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FlintSpace

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
2,817
They can't use the supporting characters. It's going look weird as fuck if they try to continue the story.
I am not too knowledgeable about Spiderman comics but if the enter the spiderverse animated movie is any indication, they could possibly do many live action stories without involving too much of the MCU. And they got Venom already setup.

of course it depends if Sony can make decent live action movies on their own.
 

kurahador

Member
Oct 28, 2017
17,560
You were talking about Far From Home though? And the 30% in revenue that Sony would concede is likely to be much higher than 50% of the cost of production? Why would Sony give up on the expected profit?
They get to have a critically acclaimed live action Spider-man in the biggest cinematic universe currently, guaranteed $800m floor grossing movie, work with Kevin Feige which means better quality for Venom 2/Morbius/Aunt May Spy movie.

I'm not sure how anyone can justify 2-98 split (first week box office take only at that) is remotely fair. Sony knows this and their strategy right now is to fan the flame their way which is another mind boggling aspect on their part.
 

DeltaRed

Member
Apr 27, 2018
5,746
The MCU got to use Spiderman in the Avengers films. It actually surprises me they ever got anything more from the deal.
 

Phantom_Snake

The Fallen
Jul 26, 2018
3,778
Montana
That still leaves open the question for the rights. Disney is in no position to buy Sony right now and an acquisition of that scale wouldn't fly either. The rights automatically reverting just sounds odd.
I don't see Sony selling for a couple years at least. As far as the rights go, the Forbes writer states it's his understanding the the rights are Non-Transferable but he isn't completely positive. Probably nobody knows for sure besides Sony and Disney/Marvel. I just don't see Disney not at the very least buying the rights back, especially if the rights are transferable. If Apple were to get those rights, Marvel would never see Spider-Man again.
 

MilesQ

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,490
They get to have a critically acclaimed live action Spider-man in the biggest cinematic universe currently, guaranteed $800m floor grossing movie, work with Kevin Feige which means better quality for Venom 2/Morbius/Aunt May Spy movie.

I'm not sure how anyone can justify 2-98 split (first week box office take only at that) is remotely fair. Sony knows this and their strategy right now is to fan the flame their way which is another mind boggling aspect on their part.

Wait, the Aunt May spy movie is still happening?
 

Donthizz

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,902
I am not too knowledgeable about Spiderman comics but if the enter the spiderverse animated movie is any indication, they could possibly do many live action stories without involving too much of the MCU. And they got Venom already setup.

of course it depends if Sony can make decent live action movies on their own.

They can do anything as long as it doesn't involve any of the people that showed up on homecoming & ffh.

There's a reason aunt May and vulture was young. Sony can't use them. Instead they can use an older version of them. That's my understanding anyway.
 

ZackieChan

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
8,056
The MCU got to use Spiderman in the Avengers films. It actually surprises me they ever got anything more from the deal.
If we rewind a few years, it was seen as basically never going to happen. So just the fact that we got what we got is more than I ever expected. Would love to see one more film to wrap up the MCU Spidey story, though.
 

Halbrand

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,616
They can do anything as long as it doesn't involve any of the people that showed up on homecoming & ffh.

There's a reason aunt May and vulture was young. Sony can't use them. Instead they can use an older version of them. That's my understanding anyway.
Why would Sony-owned characters being a different age stop Sony from using them?
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,202
Spiderman is kind of the emotion anchor for infinitywar and engame. The idea that disney didn't get a lot out of the deal is incorrect. Especially when they got to use him for free in their movies, got free money from the sony films, and they have 100 percent of merch rights (they got in 2011) which means a large profit boost for each movie featuring spiderman.
 

Glenn

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,294
They cannot use Nick Fury and his sidekicks, Avengers, etc. Basically back to self contained Spider-Man.
They could just say Venom ate them or that this is an alternate universe SM who had to do everything himself (never met Stark) and no snap ever occured.

