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Democratic Presidential Primary |February OT| It Can't be Worse than Iowa, Right? (Discussion Guidelines in OP)
- Thread starter Poodlestrike
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You mean he's trying to win a campaign by using the endorsements of popular figures? Okay. I'll admit that the Rogan thing made me uncomfortable, but Rogan's bullshit doesn't reflect on the movement or the policies in anyway.
Brihana gets to enjoy a little protest vote considering she lives in NY. More power too her, Hillary is awful.
This made me Google an extremely cursed image so I have to share it with this thread now:
when will this dog take off it's obvious mask
I hope this isn't a reference to me. Because I tried to keep the conversation going (follow up questions and commentary) and everyone disappeared. So please spare me with this.
The reason some of us are worried is because this similar behavior led to the complete capture of the GOP by fascist goons (the GOP's own racism and shittiness didn't help but I digress). I fear there is a bit of cult of personality with Bernie and that is dangerous.
Again, cheer for Bernie and call out issues in the dem party.
Do it without cheering on snake emojis for Warren or saying all of us like Bloomberg(his favorables are shit).
I'm a big Warren fan. Bernie is my 1b to warrens 1a in my mind. I'd vote for the guy in a second if warrens chances start looking real dire. That said, Bernie def has a toxic element to his supporters that I don't think really exists for the other nominees (I think this is partly based on him having a MUCH bigger online fan base then other nominees).
When the whole Warren/Bernie beef happened a few months ago, I had to unfollow a bunch of progressive folk on twitter because it just became to much for me. Bernie supporters were REALLY going in on her. To a point where I was annoyed/uncomfortable at how toxic they were being
So while I think it's reasonable to think that media claims of Bernie Bro's might be exaggerated, they are def real events
When the whole Warren/Bernie beef happened a few months ago, I had to unfollow a bunch of progressive folk on twitter because it just became to much for me. Bernie supporters were REALLY going in on her. To a point where I was annoyed/uncomfortable at how toxic they were being
So while I think it's reasonable to think that media claims of Bernie Bro's might be exaggerated, they are def real events
Bernie bros are so much like Trump supporters. They're for anti-bigotry and Trump supporters are for bigotry. They're so toxic just like Trump supporters.
Some of you are just so anti-Bernie that you come off as delusional. Seriously, what are you reading on twitter in your bubble that makes you say shit like that?
And this whole Bernie Bro thing is so overblown. I remember MSNBC pundits calling out Bernie bros because they dared to defend Sanders based on obvious lies. I still remember Zerlina Maxwell saying Bernie didn't mention race or gender 23 minutes into his speech, yet he did it in the first 1-5 minutes. People rightly called her out and then she claimed that was an instance of toxic Bernie bro abuse.
It's so dumb and it's always been meant to silence activists or Bernie's supporters so they can have free reign to lie about Bernie. You don't see me calling out Liz's lads for minimizing Trump supporter's racism, xenophobia, homophobia, etc...
How is that not toxic? To equate Bernie supporters to that of Trump is disgusting.
Some of you are just so anti-Bernie that you come off as delusional. Seriously, what are you reading on twitter in your bubble that makes you say shit like that?
And this whole Bernie Bro thing is so overblown. I remember MSNBC pundits calling out Bernie bros because they dared to defend Sanders based on obvious lies. I still remember Zerlina Maxwell saying Bernie didn't mention race or gender 23 minutes into his speech, yet he did it in the first 1-5 minutes. People rightly called her out and then she claimed that was an instance of toxic Bernie bro abuse.
It's so dumb and it's always been meant to silence activists or Bernie's supporters so they can have free reign to lie about Bernie. You don't see me calling out Liz's lads for minimizing Trump supporter's racism, xenophobia, homophobia, etc...
How is that not toxic? To equate Bernie supporters to that of Trump is disgusting.
I'm pretty sure the Dem party won't be turned into a brocialist haven overnight if Bernie wins the White House. GOP has always been adjacent to fascism as long as any of us have been alive, Trump and the Tea Party just let them be honest about it.
It is funny that people are talking about not attacking others over a topic where Warren decided to go on the offensive with bernie, something shes been doing a lot of recently. It works both ways. Using Bernie bros to describe his supporters isn't much different than using snake emotes for warren.
People telling Warren to drop out will not
1) make Warren drop out.
2) make Warren supporters want to support whoever you're supporting.
It's not a good strategy. It was annoying in 2016 and annoying now.
