Epic Seven (Mobile/Mobage) |OT| 1.25% better than Dragalia Lost's Rates!

[galvenize]

I for one remain sceptical on the new ways to get MLs. One year in, I'm still waiting to get my first 5* ML but I dont want them to make it easier for me. The satisfaction of finally getting your first one is something special that I've yet to experience and I want it to happen before the changes.

 

[Razmos]

The ML changes are a net positive if those newly released ML characters get focus banners (and reruns) the way regular covenant summons do.

You'll need more bookmarks relative to how much you need to get non-ML 5*s now, but far, FAR fewer bookmarks than if you tried to collect all the ML units through the absurd gated system we currently have. Plus guaranteed pity, so you can never get truly fucked over, and the super whale type players can just keep rolling to max out their imprints. Win-win.

Overall a massive improvement over the current system. I see no reason to complain, unless you're one of those asshole types that gets off on exclusive access to the right to succeed in arena.

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Most of the complaints I've seen seem to be exactly that.

I for one think these changes sounds great, moonlight summons are a ridiculous feature

 

[Westlo]

Not really sure how to take these changes until the full picture is shown....

Don't know why they just didn't increase rate up on ML summons after every non 5 star pull.... and handed out more pulls.

I wonder what my odds are to get an ML Lots when I pull 4 star rarity after including all the 4 star characters and artifacts together now...... less than a non banner 5 star character?

It's a really bloated pool and the game isn't even a year old yet.....

Most of the complaints I've seen seem to be exactly that

I for one think these changes sounds great, moonlight summons are a ridiculous feature

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Moonlight summons were fine, they only went to shit when they started to monetize them through mystics and deliberately released over the top units to push sales with mystic packs.

And guys with nerfed ML Ara and Baals are just going to trade them in for ML Luna or whoever, and good luck pulling that new "strong" but not OP unit if they're still introduced by mystic packs and are than a f all chance of being summoned in the general pull.

Them being given a ML selector for nerfed units means they're still ahead, they can trade in ML nerfed for ML Kise and cleave their way to legend since Armin will be getting nerfed.

She's good, until the opposing asshole decides to go full effectiveness on his ML Ara, ML Baal, or Dizzy, and then your effect resistance can go straight in the shitter.

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ML Ara and ML Baal will mess your day up since a lot of time 150 ER feels like 0......... but lol @ Dizzy, you're cleansing that shit who cares about her S3 if you are KC.

 

[Numberfox]

I like the ML abolishment, though I'm not too affected either way with how little I roll.

Managed to 6* General Purrgis thanks to the EXP buff, so I consider this event a success. One step closer to a proper Wyvern team.

 

[Jiraiza]

Not really sure how to take these changes until the full picture is shown....

Don't know why they just didn't increase rate up on ML summons after every non 5 star pull.... and handed out more pulls.

I wonder what my odds are to get an ML Lots when I pull 4 star rarity after including all the 4 star characters and artifacts together now...... less than a non banner 5 star character?

It's a really bloated pool and the game isn't even a year old yet.....



Moonlight summons were fine, they only went to shit when they started to monetize them through mystics and deliberately released over the top units to push sales with mystic packs.

And guys with nerfed ML Ara and Baals are just going to trade them in for ML Luna or whoever, and good luck pulling that new "strong" but not OP unit if they're still introduced by mystic packs and are than a f all chance of being summoned in the general pull.

Them being given a ML selector for nerfed units means they're still ahead.



ML Ara and ML Baal will mess your day up since a lot of time 150 ER feels like 0......... but lol @ Dizzy, you're cleansing that shit who cares about her S3 if you are KC.

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Don't know what garbage Dizzys you're playing against, but most Dizzys I've fought usually manage to get a second S3 up before my cat even gets her S3 CD count down to 2. I'm just lucky that I outgear most of these cancer compositions that I win by pure numbers alone.

 

[Alkez]

Ofc, questioning anything makes you an asshole. Just another day in the E7 thread...

An ML selective on nerfed MLs just seems very dangerous territory to me. I understand their reasoning, as people have spent money on them and that's why they were reluctant to nerf them in the first place, but giving players instant access to whoever they want just seems like the wrong approach.

I question MLs entering the covenant for a number of reasons. The pool is already becoming diluted, and now we're adding another 40 or so units. I've read the letter a few times but I can't see any indication that the pools will remain separate. Are people expecting the rates to be adjusted? Because even that feels like a stretch. Is there an additional source that supports the separate pool theory? Or did I just completely miss something in the letter?

