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DF: We've heard from multiple devs that Series S is a bit of a pain at times (regarding memory constraints not CPU/GPU power)

brokenswiftie

brokenswiftie

Prophet of Truth
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May 30, 2018
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Timestamped video

I've always thought that it would be the GPU that would be the limiting factor when it comes to games that really push next-gen systems
didn't realize the actual constraint is the memory
can anyone elaborate on why?

although I do remember a doom dev saying something similar before the console launched, but others here refuted that so IDK
will be interesting to see how devs tackle this issue going forward

edit: https://wccftech.com/id-software-devs-concerns-xbox-series-s-specs/
found the old one

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RoboPlato

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Oct 25, 2017
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GPUs and graphics settings are incredibly scalable but memory isn't nearly as "elastic". If you hit a wall, you hit a wall. Going to be very interesting to see how the Series S fairs in the longterm.
 
vixolus

vixolus

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This is going to be a fun thread like every other Series S tech thread
 
jroc74

jroc74

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Oct 27, 2017
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Uh oh....here we go....lol.

All I will say is a few years ago alot of us got into many a debate about the memory, among other things.
 
Biosnake

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Oct 25, 2017
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Very interested to see how it holds up over the years. Is this only about RT though?
 
OldBritBloke

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I picked up my Series S mostly to play 360 games but I'm still hoping it will handle Starfield without extreme compromises. Fingers crossed.
 
Winnie

Winnie

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Mar 12, 2020
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Aren't they talking about games with RT? In that case it doesn't surprise me that much tbh.
 
PanzerKraken

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Nov 1, 2017
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I think this was always going to be a problem with the S. As everyone keeps pushing their games and building around the higher end X and PS5 systems, they will constantly be having to hold back and do more work for the S series games
 
gothi

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Not surprised to hear this. Always felt like Microsoft promoted SFS as the solution to memory constraints (wasn't it positioned as 2-3X multiplier in their demo scene?) Are there (m)any games actually using SFS?
 
Biggzy

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Oct 27, 2017
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Yes. GPU can always be flexible as we see with the Switch but memory is a hard limit. The Series S is honestly 2 GBs short, so devs are going to have to really manage memory.
 
HououinKyouma

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Interesting. I figured this would be an issue at some point, but surprised to hear it's already a pain for some people.
 
zombiejames

zombiejames

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No shit. The pre-launch thought that all devs would have to do is lower the resolution and do nothing else was always a laughably stupid idea.
 
Toumari

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This always felt like it would be the case as multiple developers even said they were concerned about the memory when the specced were revealed.

Guess we'll see how things turn out in the end, but concerning to see it already be an issue so early in the generation.
 
RoboPlato

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gothi said:
Not surprised to hear this. Always felt like Microsoft promoted SFS as the solution to memory constraints (wasn't it positioned as 2-3X multiplier in their demo scene?) Are there (m)any games actually using SFS?
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Not yet. It's something that won't really be utilized until a ways into pure new gen development.
 
Kida

Kida

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Oct 27, 2017
1,899
Least powerful console is hardest to optimize for shocker.

Devs will find the compromises needed to get the games running on it. You'll probably see even bigger cuts to resolution and framerate eventually, but the vast majority of the S audience won't notice or care.
 

bastardly

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Nov 8, 2017
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i doubt the ps5 and xsx will hold up this entire gen, so i never thought the s would even come close. glad i stuck it out and held out for an x though
 

Deleted member 93062

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Not entirely surprised by this, it's not going to be a walk in the park to scale back a game for the Series S, however I also think the target demographic of the Series S doesn't care about the compromises made.

I imagine anybody who cares about all the highest quality stuff is on the Series X.

Bengraven said:
I mentioned in a thread about how games might skip the S due to hardware issues and got attacked.
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If you want to release on Xbox, you cannot skip the S.
 
