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Death Stranding 2 (DS2) Speculation and Theory Thread [Unmarked DS1 Spoilers]

RowdyReverb

RowdyReverb

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,926
Austin, TX
Kojima: "I put a lot of things inside [the trailer] so I want you guys to talk about it and find details in it"
I think it is time to respect Kojima's wishes and dissect the hell out of the first DS2 trailer. When he is involved, you know everything is going to be packed with symbolism. Let's start with the official materials from Kojima Productions:

View: https://youtu.be/Tr2yB93pIGw

Here are the official screens:
ds2_tga2022_screenshot001_2k.jpg


ds2_tga2022_screenshot002_2k.jpg

ds2_tga2022_screenshot003_2k.jpg

ds2_tga2022_screenshot004_2k.jpg

ds2_tga2022_screenshot005_2k.jpg

ds2_tga2022_screenshot006_2k.jpg


And here is the TGA Podcast with Kojima and Geoff
open.spotify.com

#15 Hideo Kojima x TGA Special: DEATH STRANDING [ENGLISH]

Listen to this episode from Hideo Kojima presents Brain Structure on Spotify. Game creator Hideo Kojima's PODCAST program “Hideo Kojima presents Brain Structure” This week’s episode is all about “DEATH STRANDING,” Hideo Kojima’s first title after going independent in 2015. Coming up with the...
open.spotify.com open.spotify.com
He gives some hints about the connections between DS1 and DS2 and the themes he wants to explore.

Fi8O3_cVsAEltVM


FjgmWaoUoAEirrp


And for those who would like a refresher on the themes of DS1, I would suggest Noah Caldwell-Gervais's excellent analysis of the game
 
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RowdyReverb

RowdyReverb

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,926
Austin, TX
First, let's talk about Drawbridge.
Kt4cPc0.gif

The first game had us building bridges to connect the UCA for the organization, Bridges. So why change from Bridges to Drawbridge?
The first thing that comes to mind is Kojima's statement on how the pandemic greatly influenced the story of the game, to the degree that he re-wrote it completely. The biggest difference between a Drawbridge and an ordinary Bridge is that a drawbridge enables a deliberate disconnection. I think this is going to be one of the primary themes of DS2. We were forced to deliberately disconnect from one another during the pandemic, just as a drawbridge disconnects two connected pieces of land. However, we continued to live parallel to each other, and this is symbolized by two parallel "strands". This imagery recurs multiple times throughout the trailer

dsp4f11.png

zsGuaSY.jpg

uhiZNST.jpg


7epQlAF.jpg

This last one is interesting. Notice how none of the strands intersect. This is the case for every strand we see in the trailer. All of them are parallel, disconnected, just like a raised drawbridge.

Drawbridges official motto:
Both stick and rope, to protect and connect, together, for tomorrow

Kojima has referred to stick and rope as analogies for games about connecting and games about combat, respectively. I think that including "stick" in this motto is an indication that perhaps we will be doing some more combat or disconnection in this game.
 
Wrexis

Wrexis

Member
Nov 4, 2017
21,227
I would like to know how Fragile's skin is healed.

Nanomachines? Hologram? Synthetic skin? Or a dream sequence?

Ah, Kojima. Just like old times.
 
AuthenticM

AuthenticM

Son Altesse Sérénissime
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
30,001
I have to imagine that this time, Sam will have to connect the USA to other countries. The ship coming out of the water might serve as the player's HQ. Maybe the game will even take a page out of MGS V's motherbase aspect, whereby the player can build bases on water and link them together. Maybe the player will have to do this to link europe to north america.

Wrexis said:
I would like to know how Fragile's skin is healed.

Nanomachines? Hologram? Synthetic skin? Or a dream sequence?
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The most likely explanation is that it's a flashback to before the events of DS1.
 
