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E3 PC Gaming Show 2019 is being sponsored by Epic (See EGS Guidelines)

Oct 27, 2017
301
Epic gamer showed his ass finally, it doesn't surprise me a bit. At least they can finally stop burying their head in the sand.
Sadly there is day9 hosting the event, I love him so much but I'll not follow this shitshow this year. I wish you the best Sean!
 
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Oct 27, 2017
4,880
I haven't been keeping up with PC Gamer so I don't know if this is surprising or not.

That said, I'll be very interested to see if there are any changes to the previous years.

I really just want some Age of Empires gameplay PLEASE
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,008
Sorry, but acting like Battletech in 2017 or Sable, Satisfactory and Neo Cab in 2018 didn't exist because all you can remember is Yakuza and thus PC Gaming Show is always bad is ridiculous.

And yet PCgamer has given pretty bad (or at most mediocre) reviews to pretty much every EGS game except for Metro Exodus (and I guess Anno, if that counts).

You'd think the checks would cover review scores above a 70 at least.

Heck I'm pretty sure they gave Operencia it's lowest score (and that game's pretty good).
Giving biased of coverage of something is not the same as getting checks, even though that is the only way people are able to interpret review scores (thanks, years of Famitsu threads?).

Again, I posted earlier how a PCGamer writer actively shunned rational call outs on his reporting and dodged being questioned on accepting Epic's excuse without verifying the other side of the story. In no way this means I think he is getting bribed because of that. It's just weird, and it's fucking healthy to be skeptic of a place that has doing that as a pattern.

The way this thread has gone from page one shows us the exact opposite is true. EGS could meet feature parity with Steam tomorrow and the same 10 posters would still rain their performative disinterest on every thread with 'EGS' or 'Epic' in the title.
Way to be reductive and disingenuous but ok.
First, if they did that, a lot of very fair and reasonable questions would arise.
Second, there would be zero reason to trust a company that in one day decided to have a lot of features they are actively championing against.
Third, their stance regards foreign markets still is shit and elitist.

These are the examples you asked for

Childish noises, unconstructive tantruming
Excuse me, how my "pretends to be shocked" is a tantrum? Yeah, I expected Epic to sponsorship this show. It happened. Boo-fucking-yah. I'll still watch it and not buy anything on EGS. Is my position that offensive I can't post about it?

It's a lot of people saying 'NO I DON'T LIKE IT' and bleating like wounded animals whenever their appalling behavior is called out for what it is.
If you go out of your way to ignore hundreds of posts in every EGS thread explaining in great detail the issues with it to make such an hyperbolic statement, maybe. Yes, there are people adding noise and nothing more that are against the EGS. As there are people in favor of EGS doing the same in this very thread, as I believe you saw when scoring for your quotes (fuck, see the damned implications that skepticism towards PCG coverage of EGS means we are gamergate). If you want to do a call out, then do it properly.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,969
Excuse me, how my "pretends to be shocked" is a tantrum?
Fronting like a game that is out first on EGS then steam 6-12 months later 'isn't really out it's just delayed' for the interval is exactly the sort of empty mouth sounds that the Form Letter posted in every single EGS thread interdicts. It's not a uniformly enforced rule at all but it's correctly identified as shitposting. So yes, you contibuted childish noise. Improve.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,008
Fronting like a game that is out first on EGS then steam 6-12 months later 'isn't really out it's just delayed' for the interval is exactly the sort of empty mouth sounds that the Form Letter posted in every single EGS thread interdicts. It's not a uniformly enforced rule at all but it's correctly identified as shitposting. So yes, you contibuted childish noise. Improve.
Ah yes, good to see you ignored everything else in both my posts. Take your own advice.
 
I want to say that for the most part I think the moderation on this topic has been fairly good. I was concerned when things started to get a bit heated, but that was unwarranted apparently.

They do not. Valve prefers to communicate through its actions, and directly with its users/customers, without engaging the press whenever possible. I have some cool anecdotes about my time there in this regard I probably can't share, but I assure you their philosophy is to communicate directly with who they serve and not use the press as middlemen whenever possible.

My time there actually majorly changed my views and opinions on the gaming press and its dynamic with the companies it covers.
I enjoy hearing about your time there.