ML heroes are some of the strongest PvP heroes in the game. I would argue a number of ML 4*s are the equivalent of Covenant 5*s in PvP. So are we expecting a complete rebalancing of these heroes, and not just nerfs on the standout OP ones? Because at this moment there aren't many 4*s in the Covenant summon that are as strong as say someone like A Coli or Watcher Schuri. Heroes that are not considered OP but are some of the strongest PvP units out there. The gap between the ML 4*s and Covenant 4*s is pretty great, so if we now have an equal chance to acquire an ML 4* as we do a Covenant 4* that makes pulling a Covenant 4* significantly worse. Will the player experience really be any better? If you pull a Covenant 4* "I got spooked!" If they make the ML rates lower than Covenant rates "The rates are too low!"

These are the questions running through my mind atm. It's a big change I think questions need to be asked of this (though clearly some of you disagree lol). We need to wait for more information before jumping for joy imo. And for reference I am completely F2P so I don't care about exclusive units or whatever it was. I have posted a few times that I believe separate summoning pools should never have been a thing to begin with, but if that had been the case the balance wouldn't be as off as it is right now.

The ironic part is if everyone has easier access to these units, the powerlevel of every player is going to go up, so the chances are you're going to remain in roughly the same arena tier you're currently in regardless.

 

[Westlo]

Don't know what garbage Dizzys you're playing against, but most Dizzys I've fought usually manage to get a second S3 up before my cat even gets her S3 CD count down to 2. I'm just lucky that I outgear most of these cancer compositions that I win by pure numbers alone.

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Garbage? Probably a fair few of them but I had no problem against the 3 dizzys I fought in rank 19 guild earlier this week....

I have a fully mola'd, max level portrait, over 100,000CP (which doesn't mean that it's optimal gear, nowhere near it) Baiken that gets cleansed and cr pushed by Destina... I don't really have Dizzy problems unless Fat Cat makes me miss S2 or C.Armin is super quick

No idea what team you run but leaving Dizzy alive is just asking for trouble.

The ironic part is if everyone has easier access to these units, the powerlevel of every player is going to go up, so the chances are you're going to remain in roughly the same arena tier you're currently in regardless.

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Yeah I agree with that, and like I said earlier... these whales are going to get new ML units because their current broken ones are going to get nerfed.

A whale with ML Ara and ML Baal will have enjoyed months of domination and can trade in for Judge Kise who will cleave everything after C.Armin gets nerfed and they can grab a ML Luna or ML Charles or ML Basar, whoever's the best of that lot.

Meanwhile a normal user is hoping they get an ML unit and could end up with ML Sez or normal Basar or whatever when they finally get a 5 star hero on summon.

 

[cyldman]

To be honest, I like how rare ML heroes are.
It keeps the game different for everyone and it keeps (me specifically, chasing for that carrot)
Let's hope they don't get "too easy" to get, because if so, the game will mainly revolve only about gear.

 

[cw_sasuke]

Gotta cosign Alkez and cyldman

As a f2p i really liked the idea of OP ML units that were really difficult to get. Doesnt really matter how long it would have taken but i know that feeling of pulling a 5* ML unit at some point would have been crazy.

While i understand that changes needed to happen - i dont know if this is the right one and that more people having to the ML units will result in a easier time in PVP for the members here who are very dedicated to it.

Not too long ago they stated that ML units wont be nerfed and they were incredible easy to get, which meant that some players spent god knows how much time/money on getting them - just changing up those hard rules like this....is interesting. I hope it all works out in the end and we only laugh about those early e7 months and how crazy rare those ML pulls were.

They need to get their shit together soon, since i dont think they can afford to man reworks of that kind, since it has a very strong impact on the spending behavior of their whales.

The fact that they are willing to make such massive changes across all servers because of the heat that they got mostly from one region is good but also dangerous.

Iirc she targets the hero with the longest cooldown at the time of her using it.

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Hmm....she seems to be quite gimped in auto mode at least in combination with Tamarinne.
Whats worst she wont even use her S2 when its ready though it grants another turn after using it.
So instead of using her S2 and then S3 on round 1....she just goes ahead and uses her S3. So stupid.

 

[lt519]

I called it, combine the summon pools was one way out of this. Gacha within Gacha was never a good idea. I'm fine with Mystic summons if they do this as a way to get the newest unit. I'd prefer they do separate pools with an increased cost for ML units but a combined pool at same cost but lower rates is about the same.

They need to sort through some initial balancing issues and making sure ML doesn't overtake the game entirely but that's also how Gacha goes, units get left in the dust all the time.