Det

Det

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Jul 30, 2020
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gothi said:
Not surprised to hear this. Always felt like Microsoft promoted SFS as the solution to memory constraints (wasn't it positioned as 2-3X multiplier in their demo scene?) Are there (m)any games actually using SFS?
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Not sure if SFS has any impact on RT, as that seemed to be one of the primary concerns with memory bandwidth.
 

LCGeek

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Oct 28, 2017
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Known quantity but same devs need to remember they got mouths to feed and bigger audiences lead to more money.

This shouldn't be a debate in 2022 not after switch.

bastardly said:
i doubt the ps5 and xsx will hold up this entire gen, so i never thought the s would even come close. glad i stuck it out and held out for an x though
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Ryzens of their class don't have horrible minimums like older cpus before them do. Until devs start beating last gens best it's not the gpu to blame either. Plenty of engines should be chucked or heavily modified to take advantage of features or be more efficient. We have FSR 2.0 and VRS as well.
 
Rogote

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Oct 25, 2017
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Well duh. Anyone with a brain that can put 2 and 2 together has known this for a long time. Anything trying to explain it away is and always was hopiumcopium. It's not deep. It just is what it is.
 
Sephiroth

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Oct 26, 2017
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If Series S can stream games, do the hardware limitations matter? Asking because Xbox seems so gungho about streaming Gamepass everywhere.
 
demondance

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I think there's going to be a real awkward situation for the Series S, where some games run wonderfully even compared to the cross gen stuff we have now (games optimized for next gen GPUs), but anything that needs more memory bandwidth is going to have to make some awkward Switch-esque compromises.
 
Doctor_Thomas

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They may not be able to "skip" it, but I bet Series S gets Switch style "streaming only" versions of games at some point
 

LCGeek

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demondance said:
I think there's going to be a real awkward situation for the Series S, where some games run wonderfully even compared to the cross gen stuff we have now (games optimized for next gen GPUs), but anything that needs more memory bandwidth is going to have to make some awkward Switch-esque compromises.
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More like steam deck

DF has shown that switch is quite a ways in distance from RDNA2 that can actually do some tasks. It's not perfect as some UE5 demos need lord's work.
 

Deleted member 93062

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I think Microsoft is more likely to release a next gen Xbox lineup before allowing streaming only games on Series S.
 
Jawmuncher

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I imagine as we drop cross-gen, we'll see a lot more "Yeah it's on the S but not necessarily how you should play it). Much like the OG XB1 was/is starting to show. It's almost always the worst place to play anything Performance/Tech wise.

With that said, the market of the S is the market that can "deal" with that. I know people still rocking a launch XB1 because as long as their system can play the game they want in some form, they're happy.

Sephiroth said:
If Series S can stream games, do the hardware limitations matter? Asking because Xbox seems so gungho about streaming Gamepass everywhere.
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I'll say yes just because streaming can't be the be all - end all due to how networking is worldwide. Someone buying a Series S might not necessarily have a good connection that can stream (but is just fine downloading games or playing online).
 
cgpartlow

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I do think MS should have bit the bullet and raised the Memory in the S, but I think once things like VRS and SFS start taking off, less memory will be required for 1080p
 
julia crawford

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i mean if that's the worst of it then things are pretty good anyway, a bit of a pain sometimes is the definition of not a big problem
 
jroc74

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LCGeek said:
Known quantity but same devs need to remember they got mouths to feed and bigger audiences lead to more money.

This shouldn't be a debate in 2022 not after switch.



Ryzens of their class don't have horrible minimums like older cpus before them do. Until devs start beating last gens best it's not the gpu to blame either. Plenty of engines should be chucked or heavily modified to take advantage of features or be more efficient. We have FSR 2.0 and VRS as well.
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I think some ppl really are sleeping on Ryzen.... and also the work that was done to the gpu's in these consoles.
 
Rats

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Surprised Pikachu. I imagine any problems that exist now will only be exacerbated as the gen goes on.
 
Fisty

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It's definitely going to slow the rising min spec more than we have seen in previous gen transitions. Not ideal but I guess Microsoft has MAUs to feed lol
 
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