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Eurovision Song Contest 2019 |OT| The place where joiking, dead drops, dentists and bondage come together.

Steiner_Zi

Member
Oct 28, 2017
266
Since 2009, winners have been

  • Norway
  • Germany
  • Azerbaijan
  • Sweden x2
  • Denmark
  • Austria
  • Ukraine
  • Portugal
  • Netherlands
  • Israel

So aside from Azerbaijan and Ukraine, a traditional country (at least 40 participations) has won 9 out of 11 times since the voting system was split between Jury and Public vote. So the new system is better protected against bloc voting, and shows that top countries can win again. The BBC has missed that change.
What are you talking about? The Nordic bloc vote is stronger than ever. And unlike Greece/Cyprus which have just one another to co-vote, the Nordic vote consistently goes to the Nordic countries which does skew the result. This is why I find the selective booing from the crowd unreasonable.
 

Jacknapes

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,162
Caldicot, South Wales
Netherlands winning was well deserved, that was a good performance and a great song. My partner thought i was nuts saying Slovenia had a decent song, but they did. Bit weird, but a 1/2 decent song from them this year. Still thinking about Iceland's performance, that was certainly something else. More weird than wonderful.

I'm still thinking that i;ve heard something similar to the San Marino song before, the chorus certainly was familiar and i can't put my finger on it.
 

Basarili

Member
Oct 27, 2017
898
Haarlem
Before the jury shift, we came from a 10 year period with Russia, Serbia, Estonia, Latvia as winners. From that period I only remember Wild Dances and Hard Rock Hallelujah. That did stop the 90s Irish domination.



Which is completely idiotic. They managed fourth place with Hadise and second place with maNga. Even their third result was 7th place. Only once they did they fail to qualify at all. It is a lot beter than their track record before.
They probably had more problems with the EBU then that, but no official statement came out from both parties I think. They had indeed better tracking record then before the public vote was introduced.
 

amanset

Member
Oct 28, 2017
535
And what about previous years? Just curious.
The Nordics have been going on like this pretty much as long as the contest has been going on.

Use "Total number of all points given to <country> from 1957 to 2019" on this site:
https://eschome.net/

Top 5 for Sweden:
1. Norway
2. Denmark
3. Finland
4. Iceland
5. UK

Top 5 for Norway:
1. Sweden
2. Denmark
3. Ireland
4. Iceland
5. Netherlands
(Finland were number 6)

Top 5 for Finland:
1. Sweden
2. Norway
3. Iceland
4. Estonia
5. UK

Top 5 for Denmark:
1. Sweden
2. Norway
3. Iceland
4. Netherlands
5. Ireland

Top 5 for Iceland:
1. Sweden
2. Denmark
3. Norway
4. Finland
5. Spaim
 
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Red Arremer

Red Arremer

Member
Oct 26, 2017
7,336
Finally got off my ass and fixed the weird alignment issues of the flags being 32x32 by cutting down the height.
Also did the same to all countries that have participated in the past, and might participate in the future, regardless of the likelihood of that happening, so let me take you down memory and fortune telling lane. Let's start with countries that participated in the past:

Ukraine withdrew from the contest this year because of the controversy surrounding the contract they would have wanted the winner of the national selection to sign. After it was announced she would not participate for Ukraine, the second and third placed acts also rejected the offer by the Ukrainian broadcaster. Ukraine has confirmed wanting to return in 2020 though, so I consider them a technically active member.

Andorra has withdrawn after the 2009 contest, citing financial difficulties. In the past 10 years, voices in Andorra, including previous performers representing it, have become louder wanting the country's return to the contest, but the broadcaster can't afford participation - they nearly left the EBU even but they were able to negotiate remaining within the EBU.

Bosnia and Herzegovina has withdrawn after the 2016 contest (though having taken a break for a few years prior to that). They are in debt with the EBU and generally have financial difficulties, even though they very much want to come back to the contest.

