Just by watching Maximillian_DOOD's stream I learned Nero can do Buster Knuckle while riding around Punchline. I mean it's obvious when you think back to it but sometimes you just need to see somebody do it.
yeah i just realised you can knuckle an Overture strike as well, which should have been obvious since I've been knuckling helter skelter forever.
using the DT swords during holds though is brilliant, i wonder what the numbers are like and if it's worth burning DT just for the additional damage if you're not already in DT
And that's M20 done. Playing as Nero in that fight is such a fucking amazing denouement and power trip even on DMD. Absolutely makes *you* feel like the final boss. DMD is done.
This fight is so good and feels empowering even on DMD. It's so gooooood. In hindsight I didn't realize I almost had no hits. Not god-tier play or anything but I wanted a clip of the fight against the final boss regardless.
This fight is so good and feels empowering even on DMD. It's so gooooood. In hindsight I didn't realize I almost had no hits. Not god-tier play or anything but I wanted a clip of the fight against the final boss regardless.
After some 15 hours in-game I finished it. The first 2/3 of the game were a bit of a struggle as the game felt like it didn't play as I wanted to, or that I couldn't play the game as it wanted me to, but eventually things started to fall into place and as encounters became more interesting and as I got the hang of the controls the game became much more enjoyable. The last 5 bosses or so in particular were amazing.
Making my way through SOS. Doing pretty decently so far, constantly getting S ranks on missions but I believe that may be more down to just having a larger move set than anything.
I'm really starting to get into V's gameplay, which is a shame that it had to happen after I finished.
The two issues I have identified with him is that;
A) He's lacking a personal attack of his own. Obviously he's not supposed to be in the fray but it'd be nice if his cane at least did some damage. And,
B) Shadow has a variable and often unreliable pause in-between attacks. Griffin feels good to sue as when you press the button he instantly attacks. Shadow meanwhile sometimes has a delay, sometimes doesn't. And I think that's specifically what doesn't feel so good about playing V for most people as that's the main form of melee attack V has. Sometimes Shadow uses attacks you aren't even trying to use, sometimes he just dissapears and reappears further away from the target for no reason.
The best way to play V therefore, is to keep your distance and stand still whenever you can. That and using Shadow a lot slower and more purposefully. He's much easier to see and control then and you know which enemies he can hit easier.
I'm finding it a lot more fun to pick raised positions enemies can't reach easily and taunt with V while switching targets and use Shadows ariel launcher attack to fling groups of opponents into the sky.
If you can get enemies to gather in a group as well, through careful kiting, that's the perfect time to use Nightmare as he seems to drop in on the biggest grouping he can.
Only thing I can't adjust to is V's sliding. He doesn't stop on the spot unless you jump backwards and it gets aggravating.
The two issues I have identified with him is that;
A) He's lacking a personal attack of his own. Obviously he's not supposed to be in the fray but it'd be nice if his cane at least did some damage. And,
B) Shadow has a variable and often unreliable pause in-between attacks. Griffin feels good to sue as when you press the button he instantly attacks. Shadow meanwhile sometimes has a delay, sometimes doesn't. And I think that's specifically what doesn't feel so good about playing V for most people as that's the main form of melee attack V has. Sometimes Shadow uses attacks you aren't even trying to use, sometimes he just dissapears and reappears further away from the target for no reason.
For A) : you have Royal Fork, it does AoE damage, it's not only a finisher, the description is so bad. it's a good attack to get quickly rid of healing flies for eg. Or sometimes I use it to interrupt mad foes. You are invicible for a short time while doing Royal Fork too. It's an underrated attack ^^.
For B) Shadow disappears if you evade or if you are too far away. Personally I love the spin attack (the air version is very good on small/normal ennemies) and skewer (good chunk of damage but delayed attack). I like the charged AoE too, very useful in Bloody Palace. But yeah, not easy with all the mess to do the chain combo you want so I don't rely on those ones.
Honestly I was super fucking pumped and surprised when I pulled it off. You can see I break off gerbera to get ready to buster arm but had to basically panic break the buster arm since he was starting the cut and I didn't have time to get out.
Making my way through SOS. Doing pretty decently so far, constantly getting S ranks on missions but I believe that may be more down to just having a larger move set than anything.
I'm really starting to get into V's gameplay, which is a shame that it had to happen after I finished.