Very happy they are thinking big with the changes and are willing to rework for the long term health of the game at the cost of some short term health

The only way out of this for them is to remove Mystic Summons and consolidate summoning currencies. Screw ML bookmarks, etc, just make the ML summons more expensive covenant summons (I don't know, like 50 covenant bm's) and let players decide what they want to spend their marks on. They'd probably do better fiscally too as I don't see how it would slow down spending and it'd open the summon pool up to more F2P/dolphins that could turn into potential whales. Right now a $99 Mystic Pack is pure P2W, it's so expensive there's really nobody but whales that will keep buying them.

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I was close. What they are suggesting is much better I think. Very very pleased but we'll see how they roll it out. They could make the rates so abysmally low it won't matter lol.

 

[PancakeFlip]

https://www.reddit.com/r/EpicSeven/comments/cf2nut/apology_letter_from_smilegate_megaport_ceo/

I think they picked the worst possible route in regards to how pulling ML summons will be handled. PVP is gonna be a mess.

Hopefully they massage these ideas a bit more before they get released.

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What happened that made them 180 THIS sharply?

I actually stopped playing a few weeks ago because I wasnt impressed with the new characters (design wise).

 

[Alkez]

They need to get their shit together soon, since i dont think they can afford to man reworks of that kind, since it has a very strong impact on the spending behavior of their whales.

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Yeah I was thinking about this after I posted. If I was a whale I would be pissed right now. Not because I want to keep the F2P players down, but because I've already spent money that they are not going to give back. I'm actually concerned about the whales reaction (not sure what it is atm) because those are the players that allow F2P players like me to keep playing.

Hmm....she seems to be quite gimped in auto mode at least in combination with Tamarinne.
Whats worst she wont even use her S2 when its ready though it grants another turn after using it.
So instead of using her S2 and then S3 on round 1....she just goes ahead and uses her S3. So stupid.

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Yeah I've seen the not using S2 issue before. They didn't give her the AI that Karin and Baiken have for some reason.

The AI isn't great most of the time unless they go out of their way to write something for that character. The amount of times I watched Ruele bring back a dog over my level 60 Bellona yesterday was infuriating.

 

[lt519]

Yeah I was thinking about this after I posted. If I was a whale I would be pissed right now. Not because I want to keep the F2P players down, but because I've already spent money that they are not going to give back. I'm actually concerned about the whales reaction (not sure what it is atm) because those are the players that allow F2P players like me to keep playing.
Yeah I've seen the not using S2 issue before. They didn't give her the AI that Karin and Baiken have for some reason.

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I imagine letting them pick what ML unit they want is good enough. But someone will always complain they won't retain everyone.

 

[PancakeFlip]

Wouldn't the real whales not give a damn since money or value shouldn't be a factor to them at all? Like if I could spend 10,000 dollars on this game like it was nothing, I'd likely not care about changes to the game that could effect the value of my spending.

 

[lt519]

This is also big because it means they have to be smarter about designing units and can't just make busted units that are ML only because they are "for top tier PvP" i.e. whales. It means more units for F2P players as they'll have to design with both in mind which allieveates some of the we are only getting one new F2P unit every two weeks.

Wouldn't the real whales not give a damn since money or value shouldn't be a factor to them at all? Like if I could spend 10,000 dollars on this game like it was nothing, I'd likely not care about changes to the game that could effect the value of my spending.

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Right the real whales fully expect to have to keep buying new units as old ones get powercrept. I don't think they will care as much. It'll be the dolphin that splurged that one time for ML Baal that'll be pissed but letting them pick ANY ML unit is a really really good form of payback.

 

[Rokuren]

Wow, those are some interesting changes. I think I like it. It all comes down to the execution, particularly in how they balance the ML heroes vs the covenant heroes.

I'd need to see the finalized details before I could really decide how I feel, but it sounds like an overall positive.

 

[lt519]

I do feel for Pelicano though, this means complete whaling that isn't time gated is possible. Top PvP is going to be out of reach for nonwhales/dolphins as it is for must Gachas unless you are extremely lucky.

Again we'll see the implementation but I do want to shout out that I understand these changes aren't great for those in the middle.

Although buying stones to bookmarks to gold stones was always possible it was at a dumb rate previously.

 

[Grim]

Lol, there will be a meltdown after these changes are implemented.

You're still going to complain about defence teams that take ages to kill.

You're going to complain about everyone using the same unit in even more ranks.

You're going to complain about the how the pool is now diluted and you "must" get to pity get the on banner unit because rates suck. (If the pools aren't seperate)

All so you stay in the same rank in PvP because you'll never spend enough money & time to be Top 5000 to begin with.

 

[cw_sasuke]

I called it, combine the summon pools was one way out of this. Gacha within Gacha was never a good idea.

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You are right, while i did get used to the ML pull system.....taking a couple steps back it never really made sense to have a Gacha within a Gacha, with the expectations that the ML pulls needed or would be much better than the rest.

