E3 PC Gaming Show 2019 is being sponsored by Epic (See EGS Guidelines)

BlueOdin

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,227
The way this thread has gone from page one shows us the exact opposite is true. EGS could meet feature parity with Steam tomorrow and the same 10 posters would still rain their performative disinterest on every thread with 'EGS' or 'Epic' in the title.
Even if Epic had feature parity shitty business practices would still be shitty business practices. The current lack of features is only an addition to that.
 

AshenOne

Member
Feb 21, 2018
661
I'm sorry. But what exactly do you think sponsorships are if not for sale? Like there are legit things to worry about Epic buying, but this is literally what sponsoring is.
At this point Epic is openly aggressively trying to spread its influence. PC Gamer has already shown and exhibited some of that with its articles already. I DO NOT like Epic spreading their influence with journal sites like PC Gamer. It creates room for much bias and one sided-ness. Epic clearly doesn't care about that and only wants to take over the market and everything PC with its money but oh no they won't spend a dime on their shitty store and make that a priority first and foremost instead of snatching 3rd party games and label them as 'exclusives'.
 

Gentlemen

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,831
What to point out the posts that give you this impression? Because this feels like a pretty horseshit statement.
the first page of this thread is just like the first page of every EGS thread. "I have no interest in this topic or product and I want *everyone to know it*" is the rallying cry and it happens in every single thread without fail. It's pavlovian at this point. It's impossible to actually talk about the EGS without the usual suspects flooding in and holding the entire conversation hostage to their specific talking points. EGS could sponsor a hot dog eating contest or a sack race and you'd have people who hate hot dogs and sack races say "well now that's ruined for me."

The PC Gaming show at E3 was never this sacred thing that rose above the level of running joke. It's not ruined by an EGS sponsorship. It's not evidence of the 'ethics in egs journalism' conspiracy theory getting durante all hot right now. It's not a reason to slyly interrogate a Rebellion Developments rep about their moneyhatted exclusive. It's just crappy and childish behavior and it's reason numero uno I am loath to enter a pc-gaming thread in Era lately.
 

Micael

Member
Oct 28, 2017
652
Yeah can you imagine people wanting say, PC gamer to disclose that there is a potential conflict of interest when writing an article about EGS, what are these people, the FTC, pff these anti EGS snowflakes.
 

Mentalist

Member
Mar 14, 2019
1,437
The way this thread has gone from page one shows us the exact opposite is true. EGS could meet feature parity with Steam tomorrow and the same 10 posters would still rain their performative disinterest on every thread with 'EGS' or 'Epic' in the title.

This would not be the case if they dropped their exclusivity deals.

Clearly, Epic wants the attention. But it doesn't want to put in the work needed to get the good kind of attention (having decent store features), but are just throwing money around.

Since this exclusivity is extra hassle for no gain to the consumers, it's a no brainer they are getting the bad kind of attention.
 

dude

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,193
Tel Aviv
Should Washington Post be forced to publish holocaust denying articles in order to show "both sides" of that """debate"""?
WTF. I mean... Maybe a discussion about PC storefronts is not the best thing to compare to Holocaust denial? I mean, for starters the Holocaust is an historic fact, a debate on whether EGS is good or bad for PC gaming is not a fact.
It's not that you can't bring up the Holocaust, but please do so where it makes sense and not just to try and win a random internet argument.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,016
- Epic are sponsoring an event that PC Gamer has independently run for years, with the promise of exclusives for their store being revealed.
What sort of fact is this?

AMD has been a main sponsor of the show before, and now it is EGS. Either the show has always been influenced by sponsors, or sponsors don't impact the show. The opportunity to demo games for whatever platforms has always been there. Microsoft promoting Age of Empires, Star Citizen promoting their own game, Oculus Rift games.

You have double standards with the statement like that.
 