Bulgaria has withdrawn after the 2018 contest. The Bulgarian broadcaster has gone through a restructuring, including dismissing the Eurovision delegation, and also mentioned financial difficulties as a potential problem. This is especially sad because Bulgaria has become a force to be reckoned with in recent years.

Luxembourg has been out of the contest since after 1993. Along with Italy, the EBU was trying very hard to have them come back, but Luxembourgois broadcaster RTL has absolutely no interest, already stating the struggle of smaller countries back in the 90s. There has been a petition from Luxemborgois people to have the country return to the contest, but RTL ignored that as well. Currently, there is no indication that Luxembourg will ever come back.

Monaco withdrew after the 2006 contest. They came back for 3 contests after over 20 years, did not qualify in the semi finals, and then cited just how bad the chances for small countries are to qualify as the main reason to withdraw. What makes matters more difficult is that the Monegasque broadcaster TMC got acquired by the French media holding group TF1, which might make a return more complicated.

Morocco withdrew after their single participation in 1980, where they only joined because Israel hadn't. A newer broadcaster expressed interest for the contest, but that has been a few years ago, and we haven't heard anything since.

Slovakia has been withdrawn since after the 2012 contest. They cite financial difficulties as the main factor, and have expressed interest in returning.

Turkey also has been out since after 2012. They are boycotting Eurovision because of the Big 5 system, the jury vote split, and also because of acts such as Conchita Wurst. As long as the conservatives and right wingers are in power in Turkey, it seems exceedingly unlikely for it to return.

Now for countries that almost took part but didn't.

Lebanon almost participated in 2005, even was featured on some promotional material, and a song and performer have been selected (it even is a pretty good song!). The EBU inquired if Lebanon was going to broadcast the Israeli entry, which they said they couldn't guarantee, and shortly after, withdrew. They have not expressed interest since then.

Tunisia was going to participate back in 1977, but withdrew for some reason and has not expressed any interest to debut since then.

And last section, countries that have not participated yet, nor almost, and have expressed interest.

One of the most likely debuts within the next few years, Kazakhstan has taken part in Junior Eurovision last year, expressed interest for the main version, and Jon Ola Sand, the executive supervisor of the contest, has stated that they are going to have a discussion whether Kazakhstan, an Associate EBU member, is going to be allowed to participate - apparently this is a discussion that might involve more than just the Kazakh participation.

Another very likely debut, perhaps as early as 2020, the national broadcaster of Kosovo joining the EBU is going to be discussed during the next few months. If they are accepted, which is likely as the EBU has expressed interest in having them along, Kosovo will be allowed to debut next year, or if not then due to time constraints, then very soon after.

Rumours of Liechtenstein debuting at the contest have been flying around for many years now, but the Liechtensteiner broadcaster is not a member of the EBU yet, and has cited that they have not been able to procure funds from the government to both join the EBU and participate in the contest as a result. Furthermore, the director who was the driving force behind a Liechtensteiner EBU membership and contest entry has passed away recently, making the debut of Liechtenstein even less likely.

Qatar is an EBU Associate member much like Kazakhstan, is quite enthusiastic about the contest, and has expressed strong interest about joining it. They also have explicitly mentioned that they would have no problem showing the Israeli entry, and I imagine that they are not entirely unlikely to debut if Kazakhstan is permitted to.

The regional broadcaster of Catalonia, while not an independent country, has brought up the argument that not being an independent country does not mean they shouldn't be allowed to join the EBU, as they do region-specific broadcasts in Catalan. The EBU said they are going to resolve this issue some time this year. That said, even if non-independent regions are going to be permitted in the EBU, the Spanish national broadcaster RTVE is going to be able to veto a membership of the Catalan broadcaster.

In a similar fashion, the Faroe Islands' regional broadcaster has brought up similar arguments to Catalonia, and also proposed a similar national selection format as the Danish one. I imagine that if regional broadcasters, even if not for independent nations, are allowed, then the Faroes are going to be one of the first new members, and will debut in the contest shortly after.

Greenland has expressed similar sentiments to the Faroes, and is in a similar boat as they are.