Don't discount the possibility the very real possibility that it's dirty tricks by Russians or another campaign.
If you're willing to look at some of the toxic messages from anti-bernie folks, there's a compilation here. The hate directed towards folks like Grey or Turner is insane.
It's chronological so if you want to read recent comments they're at the bottom.
People from all campaigns are very capable of being 'toxic'
1) make Warren drop out.
2) make Warren supporters want to support whoever you're supporting.
It's not a good strategy. It was annoying in 2016 and annoying now.
Now, how are you so sure that whoever sent those messages were Bernie supporters?
Don't discount the possibility the very real possibility that it's dirty tricks by Russians or another campaign.
If you're willing to look at some of the toxic messages from anti-bernie folks, there's a compilation here. The hate directed towards folks like Grey or Turner is insane.
It's chronological so if you want to read recent comments they're at the bottom.
People from all campaigns are very capable of being 'toxic'
And people propping up Jill Stein and not voting was feeding into the Russian disinformation campaign that resulted in a Trump Presidency. So I'm not sure that 4D Tic Tac Toe move worked out.
Also just going to gloss over Cardi B who admitted to drugging men and robing them, as well as her connection to multiple assault allegations?
The person I had this discussion with previously was banned. The point is the information is pretty easily available and if you can't find examples of it it's either a willingness to avoid it or an active effort to reject it.
She's better spent using her time to go attack dog like she was earlier this week.
It's not like I don't understand why she phrased her response re: the "bernie bro" issue the way she did. She doesn't want to rock the boat with Culinary union leadership and a non-committal answer to the issue would come off as probably bite her in the ass as well. The problem is that online harassment is not invented nor exclusive to Bernie's campaign and anyone who wanted to engage in any talks for real solutions wouldn't be calling on candidates to fix the issue, but rather the operators of these social media sites that have abysmal policies in place to deal with targeted harassment.
At the end of the day, all this shit being brought up yet again is smokescreen by Bloomberg and bait for debate moderators to waste time by making Bernie answer for bullshit he has little control over.
Here's some of the doxxing paper trail :)
Bernie Sanders's Supporters Doxed a Critic on Twitter
[Original title edited by Admin] Unhappy that the tweet above was shown on MSNBC when they covered the #MyBernieStory hashtag campaign, Sanders campaign employees and several notable supporters are encouraging the doxing of that detractor. Here is Sam...
www.dailykos.com
Btw, all of this came about because you asked what he could do. When you have top level staffers doxxing, rushing to defend Tulsi Gabbard, keeping Trump supporters on your staff, my thought was that perhaps a culture change at that level might make some of the types of supporters that Warren was talking about less emboldened.
I agree with Warren. You don't need to, no one here needs to but I do.
As I said I'm happy to follow with more links tomorrow but it's not some wacky out of the blue or at all new or undiscussed notion that Sanders has some extremely problematic hires (and my hypothesis is that might have had an effect on the culture of some of his more... enthusiastic supporters.)
No, but this type of dialectic approach may lead to trouble in the future. Look, the rich suck and fascism is shit. Dems getting in the way either by accident or choice isn't helpful either but they are (most of the time) an ally against those folks. If we start allowing the toxic portion of "very online" folks have their way we walk a dangerous path.
There are issues that require more nuance than "good/bad".
people don't even care about the racist attacks against Brie Joy. It's just completely ignored.
Hard to take this seriously when you refused to show evidence under the guise of " you won't believe me". Just makes me think you have nothing and your arguing in bad faith.
Warren was once considered as the leading contender for the nomination, dwarfing even Bernie.
Who or what do you think is mostly responsible for causing her campaign to uncontrollably spiralling down like it is currently?
I mean, it isn't BS.
The Chapo Trap styled leftists are a pox on us all. Backing the right morality/idealogy be damned.
^^^
Exactly. And people keep falling for it every time.
Sorry Black Lives Matter, Trans Rights Are Human Rights, Climate Change activists, and any other movement that matters, you're just too rude and toxic.
If it was twitter drama that brought her down, then it's probably for the best that she's not getting the nom, because there will only be more of that
Keep in mind you are mad people are using snake emojis while constantly calling people chapo on this board hunter.
Some GE polls that led to her appearing to lose to Trump, the impeachment vote scaring all/most dems into "gotta win" and the fact that she tried to thread the needle between "too left" and "left enough".
