Do you NEED to be good at Math/Science to be successful?

[Deleted member 9306]

I'm just asking this because I'm actually really anxious about my major right. I'm 19, poor, a minority, and a woman. I live on my own and have since i started University. In High school I was horrible at math and science, so I enrolled in an English Program at the best University in my country (Canada). It's supposed to be a Co-Op program, so I was a little at ease because that's supposed to be paid work experience.

Fast forwards to me right now, in my second year. I've completely collapsed mentally and physically. I had the worst semester. Now I'm starting therapy for my childhood abuse, social anxieties and depression. I'm about to fail an introduction to computer science course (I'm trying my hardest with these last assignments but it's just not working), and I'm working two jobs (although thankfully next year I can quit one). If I fail a course, I'll get into some minor trouble with my student loans (apparently I'll have to explain to them why I failed). I feel very, very stupid. I feel as if almost everyone else understands Math/Science, but I'm just not getting it at all. My marks in English and all the other subjects are still pretty good/stellar, but I'm concerned that it's not going to lead me anywhere. And on top of that, I still don't know exactly what i want to do with my life. I know I love to write, I know I love helping people, I love computers, I know I love music, but that's basically it.

So I guess to tl;dr it, do you HAVE to be a STEM major to be successful? Because all around me and especially when I was in high school, people basically showed/told me that if I don't get a big degree SuperMechanicalChemical Engineering, I'm going to be broke. And right now I'm really struggling to even find a good Part time job, and I remember how scary it was last summer when I wasn't in school, and I was trying to get a job, and I ended up in a horrible one that stressed me out during the semester. I'm just curious and also very concerned.

 

[Deleted member 14313]

No. I say that as a guy doing a Master's in Theoretical Physics.

 

[Kirblar]

No, but those fields are easy to find a career path in post-graduation because they're always short people since Math/Science skills are harder to come across on the market.

Maybe consider accounting if you're looking for a solid field w/ Math?

You have to ultimately play to your strengths. Figure out what those are.

 

[Malovis]

I would focus less on what i love and more on "pays the bills and i don't kinda hate it". Just look at the market and pick from there. I liked football but i sure as hell did not plan on making a career out of it.

 

[capitalCORN]

No need to be a STEM lord to find a way in life. As for your OSAP issues, if it's the first academic probation, just means writing a one page letter to the OSAP office at your school. And they're not particularly strict about it either. No sweat off your back.

 

[Pooh]

Obviously not

 

[dragonchild]

I mean. . .

 

[Cels]

Obviously not

Click to shrink...

if you're good at having a wealthy dad, why do you need to be good at anything else

 

[Fulminator]

No

You should maybe talk to your University career counselors. Sometimes they can help give you a better direction on what you could do

 

[Lackless]

Absolutely not. The amount of things you can be successful in is endless.

Obviously not

Click to shrink...

Can you not? No need to turn this thread into something else.

 

[Masoyama]

No, but if you are good at it and make a few good decisions along the way you are almost guaranteed a $1ook+ starting salary after school.

 

[Hollywood Duo]

Depending on career no.

 

[4859]

Im great at math and science and i'm not successful at all, take THAT statistics!

 

[super-famicom]

Professions in the field of engineering, science, and medicine usually do have higher salaries, but require a good amount of investment in terms of studying and certifications. But you shouldn't feel pressure to enter those fields if you think you'd be unhappy.

In my mind, the best career for you is the one you are happiest doing. People telling you that STEM careers are the best are probably just looking at the salaries. Sure, you could work your ass off and become an engineer or doctor making 6 figures, but if you are unhappy and stressed to the point that it is affecting your health, then you need to step back and decide if that is worth it. Some people think that it is, but ultimately you are in charge of your own happiness and well being.

You're still 19 and have plenty of time to figure out what you want to do. That said, it may be good to focus on other issues in your life. I hope the therapy goes well for you. It may also be a good idea to speak with an academic advisor or attend any workshops your university may offer that can help you decide on what you'd like to focus your studies on.

Personally, I entered university and declared a Biology major. In my first year I was unhappy and depressed, and even harbored suicidal ideations. I also ended up dislike jg some of the courses I took. Iwent through counseling in my second year and changed my major to Intl Studies. I also minored in Japanese. I ended up a lot happier and loved all the courses I took in my third and fourth years, and moved to Japan to 'teach' English for a number of years. Sure, I wasn't rich, but I had great experiences and am happier. Now I'm married and I am planning to go back to school to study radiology. I'll start in June since there's a wait list for the program. I've waited almost 2 years and worked in retail the entire time waiting and recently, a part time job in the Emergency Dept. I still have some depression issues, but I feel I'm in a decent place so far.