Final bit, I'm gonna lump all of these together:

Scotland, Wales and Gibraltar all have expressed interest in sending their own entries to the contest in the past, even though they had been denied on the grounds of the BBC representing them with the UK entry. However, both Wales and Scotland have participated in Eurovision Choir, and Wales also in the Junior Eurovision.
It is unlikely that any of these countries are going to be part of the contest any time soon.

Other countries that are technically eligible to join the contest but very likely aren't going to are the Vatican, Algeria, Libya, Egypt and Jordan.

And also, on a similar note, Australia has been allowed to participate until at least the 2023 contest.
 
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Tyaren

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,470
UK got shown what Europeans think of them. Think that was a humiliation? wait until you try and get your political voice heard after Brexit.

(uk remainer here. fuck brexit)
It's less about Brexit and more about the UK sending really bad songs and singers. Seriously, the UK has one of the best music industries in the world and this is what they send each year? That's deliberate self-sabotage. ;)
Similarly look at Germany, the memes say everyone hates Germany in the Eurovision Song Contest and it got in fact zero points from the public this year (even worse than the UK's 3 points), but when Germany actually sends a good entry, like Lena or the guy last year, they actually can reach first place or fourth place.
 

Joni

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,717
What are you talking about? The Nordic bloc vote is stronger than ever. And unlike Greece/Cyprus which have just one another to co-vote, the Nordic vote consistently goes to the Nordic countries which does skew the result. This is why I find the selective booing from the crowd unreasonable.
That isn't the bloc people wanted to introduce the protection for. In the end, they are only five countries and they tend to shift their bloc voting with the general consencus. They voted mostly for Sweden this time, like the general votes.
 

admataY

Member
Oct 25, 2017
821
Folks, if israel can win it with techno-clucking the UK can win aswell, they just need to pick a lane - either send an actual good song, or a memorably bad joke song , not boring half measures .
 
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Red Arremer

Red Arremer

Member
Oct 26, 2017
7,336
That isn't the bloc people wanted to introduce the protection for. In the end, they are only five countries and they tend to shift their bloc voting with the general consencus. They voted mostly for Sweden this time, like the general votes.
To be fair, at the height of the bloc voting that the Balkans (Ex-Yugoslav countries, let's be real here) were accused of, it also was like 5 or 6 countries at most, and even then, it's not like all points always went to the most popular one there (usually Serbia), considering the relationships between the former Yugoslav countries are tense as well. Same goes for Russia and the CIS countries.
Those two along with the Nordics are the biggest voting blocs period. It's just that the Nordics have been around forever while the Eastern countries all debuted in the 90s (and a few in the early 2000s).
 

Bromancer

Member
Oct 30, 2017
109
So what's everyone's final verdict? After all is said and done I think this year was... eh.

Duncan was a deserving winner, if only because he was one of the few singers to pull off the live performance. Out of the top countries only Russia and Sweden weren't clearly worse than the studio version. It's been said before but Shalva (the disabled semi 2 interval act) would likely have won the whole thing, and Ukraine would've had more than a good chance. Sadly I think Klemens' Grand Final performance takes the Even-Worse-Than-Madonna Award. How come only the worst performers of the night had the gall to call attention to Palestine? :(

But I did make some discoveries this year! Though his live performance didn't really translate in my opinion, Mahmood is a blessing. Slovenia's Zala Kralj certainly didn't translate well (partly because of the stare, partly because she didn't sing well) but I've been playing her music around bedtime lately and I'm totally into this stuff now. So soothing... oh and after hearing the studio version I finally understand the enthusiasm surrounding Norway! Man that song really works, shame it wasn't as good live.