She actually started going down before any of the "unity" or "m4a" stuff happened.
All three of these movements are having actual effects on policy now.
Did Sanders change his policies to legalizing drugging and robbing dudes to get her endorsement? I'm not going to defend Cardi B's past, but it hardly seem relevant here.
And honestly, who cares if Brihana voted Stein? Being a leftist activist in NY basically requires you to protest vote when your only option is Hillary Clinton.
I too remember when a Bernie supporter plowed their car into a crowd of people at a white supremacist rally and Bernie came out and said there were "very fine people" on both sides. /s
Fucking listen to yourselves holy shit.
Fucking listen to yourselves holy shit.
She loses points because she advocated people to not vote for Hillary.
That was irresponsible.
In 2016 Bernie had lost the election and refused to concede.
No one has won the nomination as of yet.
Apples and Oranges.
It's been pointed out to you before, several candidates, including Biden and Warren defended Tulsi after Clinton's comments. if that's what you're referring to.Here's some of the doxxing paper trail :)
Bernie Sanders's Supporters Doxed a Critic on Twitter
[Original title edited by Admin] Unhappy that the tweet above was shown on MSNBC when they covered the #MyBernieStory hashtag campaign, Sanders campaign employees and several notable supporters are encouraging the doxing of that detractor. Here is Sam...
Btw, all of this came about because you asked what he could do. When you have top level staffers doxxing, rushing to defend Tulsi Gabbard, keeping Trump supporters on your staff, my thought was that perhaps a culture change at that level might make some of the types of supporters that Warren was talking about less emboldened.
I agree with Warren. You don't need to, no one here needs to but I do.
As I said I'm happy to follow with more links tomorrow but it's not some wacky out of the blue or at all new or undiscussed notion that Sanders has some extremely problematic hires (and my hypothesis is that might have had an effect on the culture of some of his more... enthusiastic supporters.)
edit: maybe not Warren actually
Here's my post from the other day:
The primary reason cited back then was that his continuation would 'fracture' the party. Guess what, the constant demand that he drop out and the negative insults actually intensified the fracture. The smart play would have been to let Bernie lose because he had *near* zero chance. It was counter productive to demand he drop out.
Warren has near zero chances now.
What massive influence Briahna had back when she had like *checks notes* 200 or so followers.
I'm a vote blue no matter almost who kinda guy.
You lose points for not voting dem against a fascist (unless it's bloombito. That's fair game).
I mean, I care not about how many followers one has just that you did it but Nina Turner also did it.
Bernie chose to make both of them surrogates and parts of his campaign well after the stuff they did was made known. He may not advocate for what they did, but by making them a prominent part of his campaign he's saying "the bad stuff they did doesn't bother me enough to seek outreach elsewhere".
Did she tilt the scales against Clinton? With her <1000 followers at the time?
It's principle and less follower count.
See above. I'm going to call out anyone saying "Never Sanders" when he most likely wins the nom too.
No I'm not going to go on twitter and denounce everyone but just so we know now. Anyone who does that is a shithead.
I pretty much agree. I think we're seeing it because many of these anti-Bernie posters were telling Bernie to drop out back when he wasn't doing as well as he is right now. They're basically turning it back on them.
That happened because the Republican party was and is full of fascists, and Trump's platform was fascism. It wasn't some fluke. "Uh oh, Trump was really mean so now everyone loves border concentration camps." It was always there, and it was always the heart of the party. Republicans love Trump because he disposed with the dog whistles and just appealed to the racism and bigotry of Republican voters directly, and they loved it.
Like, if you think lots of Sanders supporters are a bunch of dickheads, whatever. But what is the actual fear, here? That the Democratic party is going to be taken over by a bunch of crazed, ruthless sycophants who will stop at nothing to enact their insidious agenda of- ...universal health care and a more equitable society?
No, it didn't. What "intensified" the fracture was the nonsense conspiracy theories that the election had been stolen from him. In 2008 Hillary took like 4 days to concede after Obama had clinched the nomination, and people were very worried she'd keep the primary going all the way up to the convention. You may not have been around to remember how angry Obama supporters were over that weekend, but I sure do. But she eventually acknowledged reality and did the right thing. Something Bernie did not. All the political theatre at the end of the primary between the two in 2008 was important and done for legitimate reasons. And none of that happened in 2016.
Warren is not polling low enough to make a call for her to get out reasonable with more contests upcoming. The race has an unusual amount of fluidity.
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