Played the game late, so I missed out on most of the the OT. Discussed it a bit in the Sony first party thread though, which is how I'm assuming the OT would've gone as well for me.
Funny you accuse me of not wanting an actual discussion after excusing Cage and the game in the way you just did. Great tactic, bravo!
At any time you feel like having a discussion, feel free to watch the video and actually respond rather pull a bullshit ass "blind hatred" card. It's a tired dumb nonsensical point and you're not fooling anyone except other die hard Cage fans.
Find me one exemple in the OT where anyone was ganged up against. Go ahead. Or you can make shit up if you want, that's fine too.
Everyone has always been glad to have discussion about the game, positive or negative, nobody has attacked anyone there, and everyone was welcome. If you had genuine questions or things you wanted to talk about, it would have been nice to have you there. But it does seem like you were more concerned about just shitting on the game. So yeah.
Also I did accuse you, but I was also explaining and giving more context to a thing you said. I wasn't planning to debate on this topic.
I am now convinced of your ABSOLUTE bad faith, since you dared to call the "blind hatred" a bullshit argument, when it was really obvious ? And that doesn't mean any negativity was non legitimate. It means there was a ton of it that wasn't and was either confirmation bias or pure shit posting and circle jerking. This has gone on for months. There's no fooling.
But ok I did watch the video. It wasn't enjoyable, his tone made it hard to go through it. Anyway here are my thoughts.
- "David Cage is a hack and can't direct actors or write competent scenes" "actors are shit besides connor and hank" Millions of players loved his characters, many have praised the acting of pretty much every character, the scene directing and cinematography is also recognized by THE VAST MAJORITY as highly competent for the most part, I'll get back to the writing later as it's its own big chunk
- He keeps implying that any lack of subtlety in the narration regarding the main themes equals a terrible game, as if the characters, choices, consequences, interactions and evolution of relationships, all thanks to the players' actions, are not part of the narration.
- Using the Kotaku (
uhum) interview to keep shitting on Cage despite the many other interviews he gave to clarify his statements, some of which the author of the video DID include but decided to make fun of and then kept ignoring cause it didn't fit his narrative. Ok then. Cage has stated many times all the parallels are intentional and are echos of the past. The story he chose to tell wasn't just "robots", this is an over simplification of what he said. I didn't search for the Kotaku interview but considering I read his answer to the question "what is the game about" from multiple other outlets, either he did not want to spend any time with kotaku, either the interview was cut short, or twisted. The author knew that and didn't care.
- All the Canada stuff is the author not paying attention to what's said and shown in the game. The state of Androids in Canada is touched upon multiple times. And of course a canadian guard would be influenced by what's happening in America, why not ???
- He goes on saying a white person kinda has no legitimacy writing black people, which I don't agree on, and also ignores multiple writers have participated on the game, not just Cage. The game takes place in 2038, none of those humans he's talking about have even SEEN human slavery, they've only read about it, heard about it. The fact that some of the humans of that era relate with Androids isn't a bad thing to me.
- He spends a whole lot of time saying how Androids look like humans as if that was a bad thing then acknowledges discrimination happen to people that "look just like you" anyway.
- What the androids "feel", whether it's genuine or not, is down to the player. You decide.
- Most of the deviancy case that led to murder, were preceded by intense act of violence towards the android. That's... the entire point of Connor, he investigates crimes, so of course you see crimes...
- Kamski is NOT the god figure ???? It's stated what they see as their god figure is the first android that broke free (and possibly infected the others). How Connor sees his creator is entirely up to the player. And what Kamski says last is about Connor's failsafe not... anything else.
- The androids are known by humans to be superior, so their act of pacifism is why it's powerful. The fact they also demonstrated "emotions" when they thought they were going to die is another proof that they were not faking it the whole time. So humans did react to that. Not sure what's the problem here, I thought it was an effective scene. Maybe you can hate this ending for being too naive, but like.... whatever.
- "the public opinion doesn't affect anything except literally Kara and Markus' fate"
- He says you don't get to experience the trials and situations the characters go through because of how the game is designed..... and there's nothing to argue about, I think he's completely wrong and many people I'm sure will disagree with what he said. Like, we played the game, I honestly don't know what to say, Detroit made me feel stuff I haven't felt in a long time, and also put me in unique situations, and always made me feel like I had control, so I have no idea what's even trying to do here.
" Maybe they shouldn't have made a game lulz" "maybe David Cage should stop making games entirely lulz" yeah K,
you have to realize that a lot of people did love the game. We're not talking 4 people here, we're talking thousands and thousands. Cage wasn't the only writer on this, hundreds of people have worked on the game on many levels, there is such a lack of respect going on it's really hard to see any value there. Anything can be terrible if your judgement is already clouded by negativity. Many people have loved the character interactions, several people have even cried in a scene or two, you have HUNDREDS of testimonies, in the OT, on twitter, clearly the way he writes can't be all that awful, even if you think he made a very straightforward story with unsubtle allegories, that doesn't mean the characters and the situations didn't work for people. Personally I thought Markus' story was really bad except at the end, but Connor and Kara ? Loved them.
It's a long game, not everything works, not everything is perfect, but the majority of the content did end up great for me and many people.
- "Humans don't join the androids" dude it's been ONE DAY in the story at this point. And the mass population is very confused as to what's happening. As for humans before that point, you do see some humans that sympathize with androids. He does cite them and them brushes them off as if it didn't matter while they're interacting with the main characters......
- Markus' dialogue about humans is, again, shaped by the player. It is what you want.
- The obscure ending is a "twist" that is contradicted by all the other endings (and it's one of the rare endings that does get contradicted while the others just add more elements to the overall story), there can be multiple explanations for it though (that are actually fun, but I feel like it's another discussion that should be had in the OT). It's an ending seen by like 5% of people and not sure why he took it so seriously, it was obviously meant as a "dark stinger" . If it bothers you that much just tell yourself it's one of the shortcomings of the having so many endings. Big whoop.