Yeah I was thinking about this after I posted. If I was a whale I would be pissed right now. Not because I want to keep the F2P players down, but because I've already spent money that they are not going to give back. I'm actually concerned about the whales reaction (not sure what it is atm) because those are the players that allow F2P players like me to keep playing.
Yeah I've seen the not using S2 issue before. They didn't give her the AI that Karin and Baiken have for some reason.

The AI isn't great most of the time unless they go out of their way to write something for that character. The amount of times I watched Ruele bring back a dog over my level 60 Bellona yesterday was infuriating.

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bolded part made me laugh heh. Guess ill just have to get used to it - i hope they fix or update some AI routines of these characters down the line. Most of the games play time is auto and it already takes enough time as it is - improving some of the AI and letting us skip the S3 sequences would come along way.

Was feeling the same about whales - but they are probably invested enough to stick around since the game in general is quite good. Feels like this setback is necessary for the game to really come together in the future.

Lol, there will be a meltdown after these changes are implemented.

You're still going to complain about defence teams that take ages to kill.

You're going to complain about everyone using the same unit in even more ranks.

You're going to complain about the pool is now diluted and about how you "must" get to pity get the on banner unit. (If the pools aren't seperate)

All so you stay in the same rank in PvP because you'll never spend enough money & time to be Top 5000 to begin with.

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Thats probably true lol.
f2p players and small spenders complaining that they cant keep up with with Uber Whales will likely never stop.

 

[Sorel]

Hello everyone !

I don't know which of my hero I should upgrade.
Right now I'm stuck at 9-1 and my main team is Ken, Basar, Alexa 4 star and Aither 4 star. I'm considering to put one off them 5 star but I'm not sure.
As healer I also have Hazel and Jecht.

But I also have a Lorina and Kluri lvl 40. Plus I have Cecilia and Ludica.

What should I do ? Alexa and Aither 5 star ? Lorina and Kluri for their evolution ? Or focusing on the five star ? Praying the RNG god for Angelica or Montmorency ?

 

[Mupod]

I beat Automaton 96 last night by moving ALL of my crit gear off my entire team, using Chloe and plinking him down with Magic Nail. I still had a chain of like 6 crits at one point, even with 15% on everyone.

97-99 I barely remember, as always the tower balance is completely fucked and inconsistent. I nuked 99 Destina in the face with a Cermia that I had moved all my damage gear onto and she never transformed.

100 I don't even know how to approach. I don't have Tamarinne, Iseria, Krau or Dark Corvus. I have a huge roster with a wide variety of characters but apparently nobody has ever beaten it with a combination I can actually field. Has anyone found unconventional clears? I've heard of some people using Ravi, and mine is fairly high investment.

As for the news, I don't really care what other people have as the arena tier I'm in wouldn't get any worse than it is right now even if everyone got every ML 5* in the game overnight. If you think having tons of them is a free pass to legend then oh boy you should see the gear these whale-ass motherfuckers have. I had a blinded, attack-down ML Ken counter my Dizzy's S2 last night for 17K.

I do think the only ML 5* that will be nerfed is Aramintha, though. Baal is very strong but is only in absolute broken tier due to his synergy with her. I'd be surprised if they nerfed the characters they just buffed instead of just adding better Extinction characters. But maybe the recent shitstorm made them reconsider the tried-and-true method of gacha PVP 'balancing' (aka powercreep).

 

[Hakunon]

My only 5* ML (Ara) is surely taking a hit with the upcoming nerf, a bit sad and I don't know if I want to swap her with someone else.

Pity for every banner sounds promising but I hope they don't make it so that the guaranteed unit could be any 5* or rolling a 5* could reset the counter since it's different from limited banners where the featured unit is the only 5* in the pool. Ideally, though, they could just remove other 5*s.

 

[Pelicano]

I do feel for Pelicano though, this means complete whaling that isn't time gated is possible. Top PvP is going to be out of reach for nonwhales/dolphins as it is for must Gachas unless you are extremely lucky.

Again we'll see the implementation but I do want to shout out that I understand these changes aren't great for those in the middle.

Although buying stones to bookmarks to gold stones was always possible it was at a dumb rate previously.

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Yeah, people claiming this to be a net positive are people who weren't planning on staying with the game for a long time. Why are people so excited for MLs when they don't like PVP? I don't get it. This is a net positive to whaling. People without 5 stars still have to pull out of a super diluted pool. If people are barely playing the game and at silver in arena, sure, net positive bc you MAY get to play with the one pretty ML unit.

