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Epic launches digital games store with 88% revenue going to developers

Durante

Dark Souls Man
Member
Oct 24, 2017
4,134
0
You'd think people just took their first class of economics with the blind it's competition! statements.

New platforms that do not try to compete by providing better services, but rather through exclusivity is terrible competition, and only hurts customers. Closed-platforms (i.e. consoles) that force you into using their one (paid) service, one store, approved accessories, and largely compete by exclusivity nonsense is terrible competition.
And we have ample evidence for that.
E.g. when console platform holders with a captive audience and exclusive distribution of games require payments to play peer-to-peer online games, people shrug, maybe moan a bit, and then pay up since they don't have an option.
If you try that on a marketplace with actual competition, where you can get the same game on different software platforms, it fails miserably. As we saw.

The power there is exactly in the same library being available across different platforms on the same hardware, and paying for game exclusivity takes away that power from gamers.

Competition would look like a platform that offers new competitive features to their customers, and does not force people's hands with exclusives, even among their first-party games. This is GOG.

Steam is the best gaming platform by far because it offers the best features to both customers and developers. Despite being at the top, they've continued to release incredible features that are far ahead of any competitors (on the PC and outside of it). And to top it all of, they've insisted on open-platform policies such as allowing developers and third-party storefronts to sell keys taking no cut that ironically create better competition for customers than what these other (vast majority) competitors have managed to do.
Exactly.

Epic: We're announcing a storefront with extremely competitive revenue splits, and we're also making explicit statements about our intention to compete with other storefronts to change the market for the better for developers large and small alike.
They also made explicit statements about their intention to buy store exclusivity.
Which is the exact opposite of being competitive in a sense which is positive for customers.

They also stated that e.g. their store will allow publishers to decide whether or not their games can be rated/reviewed by customers.
Which is an indication of a power balance shift from gamers to publishers I really don't appreciate.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,628
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China
Epic: We're announcing a storefront with extremely competitive revenue splits, and we're also making explicit statements about our intention to compete with other storefronts to change the market for the better for developers large and small alike.

This thread: Endless posts about Epic not akshually being competitive and why Steam is so great.
We have developers in this thread and on Twitter chiming in:


I'm a one-man indie dev who just released their second title on Steam. Would I like to get more than 70% of the revenue? Sure. But for that 18% difference:
1) My games support integrated leaderboards--a critical feature in score-attack games like mine--and I don't have to run any servers.
2) My games support Xbox One/360, DualShock4, Switch Pro, and Steam Controllers, without me having to do anything.
3) My games have a set of Achievements.
4) My games support cloud saving.
5) My games can't be copied/pirated willy-nilly, because they can detect whether they're running through the Steam client, and they quit if they're not.
6) Steam Support has gotten back to me very quickly when I've encountered any issues, and they've been very thorough when reviewing my builds.

The price difference is justified imo. My customers get more and I get more.

If Epic offers comparable service in the future, that'd be awesome. I hope they do. But if not, then dollars aren't everything.
If you want to compete with Steam, please compete with Steam in 2018, not 2009.
 
Dec 9, 2017
587
0
Not another one.
Discord, Uplay, Origin, Steam, Epic, Microsoft, GOG, etc. I want a launcher that can put all this shit together.
I know Playnite can put all your games in one place automatically, but I wish Steam was capable of doing the same thing all on its own. And then on top of it, they could also add the option to force BPM in non-steam games for easy controller support for all games.
 
Oct 25, 2017
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STEAM definitely needs the competition, they take their position for granted.
Yeah, what did they do this year?
Create an app for Android that lets you transform your smart devices into computers via easy and functioning streaming?
Create and support a program that allows thousands of new games to be playable on Linux?
Changes in preparation for the new Steam UI rollout
  • like the new chat?
  • like being able to stream in your game page?
  • like adding developer pages and franchise pages?
Finally allowing R18 games?


Truly a year they did nothing
 
Nov 2, 2017
338
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I still have yet to see why people would switch to this platform or just use it beyond the odd game.

Great for devs though, I just don’t see it being successful.
I'm curious as to the numbers for people who play fortnite on PC, but don't own games through other services like steam. For those, the Epic store would be their only store front. Even if that percentage is small (10% or so ) of fortnite pc users, that is still millions.
Considering the lack of competition on the storefront seeing as it's a brand new store, that could mean large sales numbers for early adopters.
Think switch software sales numbers.
 
Oct 18, 2018
184
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Europe
Amazing. Valve has been an incredibly shitty tech libertarian company that needs to be fixed entirely, and I hope that this platform at least won’t be as hands off, neutral towards fascists, and offloading the work to its consumers (read: exploiting) as Steam does.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tencent#Controversy

Many of Tencent's software and services are remarkably similar to those of competitors. The founder and chairman, Huateng "Pony Ma" Ma, famously said, "[To] copy is not evil." A former CEO and president of SINA.com, Wang Zhidong, said, "Pony Ma is a notorious king of copying." Jack Ma of Alibaba Group stated, "The problem with Tencent is the lack of innovation; all of their products are copies."
They own almost 50% of Epic.

