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Disney+’s Surprise Biggest Threat Is… Netflix Loyalty

Oct 27, 2017
12,609
Seattle
Netflix has a little bit of everything, that’s why I’ll keep subscribing. Disney+ is too focused on family friendly content for me to very interested. If I had kids it would be a different situation.
Yeah, In the end, unless you are all in lucasfilms/marvel/disney stuff, I can see how it would not appeal to those not interested that. I mean sure, they will have some stuff that people that don't fall into that will be interested in (Malcom in the Middle, Simpsons, some of the other fox movies/properties/disney sports movies, Nat geo etc).

Disney knows that a large part of that demo will be families with kids.
 

Darknight

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,346
If they carefully plan shows to only last two or three seasons then I don't think it's a problem necessarily. I do think there are diminishing returns on long series as they inevitably not only become more expensive but they also lose steam, both creatively and in the burden it takes for someone new to catch on (unless there is just incredible buzz).
Well the problem is they aren't planning around that and I think I can understand why. Even with all of Netflix's data, they can't predict their next huge hit. So making sure things tie up and end within 2 to 3 seasons doesn't give them the wiggle room to carry on a big hit. So it's hard to say, this show should have a proper conclusion but this one shouldn't because we're investing in this one long term. It would seem to me that Netflix is afraid of closing a door prematurely on something that can greatly benefit them but they don't know which doors they can and can't close ahead of time.
 

Kthulhu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,950
How's is this surprising?

Netflix isn't just big because you can watch Iron Man and Star Wars. They've been making exclusive content for years now.
 

T002 Tyrant

Member
Nov 8, 2018
1,095
Eh I'm just going to have to bite the bullet because Disney+ has everything I want especially in the Marvel and Star Wars department. I'm just going to downgrade my Netflix to SD and use the mcable to upscale the footage.
 

ChrisR

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,139
Don't care about any of the content on Disney+, while I do watch shows on Netflix.

Why would I drop the thing I use for the thing I wouldn't use?
 
Dec 11, 2018
2,368
There are plenty of people online who think Netflix is dead because of Disney+. I think they’re insane.
A lot of those people are on this site. Go back and read the thread that got posted when Disney announced pricing for their service. The number of posts claiming Netflix was on life support is hilarious. But that's what happens when you think the world must love comic book movies as much as you do.
 

Dabanton

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,469
Netflix Original content is what will keep me signed on.

I mean most Disney stuff is OK but not anything I'd want to watch week to week.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,124
The Disney+ and Hulu combined sub is still less than Netflix (which is something Disney will be offering at launch) so I'm not sure this is really true. Especially as fewer companies are going to be renewing their content for Netflix, at least exclusively. The big syndicated TV shows are all leaving in the next couple years for example.
Price is a huge point in their favor but it isn't going to stay static forever.

Netflix has made it a point to base their entire strategy moving forward on their own original content, not others. They're investing billions of dollars in it and it's paying off for them.

While Disney is by no means guaranteed to win the streaming wars, I find this thinking to be even more bizarre. Disney is an absolute threat and should be taken seriously. You can bet the people at Netflix are treating them as such. Disney owns so many companies and IPs that they can leverage that go beyond just Star Wars and Marvel and to discount them as a threat is incredibly naive and not understanding how wide of a reach Disney has.
They're a threat in some ways, not a threat in others... but sure, it'd be silly for Netflix to discount Disney+ posing problems potentially.

Great catalog and IP's but it will take years, if not a decade, for them to catch up to and compete with the breath of content Netflix offers. So far they haven't shown anything outside of MCU and Star Wars that looks interesting. All their re imagined properties look cheap and unnecessary. People can point to the bad content Netflix pumps out but it's not arguable that they've built up a stable of critically acclaimed and popular series and films that continue to attract and maintain their humongous user base.
 

Kthulhu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,950
There are plenty of people online who think Netflix is dead because of Disney+. I think they’re insane.
I definitely think they'll see a dip thanks to Disney stuff leaving and shows like the Office going away.

TBH I see Apple TV+ as a bigger threat. Apple could easily do to Netflix what they've been doing to Spotify if they wanted to.

Regardless, the death of Netflix is greatly exaggerated.
 

