Dragon Ball Super |OT6| The waiting game

Rutger

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,790
Your Freeza bias is showing again. He had trouble keeping the death beam cage up and running not the form itself. He hasn’t had a problem with the form since the ROF movie and that was only because he wasn’t used to it then.
He hasn't been shown to be able to use the form for long periods since then either. Frieza was well rested at that point since he barely did anything in the tournament and yet had an abysmal showing. At best he is no longer helpless once he's worn out, but we have no reason to believe his bluff after what we saw in the ToP.
 
Oct 25, 2017
8,821
He hasn't been shown to be able to use the form for long periods since then either. Frieza was well rested at that point since he barely did anything in the tournament and yet had an abysmal showing. At best he is no longer helpless once he's worn out, but we have no reason to believe his bluff after what we saw in the ToP.
You're reaching. He specifically mentions during his fight with the universe mooks that his form doesn't drain his stamina anymore due to mentally training himself to regulate his energy in Hell. The show specifically points it out to the audience and that's why they make such a big deal of him now being equal to Goku with that little sparring session with Beerus and Whis.

It's kinda annoying when people blatantly ignore what's stated in the actual show and go with a personal head canon.
 
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Rutger

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,790
You're reaching. He specifically mentions during his fight with the universe mooks that his form doesn't drain his stamina anymore due to mentally training himself to regulate his energy in Hell. The show specifically points it out to the audience and that's why they make such a big deal of him now being equal to Goku with that little sparring session with Beerus and Whis.

It's kinda annoying when people blatantly ignore what's stated in the actual show and go with a personal head canon.
When what's stated and what's shown are contradictory, we are left with no choice but to make our own readings on things.

You said before that my bias against Frieza was showing. You were half right in that I love to take jabs at his golden form because it looks awful, but my take on how the events play out in the ToP I think is just more interesting. If Frieza was shown to be able to back up his words then my opinion on him in Super would be even lower, haha. At least with my take there's still a tiny bit of what made Frieza work so well as a villain on Namek left there, for however long that will last...
 
Oct 25, 2017
8,821
When what's stated and what's shown are contradictory, we are left with no choice but to make our own readings on things.

You said before that my bias against Frieza was showing. You were half right in that I love to take jabs at his golden form because it looks awful, but my take on how the events play out in the ToP I think is just more interesting. If Frieza was shown to be able to back up his words then my opinion on him in Super would be even lower, haha. At least with my take there's still a tiny bit of what made Frieza work so well as a villain on Namek left there, for however long that will last...
The only thing that was contradicted is your sequence of events though? What is shown is that he can't keep up his death beam cage not his Golden form. He's shown no trouble with anything that happens to do with his Golden form in both the manga and anime versions of Super after ROF. At this point it's the equivalent of a Super Saiyan form.

I guess your opinion of him will just have to be even lower then haha.
 

Rutger

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,790
The only thing that was contradicted is your sequence of events though? What is shown is that he can't keep up his death beam cage not his Golden form. He's shown no trouble with anything that happens to do with his Golden form in both the manga and anime versions of Super after ROF. At this point it's the equivalent of a Super Saiyan form.

I guess your opinion of him will just have to be even lower then haha.
Krillin isn't shown to be worn out after controlling multiple discs while Frieza's death beam cage takes nearly all his power(and Krillin's attack is more complicated), I have a hard time buying that attack alone would be such a toll on Frieza, but with the established toll the golden form takes it makes more sense.

But you know what, that doesn't even matter, the whole sequence was the only time in the ToP where Frieza's overconfidence in himself has consequences instead of the writers repeatedly trying to tell us "no he's just that good, and always was". Whether it's because of the death beam cage or his tacky golden form, it was a brief moment where Frieza didn't feel like a caricature of himself in Super.
 
Oct 25, 2017
8,821
Krillin isn't shown to be worn out after controlling multiple discs while Frieza's death beam cage takes nearly all his power(and Krillin's attack is more complicated), I have a hard time buying that attack alone would be such a toll on Frieza, but with the established toll the golden form takes it makes more sense.

But you know what, that doesn't even matter, the whole sequence was the only time in the ToP where Frieza's overconfidence in himself has consequences instead of the writers repeatedly trying to tell us "no he's just that good, and always was". Whether it's because of the death beam cage or his tacky golden form, it was a brief moment where Frieza didn't feel like a caricature of himself in Super.
Yeah, but Krillin's discs only have to be made once and is a one time deal. He doesn't have to keep sustaining them by continuously throwing out new ones out, so that his opponent doesn't move. Freeza also never dropped out of his Golden Form or got any weaker after doing them either. So once again this really doesn't have anything to do with his Golden form's stamina and everything do with the move he was using.

I mean the example you're using for Freeza getting over confident didn't really happen the way you say it did in the Dypso scene. A much better example that actually happened was with Toppo and thinking he could handle his God Energy after only previously dealing with a small portion.
 

Rutger

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,790
I mean the example you're using for Freeza getting over confident didn't really happen the way you say it did in the Dypso scene. A much better example that actually happened was with Toppo and thinking he could handle his God Energy after only previously dealing with a small portion.
Except when Gohan asked for the cage Frieza said it'd be no problem, until it was a problem and Gohan had to think fast to keep them both from losing.
 
Oct 25, 2017
8,821
Except when Gohan asked for the cage Frieza said it'd be no problem, until it was a problem and Gohan had to think fast to keep them both from losing.
Yeah, except Freeza didn't say that nor did he say it would be easy he only agreed to the plan. Still not really exactly an example of him being over confident when he listened and did exactly as Gohan requested.