Going by the very vague notes, when this change is implemented everyone who has a ML 5 star that got nerfed will switch to have the "one" that is the most broken still. Whales will have every unit and all GvG will be ML Vildreds/Rueles/Aras. However, there's still no mention of compensation for people who don't have ML 5 stars or ML Banners (since they haven't mentioned removing mystic summons), in that scenario, everyone here is still going to be rolling on covenant summons and mystics praying for luck.

If they had just re-tooled the ML system to only need like 4 Gold Transmit Stones, have every side event give out a transmit stone on top of the artifact grind events, have raids drop gold transmit stones as a low % (instead of ML BM), have a 30-40 pull ML Pity and lower the rates of getting a ML 3 star by like 10-20% and divy that up between 4/5 stars, it'd make the chances of getting MLs way higher without spinning the high ranks out of control.

Overall, I don't think this is super healthy for the game, but for people that didn't have high aspirations, sure, you might randomly get ML Ken during your daily summon. The only way I see this working is if they nerf the living shit out of ML 5 stars. ML 4 stars being in the covenant pool is fine, it's just the 5 stars in their current incarnation would run rampant and make the game generally way more unfun.

Additionally the main thing I'm cranky about isn't arena, because arena is a shit show in Champion as is, is GvG. GvG was a place of salvation and fun. Now it'll just be ML 5 stars running rampant on every squad in the top 20. (My guild is currently top 10 :poggers:)

 

[cw_sasuke]

Hello everyone !

I don't know which of my hero I should upgrade.
Right now I'm stuck at 9-1 and my main team is Ken, Basar, Alexa 4 star and Aither 4 star. I'm considering to put one off them 5 star but I'm not sure.
As healer I also have Hazel and Jecht.

But I also have a Lorina and Kluri lvl 40. Plus I have Cecilia and Ludica.

What should I do ? Alexa and Aither 5 star ? Lorina and Kluri for their evolution ? Or focusing on the five star ? Praying the RNG god for Angelica or Montmorency ?

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You usually wanna 6* your farmer/dog walker first...looking at your post it doesnt seem like you have one.
From the units at your disposal Ken is def. the best one and a good candidate to be 6*. He can be used pretty much in all content of the game.

I would go for Ken now and the hope that you pull or get a Top Tier farmer and 6* him next.

 

[ShadowSoldier89]

I dont understand...PvP is a fucking mess now. Its not going to get any worse

People can actually have a hope and a prayer of getting ML units they want, thats a net positive

 

[Pelicano]

I dont understand...PvP is a fucking mess now. Its not going to get any worse

People can actually have a hope and a prayer of getting ML units they want, thats a net positive

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It can get worse. Nearly every team can have a Ruele or ML Vildred.

If you dont care about PVP, like you seem not to, then yeah, it'll be fun to maybe (probably not still) get the ML unit you want via F2P or whatever.

 

[lt519]

Yeah, people claiming this to be a net positive are people who weren't planning on staying with the game for a long time. Why are people so excited for MLs when they don't like PVP? I don't get it. This is a net positive to whaling. People without 5 stars still have to pull out of a super diluted pool. If people are barely playing the game and at silver in arena, sure, net positive bc you MAY get to play with the one pretty ML unit.

Going by the very vague notes, when this change is implemented everyone who has a ML 5 star that got nerfed will switch to have the "one" that is the most broken still. Whales will have every unit and all GvG will be ML Vildreds/Rueles/Aras. However, there's still no mention of compensation for people who don't have ML 5 stars or ML Banners (since they haven't mentioned removing mystic summons), in that scenario, everyone here is still going to be rolling on covenant summons and mystics praying for luck.

If they had just re-tooled the ML system to only need like 4 Gold Transmit Stones, have every side event give out a transmit stone on top of the artifact grind events, have raids drop gold transmit stones as a low % (instead of ML BM), have a 30-40 pull ML Pity and lower the rates of getting a ML 3 star by like 10-20% and divy that up between 4/5 stars, it'd make the chances of getting MLs way higher without spinning the high ranks out of control.

Overall, I don't think this is super healthy for the game, but for people that didn't have high aspirations, sure, you might randomly get ML Ken during your daily summon. The only way I see this working is if they nerf the living shit out of ML 5 stars. ML 4 stars being in the covenant pool is fine, it's just the 5 stars in their current incarnation would run rampant and make the game generally way more unfun.

Additionally the main thing I'm cranky about isn't arena, because arena is a shit show in Champion as is, is GvG. GvG was a place of salvation and fun. Now it'll just be ML 5 stars running rampant on every squad in the top 20. (My guild is currently top 10 :poggers:)

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That's why my earlier suggestion to combine currencies but make a separate pool still that is way more expensive would help. You'd have to chose between what you want, and at a significant cost, all while not dilluting the pool. It's make whaling harder but allow F2P players a shot at ML units. I think separate currencies gated by events unless you are willing to pay out the nose is not healthy in the long run.