Komo

Member
Jan 3, 2019
2,776
The way this thread has gone from page one shows us the exact opposite is true. EGS could meet feature parity with Steam tomorrow and the same 10 posters would still rain their performative disinterest on every thread with 'EGS' or 'Epic' in the title.
I wish this was true and honestly I was supportive of Epic before the EGS, but their bad practices just continuously deter people.

If they went and did something positive then yes I'd very much gladly agree with them and support them in whatever their trying to do, but so far it's been buying out publishers, and ruining the reputation of any dev greedy enough to take a check. Epic is the same company that wouldn't release Gears on PC because of "consoles make us more money".

So currently Epic doesn't have my trust, they'd have to earn that and a whole lot of other peoples trust by doing things that we can trust them to accomplish. And right now Epic can't even be trusted to update their store.
 

Wamb0wneD

Member
Oct 26, 2017
15,164
Guess Borderlands 3 will be there unless MS gets the showing, no? I can picture cokelord Randy sitting down in that PC show setting and showing us some magic tricks though.
 

m_dorian

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,933
Athens, Greece
I mean, it actually does work like that but whatever. Not a hill worth dying on
No it does not. Holocaust happened. Earth is not flat. No one sane asks for the other opinion on things that have happened.

However, when you have a comparison about marketplaces it is legit and understandable for people to want the medium to represent the competing parties fairly and thoroughly examine the case at hand.

I say this and at the same time i do not think that PC Gamer is in EGS pocket. They had a couple of not well thought opinions on the issue and they have been enthusiastic on presenting the EGS offerings but there is nothing that indicates a deeper association.
 

Walnut

Member
Nov 2, 2017
315
Austin, TX
It’s actually really cool how Epic is actively trying to kill my favorite hobby /s

I don’t mind that they’re sponsoring the event but I just know I’m going to be left feeling sore by at least one announcement I was looking forward to being bought up and made exclusive for this launcher I don’t want to use and company I don’t want to support
 

Micael

Member
Oct 28, 2017
652
Oh so it's about ethics in games journalism...
Because asking for proper disclosure on something is the realm of right wing assholes, what is your next hot take, "Oh Sean hannity didn't disclose that he had the same lawyer as Trump while talking about the subject, guess that is ok we wouldn't want disclosure of things in journalism, what are we gamer gaters".

Proper disclosure has been a staple of good journalism long before there was even video games, so sorry for asking for it.
 

Arsenekinz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,778
Canada
the first page of this thread is just like the first page of every EGS thread. "I have no interest in this topic or product and I want *everyone to know it*" is the rallying cry and it happens in every single thread without fail. It's pavlovian at this point. It's impossible to actually talk about the EGS without the usual suspects flooding in and holding the entire conversation hostage to their specific talking points. EGS could sponsor a hot dog eating contest or a sack race and you'd have people who hate hot dogs and sack races say "well now that's ruined for me."

The PC Gaming show at E3 was never this sacred thing that rose above the level of running joke. It's not ruined by an EGS sponsorship. It's not evidence of the 'ethics in egs journalism' conspiracy theory getting durante all hot right now. It's not a reason to slyly interrogate a Rebellion Developments rep about their moneyhatted exclusive. It's just crappy and childish behavior and it's reason numero uno I am loath to enter a pc-gaming thread in Era lately.
Really cool of you to assume that the people who regularly participate in EGS threads have no interest in the games they’re commenting on. Or do you know these people personally and their interests?
 

LabRat

Member
Mar 16, 2018
1,763
PC gamer just banned me (and several other people) from their comments section, so you better don't talk about this on their site.
that is seriously some pathetic shit
i think i'm still going to watch the pc gaming show though, i hope they at least have some games to announce that arent exclusive to the epic store. sad to see sega seems to be missing?! the yakuza 0 announcement was one of my favourite moments at last years e3
 

sredgrin

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,370
Guess Borderlands 3 will be there unless MS gets the showing, no? I can picture cokelord Randy sitting down in that PC show setting and showing us some magic tricks though.
It's not going to be there. Or if it is it'll be at MS first and then show off some gameplay here, like has been done in the past. PC gaming show is too small fry for something like Take Two.