Can't wait for China to deliver us from the unspeakable evils Valve is committing every day.

i see your username and you are obviously biased, opinion dismissed
Damn, exposed. Gottagofast.
 
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Oct 25, 2017
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Seriously? Because the people who poured multiple years of their lives into making the games you love playing get more money, at no added expense for you.

Amazing news, and I’ll definitely be looking for games here first from now on.

There's an expense for me when games are more expensive and when the service is worse.
 
Oct 25, 2017
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On a side note it's extremly embarrassing for ERA that all these shit and low quality drive-by-post are allowed by the moderation in PC and especially threads about Valve.

LIke does the moderation on this forum even care about post quality in PC threads?
 
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Dec 14, 2017
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They wont make Fortnite exclusive to the platform, but they can give some extra stufd for those who use it, new skins or bonus XP or whatever for some time to force adoption.

If they do that, deliver a solid service (dl speed, stability) and can have some games cheaper than everywhere else they will be up to a good start.
 
Jan 28, 2018
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Love to see people shitting on Steam, Valve shacked the PC platform and market, a fuckton of indies found success thanks to Steam, major publishers started to release their games on PC, we had a huge influx of japanese games and the whole Steam ecosystem is always improving, but, somehow now Steam and Valve are the bad guys, try to guess why in 14 years no major publisher ever managed to reach Steam numbers or popularity, try to imagine PC gaming in 2018 without Steam. I have no issues with competition and more launchers as long as i have a good experience and i don't have to deal with broken stuff.
 
Oct 27, 2017
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Hello fellow PC gamers I think Steam needs the competition to help keep my prankster uncle from updating my drivers from his comfy couch.

Competition tends to offer something to the consumer, not just the business end. If anything this will likely take some things away as "exclusive" games on the platform will not end up on third party sites like GMG, Humble, etc and so it will give us less choice.

The only possible way it could offer us stuff is if devs, since their cut is now bigger, will more aggressively discount their games, though with other store / platform versions that's been seeming rarer and rarer in general.
 
Oct 25, 2017
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On a side note it's extremy embarrassing for ERA that all these shit and low quality drive-by-post are allowed by the moderation in PC and especially threads about Valve.

LIke does the moderation on this forum even care about post quality in PC threads?
Of course not. It’s why the PC thread title was changed from Steam Gaming to PC Gaming.
 
Oct 29, 2017
4,625
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Mt. Whatever
On a side note it's extremy embarrassing for ERA that all these shit and low quality drive-by-post are allowed by the moderation in PC and especially threads about Valve.

LIke does the moderation on this forum even care about post quality in PC threads?
I mean, they have told us flat out before that "PC isn't a platform."

They locked down our community thread and almost killed it one time, not because we were bad, but others came in to stir shit and we reacted.
 
Jan 27, 2018
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The big challenge will be customer acquisition and getting people to buy on their platform rather than their competition. You have to offer consumers what they really care about, games and good prices.
 
Nov 1, 2017
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How do you figure? Are you even aware of what Valve has been doing in the PC space lately? They don't just sit around and farm money from the Steam store you know
I wish they'd invest some of it in customer service because the few times I needed it I never got a reply back from them. That is pretty god damn frustrating. What games they permit on their site was a shitshow for the longest time as well.
 
Oct 25, 2017
7,969
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I wish they'd invest some of it in customer service because the few times I needed it I never got a reply back from them. That is pretty god damn frustrating. What games they permit on their site was a shitshow for the longest time as well.
Newsflash, they did. They've hired dedicated support teams and have open support stats available to you at anytime, which demonstrate that the rate of resolved support tickets has increased dramatically.
 

Durante

Dark Souls Man
Member
Oct 24, 2017
4,134
0
Great news for developers. 30% was always a ridiculous amount. I hope the Apple App Store and Google Play stores consider lowering their cut going forward.
What about Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo?
They should go even lower since people are already paying monthly fees to them.

I'm all for reducing platform holder fees across the board.
 
Oct 18, 2018
184
0
Europe
I wish they'd invest some of it in customer service because the few times I needed it I never got a reply back from them. That is pretty god damn frustrating. What games they permit on their site was a shitshow for the longest time as well.
They did invest into their customer service and it has improved tenfold. Don't know when you had issues but nowadays it's pretty solid and on the level of other stores.

You mean the infamously godawful Steam support that no one likes and everyone calls a hassle to use? That's the hill you want to die on?
When have you yourself talked to them the last time? Kinda useless regurgitating old tales for all eternity.
 
Oct 25, 2017
51
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Finland
You mean the infamously godawful Steam support that no one likes and everyone calls a hassle to use? That's the hill you want to die on?
Maybe in the past, but that hasn't been the case for years. Which year are you living again?

No I mean their customer service that never got back to my emails when I needed their help.
So, you emailed them instead of using the support function on the client/site?
 