The two issues I have identified with him is that;
A) He's lacking a personal attack of his own. Obviously he's not supposed to be in the fray but it'd be nice if his cane at least did some damage. And,
B) Shadow has a variable and often unreliable pause in-between attacks. Griffin feels good to sue as when you press the button he instantly attacks. Shadow meanwhile sometimes has a delay, sometimes doesn't. And I think that's specifically what doesn't feel so good about playing V for most people as that's the main form of melee attack V has. Sometimes Shadow uses attacks you aren't even trying to use, sometimes he just dissapears and reappears further away from the target for no reason.
The best way to play V therefore, is to keep your distance and stand still whenever you can. That and using Shadow a lot slower and more purposefully. He's much easier to see and control then and you know which enemies he can hit easier.
I'm finding it a lot more fun to pick raised positions enemies can't reach easily and taunt with V while switching targets and use Shadows ariel launcher attack to fling groups of opponents into the sky.
If you can get enemies to gather in a group as well, through careful kiting, that's the perfect time to use Nightmare as he seems to drop in on the biggest grouping he can.
Only thing I can't adjust to is V's sliding. He doesn't stop on the spot unless you jump backwards and it gets aggravating.
Highly recommend using royal fork liberally. The description makes it sound like it's only a finisher, but it actually does solid AOE damage and staggers things really well. Definitely agree with shadow's unresponsiveness. Any time he repositions there's this annoying delay where inputs won't do anything. Some more demons would be nice to round out his kit though. He's lacking in that regard.
repositioning shadow is also annoying cos if you do it with the side-dodge he still has to leap up out of the ground from where you are, it takes a second and he ends up in a different spot to you which is annoying
For A) : you have Royal Fork, it does AoE damage, it's not only a finisher, the description is so bad. it's a good attack to get quickly rid of healing flies for eg. Or sometimes I use it to interrupt mad foes. You are invicible for a short time while doing Royal Fork too. It's an underrated attack ^^.
For B) Shadow disappears if you evade or if you are too far away. Personally I love the spin attack (the air version is very good on small/normal ennemies) and skewer (good chunk of damage but delayed attack). I like the charged AoE too, very useful in Bloody Palace. But yeah, not easy with all the mess to do the chain combo you want so I don't rely on those ones.
Highly recommend using royal fork liberally. The description makes it sound like it's only a finisher, but it actually does solid AOE damage and staggers things really well. Definitely agree with shadow's unresponsiveness. Any time he repositions there's this annoying delay where inputs won't do anything. Some more demons would be nice to round out his kit though. He's lacking in that regard.
You can also Buster Knuckle during Showdown which is super cool. You can use it during so much shit. I find myself spamming it during animations just to see what else I find.
tomboy is like ridiculously good swordwise. The gun is almost more of a trap than anything else though because jeeeesus reorienting to a TPS suddenly in the middle of a combo is a bad time
tomboy is like ridiculously good swordwise. The gun is almost more of a trap than anything else though because jeeeesus reorienting to a TPS suddenly in the middle of a combo is a bad time
Which is why I never use it. I'm constantly holding down the gun button with Nero so when I use Tomboy he immediately goes into his gun mode. It's hard to break the habit.
I don't really use Tomboy that much since I'm always so scared of it breaking and I'm not a fan of the lack of lock-on. If I use it, it's always with the spinning aerial attack, rarely with the ground combo, and never with the gun.
Making my way through SOS. Doing pretty decently so far, constantly getting S ranks on missions but I believe that may be more down to just having a larger move set than anything.
I'm really starting to get into V's gameplay, which is a shame that it had to happen after I finished.
The two issues I have identified with him is that;
A) He's lacking a personal attack of his own. Obviously he's not supposed to be in the fray but it'd be nice if his cane at least did some damage. And,
B) Shadow has a variable and often unreliable pause in-between attacks. Griffin feels good to sue as when you press the button he instantly attacks. Shadow meanwhile sometimes has a delay, sometimes doesn't. And I think that's specifically what doesn't feel so good about playing V for most people as that's the main form of melee attack V has. Sometimes Shadow uses attacks you aren't even trying to use, sometimes he just dissapears and reappears further away from the target for no reason.
The best way to play V therefore, is to keep your distance and stand still whenever you can. That and using Shadow a lot slower and more purposefully. He's much easier to see and control then and you know which enemies he can hit easier.
I'm finding it a lot more fun to pick raised positions enemies can't reach easily and taunt with V while switching targets and use Shadows ariel launcher attack to fling groups of opponents into the sky.
