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Elseworlds |OT| Batwoman Forever - DC TV Crossover, Dec 9-11 on The CW

Oct 25, 2017
3,687
Just finished it and I have to say it was pretty damn lame. I was expecting more from the alter ego switch than a straight body swap. Would have been more fun to see how Barry Allen might have become the Green Arrow and Oliver Queen become the Flash. Nothing Deegan did made sense. They give you this intro where it sounds like he wants to give everyone powers so that they can experience being special and when given the keys to reality he.... switches Barry and Oliver's bodies? What? Why? What is the motivation for anything he's doing? Batwoman doesn't really do anything interesting or give me any reason to care about her show. More lame "The darkness in Oliver!" stuff and some throw away thing where Barry is embracing it for two seconds and might risk becoming dark! Oh no! So fucking corny. Just realized while typing this that the Legends don't show up at all which is why this feels smaller than usual. 90's Flash is there for only two seconds which is lame. Then the whole slowing time down thing because the Earth is slowed?! Come on. I know this stuff plays fast and loose with science and stuff but really? I don't care if it's an homage, it was lame then and it's lame now. The whole thing was lame.

 
Oct 25, 2017
3,071
Just finished it and I have to say it was pretty damn lame. I was expecting more from the alter ego switch than a straight body swap. Would have been more fun to see how Barry Allen might have become the Green Arrow and Oliver Queen become the Flash. Nothing Deegan did made sense. They give you this intro where it sounds like he wants to give everyone powers so that they can experience being special and when given the keys to reality he.... switches Barry and Oliver's bodies? What? Why? What is the motivation for anything he's doing? Batwoman doesn't really do anything interesting or give me any reason to care about her show. More lame "The darkness in Oliver!" stuff and some throw away thing where Barry is embracing it for two seconds and might risk becoming dark! Oh no! So fucking corny. Just realized while typing this that the Legends don't show up at all which is why this feels smaller than usual. 90's Flash is there for only two seconds which is lame. Then the whole slowing time down thing because the Earth is slowed?! Come on. I know this stuff plays fast and loose with science and stuff but really? I don't care if it's an homage, it was lame then and it's lame now. The whole thing was lame.

They explained that in the episode. He wanted to make himself the Flash, but he sucked at using the book so instead he made Oliver the Flash.
 
Aug 22, 2018
1,970
I just thought of something that doesn't honestly bother me at all, but it's sort of amusing.

When 90s Barry shows up, and everyone is like "Wow, Jay!" and Now Barry say "Dad!?" the only reason this happens is because he's played by the same actor. There's absolutely no in-universe reason whatsoever for them to look identical.

Anyway, just a random thought.
 

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,059
I just thought of something that doesn't honestly bother me at all, but it's sort of amusing.

When 90s Barry shows up, and everyone is like "Wow, Jay!" and Now Barry say "Dad!?" the only reason this happens is because he's played by the same actor. There's absolutely no in-universe reason whatsoever for them to look identical.

Anyway, just a random thought.
Unless that Earth's Henry Allen's parents decided to name him Barry.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,110
Bothell WA
That's my one gripe with the Multiverse stuff in the Arrowverse... They break their rules too often for the different worlds. Barry Allen should look like Grant Gustin on every Earth. Just like how all the Wells' looks like Tom. I'm ok with them being different ages give or take a few years just due to random events which cause other events to happen sooner or later, but when a character is a completely different actor, that's weird.
 
Oct 25, 2017
9,879
I just thought of something that doesn't honestly bother me at all, but it's sort of amusing.

When 90s Barry shows up, and everyone is like "Wow, Jay!" and Now Barry say "Dad!?" the only reason this happens is because he's played by the same actor. There's absolutely no in-universe reason whatsoever for them to look identical.

Anyway, just a random thought.
Garrick is actually an Allen in the CW verse,
Jay's mothers name was Garrick which he went with vs Henry Allen.

something like that.
So technically Earth 90's Barry could just have gotten all his father's looks
 
Aug 22, 2018
1,970
Unless that Earth's Henry Allen's parents decided to name him Barry.
There's probably a few answers we could come up with ourselves, for sure. As I said, it's not a plot hole or damaging to the story or anything; it's just not explained.
That's my one gripe with the Multiverse stuff in the Arrowverse... They break their rules too often for the different worlds. Barry Allen should look like Grant Gustin on every Earth. Just like how all the Wells' looks like Tom. I'm ok with them being different ages give or take a few years just due to random events which cause other events to happen sooner or later, but when a character is a completely different actor, that's weird.
Personally, I don't mind there being something like a "90s universe" or whatever. It's fine to me. That one particular instance just stuck out to me. That said, I'll mostly agree with you. They should all look like their original actors unless the universe is seriously divergent in some way.
 
Oct 25, 2017
790
Hey gang, this is one of those regularly scheduled yearly 'where does this fit' questions.

Which one's first, second third? Flash > Supergirl > Arrow? I understand Legends isn't part of it.

Gonna binge most of each of the seasons during the holiday, but probably going to skip to this first. Unless that's not advised? Worked out well last year.

Thanks!

If I'm being honest I've got to re-watch a lot of the previous seasons of all of these but yeah.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,110
Bothell WA
Hey gang, this is one of those regularly scheduled yearly 'where does this fit' questions.

Which one's first, second third? Flash > Supergirl > Arrow? I understand Legends isn't part of it.