Sargerus

Sargerus

▲ Legend ▲
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
20,827
Higgs was like the ultimate Amelie fanboy, makes sense he's trying to cosplay as her.
 
darfox8

darfox8

Member
Nov 5, 2017
984
USA
Reposting my original theories I posted in the announcement thread.

image.png
 
APOEERA

APOEERA

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,061
RowdyReverb said:
Fragile looks younger while Sam looks much older. Lou has only aged about 1 year. Hmmmmm
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Time displacement. Fragile and Lou / Fragile's child were pulled forward to the future and Sam stayed the same. They solved the Timefall problem but other things broke (like time itself).

What about:

- The broken capsule has a baby turning into a BT?
- The baby has tears similar to Higgs' tears from the first game?
- Higgs and his costume looks similar to Amelia?
- How were they able to get a massive ship to seemingly come out of the murk that destroys / ages things?
 
Kinthey

Kinthey

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
22,260
Fragile seemingly gets shot, we see a tar baby inside someone's lungs and then Fragile has tar around her eyes. Makes me wonder if she might be a repatriate?

VdL0UiD.png


I'm not really sure though since she's still wounded, something Sam never was whenever returned from Death
 
Vic_Viper

Vic_Viper

Thanked By SGM
Member
Oct 25, 2017
29,022
Who do we think is the new badguy? The one that looks like Raiden wearing a mask lol.

I hope we get more combat interactions this time around. And I really like the idea of having like a roaming ship base. Would be really neat to see some more building aspects in this one.
 
Fudus

Fudus

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Member
Sep 18, 2020
1,791
One detail I thought was interesting is how the "metal gear" is revealed with what at first appears to be a huge cannon is actually a crane.
Wonder if it will be like a mobile base/construction facility.
 
Wrexis

Wrexis

Member
Nov 4, 2017
21,227
Fudus said:
One detail I thought was interesting is how the "metal gear" is revealed with what at first appears to be a huge cannon is actually a crane.
Wonder if it will be like a mobile base/construction facility.
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Not quite sure why people are insisting it's a metal gear. It's just a movable airship/drawbridge.

It does hint at a much larger world though.
 
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RowdyReverb

RowdyReverb

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,926
Austin, TX
Next let's talk about Aquatic themes. I suspect there will be a heavy emphasis on travel by sea. What does raising a drawbridge do? It permits ships to pass under!

bS3kq3T.jpg

xKoL9Th.jpg

3SES7Fe.png

Perhaps not an aquarium, but a Cryptobiote habitat. But it evoked an aquarium to me, so I'm leaving it.
Sidenote: see the "We all love PIZZA" magazine and the Homo Ludens duck in the background?

MpCIu3s.jpg


bahOPd8.jpg

BTs are still around!

Mqzq8Ud.jpg


lDRAAtW.jpg

So let's hop on board the Magellan and circumnavigate the seas!

Ok, so here is my theory. Lou (BB) has died. When people die in this universe, they walk from their Beach out into the ocean. I believe that Lou is "lost at sea" so to speak, and Sam and Fragile are seeking her. This is why the big ocean vessel horn plays BB's theme.
Sam and Fragile are disconnected from Lou and seeking to reconnect. I think this will be the driving plot of the game.
 
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APOEERA

APOEERA

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,061
Fudus said:
One detail I thought was interesting is how the "metal gear" is revealed with what at first appears to be a huge cannon is actually a crane.
Wonder if it will be like a mobile base/construction facility.
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I wonder if this is Kojima's way to bring back the gameplay loop from MGSV but applied to Death Stranding. Whoever you're playing as (Sam? Fragile? The other two announced people?) act the way as Venom Snake did with completing missions / rescuing people except with deliveries. While at the same time managing other deliverers and their deliveries.

The crane is part of the "Mother Base."
 