If you can get enemies to gather in a group as well, through careful kiting, that's the perfect time to use Nightmare as he seems to drop in on the biggest grouping he can.
Only thing I can't adjust to is V's sliding. He doesn't stop on the spot unless you jump backwards and it gets aggravating.
Get Royal Fork. The description for the move isn't accurate.
It actually does good damage in of itself, regardless if it's used as the 'killing' blow. It also only consumes like one DT pip, not the entire gauge like the description makes it sound like.
I don't really use Tomboy that much since I'm always so scared of it breaking and I'm not a fan of the lack of lock-on. If I use it, it's always with the spinning aerial attack, rarely with the ground combo, and never with the gun.
Tomboy's Breakage usage prevents it from breaking even if you get hit. Obviously, it'll break once the cycle is consumed, but that's the bet way to use it IMO.
It also really bugged me how gung-ho Dante was on fighting to the death with him, since originally he was pretty broken up about losing his brother, even though it was necessary to save the world. In fact him being broken up about that was even explicitly cited as his key humanizing moment. Like, it was really satisfying to see Nero deck both of them in the face and be the main character finally, but I wish it hadn't been at the expense of the both of them acting out of character the whole time.
why Vergil even wants to kill Dante so much, it looks like its mostly revenge from 3, but if you take Nelo Angelo shouldn't Vergil at least be grateful to Dante he helped him from being Mundus slave? 🤔maybe his motivation could have changed to kill off Mundus using the tree, and later become king and Dante is not ok with that
Lol no, I love to read about how people see characters, it's often very different from me because I tend to overthink and have my own alternative universe too, haha. But yes, mine is odd because I have a huge hole in the story (I don't have a PS3/4 that's the main reason I skip DMC3 also because I hate Dante3's hairstyle, I only bought the shameful HD collection recently and stop after Cerberus because of DMC5... xD). I'm wondering if it will beat my infinite love for DMC1.
*High Five*! :D
It was similar to me; DMC3 SE on PC it was, cause I never had a PS2. I had only seen the games before, and I'm actually not much of a player, not really my genre and I suck hard. Mostly in for the story. :o
There is also a prequel Manga to 3, if you don't know. It's as confusing as everything around DMC tends to be, and they wanted do release a third volume originally, but it got cancelled. But it explains at least that whole year they haven't seen each other, Dante is mentioning, and how the quarrel, they already have, started.
Dante's hairstyle is best in 4, I'd say.
why Vergil even wants to kill Dante so much, it looks like its mostly revenge from 3, but if you take Nelo Angelo shouldn't Vergil at least be grateful to Dante he helped him from being Mundus slave? 🤔maybe his motivation could have changed to kill off Mundus using the tree, and later become king and Dante is not ok with that
He always hated Dante, they never got along as kids. Vergil felt neglected and that Eva favoured Dante, leading to that nonsense, that she abandoned him during the attack.
What is not just plain wrong, but a strange thought to begin with, because he was playing far away from the house without her knowledge. And he can't know that she hid Dante, cause he wasn't there to see it.
So he is super jealouse of Dante and always wanted to fight him. That's his new goal even in DMC3: Get more power to defeat Dante.
Didn't went well 'n stuff, and now splitting him is the final attempt to avoid certain death and beat the shit out of Dante. To prove that he's the better twin. A bit like Liquid challenging Snake.
Then we have that bullshit idea from Vergil, if their positions had been switch that day - but there is no real difference in both of their lifes. Eva died, both survived, spending the following years on the run from demons. Both went through the same shit. What leads him to this strange thought?
They could have Vergil going for revenge on Dante for denying him Sparda, leading to his Nelo Angelo nightmare (also it's mostly his own fault).
They could have given him a real redemption and seeking revenge on Mundus for his torture. Instead of that Kingdom Hearts story let Urizen be some Mundus resurrection and Vergil barges in on the fight to help bring him down.
But they went with that strange siblings rivalry thing even Nero thinks is dumb.
Oinone : hell yes ! I'll catch up when I'm done with DMC5, I didn't even know that the prequel manga exists in my language, I never saw it in stores though, I'll order it online despite the negative comments (and I'll play DMC2 one day too HAHA). My English is too weak for the novels though.
@Oinone : hell yes ! I'll catch up when I'm done with DMC5, I didn't even know that the prequel manga exists in my language, I never saw it in stores though, I'll order it online despite the negative comments (and I'll play DMC2 one day too HAHA). My English is too weak for the novels though.