Gonna binge most of each of the seasons during the holiday, but probably going to skip to this first. Unless that's not advised? Worked out well last year.

Thanks!

If I'm being honest I've got to re-watch a lot of the previous seasons of all of these but yeah.
The Flash episode is first, then Arrow, then Supergirl. They flipped Flash and Supergirl for the crossover only.
 
OP
OP
ZeroX

ZeroX

Banned
Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,208
Speed Force
Earth 90 Barry Allen is just Henry or Jay by a different name. It’s not hard to understand at all. He’s not our Barry, but if he had a son he’d probably look a lot like him.
 
Oct 25, 2017
8,858
If you’ve already got Superman and Flash in Arrowverse, can’t they just add Batman and Wonder Woman? They shouldn’t do Crisis without the JLA.

I guess I don’t expect them to kill Supergirl either.
 
Oct 25, 2017
9,879
If you’ve already got Superman and Flash in Arrowverse, can’t they just add Batman and Wonder Woman? They shouldn’t do Crisis without the JLA.

I guess I don’t expect them to kill Supergirl either.
No, the problem is WB doesn't like Batman legitimately on tv
Wonder Woman on the other hand is actual rights issues that have to be negotiated around with.
Wonder Woman for example was completely blocked from Batman Beyond, a huge issue for Justice League and even had trouble getting her and WonderGirl in Young Justice.
 
Oct 25, 2017
8,858
No, the problem is WB doesn't like Batman legitimately on tv
Wonder Woman on the other hand is actual rights issues that have to be negotiated around with.
Wonder Woman for example was completely blocked from Batman Beyond, a huge issue for Justice League and even had trouble getting her and WonderGirl in Young Justice.
Wow, what a mess. Amazing that it’s that complicated. Why does tv cheapen Batman but not any other character?
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,483
No, the problem is WB doesn't like Batman legitimately on tv
Wonder Woman on the other hand is actual rights issues that have to be negotiated around with.
Wonder Woman for example was completely blocked from Batman Beyond, a huge issue for Justice League and even had trouble getting her and WonderGirl in Young Justice.
Wonder Woman seems to be fine when it comes to rights. Both NBC and The CW tried to develop shows for it the last couple of years.
 
Oct 25, 2017
345
Finally watched this. Not as good as last year's crossover but still pretty fun. Loved Batwoman's debut and I hope they start rolling on her full series sooner than later. Arrowverse Superman is still the best and the Oliver/Barry/Kara trio is *chef's kiss*. No idea how they're gonna pull of Crisis but I'm excited
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,748
USA
Teen Wolf alumna Meagan Tandy, Camrus Johnson(Luke Cage) and Nicole Kang (You) have been cast in lead roles opposite Ruby Rose in Batwoman, the CW’s DC drama pilot from Greg Berlanti’s Berlanti Productions and Warner Bros. Television.

Tandy will play Sophie Moore. After graduating from military academy, Sophie rose through the ranks to become a high-level private security agent and one of Gotham’s staunchest protectors. Despite her bite and regimented outlook, Sophie has a soft side, illuminated by Kate Kane’s return.

Johnson will portray Luke Fox. A Dark Knight loyalist and son of Wayne’s R&D director Lucius Fox, Luke works to keep Wayne Tower secure in his boss’s absence. While Luke considers himself the guardian of all things Batman — specifically his symbol — he also recognizes the city’s need for a new hero.

Kang is Mary Hamilton. Excitable, talkative, and an influencer-in-the-making, Mary is Kate Kane’s step-sister and polar opposite. But what Mary lacks in a filter, she makes up for with her compassion for Gotham’s underserved communities, proving she has more in common with Kate than she thinks.

https://deadline.com/2019/01/batwom...e-kang-to-star-in-the-cw-pilot-dc-1202541983/
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,897
Teen Wolf alumna Meagan Tandy, Camrus Johnson(Luke Cage) and Nicole Kang (You) have been cast in lead roles opposite Ruby Rose in Batwoman, the CW’s DC drama pilot from Greg Berlanti’s Berlanti Productions and Warner Bros. Television.

Tandy will play Sophie Moore. After graduating from military academy, Sophie rose through the ranks to become a high-level private security agent and one of Gotham’s staunchest protectors. Despite her bite and regimented outlook, Sophie has a soft side, illuminated by Kate Kane’s return.

Johnson will portray Luke Fox. A Dark Knight loyalist and son of Wayne’s R&D director Lucius Fox, Luke works to keep Wayne Tower secure in his boss’s absence. While Luke considers himself the guardian of all things Batman — specifically his symbol — he also recognizes the city’s need for a new hero.

Kang is Mary Hamilton. Excitable, talkative, and an influencer-in-the-making, Mary is Kate Kane’s step-sister and polar opposite. But what Mary lacks in a filter, she makes up for with her compassion for Gotham’s underserved communities, proving she has more in common with Kate than she thinks.

https://deadline.com/2019/01/batwom...e-kang-to-star-in-the-cw-pilot-dc-1202541983/
In ususal CW style, Batwoman has a full team for.. reasons. *sigh*

Love interest, that starts outside the circle and is brought in eventually: Check.
Tech person to conveniently develop plot needed solutions: Check.
Family member for flashbacks and emotional connection: Check.

Just cast her dad as the wise elder who keeps her focused already.