People don't really understand these sponsorships. What they get you is a 10 minute boring lecture and like AMD and Intel did. They don't suddenly own the whole show, nor is most of the show associated with them (so all the people freaking about like Rebellion and Warframe there are just that, freaking out). It's gonna be a speech and a highlight reel with likely a few small announcement like they did at TGA last year. Some devs might have EGS games too, but I'd bet the majority won't.
 

Ramjag

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,858
Yeah, console wars-like bullshit is fun.

.... if you're twelve.



How is this circling of the wagons from people who never give a shit about PC threads until Epic shows up acceptable?

You're transparent as fuck.
Never understand why some come in boasting about their enjoyment reading about people’s issues with something. It’s immature as hell and odd in general.
 

Wamb0wneD

Member
Oct 26, 2017
15,164
What else is there to show from that game? I think they've shown enough.
Uhh..they could show, you now, the remaining two vault hunters. The game is out in September and E3 is one of the few major showings it's going to get before launch. They already said they are going to be there, afaik.
It's not going to be there. Or if it is it'll be at MS first and then show off some gameplay here, like has been done in the past. PC gaming show is too small fry for something like Take Two.

People don't really understand these sponsorships. What they get you is a 10 minute boring lecture and like AMD and Intel did. They don't suddenly own the whole show, nor is most of the show associated with them (so all the people freaking about like Rebellion and Warframe there are just that, freaking out). It's gonna be a speech and a highlight reel with likely a few small announcement like they did at TGA last year. Some devs might have EGS games too, but I'd bet the majority won't.
Makes sense. I wasn't suggesting we'd only see Epic related games, but BL3 is their biggest exclusives as of now, and it's launching this year. Would make sense for them to promote it during E3.
 

Ojli

Member
Oct 28, 2017
295
I'll be there watching (since I most likely won't have anything else to do that evening). It will most likely be more fun than when AMD sponsored the show in that games will most likely be shown instead of cards, processors and hardware gimmicks. Excited for E3, less than 30 days left! :)
 

Delusibeta

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,281
People don't really understand these sponsorships. What they get you is a 10 minute boring lecture and like AMD and Intel did. They don't suddenly own the whole show, nor is most of the show associated with them (so all the people freaking about like Rebellion and Warframe there are just that, freaking out). It's gonna be a speech and a highlight reel with likely a few small announcement like they did at TGA last year. Some devs might have EGS games too, but I'd bet the majority won't.
I think you're going to be wrong here. I wouldn't be too surprised if it turned out that, as a requirement for the title sponsorship, everything shown will have to agree to be at least available on EGS.
 

Gentlemen

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,831
And you jumping into this thread just to shit on it is not doing the exact same thing?

Doing nothing but downplaying concerns and handwaving away criticism as childish behavior?
These are the examples you asked for

Childish noises, unconstructive tantruming
Yeah. Not watching them announce more exclusives for their shitty store
And I'm out. Not interested in any Epic exclusives so there's no point in me watching.
* pretends to be shocked * This just means five or so games have a 6-12 months delay.
PC Gamer has officially shown their ass, I'm done with them.
Conspiracy theories
As a side note: would it still be considered "vilifying games media" if people accuse Pc gamer of getting paid by epic? 🤔
Well, at least PC Gamer being 100% uncritical about the Epic Games Store makes sense now.
Crypto-racist dogwhistling about a Chinese company
Is there an add-on that replaces "Epic" with "Tencent" because that's exactly what it is.
Needless suspicion and interrogation cast on an official rep of Rebellion Developments who literally just said their game is still coming to Steam.
We're going to hold your word on that.