I experienced a lot of "communication through action, not words" through my many years of Dota 2. Some appreciate it more than others. "Lack of communication" is cited very frequently as an issue some of the community has with the game. But we know the employees read the subreddits. And we know actual action takes time. But I guess everyone has limits to their patience and with no real pr branch some feel it's like talking to a brick wall.
 
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Jan 30, 2019
227
You know who charges 30% of all transactions on their digital platforms? Apple, Google, Sony, Microsoft, Nintendo, Valve.

And every single one of them, except Valve, spend hundreds of millions of dollars promoting that platform. Meanwhile, Valve never stops looking for new ways to do less work maintaining their store.
Ah yes constantly introducing more dev and consumer facing features is >looking for ways to do less work

*sigh*
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,798
I enjoy hearing about your time there.

I experienced a lot of "communication through action, not words" through my many years of Dota 2. Some appreciate it more than others. "Lack of communication" is cited very frequently as an issue some of the community has with the game. But we know the employees read the subreddits. And we know actual action takes time. But I guess everyone has limits to their patience and with no real pr branch some feel it's like talking to a brick wall.
Thanks. I wish I could share more, but alas, my friends and ex co-workers work too hard to have me going around spewing stuff I shouldn't.

With that said, you nailed it on the bolded, and this is almost the exact phrasing used to describe it to me when I joined.

The subreddits and Steam communities for DOTA2/TF2/CSGO were heavily trawled for sentiment and often discussed. If there's one thing you can be sure of if you're playing a Valve game, it's that someone at Valve is listening, even if action is not immediate. They are quite aware of what their fans want :) Like every company, it's processed and filtered, and there of lots of internal dynamics that influence action (or inaction). During my time there, I never saw Valve act in bad faith. The people there are incredibly talented, some of the best I've ever worked with.
 
Oct 27, 2017
764
Am I supposed to resent valve for not doing gobs (really not much at all to be more precise) of marketing and self promotion?
No, but maybe you could recognize their inaction compared to others in the space and imagine a world where they cared as much.

Ah yes constantly introducing more dev and consumer facing features is >looking for ways to do less work

*sigh*
Constantly? Their introduction of new consumer and dev facing features happen at a tiny fraction of the rate of any other player in the space charging a 30% revenue share. And many, many of Valves initiatives are primarily self-interested or strategic hedges. Even their VR support is embarrassingly anemic compared to the large number of third party games both Sony and Oculus have directly financed to keep the burgeoning market afloat.
 
Here's an idea: sponsor an E3 showcase to promote upcoming games and raise the profile of their platform!
Valve don't do advertising and they've been pretty upfront about not being interested in doing promotions like that.

Doug Lombardi (VP of Marketing at Valve) did a talk regarding this a few years ago:



Now, if this is the best way of doing things is up for debate. I think he has a point but yeah, I think some promotions or some form of attendance at E3 or similar wouldn't hurt.
 
Jan 30, 2019
227
Constantly? Their introduction of new consumer and dev facing features happen at a tiny fraction of the rate of any other player in the space charging a 30% revenue share. And many, many of Valves initiatives are primarily self-interested or strategic hedges. Even their VR support is embarrassingly anemic compared to the large number of third party games both Sony and Oculus have directly financed to keep the burgeoning market afloat.
Ah yes Valve's moves are the only ones primarily in self interest. I forget companies all work on the concept of charity.
Also there's still a big damn difference between "trying to do as less work as possible in maintenance" and introducing new things such as the steam link app, big infrastructure support for PCVR, proton and their work for linux support in general etc. With that stuff just being last year with this year seeming to have even bigger impact changes.

Tell me which other store that charges 30% is making as many steps forward in pc gaming as Valve is.
 

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Oct 27, 2017
1,903
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Nome, please.

Even if that is the case outside of ERA, nobody here is supporting that. Your line of reasoning is irrelevant.
You’re telling me people wouldn’t be upset over EGS if it had feature parity with Steam and was available in as many regions with as many payment options?

I don’t believe that. People here are primarily railing against buying exclusivity.
 