In any case, I'm growing bored of this argument and will stop here before we fill up the whole page with this.
 
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Skeeter49

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,142
We never see Frieza lose his golden form due to loss of stamina in the ToP, if memory serves. Even when he fucks up his death beam cage, I think he still stayed Golden? He just lost the cage.

He only lost Golden when he got his shit kicked in by Toppo and Jiren.
 

Rutger

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,790
The best part of Frieza golden form is when he asks you to ruin his day when it runs out in DBFZ.
 

Daytak

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,391
Detroit, MI
This decade:
Dragonball was absent
Came back with Kai
Died with Kai
Came back with BoG
Kai came back
Got a sequel series/manga with Super
Super ends
Got Xenoverse games
FighterZ
Xenoverse 2 doesn't fucking die
Broly
And now we are left with the Kakarot, Manga, and Heroes
 

Skeeter49

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,142
This decade:
Dragonball was absent
Came back with Kai
Died with Kai
Came back with BoG
Kai came back
Got a sequel series/manga with Super
Super ends
Got Xenoverse games
FighterZ
Xenoverse 2 doesn't fucking die
Broly
And now we are left with the Kakarot, Manga, and Heroes
It's been a great decade for DB. Revival of the anime, Manga, and a huge increase in game quality.
 

louisacommie

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,011
New Jersey
The last chance is this month of kitaro successor getting announced


The funniest thing be original dragon ball Kia but the buu Kia treatment not the 1st 100 episodes Kia treatmsnt

I had seen that as a joke on kiazenshu

Most likely some other random series

Least likely are hopes and dreams
 

icyflamez96

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,585
With kaoiken I just assumed Goku's body got acclimated to it more and more.

The stuff with tien's tri beam is just confusing to meb
 

Rutger

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,790
The last chance is this month of kitaro successor getting announced


The funniest thing be original dragon ball Kia but the buu Kia treatment not the 1st 100 episodes Kia treatmsnt

I had seen that as a joke on kiazenshu

Most likely some other random series

Least likely are hopes and dreams
I can only imagine the conversation on a classic DB Kai would go like this.

Someone: hey, what if we did something like Kai with classic DB?
Someone really important at Toei: Hm, I like the idea of getting kid Goku back on TV. How about we rerun GT.
 

Skeeter49

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,142
I can only imagine the conversation on a classic DB Kai would go like this.

Someone: hey, what if we did something like Kai with classic DB?
Someone really important at Toei: Hm, I like the idea of getting kid Goku back on TV. How about we rerun GT.
Dragon Ball GT Kai, with a few things changed so it fits into Super's canon.
 

JohnF

Member
Jan 19, 2019
124
At the least, we're more likely to see Dragon Ball 2per before Berserk gets a new chapter. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 

Jinroh

Member
Oct 28, 2017
836
Lausanne, Switzerland
Why is he slacking though? Is he working on other projects?

At least it's better than Hagiwara with Bastard!!, from memory the last chapter was released in 2011... The worst thing is that he was currently working to close a temporal gap between two arcs and none of the various re-editions are complete because this part is left unfinished.

These old mangakas don't seem to give a fuck anymore.
 

AoM

Member
Oct 31, 2017
3,949
TWO chapters of Berserk released in 2019. The least ever. :(

It will kill me inside if Miura leaves the earth without giving Berserk a proper conclusion.
Least ever was 2013 (mostly because of Gigantomakhia), which technically had one chapter (Issue #1), but 0 during the calendar year.
Why is he slacking though? Is he working on other projects?
He started Duranki in September, both to train assistants so he's more comfortable letting them do more on Berserk (to eventually speed up releases) and to just do something else, as he did with Gigantomakhia. Unfortunately, both dabble in his questionable interests when it comes to a certain character type. But hopefully the Duranki strategy works out.
 

JohnF

Member
Jan 19, 2019
124
Least ever was 2013 (mostly because of Gigantomakhia), which technically had one chapter (Issue #1), but 0 during the calendar year.
Oh yeah, you're right! I forgot about that. I'm a latecomer to the franchise, mercifully, so I haven't had to suffer through the decades-long agony that others have... yet.
 

louisacommie

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,011
New Jersey
Dragon ball i wish had more set pieces like I wish namek had diversely designed cities

Like each village was uniquely designed

I mean kame house the lookout. Capsule Corp Korrins tower the tournament setting snake way and king kias planet are all iconic but i wish there was more
 

Amnesty

Member
Nov 7, 2017
1,102
Dragon ball i wish had more set pieces like I wish namek had diversely designed cities

Like each village was uniquely designed

I mean kame house the lookout. Capsule Corp Korrins tower the tournament setting snake way and king kias planet are all iconic but i wish there was more
I don't think the villages on Namek could look different from each other and make sense for the Namekian culture, which seems very ascetic and undeveloped in terms of architecture and infrastructure. Their buildings seem the way they do because it fits their simple lifestyles. Namekians as a race are almost monastic, so it makes sense that they don't really have different styles of buildings amongst villages. I thought that Namek itself, the villages and everything else, was a pretty iconic place - all of the different visual elements just fit so well together.
 

Anth0ny

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,259

Might be finally time to bite on a UI Goku.

Also, I love that Yardrat Goku with the mutha fuckin finger up. Gohan looks great too!