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RowdyReverb

RowdyReverb

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,926
Austin, TX
darfox8 said:
Reposting my original theories I posted in the announcement thread.

image.png
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Nice spot! I totally agree on the Rope and Stick thing. This has been Kojima's refrain since DS1, that he wanted to make a "rope game".
I definitely think we will be exploring the ocean aka "the world of the dead" in this game. See my post above
Wrexis said:
Lou(ise) is a girl.
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Oops, you're right. Fixed.
 
astro

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
56,875
I think there might be some kinda of resersal thing. Maybe timefall now makes you younger instead of older. That could explain Fragile.
 
Kindekuma

Kindekuma

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
4,729
Some details I've noticed:

-The DHV Magellan is a BT "Whaling" ship. Note the icon of the BT with spears sticking out of it.

-There is no branding or iconography of BRIDGES anywhere in Fragile and Louise's home, the only mentioning of BRIDGES is on the little wooden dolphin toy (the base is also thought to be abandoned given the plant overgrowth. So likely their location to BRIDGES was sold out hence the invasion)

-Fragile and Louise are likely both repatriates. From the DS lore: "those who have not been "naturally born" (i.e. from a biological mother) in some sense, do not "die". Because of this, they are said not to possess a Beach. Consequently, if one does not have a Beach, one also does not have a "Ka", or soul." Since Louise was not born naturally and likely still has a living still-mother that may be why Lou was revived at the end of DS. Fragile has a BB within her too like when you come out of The Seam. She's also crying tar so that may also link that fact too. Maybe she has "died" and repatriated to her form before the timefall injuries. Sam was shot and killed multiple times but repatriates without those injuries so that's just contributing to my guess.

-The poster marketing the game shows that Louise has a heart shaped birthmark, and coincidentally SMACK DAB in the middle of Elle Fanning's name credits. So that might be a subtle nod that Elle Fanning plays an older Louise. Not to mention hair and eye color are the same.

-The plant at 0:45 in the trailer is a Snake Plant NEVER BE GAME OVER
 
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Roxas

Roxas

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
3,550
Buenos Aires, Argentina
RowdyReverb said:
Next let's talk about Aquatic themes. I suspect there will be a heavy emphasis on travel by sea. What does raising a drawbridge do? It permits ships to pass under!

bS3kq3T.jpg

xKoL9Th.jpg

3SES7Fe.png

Perhaps not an aquarium, but a Cryptobiote habitat. But it evoked an aquarium to me, so I'm leaving it.
Sidenote: see the "We all love PIZZA" magazine and the Homo Ludens duck in the background?

MpCIu3s.jpg


bahOPd8.jpg

BTs are still around!

Mqzq8Ud.jpg



Ok, so here is my theory. Lou (BB) has died. When people die in this universe, they walk from their Beach out into the ocean. I believe that Lou is "lost at sea" so to speak, and Sam and Fragile are seeking her. This is why the big ocean vessel horn plays BB's theme.
Sam and Fragile are disconnected from Lou and seeking to reconnect. I think this will be the driving plot of the game.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Seeing as how someone is speaking to BB/Louise, my theory is that she becomes the playable character, and she is avenging Fragile/Sam "No one should have to endure that kind of loss", after a prologue like MGS2. Clearly Elle is Louise though, due to the previously established clues, and also the fact that she was the first character revealed for the game. Yes, it was made to hide the fact that it was DS2, but at the same time, I don't believe it's a random choice
 
Mary Celeste

Mary Celeste

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,168
I think the "Should we have connected?" tagline in a more melancholic light. The trailer plays that line right before reintroducing Higgs, who had clearly gone even more nuts in the time since the first game. Maybe it's a sincere question, a wondering that if Sam/the UCA had gone out of their way to try to turn Higgs into one of them things could have been better?
 
ezekial45

ezekial45

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,737
I'm almost certain that Elle Fanning is playing an adult Lou in this game. I agree with the theory that this game will be about crossing over into other 'countries' but also further into the Beach realm.

It's very exciting to see where they could go with this.
 