I hope, the french version is not as bad as the official english one. It got translated quite freely at some points, adding e.g. a lot of sexual innuendo jokes Dante makes, that don't exist in the original. And back in the day it was quite common to translate from english into other languages instead of japanese. I've only read the fan translation myself. The manga has some really interesting bits, but it's lacking once again a clear explanation to everything. It's suspected they wanted to explain more about Lady and the killing of her mother (who seems to be still alive during the manga) in the third volume too, that got cancelled.
I thought of reading the light novels from time to time, but in the end never cared enough. The only interesting one would be the first anyway with all that Tony, Nell and Gilver stuff. Everytime when I read a little summary, I think I should get it, but are too lazy to really look for it. XD
I hope, the french version is not as bad as the official english one. It got translated quite freely at some points, adding e.g. a lot of sexual innuendo jokes Dante makes, that don't exist in the original. And back in the day it was quite common to translate from english into other languages instead of japanese. I've only read the fan translation myself. The manga has some really interesting bits, but it's lacking once again a clear explanation to everything. It's suspected they wanted to explain more about Lady and the killing of her mother (who seems to be still alive during the manga) in the third volume too, that got cancelled.
I thought of reading the light novels from time to time, but in the end never cared enough. The only interesting one would be the first anyway with all that Tony, Nell and Gilver stuff. Everytime when I read a little summary, I think I should get it, but are too lazy to really look for it. XD
I been reading them (the DMC 1, 2 and 4 books) , they have been pretty entertaining and worth reading once if you like the characters and games, 1 i couldn't stop :P its fun with classic Dante fighting the mob and then Gilver and 4 fleshes out some things from the game, like Nero avenging Credo's death , the ascension ceremony and the Order , more Lady scenes like when she fought the angelos etc. the translation on that one is a bit off , haven't read 2 yet.
*High Five*! :D
It was similar to me; DMC3 SE on PC it was, cause I never had a PS2. I had only seen the games before, and I'm actually not much of a player, not really my genre and I suck hard. Mostly in for the story. :o
There is also a prequel Manga to 3, if you don't know. It's as confusing as everything around DMC tends to be, and they wanted do release a third volume originally, but it got cancelled. But it explains at least that whole year they haven't seen each other, Dante is mentioning, and how the quarrel, they already have, started.
Dante's hairstyle is best in 4, I'd say.
They changed his background, that is why.
He always hated Dante, they never got along as kids. Vergil felt neglected and that Eva favoured Dante, leading to that nonsense, that she abandoned him during the attack.
What is not just plain wrong, but a strange thought to begin with, because he was playing far away from the house without her knowledge. And he can't know that she hid Dante, cause he wasn't there to see it.
So he is super jealouse of Dante and always wanted to fight him. That's his new goal even in DMC3: Get more power to defeat Dante.
Didn't went well 'n stuff, and now splitting him is the final attempt to avoid certain death and beat the shit out of Dante. To prove that he's the better twin. A bit like Liquid challenging Snake.
Then we have that bullshit idea from Vergil, if their positions had been switch that day - but there is no real difference in both of their lifes. Eva died, both survived, spending the following years on the run from demons. Both went through the same shit. What leads him to this strange thought?
They could have Vergil going for revenge on Dante for denying him Sparda, leading to his Nelo Angelo nightmare (also it's mostly his own fault).
They could have given him a real redemption and seeking revenge on Mundus for his torture. Instead of that Kingdom Hearts story let Urizen be some Mundus resurrection and Vergil barges in on the fight to help bring him down.
But they went with that strange siblings rivalry thing even Nero thinks is dumb.
Even so the story seems clearly positioned to be a sort of redemption for Vergil. V is his human side and clearly sees the error of his ways and post merge Vergil is noticeably more lighthearted than before, helped along by Nero. The end game cutscene pretty much shows them fully reconciled and fighting more for sport
I been reading them (the DMC 1, 2 and 4 books) , they have been pretty entertaining and worth reading once if you like the characters and games, 1 i couldn't stop :P its fun with classic Dante fighting the mob and then Gilver and 4 fleshes out some things from the game, like Nero avenging Credo's death , the ascension ceremony and the Order , more Lady scenes like when she fought the angelos etc. the translation on that one is a bit off , haven't read 2 yet.