I think dismissing non hardcore PvP players want for an ML unit isn't fair. Just because we aren't high tier PvP I'd still certainly enjoy an ML unit for Challenger and GW. They are the most fun units and at the core of it we just want to play around with them, health of the game be damned.

Whether whales want to admit it or not they need the casual base to survive. There's nothing to whale over in a dead game and they'll just move to the next new hot release. The game needs to appease to both crowds.

They did mention compensation still for past pulls. I imagine we'll all get a gold stone to bookmark exchange.

Hopefully they refine it more after community feedback which they seem intent on doing so we'll come to a better solution as long as we present opinions that aren't "fuck you got mine," or non constructive (your posts are good!).

 

[Sabin]

The ML changes are a net positive if those newly released ML characters get focus banners (and reruns) the way regular covenant summons do.

You'll need more bookmarks relative to how much you need to get non-ML 5*s now, but far, FAR fewer bookmarks than if you tried to collect all the ML units through the absurd gated system we currently have. Plus guaranteed pity, so you can never get truly fucked over, and the super whale type players can just keep rolling to max out their imprints. Win-win.

Overall a massive improvement over the current system. I see no reason to complain, unless you're one of those asshole types that gets off on exclusive access to the right to succeed in arena.

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Jup most of the complainment ive read so far basically boil down to "BUHUHU i won't be special anymore"

 

[Einbroch]

Even if it means that PVP doesn't change overall, on its own, the ML summon change means people will have more units to play with and more flexibility. That's always a good thing.

 

[okita]

That's an interesting turn of events, pity in all banners is great, about ML changes seems good to me but it's hard to have a clear picture without numbers.

 

[lt519]

Jup most of the complainment ive read so far basically boil down to "BUHUHU i won't be special anymore"

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That's a real generalization of some people's actual concerns about being able to trade for any 5* ML leading to a stale meta in higher end play. It has nothing to do with not being special. That leads to poor discussion especially when you do that dumb MemEmEeMME.

Everyone already had everything, theyve been asking for balancing and nerfing, which they are getting, but if they don't do a good job balancing everyone will just pick the same ML units and be back where we started. They needed to offer some kind of compensation but if not handled carefully they will just be back to now.

I think to that point Pelicano they need to do a good job balancing or it will be bad and right back where we started with PvP with them needing to introduce diversity fast.

 

[PancakeFlip]

Wait where is it stated that you can select a 5-star ML?

 

[Einbroch]

And lol. Some of the reason people don't like PVP is because there's no point in trying when you know people have units you'll never have and they're way stronger than you.

Now that people have hope? And that MLs are going to be nerfed? People might care about PVP now.

 

[Pelicano]

That's why my earlier suggestion to combine currencies but make a separate pool still that is way more expensive would help. You'd have to chose between what you want, and at a significant cost, all while not dilluting the pool. It's make whaling harder but allow F2P players a shot at ML units. I think separate currencies gated by events unless you are willing to pay out the nose is not healthy in the long run.

I think dismissing non hardcore PvP players want for an ML unit isn't fair. Just because we aren't high tier PvP I'd still certainly enjoy an ML unit for Challenger and GW. They are the most fun units and at the core of it we just want to play around with them, health of the game be damned.

Whether whales want to admit it or not they need the casual base to survive. There's nothing to whale over in a dead game and they'll just move to the next new hot release. The game needs to appease to both crowds.

They did mention compensation still for past pulls. I imagine we'll all get a gold stone to bookmark exchange.

Hopefully they refine it more after community feedback which they seem intent on doing so we'll come to a better solution as long as we present opinions that aren't "fuck you got mine," or non constructive (your posts are good!).

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I mean I agree, but with this change there is zero guarantee anyone that didn't have a ML, will have a ML 5 star, pending compensation information. Odds will still be jacked, except for the whales. I just think there was a better way of doing things that didn't just unlock the flood gates for whales.

I am not saying there didn't need to be a rework, just the vague explanation they gave about what they're planning on doing seems hamfisted and not well thought out at this point in time.

 

[ShadowSoldier89]

It can get worse. Nearly every team can have a Ruele or ML Vildred.

If you dont care about PVP, like you seem not to, then yeah, it'll be fun to maybe (probably not still) get the ML unit you want via F2P or whatever.

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every team already has a ML Vildred, or ML Ara, or Ruele, or ML baal

giving them out to everyone (not everyone of course but more) while balancing them down is a net positive, 100%

 

[lt519]

I mean I agree, but with this change there is zero guarantee anyone that didn't have a ML, will have a ML 5 star, pending compensation information. Odds will still be jacked, except for the whales. I just think there was a better way of doing things that just unlocked the flood gates for whales.