Well I won't, but they probably will...
I am not brushing aside legitimate concerns with business practices by Epic external to this sponsorship. I am talking about very obviously childish noisemaking that happens in every EGS thread to date. I have also voiced a ton of concern about the signal to noise ratio on gaming side over the course of the last year and by the largest visible margins the worst offender of that is the EGS discussion. I wish it were a better discussion. I wish it would actually be about interesting conversations on the widening horizons of PC marketplaces and whether or not this grows the pie or just segments it. But it's not. It's a lot of people saying 'NO I DON'T LIKE IT' and bleating like wounded animals whenever their appalling behavior is called out for what it is.
 

sredgrin

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,370
I think you're going to be wrong here. I wouldn't be too surprised if it turned out that, as a requirement for the title sponsorship, everything shown will have to agree to be at least available on EGS.

It's just not practical.

Here's the thing with EGS: A HUGE chunk of it's catalogue are multiplatform games. They don't have very many actually PC focused games. The typical game shown at this show tends to be PC-ass PC games. Some might be multiplatform, but most will skew toward heavily PC oriented. Now, maybe Epic will start to court that crowd more, but at the very least we've already seen Rebellion say they are there for a steam game.

Now we know Annapurna and Tripwire will have EGS stuff. I'd doubt say, Frontier with it's heavy DLC focus will be on EGS unless EGS actually ramps up it's features really quickly, which they have not done so. And really we've only seen a small handful of pubs have the clout for a "On EGS but also on Steam release" and only Paradox on that list is really at that level, except for maybe Warframe.
 

Falcon511

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,485
Calling out Tencent is not being racist. People call out corporations all the time on here.

And yes people have the right to be wary of Tencent because they are close to the Chinese government. The same can be said of Microsoft being close to the NSA as well. This is not racism.
 

C-Dub

Member
Oct 25, 2017
509
Cardiff, Wales
What sort of fact is this?

AMD has been a main sponsor of the show before, and now it is EGS. Either the show has always been influenced by sponsors, or sponsors don't impact the show. The opportunity to demo games for whatever platforms has always been there. Microsoft promoting Age of Empires, Star Citizen promoting their own game, Oculus Rift games.

You have double standards with the statement like that.
Fair enough.

I was wrong on that one point, but it doesn’t discount the larger point. They’ve opened themselves up to accusations of a conflict of interest due to their editorial slant in favour of a sponsor of their big event, and are unwilling to address it.
 

Alexandros

Member
Oct 26, 2017
7,227
Just to clarify: There's all sorts of examples of where it makes sense to cover only one side of a debate when the other side is not grounded on facts. While I don't think that is the case of the Epic Game Store, it is the case for many topics in the world where it makes no sense to cover both sides of the "debate." There is no journalism ethics being broken when that happens. You don't, for example, see WaPo or NTY giving equal time to anti-vax movement as they do vaccines because there isn't really a "debate" there, only one side there is grounded in science and fact and it isn't the anti-vax movement.
I don't understand why you feel that this needs to be said here. You said it yourself, this is not the case for the Epic Store. So why make this sort of argument in the first place? What's the point in using such extreme examples like anti-vaxxers, or that other poster that used holocaust denial as an example?
 

Delusibeta

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,281
It's just not practical.

Here's the thing with EGS: A HUGE chunk of it's catalogue are multiplatform games. They don't have very many actually PC focused games. The typical game shown at EGS tends to be PC-ass PC games. Some might be multiplatform, but most will skew toward heavily PC oriented. Now, maybe Epic will start to court that crowd more, but at the very least we've already seen Rebellion say they are there for a steam game.

Now we know Annapurna and Tripwire will have EGS stuff. I'd doubt say, Frontier with it's heavy DLC focus will be on EGS unless EGS actually ramps up it's features really quickly, which they have not done so.
I'm going to point out that I was careful with my wording, and that being "available on EGS" doesn't preclude games from launching on Steam et al at the same time.