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RowdyReverb

RowdyReverb

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Oct 25, 2017
5,926
Austin, TX
Ok last post for now unless I spot something else. Let's talk about Higgs.
So to recap DS1, Higgs was enthralled by Amelie and wanted to help her bring about the sixth extinction. Higgs' fate is left uncertain in DS1. He is stranded on the Beach, and we hear gunshots, but he is never explicitly shown to have died.
So, we have the remnants of his cult, who are equally Amelie-obsessed carrying his sarcophagus to some rock formation.


k1w3iI4.jpg


Now recall that there was a lot of Egyptian imagery surrounding Higgs in the first game:
20200320_165606-e1584689759170.jpg

So it is only fitting that his remains would be in a sarcophagus. Notice the leaking tar indicating that perhaps he has begun to "go necro"
w7QBmwb.jpg

I believe that the butterfly imagery on the sarcophagus is to evoke an emergence or metamorphosis. Indeed the next time we see Higgs, he appears quite different:
ds2_tga2022_screenshot006_2k.jpg


A few things to unpack in his new look.
  1. He appears to be using BB tech to preserve his body. This means that like BBs, he is somewhere between the world of the dead and the world of the living.
  2. He has an Odradek scanner, but no longer needs a BB unit to activate it. His Odradek seems to indicate that we the viewer are BTs?
  3. We again see the butterflies on his guitar strap, along with the cult's symbol for Amelie
  4. He is wearing Amelie's face mask, the color red, and her Quipu necklace from the first game (see below)

bridget-strands-necklace-1574342816.jpg

All of this put together makes me believe that Higgs is still attempting to bring about an EE (Extinction Event) via Amelie. We don't know where Amelie has gone at the end of DS1, and so he is seeking Amelie while we are seeking Lou.
 
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RowdyReverb

RowdyReverb

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Oct 25, 2017
5,926
Austin, TX
APOEERA said:
- The baby has tears similar to Higgs' tears from the first game?
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Kindekuma said:
-Fragile and Louise are likely both repatriates. From the DS lore: "those who have not been "naturally born" (i.e. from a biological mother) in some sense, do not "die". Because of this, they are said not to possess a Beach. Consequently, if one does not have a Beach, one also does not have a "Ka", or soul." Since Louise was not born naturally and likely still has a living still-mother that may be why Lou was revived at the end of DS. Fragile has a BB within her too like when you come out of The Seam. She's also crying tar so that may also link that fact too. Maybe she has "died" and repatriated to her form before the timefall injuries. Sam was shot and killed multiple times but repatriates without those injuries so that's just contributing to my guess.
Click to expand...
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I believe that the black tar tears signify loss in the Death Stranding universe, specifically if the one you have lost is on the "other side" so to speak. I believe Kojima did this to distinguish them from the ordinary tears that are also prevalent in this world.
  • Cliff cries tar as he is seeking his lost son
  • Higgs cries tar as he is seeking Amelie
  • Fragile (and her internal "Ka baby") are weeping tar for the loss of Louise
Am I missing any?
 
Dever

Dever

Member
Dec 25, 2019
5,345
I was thinking the beginning might be a dream sequence... We see that Fragile is healed from the timefall and raising Lou, presumably as a partner with Sam. Both of those things are pretty hard to understand in light of the first game. There's no way to reverse timefall that we know of, and Sam made every indication that he wanted to be alone. Fragile seemed more attached to him than vice versa in their last conversation. So we might be seeing something that Fragile wished was true, but can't be, in the form of a dream sequence.

...Or Heartman or whoever just found some way to reverse timefall and they hooked up between the games lol, I dunno.
 
ntinosaur

ntinosaur

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Oct 27, 2017
76
Bless you all for this thread !

The original Death Stranding had the mystery of its premise surrrounding it.
I think this time, this is getting replaced by the mystery of its... genre/gameplay ?
Timefall is no more (although shit is still dangerous) and the idea of cutting ties gives me the impression that deliveries are not going to be the main course this time.
 
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RowdyReverb

RowdyReverb

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Oct 25, 2017
5,926
Austin, TX
FantasticMrFoxdie said:
whoa some great breakdowns in here.