Ecotic

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
781
It's not 'loyalty' exactly, it's switching costs. Signing up for and learning a new streaming service is a big hassle. You have to create an account, put in your debit card number, get used to the interface, and get your settings and favorites the way you like them. No one has time for that crap. This is the age of 1-click shopping. It's why Disney and Apple are basically giving the service away at first because they know the initial hurdle to get subscribers is going to be steep. The Office isn't on Netflix anymore? The path of least resistance is to watch what else is available on Netflix rather than be bothered with signing up for something new. I imagine a lot of people just swearing off Disney+, Apple TV, Peacock, and whatever else is coming out simply because these companies are putting them through an ordeal to see their shows and movies.
 

HStallion

Member
Oct 25, 2017
29,981
Disney+'s biggest failing is its lack of diverse entertainment. If you dont like cartoons, comic books or Star Wars, what do they got? Not much. Netflix simply has more interesting content. So does Amazon for that matter. But Disney's advantage is they also have Hulu, which has much more interesting content than D+.
This is my issue. I've already got Hulu and Disney+ has little to offer me.
 

Darknight

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,346
They're a threat in some ways, not a threat in others... but sure, it'd be silly for Netflix to discount Disney+ posing problems potentially.

Great catalog and IP's but it will take years, if not a decade, for them to catch up to and compete with the breath of content Netflix offers. So far they haven't shown anything outside of MCU and Star Wars that looks interesting. All their re imagined properties look cheap and unnecessary. People can point to the bad content Netflix pumps out but it's not arguable that they've built up a stable of critically acclaimed and popular series and films that continue to attract and maintain their humongous user base.
Anyone saying Disney was going to kill Netflix overnight shouldn't be taken seriously. This was obviously going to be something that is going to take years to realize. Disney has said as much frequently. Disney was never going to kill Netflix in the short term, but the question of where Netflix stands in the long term is absolutely at risk. It's not just Disney alone though. Disney will have a huge impact on eating away at Netflix's dominance, but the mere fact of everyone reclaiming their content which is happening a lot sooner than later is going to be the first step in eating away at Netflix's presence. Netflix's library is going to look vastly different once the licensed content goes away. Netflix clearly sees this as a problem or they wouldn't have invested half a billion into getting Seinfeld.

This is my issue. I've already got Hulu and Disney+ has little to offer me.
Hulu is Disney though. Hulu + Disney+ is going to be the equivalent of Netflix in the long run except here you'll be able to separate out the kid stuff if you don't want it. Hulu and Disney+ is Disney's streaming strategy.
 

Emily

Member
Oct 24, 2017
1,156
Disney+ is to Netflix what Nintendo is to Sony/Microsoft. It is not intended to be a direct competitor that replaces the service as your sole streaming product, it's intended to be an add-on, which is why it costs half the price. The premise of this article is stupid.
Even Nintendo - the Disney of the video game industry - is smart enough to realize they need adult content on their system to keep their older consumers happy: South Park, The Witcher 3, Bayonetta 3, Doom Eternal, Wolfenstein II, Mortal Kombat 11, Diablo 3.

I still think limiting Disney+ to only family-friendly content will do more harm than good. Telling people to "go subscribe to Hulu for adult content" will wind up feeling like an inconvenience to most people. Especially since the Hulu in that bundle is the basic "ads" version -- it's not even the version without ads.

Like I said before, look at what HBO Max is planning.

HBO Max's ultimate goal is to eventually have all of their kids content under the same roof as their adult content. Kids content like Looney Tunes, Sesame Street, Cartoon Network, Boomerang... will be part of the same service as DC Comics, Turner Classic Movies, TNT, Harry Potter, Friends, The Big Bang Theory, The Sopranos, The Wire, and Game of Thrones. That means family friendly WB movies like 'Detective Pikachu', 'The Lego Movie' and 'Harry Potter' will be under the same roof as R-rated adult WB films like 'The Departed', 'The Matrix', and 'Joker'.

I get that Disney wants to protect their brand. But I think most consumers prefer having their content all in one place (like Netflix) instead of being told to subscribe to 3 different services to gain access to all of Disney's content.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,549
Only reason Netflix is safe now is because their sheer quantity of filler shit (hey there are some gems though) that’s always there to fall back on between the high quality tent pole series that are mostly on other services.
 