Oct 26, 2017
8,603
Here's an idea: sponsor an E3 showcase to promote upcoming games and raise the profile of their platform!
Steam is their platform. Idk what pc gaming at large is but i wouldn't call it their platform or anyone else's.

Nevertheless, they have done great things to raise the profile and the health of pc gaming. But let me get this strait: That's inaction. But sponsoring a stage show to promote themselves is action.

This part is
'This just means five or so games have a 6-12 months delay. '
That's an equally benign comment. Compare to say, accusing people of tantrums and calling them childish.
 
I don’t believe that. People here are primarily railing against buying exclusivity.
I don't buy that for a second. Some people say it's about principles but I honestly don't believe most people when they claim that. For some it is, but if Valve would do the same thing Epic is doing I don't think many people would care since Steam is already the golden standard and the place where most people buy and play games.

If EGS was a carbon copy of Steam with the same set of features, do you really believe people would be just as upset as they are now? People would still be annoyed by the arbitrary limitation (myself included) but in no way would it be at the same level. Do you believe people would be as upset by Steam exclusivity?
 
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Jan 30, 2019
227
You’re telling me people wouldn’t be upset over EGS if it had feature parity with Steam and was available in as many regions with as many payment options?

I don’t believe that. People here are primarily railing against buying exclusivity.
I think its about how it all adds up rather than the individual pieces - no one would have to care about a feature incomplete store if they didnt have to use it. On the other hand using exclusivity to force people onto your store which sucks feature wise compared to its competitors just leaves a bad taste.
 
Mar 14, 2019
570
You’re telling me people wouldn’t be upset over EGS if it had feature parity with Steam and was available in as many regions with as many payment options?

I don’t believe that. People here are primarily railing against buying exclusivity.
If Epic had same features as steam, similar prices and similar ability to buy cheap keys off 3rd party vendors AND it took the 12% cut, a lot of people (myself included) would consider it superior to Steam due to it being a better deal for devs AND consumers.

but since it offers nothing to the consumers AND forces exclusivity which drives up prices.... yeah, it's got nothing significant going for it in my eyes.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,153
Epic pays studios to be exclusive to their platform for 6-12 months, in practical terms, Epic pays developers and publishers to release on a platform that is objectively worse and less robust. There's zero advantages to effectively paying developers/studios to be on a platform that's worse and the only reason it happens is to make a quick buck. Between the EGS not having email verification of new accounts, and the laughable issues that these amateurs had on Android with Fortnite, it's obvious these chumps are thoroughly incapable of maintaining a platform/ecosystem much less a store. Email verification is full-stack development 101, like...
 
Epic pays studios to be exclusive to their platform for 6-12 months, in practical terms, Epic pays developers and publishers to release on a platform that is objectively worse and less robust. There's zero advantages to effectively paying developers/studios to be on a platform that's worse and the only reason it happens is to make a quick buck. Between the EGS not having email verification of new accounts, and the laughable issues that these amateurs had on Android with Fortnite, it's obvious these chumps are thoroughly incapable of maintaining a platform/ecosystem much less a store. Email verification is full-stack development 101, like...
Seriously not trying to be rude, but what does any of that have to do with them sponsoring a livestream?

I mean, totally seriously, is anyone going to change their stance on EGS at this point?

It just seems to be that once a thread title mentions EGS then everything goes to shit as people rush to get their talking points in. And nobody talks about the actual games being highlighted.

:(

(I just really want to talk about Witchbrook)
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,153
Seriously not trying to be rude, but what does any of that have to do with them sponsoring a livestream?

I mean, totally seriously, is anyone going to change their stance on EGS at this point?

It just seems to be that once a thread title mentions EGS then everything goes to shit as people rush to get their talking points in. And nobody talks about the actual games being highlighted.

:(

(I just really want to talk about Witchbrook)
I'm unhappy that a company who's notorious for having a platform that's cheap, insecure garbage sponsoring a PC Gaming show.
 
Oh wasn't this that chucklefish magic academy game? If so man I was wondering where it went, hope it gets a release date this year pls
Me too. There has been such an odd silence from the devs and publisher throughout the game’s development. Makes me wonder if it will end up being a 2020 game.