I'm also going to be very interested in Dauntless' launch, as according to the EGS roadmap, the overlay includes "microtransaction support", which implies it currently doesn't support microtransactions. Which is a problem, as Dauntless is free-to-play and reliant on said microtransactions. See also: Ubisoft games on EGS just being Uplay installers for the Uplay version.

What I'm saying is that EGS lacking important features games rely on won't prevent developers and publishers getting moneyhatted.

I wish it would actually be about interesting conversations on the widening horizons of PC marketplaces and whether or not this grows the pie or just segments it.
The problem is that from the looks of things (with EGS promotional efforts focusing on free games, exclusive games and now it seems that they're planning on outright handing out store credit as an incentive to enabling 2FA on Epic accounts), it's almost certainly segmentation.
 

Reinhard

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,774
Lol, not going to watch this shit show. Exclusive after exclusive announced while not giving a crap about the consumer, as the EGS is a far worse experience than Steam with worse pricing.
 

Gentlemen

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,831
The problem is that from the looks of things (with EGS promotional efforts focusing on free games, exclusive games and now it seems that they're planning on outright handing out store credit as an incentive to enabling 2FA on Epic accounts), it's almost certainly segmentation.
I've played games and shopped from storefronts that offered material rewards for enabling MFA and I can't see evidence of such behavior stunting the growth of the industry. If free games are hobbling GOG or Humble I'd be curious about the evidence to support that.
 

stealthyfrog

Avenger
Jan 6, 2019
5,153
LMFAO. Epic Games isn't even trying to improve their rep. What's their endgame? Do they just expect the backlash to die out on its own?
 

Nostremitus

Member
Nov 15, 2017
3,723
At this point Epic is openly aggressively trying to spread its influence. PC Gamer has already shown and exhibited some of that with its articles already. I DO NOT like Epic spreading their influence with journal sites like PC Gamer. It creates room for much bias and one sided-ness. Epic clearly doesn't care about that and only wants to take over the market and everything PC with its money but oh no they won't spend a dime on their shitty store and make that a priority first and foremost instead of snatching 3rd party games and label them as 'exclusives'.
Company does things that companies who want to be competitive do and I don't like it...

Like seriously, what company do you expect doesn't want to spread their influence?
 

SweetNicole

The Old Guard
Member
Oct 24, 2017
5,663
I don't understand why you feel that this needs to be said here. You said it yourself, this is not the case for the Epic Store. So why make this sort of argument in the first place? What's the point in using such extreme examples like anti-vaxxers, or that other poster that used holocaust denial as an example?
You said:
It breaks all sorts of journalistic rules and codes when a publication decides to present only one side of a debate.
This is a blanket statement that could be applied far beyond the Epic Games Store to all sorts of other topics. "A publication" and "one side of a debate" are broad terms that can apply to a host of circumstances, which is why I raised the WaPo/NYT and the anti-vax movement as a counterexample to your statement. If you intended it for only the Epic Games Store, a simple way to say this is: "It is unethical to only cover one side of the Epic Games Store." Your blanket statement is inaccurate because there are plenty of counter examples in the world where it is ethical.
 

Javier23

Member
Oct 28, 2017
951
Banned (1 Week): History of misrepresenting the Concerns of Other Users; Trolling.
And right on cue, this EGS thread has already achieved its bingo of "it's all about ethics in gaming journalism", "the failing New Y... PC Gamer must be in bed with Epic because its coverage is not as toxic as I do my darnest to be", "I'm not racist but anything and everyone Chinese is scary and ill willed by sole virtue of their nationality" (you see this one a lot too with anything Russian and is equally obnoxious), and "all of you coming out of the woodwork that don't think like me are fake PC gamers that just enjoy pissing me off".
 

Blacki138

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,645
Will be fun revisiting these threads in 1 or 2 years when EGS is fucking huge and nobody cares anymore.
 

Dandy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,287
Yeah, I'm not watching this. Getting excited for a game and then immediately being disappointed doesn't sound like fun to me.