A Spider-Man movie doesn't need Fury. Tony still died and the snap still happened.. just don't mention it. All that was dealt with in Far from Home.

They can't use the supporting characters. It's going look weird as fuck if they try to continue the story.

MJ, Ned etc are Sony characters though right? Same with The Vulture and whoever Spider-Man villain they decide to use.
 

Sandfox

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,743

Glenn

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,294
Because they appeared on MCU. Now those characters are frozen. Neither Sony or marvel can use them.

Is this confirmed anywhere or just guess work? Those characters appeared in a Sony Studios movie. That's like saying Sony can't use Tom Holland because he's the MCU version which I doubt is something Sony would agree to.
 

caliph95

Member
Oct 25, 2017
35,187
I'd watch a Zendaya MCU movie. I'm curious as to what her contract looks like.

I will never understand why Morbius of all things was greenlit. A Spot movie would probably rbrm be better than that.
I'm guessing it's because he's one of the more easier of the villains/allies to design a movie around being a tragic vampire like the billions of tragic vampire compared to like shocker or whatever
 

Donthizz

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,902
Is this confirmed anywhere or just guess work? Those characters appeared in a Sony Studios movie. That's like saying Sony can't use Tom Holland because he's the MCU version which I doubt is something Sony would agree to.

Sony can use the current Spider man, but without all the stark tech. Back to wearing spandex suit.

I'm sure somebody more knowledgeable than be me on the matter can chime in.
 

JetBazooka

Banned
Jan 25, 2018
336
If people were as passionate about the MCU about the more important issues then the world would be a better place is all I'm saying.
No it wouldn't but keep thinking that. Last I checked people were out in droves marching for other issues. Have we seen millions marching outside for the mcu spiderman? There are people who have way more to lose if humanity falls or gets destroyed. Billions of dollars, huge family trees/ traditions, and Bruce Wayne like family legacy's in the history books. If they aren't worrying about losing that then Why would I be worried about losing my little bit of property?

MCU spider-man is cool but id have rather had the alternative on what they were doing before they got mcu spider-man. I was enjoying all the new heroes they were introducing and shining light on.
 
OP
OP
Chaos Legion

Chaos Legion

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 30, 2017
16,922
I think Apple ends up buying them also, though I guess Amazon is in the mix too.

It just makes sense for SPE to sell, Fox was bigger and was smart enough to forecast their future and sell before their value went down. But I guess Sony needs to use Spiderman to raise the value.

I'm guessing there's some sort of Non-Transferable clause in the contract.
Why would Apple buy Sony Pictures, when they explored and ultimately passed on Time Warner, weren't even competitive for the Fox assets, didn't go for either CBS or Viacom?

Sony Pictures has the lowest profit margin out of all of the big six, there'd be no discernible synergies to take advantage of and Apple would be stuck with a subscale large film and TV studio with few proven IP.

MGM has a bigger film library than Sony, would give Apple Bond, Rocky/Creed, and a bunch of other IP and would be maybe 1/3rd of the cost.

I think Sony Pictures gets sold, but Comcast makes the most sense.
 

Alice

Banned
Nov 2, 2017
5,867
I can get behind this sentiment.

The MCU spiderman movies so far have been pretty lacklustre Spiderman movies.

They've been more about RDJ than Spiderman, and in Far From Home, RDJ's MCU character is dead --- so it's really saying something.

That's really not true at all. They were entirely about Peter and him finding his footing. BOTH films are all about not standing in Stark's shadow but still having some form of mentorship from him, as one of the most important and influential people in the MCU.

Not to mention that it was Sony's idea to have him there. If they continue on their own they'll just keep aping it, kind of like what they did in Amazing Spider-Man, you know the two Sony-Only films where Spidey actually did, indeed, not achieve *anything* by himself but used all of his Daddy's shit to get around.
 