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Yeah for now we'll have to wait and see what the actual implementation is while providing constructive feedback. I think your concerns are valid and it's valid for someone like myself who has been playing for 7 months to want to have something more than 2 Blaze Dingos and a Guided Aither. Whatever it is will likely be better for folks like me but they do need to balance it with not making the game saturated with meta units.

I'd love any PvP ML unit and I have 0. I don't even have Hurado lol.

every team already has a ML Vildred, or ML Ara, or Ruele, or ML baal

giving them out to everyone (not everyone of course but more) while balancing them down is a net positive, 100%

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Agreed, assuming they can balance properly it'll make more units viable, but that's a big IF.

 

[Pelicano]

every team already has a ML Vildred, or ML Ara, or Ruele, or ML baal

giving them out to everyone (not everyone of course but more) while balancing them down is a net positive, 100%

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They better get really nerfed. I also don't know how they nerf Ruele. ML Vildred needs to have his damage toned down by 10% and not get an attack buff on rez. Reduced odds on sleep and stun for Baal/Ara. I just hope you guys are prepared to face them nonstop in arena/GvG, even moreso than now.

I just wish they wouldn't have said anything without having a concrete plan in place. Speculation is killer atm.

 

[Alkez]

So unpopular opinion: I don't like C Armin. I don't mean I don't like going against her, I mean I have her and I don't like using her. I understand why she's OP but her playstyle is just not for me. I've been trying to use her for a while now because I felt obligated to knowing how much most people would love to have her, but I think it's time to put her on the bench.

Also I like how y'all keep writing net positive, in essence accepting that there are negatives, yet we have no idea the value of those negatives lol.

As for the news, I don't really care what other people have as the arena tier I'm in wouldn't get any worse than it is right now even if everyone got every ML 5* in the game overnight. If you think having tons of them is a free pass to legend then oh boy you should see the gear these whale-ass motherfuckers have. I had a blinded, attack-down ML Ken counter my Dizzy's S2 last night for 17K.

I do think the only ML 5* that will be nerfed is Aramintha, though. Baal is very strong but is only in absolute broken tier due to his synergy with her. I'd be surprised if they nerfed the characters they just buffed instead of just adding better Extinction characters. But maybe the recent shitstorm made them reconsider the tried-and-true method of gacha PVP 'balancing' (aka powercreep).

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I'm saying bro.

In regards to Baal I disagree. Baal is broken because he doesn't something he shouldn't do: he punishes you for playing the game. If his passive had set requirements, like Harudo's, then it would be ok. But the fact he gets a 30% CR boost for you having a turn is way too oppressive.

ML 4 stars being in the covenant pool is fine

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Not disputing your other points, just don't agree with this part because of the points I made in my post above.

That's a real generalization of some people's actual concerns about being able to trade for any 5* ML leading to a stale meta in higher end play. It has nothing to do with not being special. That leads to poor discussion especially when you do that dumb MemEmEeMME.

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I did find that post funny. I was like "clearly I'm on someone's ignore list" lol.

 

[Pelicano]

So unpopular opinion: I don't like C Armin. I don't mean I don't like going against her, I mean I have her and I don't like using her. I understand why she's OP but her playstyle is just not for me. I've been trying to use her for a while now because I felt obligated to knowing how much most people would love to have her, but I think it's time to put her on the bench.

Also I like how y'all keep writing net positive, in essence accepting that there are negatives, yet we have no idea the value of those negatives lol.
I'm saying bro.

In regards to Baal I disagree. Baal is broken because he doesn't something he shouldn't do: he punishes you for playing the game. If his passive had set requirements, like Harudo's, then it would be ok. But the fact he gets a 30% CR boost for you having a turn is way too oppressive.

Not disputing your other points, just don't agree with this part because of the points I made in my post above.

I did find that post funny. I was like "clearly I'm on someone's ignore list" lol.

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Yeah, after I wrote that I was like, ew. I don't think they should be part of the covenant pool at all, but was too lazy to edit, haha. Yeah, Armin is boring as shit to play with. Just toss her in your arena defense. I honestly didn't like her for the longest time until I started to climb arena, when cleave comps were everywhere, and that's when I saw her real value. I normally don't use her on offense except in GvG vs ML Ara/Baal or cleavy teams. She is there for her s2. Her s3 is just a bonus.

 

[Biestmann]

I don't entirely understand concerns about the pull rate of ML units potentially being drastically lower once they enter the covenant pool. Right now, you need 120 pulls to get one shot at a ML hero, and despite a very generous rate for 4* MLs, the axe man keeps coming my way. Therefore, they can reduce the pull rate a lot and your odds to pull a 4* or higher ML hero still will be better when they are part of the covenant pool.