Jul 25, 2018
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And we have ample evidence for that.
E.g. when console platform holders with a captive audience and exclusive distribution of games require payments to play peer-to-peer online games, people shrug, maybe moan a bit, and then pay up since they don't have an option.
If you try that on a marketplace with actual competition, where you can get the same game on different software platforms, it fails miserably. As we saw.
For a long time there was only MS charging for online access. Sony and Nintendo weren't. MS were still very successful so obviously people weren't that bothered because they had options. Do you recall that for the longest time PC games were $10 cheaper than console games? That was because the publishers of games on PC didn't have to pay a platform royalty of close to $10 to Sony/MS/Nintendo, which third party publishers had to do with every disc regardless of which retailer sold it. Despite not being a closed platform, PC gamers did in fact tolerate the price of games going up from $50 to $60 in parity to console games. Thanks to that competition on consoles, MS now includes Games with Gold with Live Gold, with dozens of free games each year included when previously consumers got nothing.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,902
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Beep bop boop. Generating a response for the Epic digital store thread now.
Beep Boop.
Adding the word "competition."
Beep bop bop.
Here you go!

"Finally, Valve gets some competition. Steam has been going downhill fast!"

Please enjoy your randomly generated response about the new Epic Game's store thread.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,007
0
For a long time there was only MS charging for online access. Sony and Nintendo weren't. MS were still very successful so obviously people weren't that bothered because they had options. Do you recall that for the longest time PC games were $10 cheaper than console games? That was because the publishers of games on PC didn't have to pay a platform royalty of close to $10 to Sony/MS/Nintendo, which third party publishers had to do with every disc regardless of which retailer sold it. Despite not being a closed platform, PC gamers did in fact tolerate the price of games going up from $50 to $60 in parity to console games. Thanks to that competition on consoles, MS now includes Games with Gold with Live Gold, with dozens of free games each year included when previously consumers got nothing.
Dozens of free games that most of the users dont give a crap about and that they are used to hide the fact that you are paying for online (the difference in money Sony is making now with PS+ when compared when it was optional is quite telling in that most users just want to play online not the "free" random games whose quality has been dipping).

Stats supplied by themselves. Always trustworthy.
Vs stats pulled from your ass and single point memory.

I am going with Steam is not going to try and lie to us and the developers on both their user numbers and support stats
 

Durante

Dark Souls Man
Member
Oct 24, 2017
4,134
0
For a long time there was only MS charging for online access. Sony and Nintendo weren't. MS were still very successful so obviously people weren't that bothered because they had options. Do you recall that for the longest time PC games were $10 cheaper than console games? That was because the publishers of games on PC didn't have to pay a platform royalty of close to $10 to Sony/MS/Nintendo, which third party publishers had to do with every disc regardless of which retailer sold it. Despite not being a closed platform, PC gamers did in fact tolerate the price of games going up from $50 to $60 in parity to console games.
Actually, PC games generally still launch at $50. Divinity: Original Sin, Pillars of Eternity 2, X4: Foundations just recently, and so on.
It's console multiplats which now often launch at $60.

Also, you are completely ignoring my central argument of what is and is not actual platform competition that benefits the customer.
Tell me again how I benefit from having to buy a game on an inferior platform.
 
Oct 25, 2017
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You mean the infamously godawful Steam support that no one likes and everyone calls a hassle to use? That's the hill you want to die on?
The last time I openend a support ticket was sometime last year (or early this year) and it wasn't a problem, but simply why a game was only listed as "Partial Controller Support" on the store page even if it was completely playable with a controller. It had a separate launcher but it looked like that was also navigatable with a controller, so I was confused.
Basically a completely superfluous and pretty esoteric support request.
They got back to me after a few hours with an actually helpful answer that explained the reason (the launcher was navigateable with a controller but only Xinput and not DirectInput, I think).
Refunds have taken an hour or 2 at most before they are processed.

Those are my experiences with their support team and they have been positive. But let's continue to mindlessly repeat old tales from years ago.
 
Oct 25, 2017
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Plenty of indie developers aren't happy enough with Steam, something like itch.io is already a quite appealing alternative for many.
I mean itch.io just barely makes money to break even. No Indies are abandoning Steam to go itch.io exclusive.
And one of the good things about itch.io I that it doesn't have curation. You can put anything in there. And that's great. But Epic seems to want to go the dumb "curated" approach. This, by definition is anti-indie, and no indie dev is going to focus that much on a platform that might not even accept them all.
 
Oct 25, 2017
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I mean itch.io just barely makes money to break even. No Indies are abandoning Steam to go itch.io exclusive.
And one of the good things about itch.io I that it doesn't have curation. You can put anything in there. And that's great. But Epic seems to want to go the dumb "curated" approach. This, by definition is anti-indie, and no indie dev is going to focus that much on a platform that might not even accept them all.
LMAO sure buddy. Now tell us about the rest of your libertarian beliefs.
 
Nov 1, 2017
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Maybe in the past, but that hasn't been the case for years. Which year are you living again?


So, you emailed them instead of using the support function on the client/site?
I contacted them via customer support. They didn't reply. That was my experience. Has it changed? Some say so. I haven't experienced that since I haven't had to bother with them for awhile now. If something happens again I shall find out. If I have a good positive experience I will surely remark as such. If not, same.