 

[Pooh]

Can you not? No need to turn this thread into something else.

Click to shrink...

There are a ton of people you can point to though, he's just the most relevant example right now.

It's really who you know, not what you know.

 

[Deleted member 9237]

You're not going to be successful doing something you don't enjoy.
Figure out what you want, then work to make yourself successful at that.

I'm in a bit of the reverse situation, did STEM and now I'm doing a PhD getting paid way less than in the private sector, but I don't regret it because I get to do something I enjoy. For the moment I couldn't imagine slaving away at a company even if they paid me three times as much.

 

[Ultima_5]

no, but it certainly makes things easier. try to find something that has a market that you don't hate/are good at.

 

[Kieli]

You don't need math or science, but you need technical skills to get ahead in this era. I highly recommend you keep persevering with your computer science electives. It's a challenging subject wherein I've gotten more than exam back with a score in the 50s, so you're certainly not alone in thinking it's tough!

 

[Lackless]

There are a ton of people you can point to though, he's just the most relevant example right now.

It's really who you know, not what you know.

Click to shrink...

Yeah, Trump has an Economics degree at an Ivy league university but wasn't a STEM major, so I guess you're right.

 

[freakybj]

You don't need a STEM degree to be successful. Hell, you don't even need a college degree to be successful. It helps, but there are still plenty of people that are able to be OK even without a college degree. Alternatively, there are a lot of people that pick the wrong major in college and unfortunately graduate with a low GPA, no job prospects, and a lot of debt. All you need to do is figure out what you want to do, set a goal and diligently work the plan to get there.

 

[Sub Boss]

No but it will help

 

[Brawndo Addict]

I would argue that what you increasingly need in today's economy is math/science fluency. You don't need to be able to program or engineer professionally, but you will increasingly have to work with programmers and engineers and any employees who can actively translate between the 'science' world and the 'business' world are very valuable to companies. For example, someone working in the marketing doesn't need to know how to perform all the steps of rigorous statistical analysis, but they should understand enough to be able to carry on a conversation with the people who do perform that analysis and then report those findings back to management in a digestible way.

 

[Canucked]

Nope. Success, in my view, has a lot more to do with effort.

 

[tears in my eyes]

Define 'successful'. I'm pretty sure Brat Pitt and Lebron James don't know jack about math.

and this guy lol

Obviously not

Click to shrink...

 

[Beef Stallmer]

...

Click to shrink...

First of: I would immediately contact the counselor at your university or what that person is called, they can offer you help and advice as well.
Also 19 is pretty young so it's natural that you have some doubts about the future; most people find out later. Also try to get some help from students. It should help you not feeling alone, as well as it's more pleasant to study together and you can ask each other things. You can be happy and successful. I don't think success require a high education perse. A lot of my friends from high school started working at companies after minimal study and they worked their way up. Also everyone has problems, so good luck and hang in there!

 

[Saikar]

You need to be good at math/science in order to get your degree. After that you can largely get by without doing math any more complicated than excel.

If this type of career counts as being successful at life is up to the reader to decide.

 

[Anna]

There are thousands of professions that don't require that sort of stuff, so no.

 

[subpar spatula]

Successful? No. However, you should strive for some math and science knowledge. You don't need to know anything complex but you should be well versed enough to be as informed as a 12th grader.

 

[Yoshi]

Since you seem to define success by having a job that requires higher education, there are:
- English / German / Spanish / Japanese / ... teachers
- music / arts teachers
- professors in sociology / history / politics / philosophy
- book / movie script / video game script authors
- musicians
- journalists
- ...

All of which require higher education, but no profound knowledge of STEM.

 

[pramod]

Computer science is just a type of Math/Science, just being bad at it doesn't mean you are bad with math/science stuff in general.

There's actually very little real "math" in computer science, it's mostly logic and analysis, while most other sciences is just memorizing stuff.

 

[Deleted member 14089]

No, it depends on the career choice you make, the definition of being 'successful' (earning millions or 10k p/m ?).
There are quite a few CEO's who don't hold a degree related to math, physics, mechanical or computer science, but they still make a lot.

As for the ones not that 'lucky', being good in Math is attractive for companies and generally tends to land a job pretty quickly.
If you're interested in following any courses or 'getting back' into math I would recommend you to visit Khan Academy (https://www.khanacademy.org).
The website was a life saviour for me.