Overall, the crux of these changes as always lies in the implementation. They don't exactly have the best track record, so we will see.

 

[lt519]

Overall, the crux of these changes as always lies in the implementation. They don't exactly have the best track record, so we will see.

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Yup, on paper this all could very well work, just depends on the final implementation of the new system and the coinciding balancing that goes with it. I'm at least excited they are doing something instead of nothing.

 

[Jiraiza]

Can't wait to trade in my ML Baal for ML Ravi.

 

[lt519]

Can't wait to trade in my ML Baal for ML Ravi.

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If it doesn't expire save it for ML Luna :P

Also for the record in Challenger III-ish every time I roll new match-ups there are typically more ML units than elemental units on the board. It isn't just a Champion/Legend problem. ML's have been around long enough that its crept heavily into Challenger (not to mention people that should be in Champion just chilling in Challenger) and I'd like something to combat that!

It's been done before, but I'm going to run W11 all day with all of my Liefs and tally up the drops. I have like 100 Liefs and could use some gold/new gear for Iseria. See how many I actually get through.

 

[Dee Dee]

Hello everyone !

I don't know which of my hero I should upgrade.
Right now I'm stuck at 9-1 and my main team is Ken, Basar, Alexa 4 star and Aither 4 star. I'm considering to put one off them 5 star but I'm not sure.
As healer I also have Hazel and Jecht.

But I also have a Lorina and Kluri lvl 40. Plus I have Cecilia and Ludica.

What should I do ? Alexa and Aither 5 star ? Lorina and Kluri for their evolution ? Or focusing on the five star ? Praying the RNG god for Angelica or Montmorency ?

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Haha, welcome to a thread in semi-meltdown mode, but in case it still helps: Of the ones you have, Ken is the most powerful, and I don't see another good DPS except Lorina in your lineup that would rival his position. You should buff your DPS first at this point in your progress, and Ken is your best candidate now - I also strongly suggest you get Lorina and Kluri to 5* soon so you can start working on their specialty change. Lorina's takes forever. Kluri's also takes forever, but the good thing is that as part of it you have to make lots of 4* phantasms, so it will naturally progress as you work towards your next promotion.
Once you finish them you'll have another single target DPS and a good tank. I don't have Cecilia, so I'm not sure if she's better, but F.Kluri is a very useful unit with her buff cleanse and small heal and barrier support.
Lidica (I think you meant her?) is also a very good unit you should look at and invest into.
Also, drop Aither for Jecht or Hazel asap, and specialty change Hazel or Montmorancy once you're done with Kluri and Lorina. Aither is the worst soul weaver, no contest. I'd even use nerfed Elson over him still.
Alexa is a very solid unit to also consider to 5*, but not over Lorina or Kluri.
Are there any other notable 4*s you have?

 

[theMrCravens]

Jup most of the complainment ive read so far basically boil down to "BUHUHU i won't be special anymore"

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100% this.
Holy shit, have you read some of the whale/spender comments on other boards ?

Some sad stuff.

 

[Chopchop]

Wow, those are huge changes. Pity on normal banners is a no brainer that they should have had to begin with, and while I agree that the ML system needed to be tossed or overhauled, I'm not sure about this approach. I like it519's idea of having a separate ML pool that just costs more bookmarks to pull. Putting everything into one pool dilutes chances too much.

I'll just wait and see how they actually implement this.

 

[Einbroch]

They're still gonna have mystics and ML summons. ML bookmarks aren't going anywhere. This is just an extra chance to get MLs.

 

[Chopchop]

Speaking of ML bookmarks, I got a few from raid this week. I see ML Ravi on the mystic banner but not the ML banner.

Do ML heroes on the mystic banner always get moved to the ML banner later? I see F.Cecilia there.

 

[Dee Dee]

Speaking of ML bookmarks, I got a few from raid this week. I see ML Ravi on the mystic banner but not the ML banner.

Do ML heroes on the mystic banner always get moved to the ML banner later? I see F.Cecilia there.

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ML Ravi isn't released yet in game, she's on the list for the Mystic pulls next week I think? So you can't get her from mystic or ML banners this week, but with the next update.

 

[Chopchop]

ML Ravi isn't released yet in game, she's on the list for the Mystic pulls next week I think? So you can't get her from mystic or ML banners this week, but with the next update.

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Thanks. I'll wait for now then, since I'm in no rush.

And since we have the gold event today, are hunts the best place to grind for gold?

I got Tama from 50 to 52 yesterday with the exp bonus lol. Didn't put enough time into that, I guess.