Holy shit, thanks for the link. o.O
Just checked amazon - at least 33€ for Vol 1 and even over 100€ for the second. Wtf?! XD
The thought of Tony and Gilver fighting together always gives me goosebumps. :3
Even so the story seems clearly positioned to be a sort of redemption for Vergil. V is his human side and clearly sees the error of his ways and post merge Vergil is noticeably more lighthearted than before, helped along by Nero. The end game cutscene pretty much shows them fully reconciled and fighting more for sport
Yeah, but that doesn't work for me, cause I see him different.
For me, Vergil always knew he wasn't doing good and always felt remorse. Now they make it sound, like he is only able to do it as V, but never before. What makes Vergil worse than before.
That he thanks Nero before going through the portal and gives him the book comes from Vs influence, that I'd say too. But that he softened up and is more lightheartened - he was like that before for me, no V needed.
The situation was different in DMC3. He was very pressured and had a goal to work against. There was no room for him to smile and joke around with Dante.
But at the end of 5, there is no goal and no pressure. And the way they hang out together would be the same, if he hadn't fallen into hell in 3 and made up after all that shit.
I absolutaly love those last scenes, they are the best and the way I want a whole game with the twins.
But he never really atones for his old deeds or apologises or makes up with Dante in a bigger way. He even causes far more trouble with the tree, why it's often criticised that in the end no one seems to care and they just team up with Vergil again, no questions asked.
That's why I made the example with him working in the background, helping to bring Urizen down. Or he could have given his life to save Dante's or shit like that. The whole V thing doesn't work for me, also because V's deeds are a bit questionable as well. Don't merge back, just kill Urizen and die. Atone for your deeds this way. And don't beat up random people to get their money with blood on. :o
This fight is so good and feels empowering even on DMD. It's so gooooood. In hindsight I didn't realize I almost had no hits. Not god-tier play or anything but I wanted a clip of the fight against the final boss regardless.
Listening to them going off with how kino the BP update will be...after BP came out:
Also:
It didn't really click until watching the final episode, but Vergil fighting with Dante in credits is probably the reason why there is a fourth player character slot. They are just re-using the cameo system for that one instance.
The R3 shortcut for auto is really annoying. I was getting really weird control problems with Nero on H&H and only realised when I got hit that he was auto comboing 🙃
The R3 shortcut for auto is really annoying. I was getting really weird control problems with Nero on H&H and only realised when I got hit that he was auto comboing 🙃
For anyone who's curious what's talked about but isn't interested to watch the whole thing, here are some main points:
For DMC5, Itsuno was inspired by a couple of anime shows or movies (to avoid copyright issues they show fake versions of the anime shows, but I have no idea what they are. Looked to be mech-related?), and he wanted to replicate the emotion he felt during a few key moments during those shows.
The above lead to him wanting to have one very specific scene in the game (it's what happens at the start of Mission 20), and he built the entire story around that.
The theme of the game is "setback and awakening." Which is very apparent in the story with how characters are met with extreme hardship early in the story but then become more powerful later on.
They had a huge design meeting around September 2015 where Itsuno presented his plans for the game (this included the overall story, what each mission is, and the idea of having some characters gaining their full power as late as the end of the game). They never veered much from that original design.
He talked a lot about the enemy design and difficulty of the game. He wanted enemies which are tough to fight, but with very clear tells as to how you're supposed to fight them.
One small example: the Fury has the colour red rather than the grey of the ordinary Riot, which makes them seem like a stronger foe. And their more human-like way of standing makes them seem more intelligent than Riot.
He wanted the player to have the feeling that when they do fail, it feels like they were close to succeeding. One example he presented is the max-act system. In DMC4, it was more of a binary thing, either you got the timing down and you got a lot of exceed, or nothing happened at all. In DMC5 they made it so that even with very bad timing, you'll at least get a small amount of exceed.
He explained the reasoning behind being able to revive with red orbs. You can choose how many red orbs to use (more means respawning with more health). He looks at this as form of betting: "How much health do I actually need to win this fight?" He hopes that with this system players will feel like they lost a bet rather than blaming the game if they ended up dying yet again after respawning with the health they chose.
It's a fun watch, although I'd be curious to know more information about ideas they had to scrap or early prototype versions of the game (he showed a lot of that during his Dragon's Dogma GDC presentation. Then again, maybe early versions of the game wouldn't be too different than the final version since it sounded like development went very smoothly).
I'm impressed they managed to create a plan very early on and stick to it. Pretty much the exact opposite of something like Anthem which sounds like it didn't find its identity until one year before release. Of course, it helped that they were building upon the gameplay of DMC4 rather than needing to start from scratch, but it's still impressive.