Also, learning computer step is a great first step you've made. I went through it too, I took the CS50 course (made by Harvard) given by my local Uni and I flunked by failing my first few assignments.
I took it again and It took me quite a while to 'get it'.
I had to put in a lot more time than my peers to get through my assignments, I was slow in thinking up my pseudocode, programming it and understanding some concepts (pointers bleh).
It's a learning curve, some go through it quickly and some may take some time to get there, but in the end, we all do.
I've made a lot of mistakes, but it was worth it.
I would also recommend looking at the CS50 course. They have a great introduction to computer science.
(https://www.edx.org/course/introduction-computer-science-harvardx-cs50x)
-

You're 19 and it's good that you're thinking and concerned about it now. Most people tend to realise after they're done..
What I would do, is to take a step back, look at what your options are and continue going to therapy (it's always great to have an outlet and don't be ashamed for going to therapy).
Don't worry about your loans, they're not that large now (I assume by what you've said).

Try to find someone to consult to.
At our local uni, we have a study consultant/advisor for students who are unsure of their choice and need a consultant to discuss what their chances are.
I would suggest you to find someone with a similar function or position. You could also mail any faculty head to discuss what your possibilities are.

My older sister is studying in the STEM field, she went from studying Nanobiology to Applied Mathematics.
She was taken aback by the number of guys at first, but once she got used to it.
I would encourage you to try to make the jump to the STEM field.

 

[Beartruck]

It certainly helps, but no.

 

[BoosterDuck]

most engineers and scientists don't know high level math or forgot it, that's just something they go through to get the piece of paper that shows they're employable

I'd say knowing how to think critically is what makes you successful in life, and that's what a lot of math and science classes teach you

 

[voidecker]

... I'm about to fail an introduction to computer science course (I'm trying my hardest with these last assignments but it's just not working)

Click to shrink...

This part sticks out to me in particular, and I'm curious, is this the only course that's making you feel anxious about your ability to do well in Math/Science courses?

I ask because the very first CS course I took in my first degree made me pretty apathetic towards programming (it was a essentially a 'Programming for Science Students' course done in MATLAB).

I'm a full-time programmer at a cancer research center (hired out of my co-op), while slowly wrapping up the 3 courses I need from graduating with my second degree in CS now.

I helped my gf this semester through what is supposed to be an 'Intro to Computer Programming for Engineers' course, and holy hell if I had to endure the BS she had to put up with, I definitely would not have continued with CS.

I guess I'm wondering if your case is another instance of a really poorly laid out 'intro' CS course.

Edit:

most engineers and scientists don't know high level math or forgot it, that's just something they go through to get the piece of paper that shows they're employable

I'd say knowing how to think critically is what makes you successful in life, and that's what a lot of math and science classes teach you

Click to shrink...

This too. I definitely wasn't the highest performer in the compulsory Math classes I had to take in my second degree, but I tried my damnedest to do my best, and I don't really use those skills anymore.

To make up for it, I doubled down and made sure that the courses I did enjoy (anything software development related) I did really well in.

 

[LosDaddie]

Define success first, and go from there.

And the answer is No, but it won't hurt your chances at success.

 

[Kobra_Zer0]

So op i am also a math challenged person and i wonder too if i can be sucessful at the programming career i enrolled recently, i enjoy programming (as a beginner) but i have never been good at math so i'm scared about failure. I think we both are gonna have to give it our best and get help anywhere we can, if you still fail maybe a computer science career is not for you, it's not for everyone, at least that what i have heard. Hang in there SaturdayAwe. Also what assigments did you get? programming? If they are simple programs maybe i can give you a hand but don't count it lol.

 

[GamerJM]

I agree with people saying no, but it makes things harder.

Also if it makes you feel any better, I almost failed intro to computer science and I spent three years of my life barely maintaining a passing grade in computer science/engineering/math classes or dropping them. Then I switched to an econ program that didn't require much math knowledge, and now I'm close to graduating with a high major GPA (of course, my regular GPA is fucked because of all of those years I spent in computer science/engineering classes....). But my point here is that you can recover, and that if computer science isn't for you switch to something else and do well in it. As someone else said play to your strengths.

 

[Murfield]

I think you should have more confidence in yourself, it seems the only reason you are struggling is that you are trying to do multiple full time jobs. I hope you can quit one next year.

What does you're computer science course entail, programming? I found it very difficult to learn computer code through courses, ultimately I found what worked was going to the library, taking every book on the language off the shelf and leafing through them to assess their understandability. Keep the ones or one you can best understand, and return the rest. You might need to pick one that's easy for you to understand, and another that has good examples. In general, I found this approach helps alot in collage in cases where the courses aren't doing it for you based on the supplied material. Though this might be too time consuming if you are close to the end of the semester and are juggling two jobs. Maybe you could study on the job, if its something where you won't get in trouble. The internet can also be a good resource but I in my experience it feels like lots of fragments scattered everywhere rather than a complete guide. Also if you have a report attached to the assignment the book can give you some good references.