Halbrand

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,616
I kind of find it hard to believe that Sony wanted RDJ in Homecoming more than Marvel since it would have been so much more unnatural to not include him, considering Civil War and the Infinity duopoly.
 

Alice

Banned
Nov 2, 2017
5,867
I kind of find it hard to believe that Sony wanted RDJ in Homecoming more than Marvel since it would have been so much more unnatural to not include him, considering Civil War and the Infinity duopoly.

Really? With the BO-Draw RDJ has, Sony would have been stupid to not ask them to have him there. Pretty sure the "We want RDJ with our Spidey" came far before CW was finished, they didn't decide on the mentorship after CW.
 

Halbrand

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,616
Really?`With the BO-Draw RDJ has, Sony would have been stupid to not ask them to have him there. Pretty sure the "We want RDJ with our Spidey" came far before CW was finished, they didn't decide on the mentorship after CW.
But the Russos wanted Spider-Man for the relationship with Tony and we're adamant he be included the way he was in CW.
 

Alice

Banned
Nov 2, 2017
5,867
But the Russos wanted Spider-Man for the relationship with Tony and we're adamant he be included the way he was in CW.

Spider-Man, or Tom? From what I read Tom and RDJ just had very good chemistry in the tests. Either way, it's obvious that both studios wanted MCU Characters in the Spidey Solo Film, otherwise his role in CW would have been different.
 

erlim

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,513
London
Sony can use the current Spider man, but without all the stark tech. Back to wearing spandex suit.

I'm sure somebody more knowledgeable than be me on the matter can chime in.

Man what a weird world it is where screenwriters will need to have constant consult from entertainment legal teams to see what narrative devices that they can and cannot use.
 

Halbrand

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,616
We're getting two more movies with Tom Holland with Tom Watts directing.
Tom Watts isn't contracted for any more.

Not that it could happen now, but if Venom has to be in SM3, bonding it to the Iron Spider suit would be a neat way to get rid of that suit. With Venom Peter becomes the villain Mysterio framed him to be.

And if Sony wants to go for a semi-reboot Peter could start off in hiding after Mysterio's announcement and kind of cause Uncle Ben's death, who's actually not dead yet.
 

NoKisum

Member
Nov 11, 2017
4,913
DMV Area, USA
bWnK1k3.jpg
*10 years later at an E3 Press Conference* "Ladies and Gentlemen, we are excited to announce, and finally unveil, the Disney PlayStation 6."
 

LinkStrikesBack

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
16,364
Not that it could happen now, but if Venom has to be in SM3, bonding it to the Iron Spider suit would be a neat way to get rid of that suit. With Venom Peter becomes the villain Mysterio framed him to be.

If they want to pretend it is supposed to be in the MCU, that won't work as a way to specifically discard that suit. As of far from home Peter should have access to all of the stark equipment needed to build a new suit as he needs, so one being unusable wouldn't really do much. The public is still mostly used to seeing him in the cloth suit anyway, right?
 
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Bonafide

Member
Oct 11, 2018
936
Children are being taken from their parents at the border to horrible child prisons, we only have so much time to fight climate change, and right wing extremist violence is on the rise.

Get over it, its just a movie.

The amazon is burning out of control and climate science declares everyday "its happening faster than expected".
Hong Kong situation potential to be a trigger for world war.
The president declared himself chosen by god.

but..

I agree.

Seeing this much fervor for a what is basically just a disagreement between two multinational corporations...is very weird.
 

Silav101

Member
Oct 26, 2017
730
They get to have a critically acclaimed live action Spider-man in the biggest cinematic universe currently, guaranteed $800m floor grossing movie, work with Kevin Feige which means better quality for Venom 2/Morbius/Aunt May Spy movie.

I'm not sure how anyone can justify 2-98 split (first week box office take only at that) is remotely fair. Sony knows this and their strategy right now is to fan the flame their way which is another mind boggling aspect on their part.