BDS

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,510
Even Nintendo - the Disney of the video game industry - is smart enough to realize they need adult content on their system to keep their older consumers happy: South Park, The Witcher 3, Bayonetta 3, Doom Eternal, Wolfenstein II, Mortal Kombat 11, Diablo 3.

I still think limiting Disney+ to only family-friendly content will do more harm than good. Telling people to "go subscribe to Hulu for adult content" will wind up feeling like an inconvenience to most people. Especially since the Hulu in that bundle is the basic "ads" version -- it's not even the version without ads.

Like I said before, look at what HBO Max is planning.

HBO Max's ultimate goal is to eventually have all of their kids content under the same roof as their adult content. Kids content like Looney Tunes, Sesame Street, Cartoon Network, Boomerang... will be part of the same service as DC Comics, Turner Classic Movies, TNT, Harry Potter, Friends, The Big Bang Theory, The Sopranos, The Wire, and Game of Thrones. That means family friendly WB movies like 'Detective Pikachu', 'The Lego Movie' and 'Harry Potter' will be under the same roof as R-rated adult WB films like 'The Departed', 'The Matrix', and 'Joker'.

I get that Disney wants to protect their brand. But I think most consumers prefer having their content all in one place (like Netflix) instead of being told to subscribe to 3 different services to gain access to all of Disney's content.
It seems clear to me that Disney will eventually merge Disney+ and Hulu in some fashion -- they're already offering discounted bundles on both, for example -- but they wanted to use the kid-friendly Disney+ as a loss leader to get an established base before slowly phasing in Hulu, if for no other reason than that Hulu's branding and presentation don't match other Disney products. Disney only just got control of Hulu so they have a ways to go before they can fully take everything back from the existing licensing deals and put it in an expanded version of Disney+, probably several years from now. The two services will likely be segregated in some fashion so that kids can't access the adult content.
 

Darknight

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,346
It seems clear to me that Disney will eventually merge Disney+ and Hulu in some fashion -- they're already offering discounted bundles on both, for example -- but they wanted to use the kid-friendly Disney+ as a loss leader to get an established base before slowly phasing in Hulu, if for no other reason than that Hulu's branding and presentation don't match other Disney products. Disney only just got control of Hulu so they have a ways to go before they can fully take everything back from the existing licensing deals and put it in an expanded version of Disney+, probably several years from now. The two services will likely be segregated in some fashion so that kids can't access the adult content.
It wouldn't be the first time they consolidated services either. There used to be three apps, Disney, Disney Junior and Disney XD but they've all moved them into a single unified app called Disney Now. This is Disney's transition phase for their streaming services. We're pretty much in Phase 1. Nobody is killing anyone with their initial launch. The question is how will things look like 5 years from now when things have evolved and moved to other phases.
 

effingvic

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,407
I'll pay for both but Disney+ can't replace the content on Netflix. If one gotta go, it will be D+

I just want the Disney movies on 4K on demand. I dont care about their originals as they arent proven yet.
 

psynergyadept

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,150
When I log into Netflix, based off of what I’ve been watching for years, they can recommend me what I’d like, and are even making content for whatever categories I really like. Their recommendations algorithms are their bread and butter.

Disney+ isn’t really like that.
This! Netflix does a great job with discovering shows for it's viewers, better than HULU and Amazon in my opinion.

That being said people aren't "loyal to netflix" there's just a great multtude of streaming services out there and adding another to the list can seem like wasted money; though I will get that Hulu/Disney+/ESPN + Subscription.
 

Emily

Member
Oct 24, 2017
1,156
It seems clear to me that Disney will eventually merge Disney+ and Hulu in some fashion -- they're already offering discounted bundles on both, for example -- but they wanted to use the kid-friendly Disney+ as a loss leader to get an established base before slowly phasing in Hulu, if for no other reason than that Hulu's branding and presentation don't match other Disney products. Disney only just got control of Hulu so they have a ways to go before they can fully take everything back from the existing licensing deals and put it in an expanded version of Disney+, probably several years from now. The two services will likely be segregated in some fashion so that kids can't access the adult content.
You make some good points. And that's true - Disney only just got control of Hulu.