Explanatory Drawbridge is so interesting especially if the theme of the game is really now disconnection 👀
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It was really the recurring drawbridge motif that inspired me to make the thread. I think it is Kojima's most deliberate hint about the theme of DS2, and when you throw in his comments about rewriting the story after COVID-19, it makes a lot of sense. Connection was always hinted at being dangerous in the first game, but the pandemic provided a more concrete example of dangers brought about by connection
 
hydruxo

hydruxo

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Member
Oct 25, 2017
20,407
Very excited for DS2, but I am a little bummed that Higgs seems to be back. Him and Amelie were the worst characters in the first game.

I'm really curious to see how the scope has expanded this time around considering Sam is meeting Fragile's team and you see that massive ship flying in front of them.
 
darfox8

darfox8

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Nov 5, 2017
984
USA
FantasticMrFoxdie said:
whoa some great breakdowns in here.

Explanatory Drawbridge is so interesting especially if the theme of the game is really now disconnection 👀
Click to expand...
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I'm wondering if the game will have a more cautious theme about dealing with bad actors. DS1 is let's all get connected and share and figure it out. It was a very anti-nihilist theme, while the bad guys were like fuck it the world is screwed let's wipe it out. Sam had to learn that even though they didn't know how to fix it they needed to save the world and go on. Maybe DS2 with the "Should we have connected" slogan has come to a point where there are some people so obstinate and destructive that we cannot just stand by and let them be.

And maybe why it was re-written after the pandemic. He was past his kumbaya period. Just talking out my ass but it makes sense to me.
 
ultracal31

ultracal31

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,615
ezekial45 said:
I'm almost certain that Elle Fanning is playing an adult Lou in this game. I agree with the theory that this game will be about crossing over into other 'countries' but also further into the Beach realm.

It's very exciting to see where they could go with this.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Wouldn't be surprised if this is another MGS2 and adult Lou is the actual game and Sam/Fragile is the first hour only
 
Astral

Astral

Member
Oct 27, 2017
28,013
Besides Fragile's skin and Sam's hair, I'm really confused about Timefall. I thought Timefall was no more at the end of the first game. I can't tell if that's still the same here or not.
 
astro

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
56,875
RowdyReverb said:
Ok last post for now unless I spot something else. Let's talk about Higgs.
So to recap DS1, Higgs was enthralled by Amelie and wanted to help her bring about the sixth extinction. Higgs' fate is left uncertain in DS1. He is stranded on the Beach, and we hear gunshots, but he is never explicitly shown to have died.
So, we have the remnants of his cult, who are equally Amelie-obsessed carrying his sarcophagus to some rock formation.


k1w3iI4.jpg


Now recall that there was a lot of Egyptian imagery surrounding Higgs in the first game:
20200320_165606-e1584689759170.jpg

So it is only fitting that his remains would be in a sarcophagus. Notice the leaking tar indicating that perhaps he has begun to "go necro"
w7QBmwb.jpg

I believe that the butterfly imagery on the sarcophagus is to evoke an emergence or metamorphosis. Indeed the next time we see Higgs, he appears quite different:
ds2_tga2022_screenshot006_2k.jpg


A few things to unpack in his new look.
  1. He appears to be using BB tech to preserve his body. This means that like BBs, he is somewhere between the world of the dead and the world of the living.
  2. He has an Odradek scanner, but no longer needs a BB unit to activate it. His Odradek seems to indicate that we the viewer are BTs?
  3. We again see the butterflies on his guitar strap, along with the cult's symbol for Amelie
  4. He is wearing Amelie's face mask, the color red, and her Quipu necklace from the first game (see below)

bridget-strands-necklace-1574342816.jpg

All of this put together makes me believe that Higgs is still attempting to bring about an EE (Extinction Event) via Amelie. We don't know where Amelie has gone at the end of DS1, and so he is seeking Amelie while we are seeking Lou.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I don't see the neckless... looks different.
 
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