Anyway, to anyone similarly disappointed, I invite you to think back to the Eurovision Dark Ages. I mean consider the top 3 in 2003:


Good god. No wonder we (Netherlands) gave up on Eurovision for the next decade. This must've been about the worst year ever, right? Either way we've come a long way. Some things never change though: UK is still in last place. :)
 

s_mirage

Member
Oct 25, 2017
897
Birmingham, UK
It's less about Brexit and more about the UK sending really bad songs and singers. Seriously, the UK has one of the best music industries in the world and this is what they send each year? That's deliberate self-sabotage. ;)
Similarly look at Germany, the memes say everyone hates Germany in the Eurovision Song Contest and it got in fact zero points from the public this year (even worse than the UK's 3 points), but when Germany actually sends a good entry, like Lena or the guy last year, they actually can reach first place or fourth place.
Yep. Brexit just feels like the current excuse. Before Brexit it was the Iraq War, even though it wasn't fresh in anyone's memory by the time Brexit happened. Also, if it is just anti-UK sentiment, why do our Eurovision songs tank in the UK charts too? The last song to crack the top 20 was Blue's 2011 entry, with most entries since then falling outside of the top 50. In the same period, five Eurovision winners cracked the top 20, and two in the top 10. If the home market isn't interested in the songs we are sending, why should anyone else be?

As long as we keep sending bland songs that seem specifically designed as Eurovision entries, or are Melodifestivalen cast offs, with boring staging, we're going to do badly.
 

moblin

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,130
Москва
I found it weird that the Greece/Cyprus thing got booed but not the high scores that Sweden got from all the other Nordic countries (12 from Finland, Denmark and Iceland and 8 from Norway).

I always find it really amusing here as Swedes moan about the voting between Eastern European countries but have some kind of cognitive dissonance when it comes to inter Nordic voting.

For the record, Sweden gave 12 to Norway, 8 to Iceland and 7 to Denmark.
Yeah Scandinavian bloc voting is way, way worse than the 12 points between Cyprus and Greece. They're the only ones still voting like the 2000 Balkans.
Someone on Reddit did the math and figured out that the Nordics + Baltics bloc was far and away the strongest in the history of the contest, much much more powerful than the ex-Yugoslavian countries or ex-Soviet Republics and Russia. People in western/central europe tend not to perceive it as being a bloc because in their mind the region typically sends quality, so it doesn't count.

- Songs I wish made it to the final:
Portugal - No idea what that performance actually was, but I vibed hard with it.
Hungary - Just a great song.
Poland - I just love unique stuff and this one stood out to me.
This is taste!
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,946
Has Madonna commented on yesterday's performance yet? My ears hurt just thinking about it!
She wouldn't last ten seconds on any reality talent show with that "singing".
 

Chocobo Blade

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,168
Like usually in recent years some basic gig wins for being "real music" or whatever. I just wish the voters would finally fully embrace the campiness of this contest.
 
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Red Arremer

Red Arremer

Member
Oct 26, 2017
7,336
Anyway, to anyone similarly disappointed, I invite you to think back to the Eurovision Dark Ages. I mean consider the top 3 in 2003:


This must've been about the worst year ever, right?
Honestly I think the top 3 in 2003 were all good. Sertab Erener still is one of my favourite winners of the past 20 years, Sanomi is easily one of Belgium's best entries ever, and tatu were like, back in a time when Russia wasn't the dictatorial hegemony it is nowadays. It's not a super great song, but not terrible either.
There's much worse years and winners than 2003, to be quite honest.
 

Sanox

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,742
Always funny to think back a few years and look at some songs you liked that come to mind first.

Quite liked this entry from Finland which got last but the live performance wasn’t great

And from the same year also didn't place high but was really catchy
 

mclem

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,254
(Scarily) extensive research has concluded on the real way to score highly in Eurovision:


It's a surprisingly extensive thread that goes far deeper than those core points.
 

Munti

Member
Oct 26, 2017
347
Man, Slovenia's song doesn't get out my mind. I love it a lot, and I think this Duo will be on my watchlist to check all their other songs. I really hope that this Duo is not disappointed by their results (although 13th rank not too bad ist).

And from the same year also didn't place high but was really catchy
Hahaha I'm not alone! Balkan Girls was and is one of my all time favourites and I still listen to it time to time.
 

Dr. Mario

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,445
Netherlands
Listening back to the whole Eurovision list on Spotify, a couple of things become even more apparent.