Most people find maths hard due to its abstract nature. Getting good reading material for general maths is more difficult as they authors vary greatly in background. For example, mathematicians think in abstract numbers and try to fit them to difficult problems; engineers look at practical problems and try to find maths to fit the problem, this results in different language being used to explain whats going on. Try and find something that is written by someone who you can understand, maybe with a similarish background to you. Or just look through general text books to find the one you can read the best.

In my undergraduate in engineering I failed a module, and I felt worthless and like I was just not able for it. Next semester I worked my ass off and managed to get to B average, and then to mostly A's the semester after. Some people this stuff comes naturally to and that's true. But you can still do it, if you work yer ass off. Strongly recommend reducing the workload outside of collage as soon as possible, but I realise that is much easier said then done.

I am not saying you should study engineering if you don't want to, but am saying that you are more than capable if you decide that involves what you want to do.

 

[Deleted member 2802]

Obviously not

Click to shrink...

He sold us on a 2,3,4,5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 12, 25 41 billion dollar wall that Mexico US is going to pay for
I mean that's some serious addition by subtraction

 

[Pau]

This is my perspective as a minority woman who majored in STEM and a social science and dropped out of university twice because of depression.

You don't need to be good at math and/or science to be successful, but the related skills are in demand. So it can make it a lot easier to get a job right out of college by just doing the minimal extra effort outside of school. In the United States, there are also quite a few organizations aimed specifically at minority women to try to get them into these fields so you get career access programs, scholarships, etc. that can really make a difference.

I don't know what the job market is like in Canada, but you might have to do a bit of outside effort to differentiate yourself from other English majors. The English majors I know who have been the most successful are those who either are just really good with people and at "selling" themselves for jobs in a variety of fields. Or those who are going for a Ph.D in English.

I've also tutored a lot of people, including minority women, who swore up and down that they couldn't do math, and hey, turns out, they can. Problem with these subjects is that there are so many years of bad experiences and social attitudes working against you. I'm also wondering how you are defining horrible: I don't have the study handy, but women are far more likely to take anything less than an A in these subjects as an indicator that they can't do it while men are more likely to be okay with getting worse grades and still pursuing the major. So I would not be quick to call yourself inherently bad at the subject. But getting up to speed can be time consuming and/or a financial burden - particularly if you don't have a good support system. Check to see what free tutoring services your school might have. As well as resources for minority and poor students at your school. Having one job while studying full time is hard. I can't imagine two. Try to find as many people on your campus (teachers, administrators, counselors, etc.) that you can talk to about how having to support yourself financially is hurting your studies.

If you have any questions about your computer science stuff, feel free to PM me. It was one of my minors, so while I'm not an excerpt, I could hopefully help out for an introductory course.

 

[Chopchop]

Hope you feel better soon. School tends to have those moments where you wonder if what you're doing matters at all. Hang in there; it'll get better eventually.

The short answer is absolutely not. While STEM fields do tend to lead to high paying jobs, it is absolutely not the only way to get a sustainable job. The notion that STEM is the only thing that matters is an elitist misconception. Some people like to lord things over others while declaring everything else worthless, and STEM backgrounds is one of those things. It's pretty much the same thing as someone calling one game console the only thing that matters while everything else is worthless, and just as immature.

There are plenty of jobs that don't require math or science, and they can pay well too. And if you want to stay in the computer field, certain fields in programming, and some tech-related jobs like sysadmin work do not involve much complicated math at all.

I graduated with an English major, and I have a job as a tech writer, which involves writing guides, instructions and manuals for a living. It's not some superstar high paying job and engineers get paid more than I do, but my work pays welI enough to live comfortably. The most math I do these days is mentally calculating tips at restaurants. I don't use math in my job at all.

There are plenty of people who work decent to high-paying jobs and don't need science or math in their work. If it's not your thing, don't think your life is ruined, because it's not.

If you want to stick to a STEM/tech education, it can lead to higher paying jobs. But if you decide to drop it, it's not the end of your life. In fact, you may be happier in the long run if you don't force yourself into a field that's not your thing.

 

[Felt]

Need? Heavens no lol. I'm about to get a PhD in a STEM field, and my GF doesn't even know the difference between prokaryotes and eukaryotes - and she is quite successful in her marketing/sales career.

 

[Vulcano's Assistant]

Not when the entertainment industry is huge and rich.

 

[Deleted member 4321]

Obviously not

Click to shrink...

