people found that too pervy?
Hey thanks so much for the impressions. It seems the series is getting there but still missing a few things. I thought holds would be tied to meter... are they at least more punishable? Is there a moment to hit after or can you still spam? That's my main concern and seems to be yours as well. Basically what I mean is if I do a long combo string can they keep guessing or will there be a moment to punish them if the guess wrong without a throw?
Damage seemed the same. It's basically there to give novice players an easier hold method. I expect ranked matches online and all tournaments to use 4-way hold.
With meter gain as high as it is right now, it really doesn't matter if it carries over or not. You'll basically always have meter unless you just used it.
You still have your normal 8-way movement, but the command sidestep from DOA5 has been replaced by the sidestep attack. Throws don't track the sidestep attack, but if you're just 8-way walking your opponent will realign with you if you press any button, meaning a throw will still work in that instance.
3-way hold is there so beginners have an easier way to perform holds. I suspect ranked matches will force 4-way holds, as will the competitive scene.
Yes, Break Blows are basically Rage Arts. They are invincible to all highs and mids, but lows will interrupt them.
Holds felt the same as they were in DOA5. I'm hoping for some changes, but without frame data to verify, they seemed unchanged.
One thing I would like them to do is a bit more stuff to do than just online play, I think they have a good opportunity here.
I just hope the stages have more character. I always loved how a stage can dictate match ups in certain places, like home allows for different things, danger zone is straight comedy. All these things can be expanded. I just hope we are allowed to have a good demo period.
I just hope the stages have more character. I always loved how a stage can dictate match ups in certain places, like home allows for different things, danger zone is straight comedy. All these things can be expanded. I just hope we are allowed to have a good demo period.
Seriously, do folks prefer 4-way hold to 3-way hold. I felt like having to guess mid+ guess punch or kick made it not worth using.
I don't mind some fun stages, but absolutely nothing like Home or Hayabusa's temple (don't recall the name). Those stages just favored characters with high launchers way too much. You can't have that much advantage with just a stage, otherwise we'll need to start "striking" stages like they do in Smash.
From a competitive perspective, holds are somewhat looked down upon. You work hard to open up an opponent in the neutral, then they can turn it around immediately with a hold that inflicts 25% damage. At least with the 4-way hold system it makes it slightly more difficult to land the correct hold.
Never felt holds were that big of a deal since you could throw them if you read a hold was coming, or just change hit level. Is that accurate (never played DOA that much, but I dabbled with Aoi in VF so I knew how folks beat counters in that game)
Hasn't the male characters always been hot in DOA? Personally I don't see how this is new to DOA6, this has been a big difference for a long time compared to other fighting games, I'd say that everyone in DOA is hottt, well except Bass and Gen Fu maybe ;P
It's interesting that they're trying to shift the focus a bit though. DOA has been a lot about sexiness, skimpy clothes and bouncing breasts all the way back from DOA1, so you're just kind of assuming that that's how the next game will be as well. Some part of me think it's all fake, that they're just trying a new PR strategy, and if the talk dwindles down they'll probably increase the fan service again. And it's the first new DOA of the generation and there isn't a crazy amount of talk right now, so we'll see how it all goes I guess.
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Read... as in guess. If you're expecting a hold to come, then you can throw it on reaction, but then you're not attacking because you're guessing a hold is coming. You can mix up your attacks, but the opponent is likely mixing up their holds. The problem is that it promotes more guessing, which is what the greater FGC strongly dislikes about DOA (and the lack of guaranteed damage).
You have time to react to hold whiffs and the timings are pretty generous. I don't love holds, but I don't get the backlash either. Combos in general have generous timings.
It seems like the same issue KI has with its combo breakers (combo breakers annoyed me but holds didn't) I think it's because KI breakers seemed reactionary while DOA is predictive. The FGC seems to be ok with reactionary because they can grind it but not ok with predictive because that's reading. (and in 2-out-of-3 tourney sets, read-based increases variance)
Also you can't hold when you are juggled- though I got the impression they were reducing juggles in this.
Also you can't hold when you are juggled- though I got the impression they were reducing juggles in this.
The reward for landing a hit in this game is to guess more to get damage.
The reward for getting hit in this game is to get numerous chances to get out of your mistake.
That's the issue. If you don't understand that, then.../shrug
The reward for getting hit in this game is to get numerous chances to get out of your mistake.
That's the issue. If you don't understand that, then.../shrug
If I'm doing a combo that's PPPP, I don't have time to stop my third P to see if you counter, then continue my combo if you don't. And the few instances in which you do have that much time to delay a combo are also a problem because it allows for way too much freedom in getting out of situations or forcing more guesses on offense AND defense.
Now if I'm expecting a counter and I free cancel out of my combo, then sure it's not all that difficult to react. But I have to stop my combo to get that kind of reaction time. There are certainly instances when someone is so eager to counter that they use it at a point where it's easy for me to react even if I'm in the middle of a combo, but against players at that level it doesn't really matter either way. It's at higher levels of play where guessing is generally reduced in other fighting games, but becomes a very strong tool in DOA.
Basically, if you like having to guess a lot, DOA is great. If you don't like guessing and would rather have other skills determine who wins, then you're going to have issues with the DOA system. Most of the greater FGC doesn't like how much guessing is in DOA, and a lot of that has to do with the ability to use a counterhold while in a stunned state.
In pretty much every other fighting game, if I land a hit I'm rewarded with guaranteed damage for the combo that follows. In DOA if I land a hit, that's where the guessing game begins and I have to hope I can out guess my opponent to get my damage in. If I guess wrong, I lose 20% or more despite the fact that I won the neutral game.
Also, if you miss a combo breaker in KI you are in trouble. You can't use another combo breaker during that combo and you're going to eat a ton of damage. In DOA if you miss a counter you can just do another one, and another one. You get one guess in KI, but you get endless guesses in DOA.
I don't think juggles are toned down, but the stuns do see to last a shorter time now. And while you can't counter while juggled, you still have to land the hit that launches. In many cases that still gives the opponent several chances to guess.
Home was a bit insane but I did like stages with slope and water and what not, made me adjust something's. Home was whatever to me, I can see the hate for dangerzone, but I found that stage funny.