  • Production quality really improved a lot over the years. Even the smaller countries' songs generally have rich soundscapes and are mixed very well.
  • There are almost no stinkers, the worst ones are just more bland. Inoffensive background music. That also bespeaks less flanderization, because there's almost no gimmicky shit.
  • Although Norway's song is eminently danceable (much like that other spirit in the sky), the joikoing is definitely very gimmicky, it would have been better without that interlude. Iceland's song actually has a really great bassline, but should have toned down the grunting too.
  • The only one who really got done dirty was Australia. I guess I got distracted by the poleswinging too much, because the song itself is super unique. I can see now why they gave it such a lavish show because they probably felt they had a winner on their hands. But listening to it better, the staging probably hurt it because you just notice the swaying and the queen of the night aria from die Zauberflote without noticing the actual song.
 
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RKR

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,379
NL
Holland used to think this was a corrupted show as well. And while bloc voting certainly is a thing I don't think this is as much the case as we sometimes thought. Our songs were simply shit for a good few years, or decades even (you should look up terrible shit like Treble or Sieneke). Since our music industry changed it up, by sending actual talented performers and writers behind the songs, we fare much better with a few top 10's, a second place and now a win.

England simply sends consistently shit songs, like we used to do. Brexit is only recently, yet England has been shit for ages now.
 

Xcell Miguel

Member
Oct 27, 2017
933
France
Man, Slovenia's song doesn't get out my mind. I love it a lot, and I think this Duo will be on my watchlist to check all their other songs. I really hope that this Duo is not disappointed by their results (although 13th rank not too bad ist).
Same, I really liked it and it was the first time I wanted to send an SMS to vote for a song.

Their other stuff is very similar to Sebi and definitely worth checking out if you liked it:

Thanks for the link, I enjoyed it !
Hope they do more, it brings back memories of when I was into Russian music almost a decade ago.
 

MrPanic

Member
Oct 25, 2017
281
So after a second viewing, I don't have anything to add to my last post here. Well, other than the new Nana Banana song from last years winner actually being a banger. I was a bit distracted by the performance the first time, but that song on its own actually slaps.

I think I'll grab the album this time around, this year actually had a bunch of nice songs.
 

cyba89

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,507
EBU issues statement on Eurovision 2019 Grand Final jury result

The Belarusian jury was dismissed following the reveal of their votes from the first Semi-Final which is contrary to the rules of the Eurovision Song Contest. In order to comply with the Contest’s voting regulations, the EBU worked with its voting partner digame to create a substitute aggregated result (calculated based on the results of other countries with similar voting records), which was approved by voting monitor Ernst & Young, to determine the Belarusian jury votes for the Grand Final."

"The EBU can confirm, following standard review practices, we have discovered that due to a human error an incorrect aggregated result was used. This had no impact on the calculation of points derived from televoting across the 41 participating countries and the overall winner and Top 4 songs of the Contest remain unchanged.
The corrected result
  1. Netherlands (498 points)
  2. Italy (472 points)
  3. Russia (370 points)
  4. Switzerland (364 points)
  5. Sweden (334 points)
  6. Norway (331 points)
  7. North Macedonia (305 points)
  8. Azerbaijan (302 points)
  9. Australia (284 points)
  10. Iceland (232 points)
  11. Czech Republic (157 points)
  12. Denmark (120 points)
  13. Cyprus (109 points)
  14. Malta (107 points)
  15. Slovenia (105 points)
  16. France (105 points)
  17. Albania (90 points)
  18. Serbia (89 points)
  19. San Marino (77 points)
  20. Estonia (76 points)
  21. Greece (74 points)
  22. Spain (54 points)
  23. Israel (35 points)
  24. Belarus (31 points)
  25. Germany (24 points)
  26. United Kingdom (11 points)
RIP Eight Belarusian jury points for Germany :P
 

moblin

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,130
Москва
absolutely nasty to do that to Norway when they had actually bested Sweden for once

also they just published a video on their official channel of the top 10 with the old results so I'm considering that official!


edit: also worth pointing out that North Macedonia now officially won the jury vote, not Sweden.