To clarify, I do think Disney+ is already shaping up to be an amazing service. I know I'll be subscribing to it on Day 1.
 

Nameless

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,407
Wish they had a bundle option that included Ad-free Hulu. The Ad Supported plan has zero value for me. I've been getting it free with Spotify for months and still upgrade instead of using it if there's something I want to see.
 

LGHT_TRSN

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,129
I'm going to continue to sub to Netflix because I like their content. They put out a ton of interesting stuff across a variety of genres.
 

Tobor

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,357
Richmond, VA
Other than drama and clickbait I have no idea why this is being portrayed as a zero sum game. Yes, they are competitors but there is plenty of room in the market for multiple services.
 

harSon

Member
Oct 30, 2017
3,814
The hardest thing to overcome for any competitor is that Netflix and streaming are literally interchangeable terms for many people at this point. It’s so far ingrained into the Zeigeist, that it’s basically a verb at this point.
 

henhowc

Member
Oct 26, 2017
14,699
Los Angeles, CA
Yes the optimal thing to do is wait until all of the stuff you want to see on a service is out and then subscribe and binge it. Some people just don't want to be bothered to be constantly switching on/off subscriptions like that though. That's just another thing you're thinking about budgeting and managing your schedule around.

Also as mentioned above, a lot of us actually like Netflix's content and they seem to have a constant stream of it. :gasp:

Its not some weird cult of loyalty where we refuse to even look at other services.
 

a916

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,119
I think a lot of it is more believing in Netflix to keep doing what they're doing. Disney has been awfully fickle about jumping into things, then jumping back out again - see gaming for an example.
Apple and Netflix are investing nearly 6B or 8B where as Disney is dipping their toe in with 1.5B a year on their streaming stuff for the next 3-4 years. They're very much going in slowly.
 

HStallion

Member
Oct 25, 2017
29,981
Anyone saying Disney was going to kill Netflix overnight shouldn't be taken seriously. This was obviously going to be something that is going to take years to realize. Disney has said as much frequently. Disney was never going to kill Netflix in the short term, but the question of where Netflix stands in the long term is absolutely at risk. It's not just Disney alone though. Disney will have a huge impact on eating away at Netflix's dominance, but the mere fact of everyone reclaiming their content which is happening a lot sooner than later is going to be the first step in eating away at Netflix's presence. Netflix's library is going to look vastly different once the licensed content goes away. Netflix clearly sees this as a problem or they wouldn't have invested half a billion into getting Seinfeld.



Hulu is Disney though. Hulu + Disney+ is going to be the equivalent of Netflix in the long run except here you'll be able to separate out the kid stuff if you don't want it. Hulu and Disney+ is Disney's streaming strategy.
That's my point. I don't want Disney+ and if I don't need it to get Hulu then I won't bother, especially since I've barely paid anything for Hulu these last couple of years thanks to crazy holiday deals.
 

Merv

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,126
Don't care about any of the content on Disney+, while I do watch shows on Netflix.

Why would I drop the thing I use for the thing I wouldn't use?
Corporate apologist! /s

I might get Disney + with Hulu, but it's ok that people are happy with the content on Netflix.

It has alot of variety/exclusive content that is also high quality...most of the time
 

Vagabundo

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,068
One streaming service is enough. I'm not subbing to a million different services for movies/tv shows.

I'd say most people on a streaming service like netflix or amazon will just pirate extra things not on their service.
 

TickleMeElbow

Member
Oct 31, 2017
1,953
Yeah for me it's less about loyalty, and more about "if I'm only gonna pay for one streaming service, which will it be?", and Netflix was my choice.
 

brainchild

GameXplain
Verified
Nov 25, 2017
7,713
Minnesota
Netflix being the first isn't the only reason they're still dominant, in this age of streaming we now have multiple options... but there is 2 reasons why it's on top. The variety in the library is a big one (just because someone in ERA doesn't like the library doesn't mean it's not varied and large). Also... the quality of life features Netflix has, no one else even comes close and is a big reason why people chose to stay on Netflix... they make everything easier via QoL. I think people underestimate the impact of QoL and the impact on people sticking with a service. The amount of QoL for non-english content is (for the most) part really well done. It's rare that I find a movie that only has 1 native language and 1-2 subtitle options, and even if it is, I've seen them add multiple language options down the line (which is the definition of QoL).