I don't care about any of this, just reading the amazing hot takes, but the 98/2 split was just for the box office. All merchandising rights and revenues are Disney's, and they're way higher than anything the Spider-man movie makes.

Marvel_vs_DC_Licensing_Chart.jpg


And that's most likely not even all of the money from it. And this is from before the movies were released, so those just boosted these numbers. The movies make good profit, but merchandising - in perpetuity? That's where the money is.

The original Sony/Disney revenue split on the movies were equitable, when this is taken into account.
 

rayngiraffe

Member
Dec 11, 2018
1,455
That's really not true at all. They were entirely about Peter and him finding his footing. BOTH films are all about not standing in Stark's shadow but still having some form of mentorship from him, as one of the most important and influential people in the MCU.

Not to mention that it was Sony's idea to have him there. If they continue on their own they'll just keep aping it, kind of like what they did in Amazing Spider-Man, you know the two Sony-Only films where Spidey actually did, indeed, not achieve *anything* by himself but used all of his Daddy's shit to get around.
I think it's more about how Peter's motivation/inspiration is largely linked to Tony (the first superhero he meets, how a large part of his actions is motivated by him wanting to impress IM, the only inspiration he looks up to is Stark); there's something off-putting in making Spider-Man so intertwined with a billionaire who has one of the greyest legacies in the MCU.
The direction makes sense - an impressionable young kid meeting with a billionaire genius, but it definitely feels wrong especially when there's so many other characters that Peter could be connected to.

Anyway as mixed as the live-action spidermen films are, we did get Spiderverse under Sony so it's not like only Disney is able to tell good stories.
 

Halbrand

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,616

Alice

Banned
Nov 2, 2017
5,867
I think it's more about how Peter's motivation/inspiration is largely linked to Tony (the first superhero he meets, how a large part of his actions is motivated by him wanting to impress IM, the only inspiration he looks up to is Stark); there's something off-putting in making Spider-Man so intertwined with a billionaire who has one of the greyest legacies in the MCU.
The direction makes sense - an impressionable young kid meeting with a billionaire genius, but it definitely feels wrong especially when there's so many other characters that Peter could be connected to.

Anyway as mixed as the live-action spidermen films are, we did get Spiderverse under Sony so it's not like only Disney is able to tell good stories.

Peter has been superheroing before Tony, Civil War spelled that our pretty clearly. Tony just gave him a boost, and has always been Peter's idiol.

It's really standard "Young Superhero" fare, Tony basically replaced the other Marvel heroes Spidey tried to impress and join up with in the first dozen issues of his solo comic.

If anything, the previous takes where Spidey *didn't* have heroes to idolize are the weird, unfitting ones.

And again, for the millionth time - Spiderverse is an animated film, that is in no way comparable to live action, and will never be.
 

Leandras

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
1,462
I agree.

Seeing this much fervor for a what is basically just a disagreement between two multinational corporations...is very weird.

Seriously. The amount of attention the production of these movies get compared to the concentration camps, normilization of fascism and global warming is depressing.

Seems most of the world is okay with everything going to hell as long as we're distracted enough.

I don't mean Era. Era talks about all of the above in ernest and I really enjoy being here for it. I'm talking about communities and media that never bats an eye at any of that suddenly losing their heads over this.

I just needed to vent my frustrations.
 

Donthizz

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,902
Man, the minimap even has enemies on it... I hate that stuff.
In RDR2 the minimap is really useful for dead bodies, loot and roads but it's so lame to have the red dots on it, so at least in mission I used the little compass.

Now here you have this giant minimap with all the enemies on it and no option to use the horizontal compass, that's disappointing.

I loved the compass in Horizon, the minimap in those freeroaming in some cases just give you too much information, and without any hud then it become a problem to orientate.

The horizontal compass is a perfect solution for that, too bad they totally removed it.

Red dead x Horizon movie to fix all the minimap issues. SPE movie funded by marvel.
 
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