(And that people regardless of platform/store get to have access to it) :)


That said chucklefish seems to be blowing up these days so they could have a lot of interesting stuff to show!


 
Oct 28, 2017
2,272
Anyone else excited to see more from Witchbrook? I am hoping for a release date!

one of my most anticipated games, straight up. I get the impression it’s still a long way off tho: one of the devs was asking for feedback about some seemingly pretty fundamental aspects of the game on Twitter recently:


For what it’s worth, I like the idea... But my handwriting/physical note taking skills are garbage, so I def. wouldn’t end up with a cute grimoire of my own by the end of it.
 
Jan 30, 2019
227
Me too. There has been such an odd silence from the devs and publisher throughout the game’s development. Makes me wonder if it will end up being a 2020 game.

(And that people regardless of platform/store get to have access to it) :)


That said chucklefish seems to be blowing up these days so they could have a lot of interesting stuff to show!


Yeah they've been pretty good with their streak of games so I have faith in their stuff, also huh I thought eastward already had a release date...
 
Oct 28, 2017
2,272
Yea. I am hoping for 2019, but I’d be happy with a new trailer and a first half of 2020 date. I really just want to see new info on it.
I think it might end up late 2020, tbh. That thing from one of the devs I edited into my original post kinda gave me the impression they still hadn’t decided on how some fundamental aspects of the game were going to work exactly as of last month, which means there’s probably still a lot of work to do.
 
Oct 28, 2017
429
The PC Gaming show has always been the red-headed stepchild of E3, it won't be really hard to pass on it.

I have to say, I'm amazed at the schadenfreude some people derive from trolling these threads. The EGS is objectively a terrible value proposition on top of being toxic, trust-breaking and hostile to the health of the platform it tries to invade. Cheering for it just because it pisses off people who care is a little too deranged for my tastes.

The upside of this annoucement is that PC Gamer selling out is pretty much a fact at this point and not merely an observation of their editorial stance.
 

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Oct 27, 2017
1,903
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I don't buy that for a second. Some people say it's about principles but I honestly don't believe most people when they claim that. For some it is, but if Valve would do the same thing Epic is doing I don't think many people would care since Steam is already the golden standard and the place where most people buy and play games.

If EGS was a carbon copy of Steam with the same set of features, do you really believe people would be just as upset as they are now? People would still be annoyed by the arbitrary limitation (myself included) but in no way would it be at the same level. Do you believe people would be as upset by Steam exclusivity?
I think its about how it all adds up rather than the individual pieces - no one would have to care about a feature incomplete store if they didnt have to use it. On the other hand using exclusivity to force people onto your store which sucks feature wise compared to its competitors just leaves a bad taste.
If Epic had same features as steam, similar prices and similar ability to buy cheap keys off 3rd party vendors AND it took the 12% cut, a lot of people (myself included) would consider it superior to Steam due to it being a better deal for devs AND consumers.

but since it offers nothing to the consumers AND forces exclusivity which drives up prices.... yeah, it's got nothing significant going for it in my eyes.
I don't doubt that there's people who consider features and availability their #1 priority, but the vibe I get from EGS threads in general is definitely more on the side of principled backlash. Anyway, I don't want to belabor the point. Everyone has their own, valid reasons for not wanting to support Epic, and that's OK.
 
Oct 27, 2017
764
Valve don't do advertising and they've been pretty upfront about not being interested in doing promotions like that.
I'm aware they don't do advertising. If they refuse to advertise their service when that kind of platform promotion is included by everyone else charging the same 30%, that's kinda shitty.

Also there's still a big damn difference between "trying to do as less work as possible in maintenance" and introducing new things such as the steam link app, big infrastructure support for PCVR, proton and their work for linux support in general etc. With that stuff just being last year with this year seeming to have even bigger impact changes.
Steamlink is largely design to increase your dependence on Steam for PC gaming. Their linux work has always been a hedge against having their fortunes tied completely to the Windows OS. VR has never been treated like more than a hobby for the company's idle, rich employees..

But let me get this strait: That's inaction. But sponsoring a stage show to promote themselves is action.
Compared to not doing a show? Yes. How is that a question? Doing something is action compared to not doing something. If your position requires denying modus ponens, you need to reexamine your logic.