A small example of a QoL feature I have seen in netflix sponsored anime. Ever try watching an English dub with English sub-titles? If you ever tried, you will get english sub-titles that don't match what's being spoken, this happens pretty much every streaming service I've ever subbed to. On Netflix however, you will sometimes see an option for "English" and "English SDH", which the second option will match what the dub says. Something fairly recently I saw (non-anime related), was separation of specific Spanish dubs. I saw a show where "Spanish" was not the only option... there was a clear distinction that said "Spanish - European" and "Spanish - South American", something that's not essential but a very nice QoL to have.

Why am I mentioning language options so much? It's a huge deal, the earth doesn't revolve on the english language, if you make things easier for non-english speakers to consume entertainment they way they want to do it... you're going to have a large established base where no one else can compete in terms of content.
All great points. One QoL feature I really enjoy is the Audio Description feature, so I can follow along with the content when I'm cooking or on the go.

Netflix is also just really good at recommending me new content. They're much better than they're competitors in this regard.
 

Sweeney Swift

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,792
I’ll never have loyalty to Netflix, especially after all the LGBT shows they’ve canceled quick as a blink, so they don’t have to worry about that
 

Zippedpinhead

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,185
I signed up for both, Amazon Prime, ad-free Hulu and ad-free CBS and I am STILL under what I was paying Uverse for television.

And I was already paying for netflix and amazon even before I ditched cable, so still saving money.

However, I am drawing the line here, HBO Go I get through my cell phone plan so I won't be getting Max, I have no desire for Apple TV, I don't funimation or Crackle.

Its all about where the line is and how much you want to pay for entertainment.
 

Nesotenso

Member
Oct 26, 2017
670
This is less about loyalty and more about people being wary of multiple streaming options and fragmentation of the streaming space and what it means for their wallet (like it says in the OP). Cable and Satellite TV giving way to streaming hasn't made it cheaper for the consumer.
 

Armadilo

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,589
Netflix has the variety in shows and movies, I hate super hero stuff and Star Wars is cool but haven’t liked the new stuff but we’ll see, Netflix just gives you everything that you need.
 

karmaforgotme

Member
Oct 27, 2017
331
Knoxville, TN
I don[t think they mean the company itself, but its programming.
Despite the shows Netflix has canceled I liked, they are still have active Mindhunter, Stranger Things, The Crown, Terrace House, Haunting of Hill House, GLOW (for at least one more season), Russian Doll, Ozark, and whatever show I have forgotten off the type of my head (plus Witcher coming soon).

I will still subscribe to Disney, but I can see it being a service I cancel and resub depending on what it is on (I do not rewatch movies, I sub for originals). Netflix just has too much quality original program for me to do that. If that changes in 5 years, I will drop them. I am only as loyal as their programming.
 

Disco

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,061
It aint about loyalty for me. The prospect of replacing my netflix sub for disney+ is nonsensical to me though since its not a particularly enticing alternative when all it has to offer is family franchise content

Bundled with hulu makes more sense tho. But that international rollout is gonna take a while and i dont see netflix being bucked by it either. I can see Disney/hulu being a solid number 2 option tho in a few years.
 

Big_Blue

Member
Dec 12, 2017
1,724
Despite the shows Netflix has canceled I liked, they are still have active Mindhunter, Stranger Things, The Crown, Terrace House, Haunting of Hill House, GLOW (for at least one more season), Russian Doll, Ozark, and whatever show I have forgotten off the type of my head (plus Witcher coming soon).

I will still subscribe to Disney, but I can see it being a service I cancel and resub depending on what it is on (I do not rewatch movies, I sub for originals). Netflix just has too much quality original program for me to do that. If that changes in 5 years, I will drop them. I am only as loyal as their programming.
Yup, I just finished Top Boy and thought to myself that if Netflix keeps putting out content like that the company isn't going anywhere.