 

[Pau]

I graduated with an English major, and I have a job as a tech writer, which involves writing guides, instructions and manuals for a living. It's not some superstar high paying job and engineers get paid more than I do, but my work pays welI enough to live comfortably. The most math I do these days is mentally calculating tips at restaurants. I don't use math in my job at all.

Click to shrink...

I considered mentioning tech writing because it sounds like a good fit for someone who likes computers and writing. How did you get into the field?

 

[Aselith]

Hell no. The people telling you that you can't get a job outside of STEM are the same types that say they don't vote because "it doesn't matter anyways." Disguising vast laziness and ignorance behind cynicism that they think makes them look like they've got it all figured out.

STEM is certainly has a lot of good fields but there are many creative fields that are growing as well. Like Erudite said, it seems like maybe this one course may be a little troublesome for you so you might stick it out a little longer but don't feel like your life is over if you switch. You're gonna be fine.

One thing I would recommend is really look at the breadth of your options when you get out of college. You may have some preconceptions about what your job "should" be (I fell into this trap myself) that will keep you from looking at some very good jobs that your degree will qualify you for. Get with job services and google for information on what your degree qualifies you for as you may find some really cool stuff that you never thought of. Don't get stuck on a dream job and limit yourself from looking at other great jobs.

 

[Glasgow Mega-Snake]

You don't need to study STEM to be succesful, and you shouldn't if something else makea you happy. Still, studying languages/humanities can be the harder path.

A degree is only part of your education, and in some fields not even the most important one. Gaining practical work experience is key. So you really need to consider the following

-Internships. Unfortunately a lot are unpaid these days, so finding the time and money can be hard. But keep an eye open!
- Student jobs. I don't know where you're working right now, but if you can find something related to a field you'd like to work in, that can be really valuable
- Extracurricular activities. You say you like to write. Is there a campus paper you could join or something similar? I really learned a lot at mine.
- Do you have any unique skills, like a language that isn't that common? Focus on them.
-Computer skills are important. Not just specialized programs, even just Excel is a really powerful tool that is used a lot in many office jobs, but most people can't use it beyond the surface. In publishing/media everything is going digital (doh), so being able to navigate different content management systems is also a bonus.
-One step leads to the other. Any internship/relevant job you can put on your cv makes it easier to get another one

I studied history and literature and had my fill of people saying I wouldn't get a job with that. Right now I'm still doing my Master's, but I have a pretty good job as a news writer with a perspective to stay after finishing my degree if I keep going.

It is possible, even in this field and in the time of dying publications. But sometimes you have to work your ass off for it.

I honestly don't know if I would try to get into journalism again, because all that work in addition to studying can be a struggle. My friendships and relationships suffered at times.

But I know that my 19-year-old depressed and insecure self would be ecstatic to be at the place I am right now and that makes it worth it

 

[patientzero]

Not at all. It can be easier, as those fields have more concrete career paths, but it's not guaranteed there either.

The biggest thing I emphasize to my students (I've worked as a writing tutor, then teaching intro courses, as well as composition and some TAing, back to being a writing tutor) is soft skills.

Can you talk to people? Can you do research? Can you write a professional email? Can you teach any skills? Can you be adaptable to changing scenarios? Do you have any leadership skills? These are universal skills that almost every field needs to some degree. I especially cannot overstate the need to communicate with other people. You'd be utterly shocked at the amount of people in any profession who simply cannot comprehend basic listening and speaking abilities. And those people could need you as a middle-person.

Also, see what jobs or internships or other resume/CV builders exist around campus. As an undergrad I did none of that and only attended classes with no job which did no good for me graduating at 23 even as a triple-major. When I went back a couple years later I tutored, worked on two undergrad journals, went to conferences as part of my job, and did some other things that helped toward building up experience I could take into a job.

Edit: Basically what the poster right above me said! Also, if you have some inkling of ever doing any job with any publishing/writing learn InDesign; few people know it and that can be very valuable.

Edit 2: Second part, considering you are in a humanities program if you want to ever take this to PMs just hit me up if you feel comfortable. I've spent a combined 10 years in humanities programs and have worked a lot in universities at this point. I can point you to some resources or fields that might be worth your time and energy, but it involves longer conversation than might be useful here.

 

[farmland]

I'm a motion graphics designs/video editor with a full time position and I have a degree in arts with a major in film. I use almost zero maths in my job. So no, you can do really will in the humanities.
However our culture does emphasise STEM fields more than the humanities sadly (I think we need both to cultivate a great society) so it'll probably be tougher.

 

[Kill3r7]

No but it is good degree to have and it certainly will not hinder your career options after college.